New beginnings - 25% Truth, 80% Bollocks

[theakston2k]

Thanks. My view is that all season ticket holders should have voting rights - not just those who pay to be members of the trust. If that meant long term an extra tenner on the price of a season ticket I’d be all for that. Note: all season ticket holders are automatically members of the supporters club.

Or you just join the Trust.

As usual you are completely missing the point of how the ownership of the ground has been set up. 50% of the ground is owned by the Trust so by definition you can only have people who are members of the Trust vote on it. Having a season ticket is completely unrelated to ownership of the ground and decisions on its future.

Unlike the supporters club the Trust needs to be independent of the club and hold it to account so completely different things so couldn’t be included with season tickets.

[horlock07]

I mentioned this in a matchday thread a few weeks back, our pitch is actually one of the better in this division at the moment and thats really saying something.

It made me smile all the complaints about  the pitch (IIRC) at Grimsby, which was probably 20x's better than what you would have encountered in even the Championship 20 years ago. Modern players are bloody spoilt!  

[4D]

Well to be fair, the ball spends 85% of the time in the air in this league. Pitches are fine.

[Peter Venkman]

It made me smile all the complaints about  the pitch (IIRC) at Grimsby, which was probably 20x's better than what you would have encountered in even the Championship 20 years ago. Modern players are bloody spoilt! 

True that!

[tans]

I particularly like this answer in the AB questions - do they get a 12 year old to write these answers?

- Can the club confirm the Fair Game annual report will provide a detailed
breakdown of administrative costs and a profit and loss account as alluded to in
the previous AB?

Swindon Town can confirm that a full breakdown of administrative costs will not be
included in the Fair Game report. We have advised Fair Game to breakdown the
Administrative Costs in as much detail as possible

[4D]

My question to that would be WHY NOT?

[Matchworn Shirts]

Well well well, its as if they are taking the piss out of us isnt it.

My thoughts exactly

[Ƭ̵̬̊: The Artist Formerly Known as CWIG]

My question to that would be WHY NOT?

Because that would be really bad for them.

[STFC_Manc]

My question to that would be WHY NOT?

Out of curiosity, does any of club provide a detailed breakdown of admin expenses and what do you mean by detailed? (As you have said why not)

[RobertT]

Or you just join the Trust.

As usual you are completely missing the point of how the ownership of the ground has been set up. 50% of the ground is owned by the Trust so by definition you can only have people who are members of the Trust vote on it. Having a season ticket is completely unrelated to ownership of the ground and decisions on its future.

Unlike the supporters club the Trust needs to be independent of the club and hold it to account so completely different things so couldn’t be included with season tickets.

Indeed, and there was a lot of work put in to determine a structure that showed the fans had the intent to back the proposals and ownership of the ground to convince the Council to sell at the rate they did.  I believe the Trust had to show significant commitment from fans to underpin it being a Community movement as opposed to just a small collection of people trying to get their hands on the freehold.

Bob does have one point worth further discussion, and that was in relation to my posed question, which is o what extent this is about developing the ground vs. trying to increase the value of the business ahead of any sale.  As DV mentioned, from a buyers prospective, the ownership and operational entanglement issues are the single biggest hurdle preventing people moving beyond interest to intent (I cannot say how, but I know this for a fact).  From Morfuni's though, this may be a way to get some cash upfront vs. the other scenario of people offering to pay his debt back, maybe over time.

[RobertT]

Out of curiosity, does any of club provide a detailed breakdown of admin expenses and what do you mean by detailed? (As you have said why not)

You know the answer, we've had this before.  Very few do.  All should.  Barely any have to.  The STFC ownership stressed transparency, but act no different.  It doesn't really matter - buyers would dig into it, and it is what lies beneath that creates caution, and they'd never put that in public anyway.

[STFC_Manc]

You know the answer, we've had this before.  Very few do.  All should.  Barely any have to.  The STFC ownership stressed transparency, but act no different.  It doesn't really matter - buyers would dig into it, and it is what lies beneath that creates caution, and they'd never put that in public anyway.

Isn't this the point, the club has said transparency but never defined it.

No business gives a detailed breakdown of admin expenses, so given the the previous level of accounts was in my view being transparent,.however they have gone backwards since.

[RobertT]

Isn't this the point, the club has said transparency but never defined it.

No business gives a detailed breakdown of admin expenses, so given the the previous level of accounts was in my view being transparent,.however they have gone backwards since.

It's a small part of a bigger picture.  In isolation, the original accounts was not an issue - in fact, very few people knocked the switch to providing a P&L without any admin cost breakdown until a few other dominos fell.  That is the point, not this in isolation, the combination of things, showing that all the talk at the start was PR and that reality was a bit more of what we had under Power, just without the footballing brains trust or anyone with any idea how to run a football club.  Even that Zav Austin appearance in the linked video isn't some sort of smoking gun, but when you add it into the mix, it's another little bit of evidence that we have been sold a kipper.  The big question is how do we get them to be a part of our past instead of our future and that is tough precisely because their claims of transparency are actually the absolute inverse of what people find.

[STFC_Manc]

That is the point though, this isn't something that anyone does or will do. So why keep bringing it up as the club  isn't being transparent? At no point did I see anything to say that they will publish a breakdown of all costs.

[Bob1978]

Or you just join the Trust.

As usual you are completely missing the point of how the ownership of the ground has been set up. 50% of the ground is owned by the Trust so by definition you can only have people who are members of the Trust vote on it. Having a season ticket is completely unrelated to ownership of the ground and decisions on its future.

Unlike the supporters club the Trust needs to be independent of the club and hold it to account so completely different things so couldn’t be included with season tickets.

1) No reason why the trust couldn’t make season ticket holders members or associate members with voting rights - it would be more democratic than those with strong views paying £20 to vote.
2) The supporters club is independent of the club - more so than the trust actually because they aren’t involved in the JV