Finally...a man who stands up and says what a lot of people really think

[jonny72]

This U.S. conservative attack on the NHS is nuts... What are they afraid of? I suppose it's all money related.

Not sure the Republicans are afraid of anything, they're just fighting it for the sake of it.

They actually spend more on health care in the US than pretty much any other country in the world. The problem is who the money is spent on, some people get too much treatment and some people get none (unsurprisingly, there is a disproportionate number of non-whites in this group). In 1996, 5% of their population accounted for 50% of health care spending.

The big question though is why the fuck are our politicians getting involved in this?

[dell boy]

I could not knock the NHS, from my dealings over the last three years I can only be full of praise for them. When there is something seriously wrong they are fantastic. Some do not know how lucky they are to be British.

[Hammer]

I could not knock the NHS, from my dealings over the last three years I can only be full of praise for them. When there is something seriously wrong they are fantastic. Some do not know how lucky they are to be British.

 Lucky ? Please explain that one to the relatives of the hundreds who died due to lack of care at Stafford General in the 2 year period ending March 2008. It was not just an allegation, they were found culpable. I'm sure it was not an isolated case.

[Mexicano Rojo]

Hammer, go and live in any other country outside of western europe and then repeat what you just said.

[jonny72]

Lucky ? Please explain that one to the relatives of the hundreds who died due to lack of care at Stafford General in the 2 year period ending March 2008. It was not just an allegation, they were found culpable. I'm sure it was not an isolated case.

I don't think anyone would suggest the NHS is perfect. But its better than in a lot of other countries.

[Anteater]

Oh really ! Wasn't it Middle America that shifted to the Left ? Hence the appointment of Obama.

Shit me ! Does that mean you think the USA is left wing now ? Or for that matter New Labour is too !!!?

[Rich Pullen]

If we got rid of the NHS chaos would follow.

Excuse my lack of knowledge but what does anyone who dislikes the NHS see as a realistic (emphasis on realistic) alternative because I can't think of one.

[Rich Pullen]

My missus' gran became very ill in the U.S. while on holiday a couple of years back... She had cover but the bill would have been $20,000! She had good care but I'd expect that for that money.

[dell boy]

Lucky ? Please explain that one to the relatives of the hundreds who died due to lack of care at Stafford General in the 2 year period ending March 2008. It was not just an allegation, they were found culpable. I'm sure it was not an isolated case.

I can only speak from my own personal experience, the Royal Berks Hospital (NHS) were superb when my wife was seriously ill, if my comments offended you because of a personal experience from Stafford for yourself  or a member of your close family or friends then I can only apologise. I can only voice an opinion from what I have personally experienced.

[Summerof69]

The NHS is not perfect. What is ?

Personally, there is too many administration managers, when the money could be used to reduce the postcode lottery scenario, and get the service people need. Also, hospitals needs to be cleaned PROPERLY and not getting cheap labour doing half the job. This will reduce MRSA.

I know this from a family experience. A couple of years ago, my dad,who is a diabetic, went into hospital with an infection on his foot. They sent him home a couple of weeks later, they sent him home.

Within a week, he was feeling sick, so he was taken back in. He had MRSA, and they had to amputate his leg below the knee. The hospital reaction ' You didn't catch MRSA from us!!'

But if you think the American system is better, people need their heads testing. Just watch a few episodes of ER and see the political games go on, as quite a number of hospitals won't start treating you unless they are sure that you've got insurance.

[pumbaa]

Having spent three years living in the USA (and the other 37 being exposed to the NHS) I think I'm fairly well qualified to have an objective view on both systems.

There is no doubt that the NHS has its faults. I've had several bad experiences with the NHS which I'd rather not delve into in detail, but also several really good experiences. The problems arise due to a lack of resources. One of my biggest gripes was having to wait, on average, a month for a routine appointment to see my GP. Now if I was really sick, and needed an emergency appointment, I could get one, but always with a locum, never my GP. That's clearly unacceptable as a general rule, and the kind of example that the right-of-centre yankees seem to be picking up on.

My experiences of health care, with one exception, in the US were nothing short of exemplary. I guess I was fortunate, my employer covered the majority of my basic health care needs, however you always needed to be aware to check out whether the health care provider took your health plan. The major problem health care wise was related to a trip to ER, where my wife waited several hours, with severe abdominal pains, to see a doctor - we were sent there by our GP equivalent; turns out she had a miscarriage.

What really took the piss about the US was the bureaucracy, and the impact it has when it fails. My wife was admitted on another occasion with an ectopic pregnancy. The direct care she received - admitted immediately, operated on within an hour of diagnosis and an overnight stay - was first class. What wasn't was one month later when I received a bill for $13500 because the health care provider couldn't electronically submit the bill to the insurance company due to 'computer problems'.

And that sums up the crux of their problem. Those who can afford to pay, or have appropriate coverage through company medical plans, are fine. Those who can't are seriously fucked. Fair play to Mr Obama for trying to change the system.

[Rich Pullen]

Surely there are too many American citizens that can't afford to pay though? Especially if the cons in the U.S. want to suggest it's better than the NHS.

[Mexicano Rojo]

15%

[pumbaa]

I don't really know % wise Rich, but I'd imagine its significant. Particularly given their national unemployment rate is close to 10% countrywide.

[pumbaa]

My mate in Dayton OH (who is very anti-Obama) has basic medical coverage through the military (being ex USAF) and though his current employer. He did tell me that he had extra coverage through a separate, or top up, health plan which covers his whole family, which cost him $500 per month. I'm sure he also said that was deducted at source from his salary. A lot of standard health plans don't cover things like dental care (if you think that's expensive here, you ain't seen nothing......)