Madeline McCann

[Flashheart]

Replace speeding with dangerous driving or driving while drunk and you'll be there.

[No Longer Posh Red]

I don't get the 3 year old in the sea analogy....

The point is that swimming in the sea with a young child isn't particularly dangerous, unless you let them do it on their own unsupervised.

As for speeding with a child in the car, you suggest it's just a case of luck (not having an accident). But surely that is true everytime you get in the car and drive on the motorway.
Personally I did drive much more carefully when I had our son in the car, but just don't see that driving at 75 instead of 70 being anywhere near the same level of negligence as leaving your children unsupervised.

I think our son was about 15 before we would leave him at home on his own.

[Batch]

Replace speeding with dangerous driving or driving while drunk and you'll be there.

But that wasn't the reference point, speeding was.

And define driving dangerously. Purposely driving like a prick, or a momentary lack of concentration? Because the latter is an involuntary action, whereas going for a Tapas isn't.

[Flashheart]

But that wasn't the reference point, speeding was.

And define driving dangerously. Purposely driving like a prick, or a momentary lack of concentration? Because the latter is an involuntary action, whereas going for a Tapas isn't.

Yeah, I know. It's just what I had in mind in the discussion. A misunderstanding of context.

It's just that it can be easy to be sanctimonious at times (not intended as a dig at anyone here)

My main issue is their reaction to what happened. I just cannot get my head around how they can try to deny responsibility. I find that quite chilling!

[No Longer Posh Red]

Yeah, I know. It's just what I had in mind in the discussion. A misunderstanding of context.

It's just that it can be easy to be sanctimonious at times (not intended as a dig at anyone here)

My main issue is their reaction to what happened. I just cannot get my head around how they can try to deny responsibility. I find that quite chilling!

If the comparison had been to drink driving I would agree, but I guess that a lot less people drink & drive than speed.

[Batch]

I think its a pointless argument, people have different viewpoints on whst is right and what is wrong. End of.

Actually I read a comment somewhere which asked, why didn't April Jones parents publicly get the same criticism of negligence for letting her play out on her own aged 5. Fair enough comparison? Its more tricky, I'd not let my kids on the street aged 5, but I live in Swindon not the arse end of Wales.
-------
To get back on the Maddie topic, at the time the police claimed that a cadaver dog and a blood detecting dog gave 'alerts' in the holiday flat and in the hire car (hired a month after the disappearance). I thought there was some DNA link with this too, might be wrong.

I assume these 'alerts' have been explained to (UK/local) police - either they are often false alerts, or occur through some other reason, or the press embellished the story. Did anyone read anything regarding this in the public domain?

I don't think mean to point the finger at the McCanns, its more it always seemed a massive thing that I never saw an explanation for.

[Batch]

Aha, wiki to the rescue, partly

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disappearance_of_Madeleine_McCann

John Barrett, a retired Scotland Yard dog handler, dismissed the cadaver-dog claim at the time, telling journalists the dogs could only detect the scent of a cadaver up to 28 days after a death

The boot of the car contained 15 out of 19 of Madeleine's DNA components. He wrote that the result was "too complex for meaningful interpretation":

[janaage]

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id242.html is a good site for McCann info.

[RWB Robin]

I have read this very carefully. I can't say that I followed the original story very closely, although from the outset, I always felt that there was something not right about the primary scenario. I didn't watch Crimewatch...I hate it as a programme so I don't know what was alleged, or what any individual said....but the scenario which rings truest to me from what I have read here is that Maddy woke up, found she was alone and went to look for her parents....the subsequent disappearance could have at least two possible explanations - abduction or accidental death.

From my own childhood, i well remember a family outing for shopping and tea in Marlborough. I was 4 or 5. I was being slow getting ready, my parents lost patience with me and said they were going without me and my older brother. In reality, they went a few hundred yards to get petrol and returned, to find that my brother and I had believed them and set out to walk the eight miles to Marlborough. We walked about three miles and then took a wrong turning. It was getting dark, and a guy in a car, who we vaguely recognised stopped and said he would give us a lift home. Classic. In fact, he did but it could have been so different... What would my parents have said if we had disappeared? Probablythat the only explanation was we had been abducted from home.....but we could have died from exposure, fallen into farm machinery, etc etc....none of which would have happened had they not apparently carried out their threat to leave us behind. Children behave irrationally.

[horlock07]

Speeding on a motorway and leaving a child alone in an unlocked apartment is not on the same scale. I'm not going to overly criticise the McCanns as I'm sure they've tortured themselves over this enough, but at the same time I'm not going to try and defend their actions either.

For a start one is a criminal offence the other isn't... so depends what scale we are working on.

[dagrumpymunki]

love putting words in my mouth don't you and no it isnt black and white but both are equally as bad are they not. I would hazard a guess more children are killed from a parent driving over the limit than kids are abducted from being left alone.

This argument is utter bollocks. If you were arguing about people driving drunk or recklessly (I don't know racing or something) then you might have a point.

But speed limits? They're almost completely arbitary. By your argument you're irresponible and neglectful driving at 65mph on most US highways, but completely responsible and safe driving at 105mph on German autobahns? Or is the assumption that the UK has the right answer on this issue and everyone else is wrong?

[Abrahammer]

To suggest that going a few MPH over the speed limit is equally as bad as leaving 3 young children on their own is utterly bizarre.

[DRS]

This argument is utter bollocks. If you were arguing about people driving drunk or recklessly (I don't know racing or something) then you might have a point.

But speed limits? They're almost completely arbitary. By your argument you're irresponible and neglectful driving at 65mph on most US highways, but completely responsible and safe driving at 105mph on German autobahns? Or is the assumption that the UK has the right answer on this issue and everyone else is wrong?

Speeding with children in the car is not neglect or stupid then,is that what you are saying

[4D]

I think this thread has gone off at a wild tangent. Life is dangerous, you could be driving at 20mph and be hit head on by someone overtaking. Nobody on here knows anything regarding what happened in Portugal, but should children that young be left alone? That is something we can all have an opinion on.

[tans]

Justin biebers army of beliebers did it

The nutters