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Author Topic: Leyton Orient v Swindon pre match chat and matchday thread  (Read 8510 times)
JoeMezz

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« Reply #300 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 09:49:12 »

Orient fans very complimentary about us although a couple are saying we lost out heads in the second half.

We really did. It’s very easy to see why McKirdy is disliked at Port Vale. He’s been largely good for us but his fuse is gone in an instant
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Jimmy Qunt

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« Reply #301 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 09:51:39 »

He definitely loses the plot easily
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Shrivvy Road

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« Reply #302 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 09:53:55 »

If he wasn't a character he would come in for a lot more criticism than he does
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Berniman
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« Reply #303 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 09:54:43 »

Think the current page of pots are extremely accurate.

We play like a Premier League clubs under 23s. We keep possession and like to pass the ball & you know what for our level we are very good at it - we can/will/do open teams up with it and beat them.

I’d be confident going up against any ‘footballing’ football team in the bottom two divisions. Probably give some Championship teams a good game of football too.

Think if we got dragged into a bit of scrap we’d get done every time.

Bit much to say we are all style and no substance because we are winning more football matches than we lose

…but…I’ve yet to see us employ any sort of plan b or different style of play when the ‘total football’ doesn’t work and we’ve certainly not been in a scrap.

I get football as a whole (and particularly grass roots up) are trying to move away from bully boy tactics and focus on nothing but football but at the end of the day it’s still a competitive sport and sometimes you have to change your tactics/style to win.

Dunno whether we have that mean streak in us.

I think this is spot on - I actually think this side is more suited to Lge1 than Lge 2, which is encouraging if we actualy did manage to get up.  We haven't had any players capable of the ugly side of the game for quite a few seasons (maybe Grant, but I think he is better than just that)
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The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey

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« Reply #304 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 10:02:35 »

Orient didn’t employ any rough house tactics. They uncovered our weaknesses and exploited them - as good sides should. Get crosses into the box, our defenders piss and panic, take advantage.

This is where I don’t think Garner really studies the opposition at all. It’s all about how we play and pay no attention to the opposition and their strengths and weaknesses. It’s as if our football will overcome no matter what the opposition do. Garner seems to be a very good coach but a tactician he ain’t.
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DiV
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« Reply #305 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 10:39:32 »

I think this is spot on - I actually think this side is more suited to Lge1 than Lge 2, which is encouraging if we actualy did manage to get up.  We haven't had any players capable of the ugly side of the game for quite a few seasons (maybe Grant, but I think he is better than just that)

Grant can (could?) no doubt play football but there is nothing wrong with a footballer having multiple string to their bow.

More prevalent the lower down you go because the quality gets lower but just because someone is a shithousing tackler doesn’t mean they can’t play football too.

Whilst he’s now a caricature of himself as a pundit - Roy Keane is mostly remember as a thug tackler, fight starting, dirty midfielder - which he was…but…people forget he could actually play football as well…
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Peter Venkman
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« Reply #306 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 10:44:11 »

Football is a game about scoring goals and not letting in goals, its not rocket science, all the passing and play is largely totally irrelevant.

If you score goals and don't concede then you will win games.

Orient didnt really look like conceding against our forwards other than the well worked goal which may or may not have been offside.

Yet, every time they broke they looked like scoring against our poor centre backs yesterday with some good deliveries and 2 experienced strikers that attack the ball.

Its rare that almost all our defence play that badly at the same time.

If Garner truly wants us to gain promotion then the January window will tell us all we need to know, if he buys players with some experience and know how who can change our style ala Grant, Doyle etc then we will be going for it, if we go for young untested players possibly on loan from Premier sides then it will be exactly as we are now.

Which basically means some good some bad and results showing the same thing and us threatening at times and looking poor at other times with poor consistancy and a percieved lack of "dirty work" when needed.

As it stands it was a blip and a bad day at the office, hopefully that will change again on Saturday and we can get back to winning ways. No knee jerk, this is all stuff we can all see all season for those of us that have watched every game.

Garner does seem very very stubborn in his way of playing and often refusing to change things, something my Rovers supporting mate told me about prior to him signing which I laughed off and said different clubs different styles etc.

Will be a big window for Garner and team so lets see what it brings in a few weeks, I and all fans would love us to be a self sustaining club getting rejected youngsters in and coaching them to a better standard and selling them on for huge profit.

But, there is no need to fill the side with such prospects you need some more experienced pros to settle the ship on the pitch and get you results who can help these players on and off the pitch too, its a very fine balance.

Yesterday for example, we had only Payne starting and Williams who came off the bench with more than 120 league games under their belt, and yes that included Gladwin!
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« Reply #307 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 10:46:28 »

Good post and clear for all to see.
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Red Frog
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« Reply #308 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 11:23:35 »

I think this is spot on - I actually think this side is more suited to Lge1 than Lge 2, which is encouraging if we actualy did manage to get up.  We haven't had any players capable of the ugly side of the game for quite a few seasons (maybe Grant, but I think he is better than just that)

I don't think our defence is close to L1 standard, and we've actually been pushing our luck in this league for several weeks. We made the mistake of not strengthening last time we went up, and if we don't get organised quicker, play as a tighter unit and get better at the basics then we'll be lucky to make an auto place, let alone survive at the level above with our current options.
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Berniman
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« Reply #309 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 11:24:07 »

Grant can (could?) no doubt play football but there is nothing wrong with a footballer having multiple string to their bow.

More prevalent the lower down you go because the quality gets lower but just because someone is a shithousing tackler doesn’t mean they can’t play football too.

Whilst he’s now a caricature of himself as a pundit - Roy Keane is mostly remember as a thug tackler, fight starting, dirty midfielder - which he was…but…people forget he could actually play football as well…

Agreed.  Not to the same degree but as an example look at Alan McCormack when he was with us.  A very good football player but able to mix it up when needed (he's the only one that came to mind, but there are probably better examples).  SSP was capable of a bit of rough housing as well as being a very good player.

To Audrey's point, LO didn't deploy rough house tactics I agree, but there was a different level of physicallity about the make up of their team that we couldn't cope with - the same can be said about our matches with Harrogate and Port Vale.  We are a very small team in certain areas, you don't usually see many 5' 8" defensive midfielders unless you have Makelele or Kante in your midfield.
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« Reply #310 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 11:35:46 »

LO may have not employed rough house tactics but we *might* have been able to stop them *if* we *had* employed rough house tactics.
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Berniman
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« Reply #311 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 12:38:30 »

LO may have not employed rough house tactics but we *might* have been able to stop them *if* we *had* employed rough house tactics.

Exactly, but that takes me back to my point that we don't really have the personel capable of playing like that, and as others have said this doesn't match with the managers football philosophies..
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« Reply #312 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 12:54:05 »

Exactly, but that takes me back to my point that we don't really have the personel capable of playing like that, and as others have said this doesn't match with the managers football philosophies..

I stand by my assertion that Garners career will eventually edge towards Senior Development style roles in big clubs.  You can see what he does and he seems to do it quite well.

Guardiola may be the pinnacle of such coaches, in their minds, but he's more than a coach.  Sure, he gets his teams playing a certain way, and they don't vary a massive amount once built.  Yet compare his Barcelona team with his current Man City team - the former were all over teams when they lost possession and played with very wide attacking fullbacks while overloading the middle with tricky forward thinking players.  The latter has fullbacks that are encouraged to come in and support them midfield with an entire army of forward thinking players who drift wide.  He can deploy different version of the same style.

Also, in both teams, he was successful when deploying someone in front of the back four who liked to kick the other team (Busquets) or players who would happily drag or kick a player to avoid a counter attack (Rodri, Fernandinho).  His Bracelona team swarmed, the Man City team likes a cheeky foul.  Both teams were designed knowing that for 30% of the game the other team would have the ball and you need a way to stop them.
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JoeMezz

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« Reply #313 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 13:31:18 »

Just watched the goals back and I'm sorry to say but Conroy has had an absolute shocker.
1) Man runs in front of him
2) Man runs in front of him
3) Man runs in front of him
4) Gets licked for pace for shot leading to rebound.

KKH also didn't cover himself in glory for allowing 2 crosses to come into the box so easily.

Saying that, Vigs made a brilliant save at 1-1 (went through bodies and was a lot more impressive in person than highlights suggest). Game could have turned our way then, but our luck had run out on the road. Time to turn the home form around!
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Dr Pierre Chang
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« Reply #314 on: Wednesday, December 8, 2021, 13:42:51 »

At times I see some parallels with our backline of 14/15…a right wing bank whose best attributes are attacking (Byrne), three younger CB’s who play out from the back and a more steady left wing back (Toffolo)

That side could get a good hiding from time to time too, whilst also playing sides off the park at other times.
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