Let's Get Political!

[horlock07]

On a brighter note worth bearing in mind when the media are getting all a lather (again) about Farage, parties of the left or centre left have won more than 500 seats in this election, no previous parliament has come close to that. Also in terms of votes cast Reform have done little better than UKIP did in 2015, so an alternative question which could be asked if we are getting more right wing is why are they not growing their vote?

[Audrey]

Because people are voting for anybody but the Tories. A lot of the Labour/Lib Dem gains are purely by default.

Quite rightly, people have decided that any old bollocks must be better than the Tories.

[4D]

If the mainstream parties could sort their shit out and get a handle on the illegal immigration then there would be no anti immigration parties popping up every few years.

[Audrey]

Don’t think that particular genie can be put back in the bottle.

But there needs to be some sort of plan for those that are here - and those coming - otherwise they’ll be thousands of disaffected young men with no future.

[Cookie]

Immigration is tame now compared to what global warming will cause. Right wingers should therefore be all over net zero.

[Audrey]

Net zero is a crock.

Ask the experts how much global temperatures will drop after spending trillions of taxpayers money on net zero and they haven’t a clue.

Even more so when China/India etc are building coal fired power stations and using cheap Russian oil.

CHINA - China opens its new coal transportation rail network.

100 new coal fired power stations to add to the 3095 all needed to provide the West with products, including solar panels.

So we can pretend we are carbon neutral.

[Nemo]

How many experts have you asked Aud?

[Audrey]

Don’t need to ask. These are the ‘experts’ predictions in years gone by. No reason to believe present day experts are any more reliable.



Here’s how they skewered this one

https://www.kennedy.senate.gov/public/2023/5/kennedy-to-biden-official-you-want-us-to-spend-50t-and-you-don-t-know-if-it-s-going-to-reduce-world-temperatures

[4D]

Yep, the West cranking up the net zero, whilst the engine rooms of the world crank up coal fired power stations.

[Nemo]

Ah yes, someone got something wrong once so there is simply no point believing any future projections or predictions. That seems a coherent and convincing argument, well done Aud.

[Audrey]

Once?

[ron dodgers]

I would legalise all immigration, thus removing all illegal immigration at a stroke.
Ron for President

[RobertT]

I wouldn't trust your source Aud as far as you can throw him, idiot that chap.

Not that I am saying the science of climate change is simple and easy to predict, but you have a chap quoting absolute specificity, which the majority never claim.  So he has chosen individual quotes rather than research output.

The claim about oil was based on the reserves of what had been identified - we know it is a finite resource, we just don't really know exactly how much there is and where.  We do know that getting it means going into more places and destroying them and we do know that pegging yourself to a single source of energy is a really bad idea for prices - see the recent energy price increases.

The claim about Ozone - well, we won't ever know for sure as we did something about it and quickly.  Evidence suggests we had an impact and that the Ozone layer continues to "heal".

On the Ice Caps - I would be amazed if the quote wasn't one specific scenario rather than perceived wisdom.  Nobody of real gravitas is going to tie themselves to specifics - we know the general patterns and potential impact of those patterns.  We know the sea levels have risen and have become warmer.  We know there is more CO2 in the atmosphere and we know that global temps have risen and continue to rise.  We know that has bad results when it comes to the weather and the conditions under which we, as a species, have chosen to live.

And so on.

You want simple answers to complex problems, nobody worth their salt is going to give them.

What we do know is that conditions in the world AS IS are having direct impacts on the lives of people and are a contributory factor on those people moving.  Some is caused by climate, some is caused by human population growth.  Drinking pints in a Wetherpsoons and ranting about THEM, or THEY, isn't going to solve much though.  That is where Farage is an issue in the longer term, if people believe in his ramblings designed to make him money.  In the short term, his inane babble meant the right leaning populists of the UK managed to create the optimum conditions for a left leaning, climate change accepting, love everyone in the alphabet party to gain power.  Which lets be honest, works out just fine for Farage, less so his followers.

[Audrey]

I’m not denying the climate is changing. I’m convinced net zero won’t make a jot of difference - apart from rinsing the people.

But surely it’s a fair question to ask what the trillions of pounds/dollars/euro spent on net zero will deliver in terms of global temperatures dropping.

[RobertT]

I’m not denying the climate is changing. I’m convinced net zero won’t make a jot of difference - apart from rinsing the people.

But surely it’s a fair question to ask what the trillions of pounds/dollars/euro spent on net zero will deliver in terms of global temperatures dropping.

What about the Trillions that Oil companies take from Governments (Subsidies, Tax breaks etc.)? or the cost to extract? or the commoditisation of the fuel itself?  Even if Net Zero doesn't change the path of the climate, what is wrong with investing in innovation to make things more efficient in their use of energy?