Let's Get Political!

[Reg Smeeton]

technically they didn't get an overall majority, thus further weakening the position and making a GE more likely.

i.e. even a united Tory party would could be hamstring by a united opposition.

(not that either side is united)

No, but the way the system works the Tories did win.  Hammond's budget which bunged money at high earners, and a few quid for some paper, exercise books and erasers at schools, along with some dosh for pot hole filling.... was definitely formulated with an election in mind.

[pauld]

This has been a total fuckfest from day 1. The country being totally unprepared for a referendum. The Government making absolutely no plans for a leave vote. Cameron and Gideon then fucking off. May picking up the baton, triggering article 50 with indecent haste and no planning on the implications of what it meant. Then calling an election and fucking up any authority she had. We then enter negotiations and show how needy we are and in doing so have to take what were given.
All the EU had to do was sit tight, string us along and wait for the tide to turn in the UK. Job done.
If there was a second referendum, I think remain would win  - not necessarily that people think staying is right. It would be more on the basis of the total fuck up we've made of leaving. 

Interesting, as IIRC you voted leave didn't you? Looking back do you regret that? i.e. knowing what you know now (which no-one did at the time) do you think it was always going to turn out badly or do you feel it could/should have worked if it had been planned for and managed properly?

[pauld]

Its BINO

I know I'm going to feel stupid when you tell me, but WTF is BINO?

[Reg Smeeton]

I know I'm going to feel stupid when you tell me, but WTF is BINO?

Brexit in name only

[pauld]

Brexit in name only

Thanks Reg!

[RobertT]

I still don't get why a good old Hard Brexit wasn't worked on - instead of all this pointless negotiating, just spend two years prepping for separation.

If the country voted to leave simply because someone painted a few words on the side of a bus and listened to a Millionaire sup a pint, it deserved to just take the pain of exit.  People were clearly not voting for the Bronze Membership Package downgrade form their current Platinum.  It wasn't too hard to think of the impact of exit and weight that up against the cozy feeling of having some other people run the country for you that you hate just as much.  So we have to accept people preferred that shit vs. what they saw as the status quo shit.

In the same way we had no right to moan about the direction the EU had taken - tough shit if you didn't read up on the plans before voting to join.

Moral of the story, you'll get what you deserve as a collective.  We've chosen to go solo, just get on with it.

[Batch]

if you are in charge and  believe hard brexit would knacker the country, you'd be violating your responsibilities as leader to push for hard brexit.

[pauld]

I still don't get why a good old Hard Brexit wasn't worked on - instead of all this pointless negotiating, just spend two years prepping for separation.

If the country voted to leave simply because someone painted a few words on the side of a bus and listened to a Millionaire sup a pint, it deserved to just take the pain of exit.  People were clearly not voting for the Bronze Membership Package downgrade form their current Platinum.  It wasn't too hard to think of the impact of exit and weight that up against the cozy feeling of having some other people run the country for you that you hate just as much.

In the same way we had no right to moan about the direction the EU had taken - tough shit if you didn't read up on the plans before voting to join.

Moral of the story, you'll get what you deserve as a collective.  We've chosen to go solo, just get on with it.

If the current fuck-up isn't an urgent call to greatly increase the amount of money we spend on secondary education, particularly History, then I don't know what is.

[pauld]

if you are in charge and  believe hard brexit would knacker the country, you'd be violating your responsibilities as leader to push for hard brexit.

But it's just as irresponsible not to prepare for the eventuality. As it is, we don't seem to have prepared for anything. Can we still hang Farage and Johnson for treason?

[RobertT]

And I speak from a country that can't even figure out how to count a vote.  Some of the Counties had over six pages of things to vote on at the same time!!

[Batch]

if you are in charge and  believe hard brexit would knacker the country, you'd be violating your responsibilities as leader to push for hard brexit.

But it's just as irresponsible not to prepare for the eventuality. As it is, we don't seem to have prepared for anything. Can we still hang Farage and Johnson for treason?

if you believe the government, they are preparing for it (yeah right).

but not pushing for it.

[RobertT]

if you are in charge and  believe hard brexit would knacker the country, you'd be violating your responsibilities as leader to push for hard brexit.

Not when that was clearly what people voted for.  We gave the people a choice, they made it.  We abstained from making such complex decisions in the existing electoral process, giving the People the reigns.  The People voted to get out, so just get out.  Prep for that as your primary focus - of course see if the EU will offer any nice customer retention bonuses, but be prepared to fuck off.  That was the Govt. responsibility.  Unfair on May because Cameron should have been doing it, but she took the job.

[RobertT]

Oh, and if they ever did decide to go for a 2nd Referendum it should be on a) Hard Brexit, no deals) b) Brexit with the deal on offer.  Staying should not be an option, not for at least another 5 years or so.

[Reg Smeeton]

But it's just as irresponsible not to prepare for the eventuality. As it is, we don't seem to have prepared for anything. Can we still hang Farage and Johnson for treason?

We have prepared.... originally Davis claimed to have lost the impact studies, but then found them, they're the ones about turning the M26 into lorry park, stockpiling food and getting the military involved...

[Batch]

Not when that was clearly what people voted for. 

Its anything but clear. Its only a 2% swing to equality in the vote. I bet 2% didn't want hard brexit once they knew the consequences.

A weak win is a win but what do you reckon "the will of the people" would now be between May's compromise, Remain or Hard Brexit?

I'm not suggesting we will hold ref #2. But a compromise deal was always the likely outcome.