Reg Smeeton
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« Reply #3870 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 15:10:46 » |
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That's not strictly correct, it was fairly clear that a) Scotland was remain and b) it would provide pennies from heaven for the SNP and other nationalists if they voted to stay but the overall was remain. I have a number of Scottish friends who all voted to stay in the union when they had their referendum but have gone completely the other way now, ironic that the Conservative and Unionist Party will facilitate the break up, but so be it.
As I assume you are retired its somewhat easier to get on with it compared with those who have been sold a pup and now find their jobs at risk and their kids futures uncertain. As for any idea of socialist reordering you are as naive as McDonnell and Corbyn, jobs will be lost at the bottom end, employment protects scrapped, its fairly clear that the Tory model is some manner of European Singapore (although even their president thinks we are mental), that hardly socialism is it?
It will be up to individuals to view the changes sprung by Brexit as they see fit... the future is uncertain Brexit or no Brexit.
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horlock07
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Lives in Northern Bastard Outpost
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« Reply #3871 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 15:50:18 » |
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It will be up to individuals to view the changes sprung by Brexit as they see fit... the future is uncertain Brexit or no Brexit.
Thanks Theresa.....
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BambooToTheFuture
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I'll Tell Ya Now - McGurk Is The New Graham
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« Reply #3872 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 16:06:58 » |
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...but I thought Brexit meant Brexit?
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'Incessant Nonsense' ______________________________________________________________
'I'm gonna tell you the secret. There's a threat, you end it and you don't feel ashamed about enjoying it. You smell the gunpowder and you see the blood, you know what that means? It means you're alive. You've won. You take the heads so that you don't ever forget.'
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Ardiles
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« Reply #3873 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 16:21:40 » |
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...but I thought Brexit meant Brexit?
Geopolitical reality dawns. Brexit means taking back giving up control.
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BambooToTheFuture
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I'll Tell Ya Now - McGurk Is The New Graham
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« Reply #3874 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 16:31:41 » |
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Geopolitical reality dawns. Brexit means taking back giving up control.
I know, I was just quoting our dearly beloved Theresa ![Smiley](//thetownend.com/Smileys/tefsmile/smiley.gif)
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'Incessant Nonsense' ______________________________________________________________
'I'm gonna tell you the secret. There's a threat, you end it and you don't feel ashamed about enjoying it. You smell the gunpowder and you see the blood, you know what that means? It means you're alive. You've won. You take the heads so that you don't ever forget.'
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RedRag
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« Reply #3875 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 16:35:46 » |
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No need to be nostalgic for the EU just yet.
It looks like Tessie's Deal will enable the Brit Press to CONTINUE to distract us with fake news and EuroMYTHS, enabling politicians to build whole careers on misconceptions:
EC regulations to ban playgrounds – Daily Express Rolling acres outlawed by Brussels – The Telegraph EU to scrap British exams – Sunday Express Obscure EU law halting the sale of English oak seeds – Mail on Sunday EU may try to ban sweet and toy ads – The Times EU to tell British farmers what they can grow – Daily Mail EU ‘Bans Boozing’ – Daily Star Light ale to be forced to change its name by Eurocrats – Daily Mail EU fanatics to be forced to sing dire anthem about EU ‘Motherland’ – The Sun British apple trees facing chop by EU – The Times EC plan to ban noisy toys – Sunday People EU to ban bagpipes and trapeze artists – The Sun Children to be banned from blowing up balloons, under EU safety rules – Daily Telegraph Straight cucumbers – The Sun Curved bananas banned by Brussels bureaucrats – The Sun, Daily Mail, Daily Express Brussels bans barmaids from showing cleavage – The Sun, Daily Telegraph Rumpole’s wig to scrapped by EU – Mail on Sunday Church bells silenced by fear of EU law – Daily Telegraph Motorists to be charged to drive in city centres under EU plans – Daily Telegraph EU to stop binge drinking by slapping extra tax on our booze – The Sun Brandy butter to be renamed ‘brandy spreadable fat’ – The European British loaf of bread under threat from EU – Daily Mail Truckers face EU ban on fry-ups – The Sun EU to ban Union Flag from British meat packs – Daily Express EU seeks to outlaw 60 dog breeds – Europa News Agency Double-decker buses to be banned – Daily Telegraph EU bans eating competition cakes – Timesonline Now EU officials want control of your CANDLES – Daily Express 21-gun salutes are just too loud, Brussels tells the Royal Artillery – Mail on Sunday Brussels threatens charity shops and car boot sales – Daily Mail Plot to axe British number plates for standardised EU design – Daily Express Women to be asked intimate details about sex lives in planned EU census – Daily Express British cheese faces extinction under EU rules – PA News EU meddlers ban kids on milk rounds – The Sun, The Telegraph British chocolate to be renamed ‘vegelate’ under EU rules – Daily Mail EU to ban church bells – Daily Telegraph British film producers warn of new EU threat to industry – The Independent Kilts to be branded womenswear by EU – Daily Record EU to ban double decker buses – Daily Mail Cod to be renamed ‘Gadus’ thanks to EU – Daily Mail Brussels to restrict drinking habits of Britain’s coffee lovers – Daily Express EU responsible for your hay fever – Daily Mail, The Times Condom dimensions to be harmonised – Independent on Sunday EU wants to BAN your photos of the London Eye – Daily Express Corgis to be banned by EU – Daily Mail EU forcing cows to wear nappies – Daily Mail Eurocrats to ban crayons and colouring pencils – The Sun Smoky bacon crisps face EU ban – Sunday Times EU outlaws teeth whitening products – Daily Mail Domain names – ‘.uk’ to be replaced by ‘.eu’ – Daily Mail Brussels to ban HGV drivers from wearing glasses – The Times New eggs cannot be called eggs – Daily Mail EU to ban selling eggs by the dozen – Daily Mail UK to be forced to adopt continental two pin plug – Daily Star, Daily Mail EU targets traditional Sunday roast – Sun on Sunday English Channel to be re-named ‘Anglo-French Pond’ – Daily Mail Brussels to force EU flag on England shirts – Daily Mail EU orders farmers to give toys to pigs – The Times Firemen’s poles outlawed by EU – Daily Mail Euro ban on food waste means swans cannot be fed – The Observer Noise regulations to force football goers to wear earplugs – The Sun Traditional Irish funeral under threat from EU – Daily Telegraph, The Times EU to ban high-heel shoes for hairdressers – Daily Express Commission to force fishermen to wear hairnets – Daily Telegraph Brussels to ban herbal cures – Daily Express Bureaucrats declare Britain is “not an island”– the Guardian EU bid to ban life sentences for murderers – Daily Express New EU map makes Kent part of France – Sunday Telegraph EU tells Welsh how to grow their leeks – The Times EU to ban lollipop ladies’ sticks – News of the World EU plot to rename Trafalgar Square & Waterloo station – Daily Express UK milk ‘pinta’ threatened by Brussels – The Sun EU bans ‘mince’ pies – Daily Mail Eurocrats say Santa must be a woman – The Sun Now EU crackpots demand gypsy MPs – Daily Express Brussels to outlaw mushy peas – The Sun, Daily Mail, Telegraph, Times Brussels says shellfish must be given rest breaks on journeys – The Times Pets must be pressure cooked after death – Sunday Telegraph EU puts speed limit on children’s roundabouts – Daily Express 2-for-1 bargains to be scrapped by EU – Daily Mirror EU madness: chat up bar girl and pub will be fined – Daily Star Queen to be forced to get her own tea by EU – The Sun EU tells women to hand in worn-out sex toys – The Sun British rhubarb to be straight – The Sun EU to ban rocking horses – The Sun Scotch whisky rebranded a dangerous chemical by EU – Daily Telegraph Brussels ban on pints of shandy – The Times “High up” signs to be put on mountains – BBC Euronotes cause impotence – Daily Mail EU to ban under 16-year-olds from using Facebook – Daily Mail Strawberries must be oval – The Sun EU orders swings to be pulled down – Daily Express Tea bags banned from being recycled – BBC British lav to be replaced with Euro-loo – The Sun Unwanted Valentine’s cards to be defined as sexual harrasment – Daily Telegraph Bosses to be told what colour carpets to buy by EU – Daily Star EU says British yoghurt to be renamed ‘Fermented Milk Pudding’ – Sunday Mirror EU to ban zipper trousers – The Sun
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« Last Edit: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 16:39:17 by RedRag »
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Sir red ken
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« Reply #3876 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 17:54:26 » |
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No need to be nostalgic for the EU just yet.
It looks like Tessie's Deal will enable the Brit Press to CONTINUE to distract us with fake news and EuroMYTHS, enabling politicians to build whole careers on misconceptions:
EC regulations to ban playgrounds – Daily Express Rolling acres outlawed by Brussels – The Telegraph EU to scrap British exams – Sunday Express Obscure EU law halting the sale of English oak seeds – Mail on Sunday EU may try to ban sweet and toy ads – The Times EU to tell British farmers what they can grow – Daily Mail EU ‘Bans Boozing’ – Daily Star Light ale to be forced to change its name by Eurocrats – Daily Mail EU fanatics to be forced to sing dire anthem about EU ‘Motherland’ – The Sun British apple trees facing chop by EU – The Times EC plan to ban noisy toys – Sunday People EU to ban bagpipes and trapeze artists – The Sun Children to be banned from blowing up balloons, under EU safety rules – Daily Telegraph Straight cucumbers – The Sun Curved bananas banned by Brussels bureaucrats – The Sun, Daily Mail, Daily Express Brussels bans barmaids from showing cleavage – The Sun, Daily Telegraph Rumpole’s wig to scrapped by EU – Mail on Sunday Church bells silenced by fear of EU law – Daily Telegraph Motorists to be charged to drive in city centres under EU plans – Daily Telegraph EU to stop binge drinking by slapping extra tax on our booze – The Sun Brandy butter to be renamed ‘brandy spreadable fat’ – The European British loaf of bread under threat from EU – Daily Mail Truckers face EU ban on fry-ups – The Sun EU to ban Union Flag from British meat packs – Daily Express EU seeks to outlaw 60 dog breeds – Europa News Agency Double-decker buses to be banned – Daily Telegraph EU bans eating competition cakes – Timesonline Now EU officials want control of your CANDLES – Daily Express 21-gun salutes are just too loud, Brussels tells the Royal Artillery – Mail on Sunday Brussels threatens charity shops and car boot sales – Daily Mail Plot to axe British number plates for standardised EU design – Daily Express Women to be asked intimate details about sex lives in planned EU census – Daily Express British cheese faces extinction under EU rules – PA News EU meddlers ban kids on milk rounds – The Sun, The Telegraph British chocolate to be renamed ‘vegelate’ under EU rules – Daily Mail EU to ban church bells – Daily Telegraph British film producers warn of new EU threat to industry – The Independent Kilts to be branded womenswear by EU – Daily Record EU to ban double decker buses – Daily Mail Cod to be renamed ‘Gadus’ thanks to EU – Daily Mail Brussels to restrict drinking habits of Britain’s coffee lovers – Daily Express EU responsible for your hay fever – Daily Mail, The Times Condom dimensions to be harmonised – Independent on Sunday EU wants to BAN your photos of the London Eye – Daily Express Corgis to be banned by EU – Daily Mail EU forcing cows to wear nappies – Daily Mail Eurocrats to ban crayons and colouring pencils – The Sun Smoky bacon crisps face EU ban – Sunday Times EU outlaws teeth whitening products – Daily Mail Domain names – ‘.uk’ to be replaced by ‘.eu’ – Daily Mail Brussels to ban HGV drivers from wearing glasses – The Times New eggs cannot be called eggs – Daily Mail EU to ban selling eggs by the dozen – Daily Mail UK to be forced to adopt continental two pin plug – Daily Star, Daily Mail EU targets traditional Sunday roast – Sun on Sunday English Channel to be re-named ‘Anglo-French Pond’ – Daily Mail Brussels to force EU flag on England shirts – Daily Mail EU orders farmers to give toys to pigs – The Times Firemen’s poles outlawed by EU – Daily Mail Euro ban on food waste means swans cannot be fed – The Observer Noise regulations to force football goers to wear earplugs – The Sun Traditional Irish funeral under threat from EU – Daily Telegraph, The Times EU to ban high-heel shoes for hairdressers – Daily Express Commission to force fishermen to wear hairnets – Daily Telegraph Brussels to ban herbal cures – Daily Express Bureaucrats declare Britain is “not an island”– the Guardian EU bid to ban life sentences for murderers – Daily Express New EU map makes Kent part of France – Sunday Telegraph EU tells Welsh how to grow their leeks – The Times EU to ban lollipop ladies’ sticks – News of the World EU plot to rename Trafalgar Square & Waterloo station – Daily Express UK milk ‘pinta’ threatened by Brussels – The Sun EU bans ‘mince’ pies – Daily Mail Eurocrats say Santa must be a woman – The Sun Now EU crackpots demand gypsy MPs – Daily Express Brussels to outlaw mushy peas – The Sun, Daily Mail, Telegraph, Times Brussels says shellfish must be given rest breaks on journeys – The Times Pets must be pressure cooked after death – Sunday Telegraph EU puts speed limit on children’s roundabouts – Daily Express 2-for-1 bargains to be scrapped by EU – Daily Mirror EU madness: chat up bar girl and pub will be fined – Daily Star Queen to be forced to get her own tea by EU – The Sun EU tells women to hand in worn-out sex toys – The Sun British rhubarb to be straight – The Sun EU to ban rocking horses – The Sun Scotch whisky rebranded a dangerous chemical by EU – Daily Telegraph Brussels ban on pints of shandy – The Times “High up” signs to be put on mountains – BBC Euronotes cause impotence – Daily Mail EU to ban under 16-year-olds from using Facebook – Daily Mail Strawberries must be oval – The Sun EU orders swings to be pulled down – Daily Express Tea bags banned from being recycled – BBC British lav to be replaced with Euro-loo – The Sun Unwanted Valentine’s cards to be defined as sexual harrasment – Daily Telegraph Bosses to be told what colour carpets to buy by EU – Daily Star EU says British yoghurt to be renamed ‘Fermented Milk Pudding’ – Sunday Mirror EU to ban zipper trousers – The Sun
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You forgot the lies about an EU army that our grandchildren will be front rank cannon fodder in. Oh but wait a minute.
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RobertT
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« Reply #3877 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 18:12:46 » |
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The army (Intervention Force) our current elected officials agree is a good idea and were pushing you mean?
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chalkies_shorts
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« Reply #3878 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 18:39:17 » |
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Interesting, as IIRC you voted leave didn't you? Looking back do you regret that? i.e. knowing what you know now (which no-one did at the time) do you think it was always going to turn out badly or do you feel it could/should have worked if it had been planned for and managed properly?
Yep, I voted leave and would vote leave again. I have no regrets at all. I said from day 1 we would not be allowed to leave and I still think it - there's still plenty of twists and turns to come. It still believe it could well have worked but not now. It starts with Cameron and Gideon being complete fuckwits with no planning for a leave vote. They thought a Remain vote was a shoe in but misjudged badly. In fact, they handed it to leave by not selling the benefits and then bringing in a cast of doom mongers. Unfortunately for them they overplayed their hand. Our starting position was shit, partly due to the lack of planning, partly due to triggering Article 50 too quickly. If I had any say in it, I'd have said leave was leave and told everyone to plan for it. I'd have put Farage in charge of negotiations. Behind the scenes, I'd be hoping for a deal but it would certainly put out a declaration of intent. Don't forget these are negotiations. Showing that we no plans for no deal meant we needed a deal and once this is your starting point, you are fucked. We showed we were needy and all the EU had to do was sit tight. I would also have made a commitment to all EU nationals already here that they had the right to stay for life - this is regardless of what the EU want to do with ours. That should be separate to negotiations. I'd also ensure we paid up for things we had committed to prior to the decision to leave but I'd also be investigating whether we could reclaim any assets. Most leavers I know are hard Brexit. I appreciate there will be many flavours of leavers just as there will be for remainers. Some would like the EU to reform, some are happier with a trading block but not political union. It was a 2 option referendum and I'd suggest a very big proportion were not at the extremes but had to jump off the fence one way or the other. If we had a second referendum I'd expect Remain to win but not because they won the argument. It would be because the decision to leave and the absolute fuck up we've made of it become merged when they are two separate things. Then we have Parliament and I can't see May getting anything through Parliament. Yet again the Government have fucked up here. Voting massively to devolve their powers to the electorate when the country wasn't and still isn't educated enough to vote on this. Also the fact that Parliament is disproportionate to the electorate on this issue is a recipe for disaster. So, whats the default - no deal, remain, election??? Nobody has the faintest fucking clue if Brexit will be good or bad - too many unknown variables. All we've got is opinions.
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BambooToTheFuture
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I'll Tell Ya Now - McGurk Is The New Graham
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« Reply #3879 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 19:04:52 » |
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Yep, I voted leave and would vote leave again. I have no regrets at all.
It still believe it could well have worked but not now. It starts with Cameron and Gideon being complete fuckwits with no planning for a leave vote.
Chalkie, serious question mate. I know we had our democratic right to vote Leave or Remain. You're an intelligent (and passionate) man, it would come across. Why would you vote leave if you were aware that the government had no plan or idea in how to execute it? I'm not picking at you, I think the result is as it is (I voted remain) and we (government) should have been working to create the best solution instead of passing the buck over nearly two years. Obviously the remain element didn't need a plan because it would have likely been, to continue as before. I'm just curious that if you knew this, why (democratic right aside) vote for something you knew had no plan?
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'Incessant Nonsense' ______________________________________________________________
'I'm gonna tell you the secret. There's a threat, you end it and you don't feel ashamed about enjoying it. You smell the gunpowder and you see the blood, you know what that means? It means you're alive. You've won. You take the heads so that you don't ever forget.'
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Batch
Not a Batch
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« Reply #3880 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 19:17:03 » |
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cabinet have backed the draft, round 1 to may
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chalkies_shorts
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« Reply #3881 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 19:21:44 » |
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Chalkie, serious question mate. I know we had our democratic right to vote Leave or Remain. You're an intelligent (and passionate) man, it would come across. Why would you vote leave if you were aware that the government had no plan or idea in how to execute it?
I'm not picking at you, I think the result is as it is (I voted remain) and we (government) should have been working to create the best solution instead of passing the buck over nearly two years.
Obviously the remain element didn't need a plan because it would have likely been, to continue as before. I'm just curious that if you knew this, why (democratic right aside) vote for something you knew had no plan?
Because I thought it was the right thing to do. I also thought leave meant leave. Cameron had made that clear numerous times. I genuinely thought it was an in or out vote. Once we voted to leave I thought we'd crack on. I knew there would be issues and had anticipated a transition period but wouldn't have triggered article 50 without a plan.
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BambooToTheFuture
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I'll Tell Ya Now - McGurk Is The New Graham
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« Reply #3882 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 19:43:47 » |
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Because I thought it was the right thing to do. I also thought leave meant leave. Cameron had made that clear numerous times. I genuinely thought it was an in or out vote. Once we voted to leave I thought we'd crack on. I knew there would be issues and had anticipated a transition period but wouldn't have triggered article 50 without a plan.
Appreciate your response. Cheers.
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'Incessant Nonsense' ______________________________________________________________
'I'm gonna tell you the secret. There's a threat, you end it and you don't feel ashamed about enjoying it. You smell the gunpowder and you see the blood, you know what that means? It means you're alive. You've won. You take the heads so that you don't ever forget.'
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Ginginho
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« Reply #3883 on: Wednesday, November 14, 2018, 20:53:32 » |
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Because I thought it was the right thing to do. I also thought leave meant leave. Cameron had made that clear numerous times. I genuinely thought it was an in or out vote. Once we voted to leave I thought we'd crack on. I knew there would be issues and had anticipated a transition period but wouldn't have triggered article 50 without a plan.
Welcome back, John. Hope you're well mate.
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pauld
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« Reply #3884 on: Thursday, November 15, 2018, 08:38:51 » |
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Yep, I voted leave and would vote leave again. I have no regrets at all. I said from day 1 we would not be allowed to leave and I still think it - there's still plenty of twists and turns to come. It still believe it could well have worked but not now. It starts with Cameron and Gideon being complete fuckwits with no planning for a leave vote. They thought a Remain vote was a shoe in but misjudged badly. In fact, they handed it to leave by not selling the benefits and then bringing in a cast of doom mongers. Unfortunately for them they overplayed their hand. Our starting position was shit, partly due to the lack of planning, partly due to triggering Article 50 too quickly. If I had any say in it, I'd have said leave was leave and told everyone to plan for it. I'd have put Farage in charge of negotiations. Behind the scenes, I'd be hoping for a deal but it would certainly put out a declaration of intent. Don't forget these are negotiations. Showing that we no plans for no deal meant we needed a deal and once this is your starting point, you are fucked. We showed we were needy and all the EU had to do was sit tight. I would also have made a commitment to all EU nationals already here that they had the right to stay for life - this is regardless of what the EU want to do with ours. That should be separate to negotiations. I'd also ensure we paid up for things we had committed to prior to the decision to leave but I'd also be investigating whether we could reclaim any assets. Most leavers I know are hard Brexit. I appreciate there will be many flavours of leavers just as there will be for remainers. Some would like the EU to reform, some are happier with a trading block but not political union. It was a 2 option referendum and I'd suggest a very big proportion were not at the extremes but had to jump off the fence one way or the other. If we had a second referendum I'd expect Remain to win but not because they won the argument. It would be because the decision to leave and the absolute fuck up we've made of it become merged when they are two separate things. Then we have Parliament and I can't see May getting anything through Parliament. Yet again the Government have fucked up here. Voting massively to devolve their powers to the electorate when the country wasn't and still isn't educated enough to vote on this. Also the fact that Parliament is disproportionate to the electorate on this issue is a recipe for disaster. So, whats the default - no deal, remain, election??? Nobody has the faintest fucking clue if Brexit will be good or bad - too many unknown variables. All we've got is opinions.
Cheers chalkies, as always a reasonable and well reasoned reply. That's why I asked you.
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