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RobertT

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« Reply #195 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 02:40:40 »

It's as if we sent a team of Village Fucking Idiots to face up to the Windies 80's bowling attack.  This lot are a National embarrassment, which in the long run may be the only small crumb that can be rtaken from this series.  If they had shown a bit of fight, got a bit closer in some games, then the powers that be and the team could have argued about "but for a bit of luck", "tried hard in tough conditions" etc.

As it is, they are a fucking disgrace, but only a symptom of the issues facing England at Test level.  It's been coming a while, which leads me to another gripe while sitting through this....

The in studio team BT Sport put together is just as fucking bad.  What is the point of asking a current international team mate (even if in the white ball game) or even recent retiree to provide "insight"  Ali is a puppet sat on a sofa, one without anyone hand up his arse to provide any sort of entertainment as Sooty and Sweep surely would have mustered.

Worse though is Cook.  It's like someone plonked a cardboard cutout on the sofa to provide analysis.  Don't get me wrong, great player and clearly has some thoughts on the technique side, but no appetite to provide any sort of critical analysis whatsoever.  "The Aussies have bowled well".  It's fucking Test cricket you plonk, they aren't going to chuck some underarms balls down the wicket for us.  To be honest, the current state of affairs, I think, goes back to him as Captain.  I can't believe his captaincy (after listening to him here) provided anything of value to any player, and probably relied on his ability with the bat to motivate.  He seems even more dull than I expected, defensive as hell (tactically) and has helped sew the seeds of what we no have at Test level.  A team full of nobodies, maybe Broad being the only one with a personality and a bit of bite in him.  It's a sad state of affairs that we revere Stokes when he is little more than average at Test level, relying on his undoubted brilliance in the short form.

I applaud the job we did in turning around our short form performances, but we've sacrificed Test cricket at the alter to do it, it would seem.

ECB should refund the fans tickets and air fares and bring them home early, abandon the series.  Or send out 11 fans and show the cricketing world just how seriously they have taken it.
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Pookemon

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« Reply #196 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 06:54:38 »

At least wood - who shouldn't be batting at 8 in any form of cricket - is showing a bit of fight.  Scored more than the top 4 managed and will be going past the openers' totals for the series soon.
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Hunk

« Reply #197 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 07:19:43 »

100 for Bairstow. Well done that man.
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Pookemon

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« Reply #198 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 07:33:52 »

Absolutely - 100 in a series is good in this team to do it in one innings with backs to the wall is a great effort.

Just seen that in 2021 Crawley had 16 innings and scored just 173 runs.

Why was he even on the tour?  

There just doesn't seem to be anyone removed from the team tapping the coach on the shoulder and saying "I know you've invested alot into him and he's a great lad to have around but he's utter dogshite!  I saw this bloke playing at Gloucester who looks worth a punt"
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Nemo
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« Reply #199 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 08:36:31 »

He was picked originally because he went to Ed Smith's school, and then made that beautiful 273 against Pakistan which has basically guaranteed him a career.

Robt, I must say your overnight rant was a joy to read, especially knowing England showed a bit of fight after! I would say on Ali/Cook though, that if you haven't seen the clip of Ali criticising Cook's captaincy whilst sat next to him, you should seek it out. Glorious stuff.

Fair play to Bairstow and Stokes and Wood for showing some fight. And I see Stokes was bowled and the bails didn't fall off, which does at least provide some comedy.
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Moss

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« Reply #200 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 09:40:36 »

It's as if we sent a team of Village Fucking Idiots to face up to the Windies 80's bowling attack.  This lot are a National embarrassment, which in the long run may be the only small crumb that can be rtaken from this series.  If they had shown a bit of fight, got a bit closer in some games, then the powers that be and the team could have argued about "but for a bit of luck", "tried hard in tough conditions" etc.

As it is, they are a fucking disgrace, but only a symptom of the issues facing England at Test level.  It's been coming a while, which leads me to another gripe while sitting through this....

The in studio team BT Sport put together is just as fucking bad.  What is the point of asking a current international team mate (even if in the white ball game) or even recent retiree to provide "insight"  Ali is a puppet sat on a sofa, one without anyone hand up his arse to provide any sort of entertainment as Sooty and Sweep surely would have mustered.

Worse though is Cook.  It's like someone plonked a cardboard cutout on the sofa to provide analysis.  Don't get me wrong, great player and clearly has some thoughts on the technique side, but no appetite to provide any sort of critical analysis whatsoever.  "The Aussies have bowled well".  It's fucking Test cricket you plonk, they aren't going to chuck some underarms balls down the wicket for us.  To be honest, the current state of affairs, I think, goes back to him as Captain.  I can't believe his captaincy (after listening to him here) provided anything of value to any player, and probably relied on his ability with the bat to motivate.  He seems even more dull than I expected, defensive as hell (tactically) and has helped sew the seeds of what we no have at Test level.  A team full of nobodies, maybe Broad being the only one with a personality and a bit of bite in him.  It's a sad state of affairs that we revere Stokes when he is little more than average at Test level, relying on his undoubted brilliance in the short form.

I applaud the job we did in turning around our short form performances, but we've sacrificed Test cricket at the alter to do it, it would seem.

ECB should refund the fans tickets and air fares and bring them home early, abandon the series.  Or send out 11 fans and show the cricketing world just how seriously they have taken it.

Sorry that is a bit harsh. No prep, locked in bubbles, Covid in the camp, no warm up games. Jimmy Anderson or Mark Wood no personality? Stokes little more than average Test player?  I'm as disappointed as anyone (can't believe how much sleep I've given up for such a load of toss) and there is a serious problem with preparing English players with the skills to compete at Test level but I think you are being a bit hysterical.
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RobertT

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« Reply #201 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 12:28:21 »

Let me know what Stokes' Test averages for both batting and bowling are again?  Other than Root there isn't a test quality batsman in our squad or even near it and because of that, like Cook before him, he ends up as default captain, a job for which he is clearly not suited.

Anderson is a star quality bowler, he doesn't imprint his personality on a game.  I'm not talking about how he talks off the pitch either.  I'm talking in a cricketing sense.  Broad has something, although it's more often displayed against his fellow team mates.  I'm not having much of a pop at the bowlers though, although Leach is a problem.  They've not bowled the right length often enough, but given they all seem to do it I have to assume it comes from coaching and how we prepare.

Covid is an excuse that is fair enough, but both teams have been impacted, Australia to the point of having players needing to drop out.  The prep is our own fault to degree and goes back to my major criticism which is the way we have approached Test cricket for the past 10 years or so.  You'll note I called the team a symptom, not the cause.
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Nemo
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« Reply #202 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 12:44:26 »

Last four years (2018-present), Stokes averages in tests, not elite on the world stage but better than anyone else we have, ignoring the fact he bowls a bit and is a good fielder. Fwiw, since 2018

Root 46.17
Stokes 37.01
Buttler 32.49
Foakes 31.53
Burns 30.92
Pope 29.79
Denly 29.53
Sibley 28.94
Lawrence 27.23
Crawley 26.62
Malan 25.23
Roy 18.70
Hameed 17.58

It's a sorry old mess.
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RobertT

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« Reply #203 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 12:56:46 »

In the 1990-1999 period, when we were shit and before the introduction of Central Contracts (which did have a positive impact on test cricket in this country for a period), 8 batsmen had an average of 34 or higher who played at least 20 Tests in that period.  Hick with 34 being the lowest, someone who never really achieved anything much of note in Test cricket.

Stokes with 37 is OK, average for a Test top 6 batsman, nothing more.  He is a different beast in the shorter forms of the game, of that there is no doubt.  That's the problem, the past ten years have created players who are only much kop at the money spinning versions.  Stokes would be the 8th best batsman of the 90's for us!!
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fittons_coaching_badge

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« Reply #204 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 13:36:12 »

Without Archer and Stone, and with a ropey batting line up, a star all rounder who comes into the series without any cricket for 4 months and off the  back of mental health problems this was always going to be a hill to steep but I did hope for a more competitive series as I still don't think Australia are that good.

Sam Billings has been called up with injury concerns over YJB and Buttler so I expect he will play in 5th Test which is harsh on Ben Foakes. 

I think the squad for the 3 tests in WI in March will make really interesting reading.

Will they take both Broad and Anderson?
I would expect Saqib Mahmood to debut. I think Archer is out until the summer and if I'm honest I think his test cricket days are done but will Oliver Stone be available?
Would mind seeing Brydon Carse given a go/
I would like them to invest properly in a Mason Crane or Matt Parkinson.
I like the opener at Warks (Yates I think)
Bohannon from Lancs has been getting good wrap and was part of the Lions squad.
Will they persist with any of a Crawley/Hameed/Burns?  Will Sibley get called up again?

A lot of questions for me ...

Also Root as captain.  As Stokes is the only one people will call a viable option but I dont think he is I'd like to see Root carry on, but with a new coach.  Kirsten or Jayawardene for me.
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Nomoreheroes
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« Reply #205 on: Friday, January 7, 2022, 15:12:42 »

Time to rebuild the batting, bowling and keeping.

We have another Jack Russell issue. Foakes is the best natural keeper in the country but they dont think he can bat well enough. So, we have tried to convert Bairstow and Buttler into a keeper. Bracey is also in the wings but his nervous debut showed he is a way off as either a test keeper or batsman.

We have to address the fact that our two best bowlers are past their best and reaching the end of the line. Time to let Anderson and Broad move into media careers. Their replacements aren't ready but need to develop quickly. I know Broad got 5 wickets in the 1st innings of this test, but a few years ago he wouldnt have conceeded 100 runs to do so. He's just a couple of mph too slow now. Anderson is the same, but when you start off as one of the all time greats, the decline takes a while to properly kick in.

All rounders. I think Stokes and Bairstow are the only two good enough in this category.

We should persist with Root and Malan. They are the only players capable of batting long, but even then I have doubts over Malan. I fear that all of the other batsmen that England have flirted with are 'dashers'. They have achieved their averages by being flat track bullies or being able to score a quick 50 and get out. You need 3-4 players capable of batting for more than a day once a series to be a good test team.

Of the other batsmen, I fear they are either 20-50 over specialists or technically flawed. Hameed has regressed significantly since debut. Burns is inconsistent and has terrible technique. Crawley is a bowling machine batsman. Sibley a technically flawed crab. Bairstow a lower order bottom handed swisher. Buttler a 20 over player. Pope is the interesting one - Good technique, but either can't read spin or is mentally shot. (I think he is worth persisting with). Billings is a bottom handed one day lower order average wicket keeper.

In conclusion, I see the problems, but not necessarily the answers!
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Nemo
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« Reply #206 on: Saturday, January 8, 2022, 10:02:47 »

Better day for Leach today, shows what a spinner can do when the game actually gets to the fourth day, which hasn't exactly been often in recent times. He's not Swann by any means, and is a better attacking bowler than he is a defensive one, but he's the best we have.

Not really worth complaining about captaincy again, but that's two innings in a row where Khawaja has been within one shot of a hundred and we've bought on Dawid Malan's filthy leggies. At least put some pressure on him, for goodness sakes.

Must say this test has been broadly in line with my expectation for the series - Aus a better team, but not by an embarrassing margin and moments for England. It's just that the first few tests were so wildly in Aus' favour that it's painful.
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Nomoreheroes
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« Reply #207 on: Saturday, January 8, 2022, 11:11:36 »

I watched until lunch - Thought we went too defensive too quickly. Got a couple of wickets despite doing so though. Pope looked a better keeper than Buttler and Bairstow! Not sure what I hope for. Would 30-40 runs each for the openers be a good thing or a bad one?  Would a rain influence draw paper over the cracks?

Another low score for Hameed and not outs from Root and Malan would be the best we could hope for.
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Nemo
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« Reply #208 on: Sunday, January 9, 2022, 11:54:38 »

We didn't lose!
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adje

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« Reply #209 on: Sunday, January 9, 2022, 12:24:47 »

Root "proud"
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