Here come the cuts

[Summerof69]

As for Labour "pissing away" all that money: nice new hospital you've got there in Swindon.

Paid for by PFI money, which we're still going to be paying for,for the next 20 years, and smaller than the one it replaced, despite the population increasing substancially.

[pauld]

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/johann-hari/johann-hari-a-colder-crueller-country-ndash-for-no-gain-2112069.html

"The papers keep writing that [my wife, Samantha] comes from a very blue-blooded background", but "she is actually very unconventional. She went to a day school."

Jesus fucking Wept

[thepeoplesgame]

Paid for by PFI money, which we're still going to be paying for,for the next 20 years, and smaller than the one it replaced, despite the population increasing substancially.

You'd rather have kept the old one then? Fair enough.

[pauld]

It's rare that I agree with SummerOf69 on these things but he's right about PFI. Fucking stupid way of doing these things. Personally I'd rather they sort out the cleaning, old or new hospital. Ever since the Tories decided outsourcing was the way forward, you've got a better chance of coming out worse than you went in

[jonny72]

You'd rather have kept the old one then? Fair enough.

Here's a good article that explains what the problem is with the majority of the new hospitals that Labour built....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1532511/PFI-hospitals-will-cost-an-extra-45bn-for-30-years.html

Some examples from the article....

- A Cornwall Partnership NHS Trust hospital cost £10 million to build, by the time the PFI payments are complete it will have cost £113 million.
- A South Manchester University Trust hospital cost £67 million to build, by the time the PFI payments are complete it will have cost £974 million.

[thepeoplesgame]

Here's a good article that explains what the problem is with the majority of the new hospitals that Labour built....

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1532511/PFI-hospitals-will-cost-an-extra-45bn-for-30-years.html

Some examples from the article....

- A Cornwall Partnership NHS Trust hospital cost £10 million to build, by the time the PFI payments are complete it will have cost £113 million.
- A South Manchester University Trust hospital cost £67 million to build, by the time the PFI payments are complete it will have cost £974 million.

It ain't perfect by any stretch, but at least they fucking tried.

Unfortunately orthodox thinking in this country has decided that nothing is worth doing unless someone can make money out of it. How, in that climate, do you get NHS hospitals and state schools built? You either fight the business interests and rich elite who propagate this myth and change orthodox thinking (I wish they had at least tried) or you give some cunt the opportunity to make a fortune out of it.

[Ardiles]

PFI deals were Gordon's Brown's very own pet project...an accounting wheeze designed to take capital spending off the government's books.  It was and is a deception.

The PFI deal that the London Underground is now saddled with is as serious.  Horrifically complicated and ridiculously expensive...the real winners were the law firms employed to draw up the agreements.  When Metronet, one of the 'PFI partners' finally went bust a few years ago, the tax payer was left to pick up the tab.  You couldn't make it up.

[Spy]

The government are aiming to reduce Jay-Z's problems to 75 by 2015.

[suttonred]

PFI deals were Gordon's Brown's very own pet project...an accounting wheeze designed to take capital spending off the government's books.  It was and is a deception.

The PFI deal that the London Underground is now saddled with is as serious.  Horrifically complicated and ridiculously expensive...the real winners were the law firms employed to draw up the agreements.  When Metronet, one of the 'PFI partners' finally went bust a few years ago, the tax payer was left to pick up the tab.  You couldn't make it up.

Exactly the same scenario in a lot of the PFI schools. There are some that I've worked on that are very close to going under, and they've still got 23 of the 25 year contract to run. As for the lawyers they are basically the only people that have made money out of the BSF project also. The whole project has taken a lot of flak for the length of time and the cost to get schools up and running. But guess where most of the hold ups were and still are caused by?

[Lumps]

No. It's just not an opinion you like or that supports your views. We're all different.

Yeah, some of us have the first idea about economics and some of us have swallowed and regurgitated the tired old shit that "running a country is the same as running a business" and don't seem to have grasped the concept that what might work for a supermarket chain might just not do the job for an entire economic system.

[Samdy Gray]

You know how to run a country do you Lumpy?

[jonny72]

Yeah, some of us have the first idea about economics and some of us have swallowed and regurgitated the tired old shit that "running a country is the same as running a business" and don't seem to have grasped the concept that what might work for a supermarket chain might just not do the job for an entire economic system.

Though some businesses are bigger than entire countries. If Wal-Mart were a country they'd be about the #22 biggest by GDP and about 20 businesses would be in the top 50. Obviously there are major differences, but some governments could learn a lot from well run businesses like not over stretching by spending money you don't have.

[Simon Pieman]

If public organisations got themselves in order then the country wouldn't piss as much money away. Having been into colleges, NHS trusts and the such, often you get people making decisions or having a big part in running the show which don't have a clue. This is where the public sector could learn from the private sector.

The Government, their departments and organisations receiving funding don't necessarily need to be more stingy, they just need to be more accountable and business minded in their approaches. The correct ethos/mentality isn't their in a lot of cases. I have seen a few organisations which are really good at this and they get more far value out of their funding.

As to the budget, I have mixed feelings. On the one hand I think it's better to recover the defecit quicker, on the other I think it's disgusting things like ESA will be cut for many and this makes me angry.

[leefer]

One question.......exactly who does the country owe these billions.........China?...or fukin Timbukto.

No guessing please.........and no nonsense about bonds.

[Samdy Gray]

Bonds and gilts make up the largest proportion of national debt leefer.