New beginnings - 25% Truth, 80% Bollocks

[Audrey]

I’d imagine, and hope, that any prospective new owner would offer up the money and tell Clem and the myriad of hangers on and sycophants to fuck off with him and never show their faces again in SN1.

[RobertT]

It’s probably been answered a hundred times already but how does the ground factor in to a club sale?

…could Clem in theory sell up for less / wipe some of the personal debt to himself in exchange for keeping / owning a % of the Stadium and / or being involved with the redevelopment ?

The club should have valued the asset once it came onto their books, which should be in the 22/23 Accounts that Hall said were ready for viewing, but they won't be sent to Companies House until Feb 2024 I think.

They would be valuing a shareholding in the JV company, which owns the freehold and would have a value as a result.

On top of that, the new lease would attract some value, and should be stated in the Accounts of the football club.

When selling shares, Clem and a buyer would take those new asset valuations into account, plus any new liabilities, to value the business.  We know Clem has Director loans, so he is owed that money on top of whatever the business itself is now worth.

If the ownership tree goes via Swinton Reds, then Hollie & Beth have the right to match any deal.

[RobertT]

And if I remember correctly, the JV can block the sale of the 50% share the club has in the JV, BUT, I presume that does not prevent the ownership of the club itself from changing.  There is s gentleman's agreement that the club would inform the other parties if it itself was being sold.

[Batch]

then Hollie & Beth have the right to match any deal.

Aside:: do we know the state of Beth's holding, OS has Chris and Hollie as declarable "Other Significant interests (as defined in the EFL regulations)" shareholders

https://www.swindontownfc.co.uk/club/whos-who/


Not seen anyone mention changes at CH, so ?!

[Ƭ̵̬̊: The Artist Formerly Known as CWIG]

If the ownership tree goes via Swinton Reds, then Hollie & Beth have the right to match any deal.

Probably what will end up happening. Which will end up being out of the frying pan and on to the fire again, I suspect.

[Mooneyraker]

And if I remember correctly, the JV can block the sale of the 50% share the club has in the JV, BUT, I presume that does not prevent the ownership of the club itself from changing.  There is s gentleman's agreement that the club would inform the other parties if it itself was being sold.

Just a shame we aren’t dealing with gentlemen…

The Trust will be Neville Chamberlain waiving their piece of paper as Clem at al smash into Czechoslovakia.

[Frigby Daser]

For as long as it is not known (with evidence) where the £8.2m is actually going, I worry that this lot have no intention to sell, and are quite content with the way the club is operating - simply because it works very nicely indeed for them. That’s why it feels necessary to turn the heat up somehow on the rogues.

[Wobbly Bob]

I don't think that Clem / The Cabal have any serious intention to sell up any time soon, unless of course somebody makes them an offer that they can't refuse...

[DV]

…but if the club is operating at a legit loss and Clem (and/or whoever is behind Clem) have to keep plugging the losses - then surely they’re going to run out of money at some point?

Even if Clem keeps transferring the debt to himself as a loan - he’s only likely to get that back by selling the club, right?


Obviously if the club is operating at a self inflicted loss due to fingers in the till: that’s a different story altogether

[RobertT]

And that is the challenge - what is our real trading position?

The only Accounts we have showed a small profit in 21/22

The CEO stated we were spending 8M+ a year, which is a big jump from those 21/22 accounts - on what? is the question.

Clem has injected money to pay off existing debt, not trading losses, until at least 2022.

We now know some money came from other sources, with the Debenture repayment.  At the time it happened, Clem claimed he paid it all, so the next big question (for someone doing due diligence) would be to confirm the source of other injections of money into the business to pay those external debts.

[Wobbly Bob]

I reckon it's a case of wanting to get involved in the redevelopment of the ground & keeping the club ticking over (just above life support?) in the meantime.

Does the CG as it stands add a great deal to the value of the club as it stands, another million or so maybe based on "purchase" price.

A fully redeveloped ground churning out income is a much more viable proposition.

Means & wherewithal to get there is the issue though which could be why we are seemingly floundering at the moment.

A logical path would be to seek additional investment in a normal business environment?

[DV]

It definitely feels to me - almost like Clem has dropped the nice guy front now the club own part of the ground & like you I’d assume having fingers in the stadium pie was his main target / reason for buying the club

…but how on earth does he finance stadium development?

Which is why I mused if he could sell the club but keep part ownership of the stadium. Then use the money he got from selling the club to redevelop the stadium and make a decent income from that long term…which depending on the split could screw the club.

Not exactly the same situation but similar to when Kassam bought some little football club to basically build a stadium that was his & that he’d continue to own once he’d found a buyer for his little football club.

[Ƭ̵̬̊: The Artist Formerly Known as CWIG]

…but if the club is operating at a legit loss and Clem (and/or whoever is behind Clem) have to keep plugging the losses - then surely they’re going to run out of money at some point?

Even if Clem keeps transferring the debt to himself as a loan - he’s only likely to get that back by selling the club, right?


Obviously if the club is operating at a self inflicted loss due to fingers in the till: that’s a different story altogether

IF the club really is operating at a loss, then they're all still lining their pockets in the process. 100%

[Ƭ̵̬̊: The Artist Formerly Known as CWIG]

It definitely feels to me - almost like Clem has dropped the nice guy front now the club own part of the ground & like you I’d assume having fingers in the stadium pie was his main target / reason for buying the club

My brother said he spoke to some that work in the legends lounge around the time he came in and I was gushing about how amazing it is to have a town fan on the board, etc. and the feedback was basically he's nice to you if he thinks you're useful to him and rude as fuck if not. Definitely been a front.

[Robinz]

Sorry to say this was plain to see from day one.
If a deal is to good to be true..... it normally is.