New beginnings - 25% Truth, 80% Bollocks

[RobertT]

I wonder if Manc can enlighten the rest of us as to why Clem seems unable (not unwilling, it's written as if he is not allowed) to write off the debt owed to him by STFC and/or convert to equity?

I'd probably wager it's because he wants some or all of that back when he does manage to shift the club on.  That is a personal choice though, not the way they responded to the question.  I also imagine he is exposed within his other businesses if he has to record a loss, somehow.  He has already shifted a portion from personal Director loans to Axis - and yes, it is still ultimately just him, but he is more protected by having that via a company than a personal loan.

[Frigby Daser]

Probably means can’t match it as opposed to won’t match it.

Honestly, I dread to think what is being hidden from sight. To think, I was uplifted when Power got replaced, but the old adage of being careful for what you wish for has never rung truer.

Just for once, surely we deserve an honest owner.

That’s right. My point was that the pre-emption rights significantly reduce the possibility that Morfuni cuts his losses, and accepts a low bid from an unconnected third party. I’d been harbouring this hope for some time. The pre-emption rights mean that if someone else comes in with a low bid, Keily/Parladorio/Austin/Standing can match it in order to continue to use the club for whatever reason they have to be involved at present, whatever that may be. I just struggle to see where it ends.

[horlock07]

I wonder if Manc can enlighten the rest of us as to why Clem seems unable (not unwilling, it's written as if he is not allowed) to write off the debt owed to him by STFC and/or convert to equity?

I'd probably wager it's because he wants some or all of that back when he does manage to shift the club on.  That is a personal choice though, not the way they responded to the question.  I also imagine he is exposed within his other businesses if he has to record a loss, somehow.  He has already shifted a portion from personal Director loans to Axis - and yes, it is still ultimately just him, but he is more protected by having that via a company than a personal loan.

I'd always assumed that it was a given that he would want back whatever he has put in (albeit how much of that was his remains unknown) its not like he was a fan or anything its purely a business transaction at the end of the day? I also wonder whether there are some accounting benefits of having a heavily loss making business within the wider portfolio to possibly offset tax or other liabilities if one is making cash elsewhere (for clarity not suggesting anything nefarious, just tax planning?

That’s right. My point was that the pre-emption rights significantly reduce the possibility that Morfuni cuts his losses, and accepts a low bid from an unconnected third party. I’d been harbouring this hope for some time. The pre-emption rights mean that if someone else comes in with a low bid, Keily/Parladorio/Austin/Standing can match it in order to continue to use the club for whatever reason they have to be involved at present, whatever that may be. I just struggle to see where it ends.

Isn't this exactly what happened with Power, agreed to 'sell' to Able for a possibly low figure, Morfuni got wind of it and voila got the club for a song. I thought they had closed the pre-emption loophole by changing the AoA after Morfuni took over, but perhaps not.

[RobertT]

It is, Morfuni didn't get wind, he was "nudged"  by Zav Austin, hence the later doorstep beating.

[Audrey]

Clem would be an idiot not the change the pre-emption rights.

So, that being the case, he probably hasn’t.

[Peter Venkman]

I'd always assumed that it was a given that he would want back whatever he has put in (albeit how much of that was his remains unknown)

Not as much as he would like to tell the fans from what I have heard, lots of those loans coming from "associates" and not Clems own bank account.

[RobertT]

On the debt thing, I agree - he is clearly retaining it as debt because it has benefits for him financially.  Not least, in any negotiation to sell the club - better to be owed money than have it as equity which has since diminished in value.  If he was an altruistic owner, he'd be converting it or writing it off (no chance).  That is his choice to make of course, I just thought the wording was a bit odd - like someone was making him keep it as debt.

[Audrey]

Tbf, Power was the master of using other people’s money to fund the club.

Standing and Abramovich spring to mind. Whatever happened about that Abramovich ‘loan’?

[RobertT]

Clem would be an idiot not the change the pre-emption rights.

So, that being the case, he probably hasn’t.

I'd imagine they are in there specifically because of the loan to pay off the Debenture, acting as a sort of security.  As we will unlikely ever see the terms of that deal, we can only speculate, but they changed at the same time.

[horlock07]

Clem would be an idiot not the change the pre-emption rights.

So, that being the case, he probably hasn’t.

I have neither the time nor inclination to go though the multitude of AoA in any detail. This https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/08462753/filing-history suggests that it was resolved to remove some pre-emption rights in October 2022 but who knows, it what I have always based what I am happy to admit is a simple assumption upon.

[tans]

It is, Morfuni didn't get wind, he was "nudged"  by Zav Austin, hence the later doorstep beating.

Dont think morals come into play here, i reckon it was out of spite and something else to be honest being nudged by Zav

[tans]

Tbf, Power was the master of using other people’s money to fund the club.

Standing and Abramovich spring to mind. Whatever happened about that Abramovich ‘loan’?

How the fuck did that fat cockney wideboy even negotiate a loan from Abramovich anyway? Its mental!

[No Longer Posh Red]

How the fuck did that fat cockney wideboy even negotiate a loan from Abramovich anyway? Its mental!

Wasn’t it a case of trying to circumnavigate the FFP rules.
It gets loaned to the football club, who then pay it to Chelsea in loan fees, so it appears as income for Chelsea, STFC get players on loan (basically for free). The money was going to be given to Chelsea anyway so Abramovich isn’t actually out of pocket. Didn’t he do it with several clubs, at that time that Chelsea had dozens of players out on loan?

[tans]

Wasn’t it a case of trying to circumnavigate the FFP rules.
It gets loaned to the football club, who then pay it to Chelsea in loan fees, so it appears as income for Chelsea, STFC get players on loan (basically for free). The money was going to be given to Chelsea anyway so Abramovich isn’t actually out of pocket. Didn’t he do it with several clubs, at that time that Chelsea had dozens of players out on loan?

No idea

Would have been good if the loans were half decent, they were all shite

[tans]

Sam in the Moonraker today posing the question as to why everything seems to be on hold, from contracts (Holloway, Ameen) to ground development to season tickets. No answers, but the right questions.

The one thing I learned from the article is that the Club Secretary guy who left left to join... Eastleigh. Hmm.

One of them on the facebook group claiming season tickets arent being announced yet until people know if they are moving seats due to redevlopment

 We dont even have planning permission yet as the plans havent even been approved by the JV and voted in. Plus im pretty sure planning wont be quick either?!?

Think you will be waiting a while there fella