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Author Topic: Leyton Orient v Swindon pre match chat and matchday thread  (Read 14636 times)
RobertT

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« Reply #270 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:24:46 »

But at least he has some defensive bite about him.

It's not even that which we lack, it's the desire to want to just hunker down for a bit and hold positions.  Clear it, reset the shape etc.

Payne and Gladwin certainly don't provide much cover - they both want to be on the ball so they drift around a lot.  Gladwin in a slow way which leaves him out of position and Payne in a schoolboy chases everything and runs to get the ball way, which again leaves him out of position.  Reed is ball player rather than a fighter as well.  None of them strike me as a midfielder that would think they had a good game because we had a clean sheet, they probably all measure their impact by goals, creating, good passes etc.

I think we will have this all season, it isn't going to change.  Garner's way is an arrogant one on one hand, but also supports development of good young players to a degree.  It's no mistake he struggled at Rovers where he didn't really have the players to play his way, but did so anyway.  He clearly tries to build a team as a "project" with three t five years in mind.  The antithesis of the "only focus on the next game" Manager if you like.
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Peter Venkman
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« Reply #271 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:28:11 »

Iím not exactly sure how it works after the first of the year to get players or if the club can afford any.   But if possible they need a defensive player.   The back line just gives up too many crossing balls.   If they could shore up the defense some I think they could really do some damage the way they are able to move the ball around. 
Its difficult to shore up the defence with better players who we can actually afford and that fit into the Garner youth model when in this league.

Defence has been our achilles heel all season TBH.
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« Reply #272 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:28:55 »

It's not even that which we lack, it's the desire to want to just hunker down for a bit and hold positions.  Clear it, reset the shape etc.

Payne and Gladwin certainly don't provide much cover - they both want to be on the ball so they drift around a lot.  Gladwin in a slow way which leaves him out of position and Payne in a schoolboy chases everything and runs to get the ball way, which again leaves him out of position.  Reed is ball player rather than a fighter as well.  None of them strike me as a midfielder that would think they had a good game because we had a clean sheet, they probably all measure their impact by goals, creating, good passes etc.

I think we will have this all season, it isn't going to change.  Garner's way is an arrogant one on one hand, but also supports development of good young players to a degree.  It's no mistake he struggled at Rovers where he didn't really have the players to play his way, but did so anyway.  He clearly tries to build a team as a "project" with three t five years in mind.  The antithesis of the "only focus on the next game" Manager if you like.

Good post.

Would tonight have yielded a different outcome if the general was playing?

I think quite possibly so.
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« Reply #273 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:29:12 »

One to forget this. Everyone played below their ability, nothing quite worked. Bad day at the office.
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RobertT

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« Reply #274 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:29:18 »

Iím not exactly sure how it works after the first of the year to get players or if the club can afford any.   But if possible they need a defensive player.   The back line just gives up too many crossing balls.   If they could shore up the defense some I think they could really do some damage the way they are able to move the ball around.  



At this level, we lack an old fashioned defender.  One with some height and one who just likes to head, tackle and mark a player.  No interest in being part of the build up.  Not going to happen though.  Same for midfield, we lack battler, but we won't be getting one.  Garner clearly believes the best way to play is his way and if it not working to do it some more.  Over the course of a season, it looks like that will work this year - very few teams in this division are as good as Orient have been tonight.
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Peter Venkman
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« Reply #275 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:30:15 »

FT 1-4 that was a bad day at the office, next game.
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« Reply #276 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:33:24 »

Still only 4 off 2nd with a game in hand - not too shabby
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« Reply #277 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:34:57 »

Never mind tactics or style, I'm sorry to say Orient wanted it more than us from the very off in that second half.

They were a very good side at this level, mind.
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« Reply #278 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:38:56 »

January is going to be interesting, but unless the embargo ends up being cleared then we will be looking around for a lower player hoping to come good and having to wheel and deal, if it is cleared then we will be able to sign a better quality of player that might make the difference between play-offs and having a chance of snatching an automatic place.

I wonder if there will be any interest in any of our players, I'm sure we have 3 or 4 that could step up to the next level quite easily, hopefully nobody tries to buy any of the loan players either.

Who would have thought beginning of the season we would be talking about needing players to help towards promotion, long may it continue.

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donkey
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« Reply #279 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:46:34 »

Poor defending and 4-1 did flatter them, but they are the best side I've seen us play this season.  Good, sharp passing, organised at the back, good strikers. They deserved their win.
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Nomoreheroes
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« Reply #280 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:47:23 »

Sam Parkin:
- Need another centreback. The centrebacks today made 2 relatively inexperienced strikers look like wily old veterans. Need more physicality there.
- Also need another striker. No way that Garner would have wanted to go into the season this light.
- Will be top 5 end of the year.
- See Orient being top 6 at the end of the year. Jackett has got everyone together pretty quickly. Not much depth on the bench
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« Reply #281 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:49:14 »

I'm not sure that Garner will be ready to question his approach, but I don't think we can carry this back line with this many luxury midfield players in future. Odimayo, Conroy and Crichlow don't seem to play close enough to each other, partly because they get no defensive support at all down the flanks from Iandolo and KKH, and in the middle it's time to sacrifice Gladwin for more grit - Lyden or Grant.

The broadcasters might have just decided it's not worth televising this side...
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Nomoreheroes
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« Reply #282 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 21:54:09 »

Garner:
- Disappointing
- First half excellent. One lapse of concentration
- Had more lapses of concentration in the second half. Didn't defend the box
- Lots of positives, its just lapses of concentration that lost us the game
- Have to stop the ball from coming in
- Fourth goal was a foul on Payne, but it put the final nail in the coffin
- Don't think we tailed off. Still looked pretty strong
- It wasnt waves of pressure, it was just moments.
- One of those nights
- Need to defend a lot better
- Smith and Drinan are a good pair. But first half we minimised their threat other than one lapse
- Responded well, go level and had 2 good chances in the second half
- Challenge to curb McKirdy's enthusiasm. Need to channel it in the right way. Looked a harsh booking
- Sometimes he gets booked because of the way that he acts
- Reed booked for complaining about foul on Payne
- FA Cup draw have impact on concentration? No, not at all.
- We knew it was going to be a tough game. The overall performance was good.
- Just shot ourselves in the foot. Defending crosses and staying with runners cost us
- Important to bounce back quickly and not get too down hearted
- You cant defend like anyone in this league like that
- Man City is a good draw for the club. Focus is 5 league games before that
- Our priority is the league.
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RobertT

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« Reply #283 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 22:06:18 »

It's the comments like "lapse in concentration" that annoy me about Garner.  I hope he doesn't really believe that it is as simple as that.  In the first half, Hawes even mentioned how it seemed like Orient were targeting the space between Iandolo and Crichlow.  In the second half they threw a bit more at it and also went after the same space between KKH & Odimayo (they were often bringing their left centre back down the line - he wasn't much kop, but he created an overload).  It created lapses in concentration, but they were the result of increasing pressure on a specific point.  We didn't circle the wagons, we just carried on as before - Gladwin & Payne not really filling the hole before, and the central three remaining zonal.

I'm not saying we would somehow win if we switched it up at 2-1 down, and hindsight is a great thing to have.  However, it is not the only game where we haven't reacted to another team getting a leg-up on us.
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« Reply #284 on: Tuesday, December 7, 2021, 22:10:12 »

Iíve only been to see Swindon three times this season (although I watch all games on iFollow if I canít attend) - Carlisle, Harrow and Orient and I have to say it- I donít think we are that goodÖ. How we are up there I donít know. In years gone by we had a Parkin, Cox or Austin up front or at least a Ritchie and in defence, a calderwood, Bodin or even a Caddis but this season. I feel we donít have those level of players and weíll be found out. Not complaining, as thatís better than I expected but o think weíll
Struggle to hold a play off place without more information investmentÖ. I am pissed and pissed off after tonight though ;-)
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