Let's Get Political!

[pauld]

Don't you ever watch Eurovision?

I'll repeat the question. Wholly agree that our position and standing in the the EU has absolutely nosedived over the last few years, entirely due to the our govt proving itself to be incompetent and untrustworthy to the extent that they are prepared to break international law. That will tend to downgrade a country's stock somewhat. That aside, what precisely is it about the "way we are being dealt with" that you object to? An actual example of such ill-treatment?

[4D]

I'm quite looking forward to driving about in my new Austin Maxi in 2021!

Or a Maclaren?

[JBZ]

Nice to see you taking an interest again. Now you're here, could you answer the question that so far no-one seems to be able or willing to answer. What are the tangible, concrete benefts of Brexit? i.e. not flag-waving rhetoric, not vague generalisations, but actual concrete "This facet of life will be better for the ordinary British citizen from Jan 1st 2021"

Presumably it will help to improve mental health in that the ordinary citizen will not need to fret about:-

- "Sovereignty" having been taken by the EU;
- People who we might not like the look of or who sound a bit funny invading the country in great swathes.

[Batch]

the Scottish?

[horlock07]

Or a Maclaren?

So a benefit for perhaps 1% of the population who can afford it, rather reinforces the idea that Brexit was just a way for the ultra wealthy to richer and fuck us plebs!

What I don't understand is that if no deal is going to be such a great thing why are the government continually trying to blame it on the EU/remainers if its such a brilliant thing why are they not celebrating and owning this great moment?

[Bob's Orange]

Or a Maclaren?

Do you think I am made of money??

[The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey]

"Makes you want to jump over the top and shout 'ya boo, sucks to you Fritz”

[pauld]

I think our position and standing in the rest of the EU has been proven over the last few years, and the way we are being dealt with.

3rd time of asking
Wholly agree that our position and standing in the the EU has absolutely nosedived over the last few years, entirely due to the our govt proving itself to be incompetent and untrustworthy to the extent that they are prepared to break international law. That will tend to downgrade a country's stock somewhat. That aside, what precisely is it about the "way we are being dealt with" that you object to? An actual example of such ill-treatment?

[JBZ]

3rd time of asking
Wholly agree that our position and standing in the the EU has absolutely nosedived over the last few years, entirely due to the our govt proving itself to be incompetent and untrustworthy to the extent that they are prepared to break international law. That will tend to downgrade a country's stock somewhat. That aside, what precisely is it about the "way we are being dealt with" that you object to? An actual example of such ill-treatment?

Possibly the way we were allowed to opt out of bits 'we' did not find hugely palatable

[Abrahammer]

3rd time of asking

Must be struggling to find an example of the Daily Mail website

[pauld]

Must be struggling to find an example of the Daily Mail website

TBF I was being slightly unfair in picking on 4D's post in this way but it struck me as an interesting example of what I have seen a lot of: the unevidenced assertion that Britain has been treated badly by the EU during negotiations when it really seems to be more that the British govt has just been a bit shit at negotiating. Which is understandable as they don't actually know what they want. But they then have to explain this lack of progress on what they assured us all would be "the easiest trade deal in history" because "we hold all the cards" bollocks which the likes of outletred are still spouting, despite it being glaringly obvious now, even if it wasn't then, that we actually have a very weak hand. Which we are playing badly. So to explain this difficulty, they just get their tame newspapers and sockpuppet social media accounts to assert that "the EU is being difficult" or "Britain is being treated badly". Without any evidence at all, but it plays well to those who find this accords with their existing beliefs (which, tbf, we all do at times).

So I thought this would be a good opportunity to ask someone making such an assertion if they could cite anything to back it up (because there may be, I've not seen anything but I'm not immune to confirmation bias either) or if it was just a general feeling they'd picked up from their favourite newspaper/website/social media accounts.

Apologies to 4D for using his post as the basis of this experiment. Other Brexiteers please do feel free to pile in with your tales of European perfidy.

Likewise with the "genuine tangible benefits" question. They seem to be long on flag-waving vagueness, incredibly short on actual tangible benefits in the face of looming economic disaster across multiple sectors.
Here you are, I'll start you off with a freebie: come Jan 1st, Britain will be free to ban the live export of animals from the UK. Whether we actually will remains to be seen, but that certainly would be a positive.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-55167473

[4D]

3rd time of asking
Wholly agree that our position and standing in the the EU has absolutely nosedived over the last few years, entirely due to the our govt proving itself to be incompetent and untrustworthy to the extent that they are prepared to break international law. That will tend to downgrade a country's stock somewhat. That aside, what precisely is it about the "way we are being dealt with" that you object to? An actual example of such ill-treatment?

I'm not on here 24/7, some of us have got some work to do pre Brexit 
I never said there was ill treatment, just the way we seem to be brushed aside with our requirements. The EU were always going to what's best for the EU. I don't think there will be any winners in this whole saga.

[4D]

Must be struggling to find an example of the Daily Mail website

Another great post from you. You must write a book.

[4D]

Do you think I am made of money??

I was thinking about the buggy  

You also have Vauxhall, Mini, Nissan, Land Rover, Toyota and others.

[Batch]

Do you think I am made of money??

I was thinking about the buggy  

You also have Vauxhall, Mini, Nissan, Land Rover, Toyota and others.

for now...

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/news/amp/business-55220840