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Author Topic: Court cases  (Read 154144 times)
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« Reply #90 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 08:48:04 »

You don't invest in any business, football clubs included unless you are a life long supporter, without expecting a return, when are football supporters going to understand that!

And to think all this time....
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RedRag

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« Reply #91 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:17:56 »

As has been noted, I'm not sure how much this all affects STFC over and above the problems of the Pandemic.  

It does indicate that Power has thus far been quite adept at taking advantage of UNWRITTEN arrangements.  I wouldn't give him a tenner to run down to the corner shop to get me a packet of fags without it being nailed down in writing and passed by my lawyers.

There seems so much in football to suggest that if you control the shares and the money, you can slip quite decent wedges to yourself unknown to business partners or possibly even HMRC.  Eg Power apparently wanting to cut a deal for 40% of any sell on from Jayden Bogle to go to him following a sale of the club - how would that impact on Morfuni's 15%?

Power will not be liable to CGT on any gain from the sale of Swinton Red shares, ie STFC, whether held by him as trustee for Standing or beneficially on his own account.  Standing, or his company, being UK resident would be liable and God knows how you report any gains to HMRC on the back of these sorts of arrangements.
« Last Edit: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:20:09 by RedRag » Logged
The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey

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« Reply #92 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:24:13 »

But Standing/Barry are up shit creek. If they want their money back they have to legally be joint owners of STFC, yet if they are declared as such they would run foul of the FA - as would, presumably, the club.

If the club is sanctioned in any way, it’s sale value diminishes as does everybody’s ‘investment’.

There could be yet another shark circling to pick us up on the cheap.
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horlock07

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« Reply #93 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:28:49 »


It does indicate that Power has thus far been quite adept at taking advantage of UNWRITTEN arrangements.  

He won against Jed because he (or his lawyers) were brighter than Jeds, seems to have come up against a bit more in the case of Clem.

Interestingly the termination of the appointment of Crouch (standings representative on earth) as a Director (14th August 2019) came the day before a revised confirmation statement was submitted to Companies House confirming that Clems Co owned 15% of the shares in Swinton Reds 20 Ltd*, that cannot be a coincidence.

I get the impression, as with many precarious businesses, Power has managed to keep the plates spinning for so long due to the informality with Standing, but when Clem started to exert pressure for some security against his investment the plates began to fall.

* I cannot be bothered to read back, has Power incriminated himself now regarding this?
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« Reply #94 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:29:34 »

There could be yet another shark circling to pick us up on the cheap.
Indeed. Which is the big worry. I'm not in the "Better the Devil You Know" camp, but firmly "Be Very Careful What You Wish For". if you find yourself thinking "Anything's got to be better than this", then things can, and often do, get worse. We only have to look at our national life over the past few years, or even months, to see that.
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horlock07

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« Reply #95 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:31:03 »

But Standing/Barry are up shit creek. If they want their money back they have to legally be joint owners of STFC, yet if they are declared as such they would run foul of the FA - as would, presumably, the club.

If the club is sanctioned in any way, it’s sale value diminishes as does everybody’s ‘investment’.

There could be yet another shark circling to pick us up on the cheap.

Be interesting to know what (if any) relationship there is between Standing/Barry/Clem?
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The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey

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« Reply #96 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:31:41 »

Going thirds on a hitman, you mean?
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The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey

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« Reply #97 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:34:21 »

He won against Jed because he (or his lawyers) were brighter than Jeds, seems to have come up against a bit more in the case of Clem.

Interestingly the termination of the appointment of Crouch (standings representative on earth) as a Director (14th August 2019) came the day before a revised confirmation statement was submitted to Companies House confirming that Clems Co owned 15% of the shares in Swinton Reds 20 Ltd*, that cannot be a coincidence.

I get the impression, as with many precarious businesses, Power has managed to keep the plates spinning for so long due to the informality with Standing, but when Clem started to exert pressure for some security against his investment the plates began to fall.

* I cannot be bothered to read back, has Power incriminated himself now regarding this?
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horlock07

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« Reply #98 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:34:44 »

Going thirds on a hitman, you mean?

No, more thinking, he is trying to screw us both over lets have a little chat over a glass of red as to how we can protect both our positions and get rid of him, especially if there is a return on our investments in the offing.

Another elephant in the room is the training ground, the only way that works in planning terms is with the club involved, yet the land appears to be owned by Power, without the club I suspect no stables and no houses, fairly worthless.
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The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey

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« Reply #99 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:39:58 »

Stupid question alert.

So what was the actual outcome of the 2 cases?
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RedRag

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« Reply #100 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:42:31 »

I don't think it makes any direct difference to STFC whether a new buyer gets us on the cheap or not.  That is Power & Co's business.  

However, the cheaper the shares, the wider the net for potential buyers, opening up opportunities for penniless chancers who want to drive around in company Mercs, a la Jed.

The proposed ground share, never mind a new training facility and running the club will require an owner with ready access to some cash, ideally invested rather than borrowed.
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« Reply #101 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 09:46:49 »

In reality this news makes little difference and I can't be bothered to get myself worked up about it with the current situation in the EFL and the world as a whole in fact.

We all knew Powers end game was selling the club, his source of funds has now become clearer but that's about it. I'm not sure any party is coming out well from this; Power comes out looking like he will use any loophole going to ensure he doesn't lose out, Standing/Barry just very naïve or just plain stupid for just relying on a verbal contract and very dodgy wanting to hide their involvement. As for Clem for a supposed owner of a company worth over £200 he doesn't seem to have done much due diligence before making his investment and although it does seem like he's the one sure thing in terms of he owns 15% its not a great reflection on his business acumen.

I'm sure more will come out in the wash but unless the FA start investigating then not a lot has really changed, it is strange that none of this Power/Standing info ever came out in the Power vs Jed ownership court case but hey ho.

Football at our level is going to materially change in the coming months so impossible to know what is going to happen, you certainly wouldn't want to be buying a club at the moment unless massively on the cheap but with the current players all claiming significant sums I can't see that happening. The club getting out the other side of the COVID19 crisis is still the immediate concern.....

As for all the trolls like Kostiuk patting themselves on the back saying this proves them right, a stopped clock is right twice a day. Lets not forget their accusations included that we deliberately threw the play-off final, Reading U23's using the CG etc so I think its safe to says they know fuck all.
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Peter Venkman
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« Reply #102 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 10:00:11 »

In reality this news makes little difference and I can't be bothered to get myself worked up about it with the current situation in the EFL and the world as a whole in fact.

We all knew Powers end game was selling the club, his source of funds has now become clearer but that's about it. I'm not sure any party is coming out well from this; Power comes out looking like he will use any loophole going to ensure he doesn't lose out, Standing/Barry just very naïve or just plain stupid for just relying on a verbal contract and very dodgy wanting to hide their involvement. As for Clem for a supposed owner of a company worth over £200 he doesn't seem to have done much due diligence before making his investment and although it does seem like he's the one sure thing in terms of he owns 15% its not a great reflection on his business acumen.

I'm sure more will come out in the wash but unless the FA start investigating then not a lot has really changed, it is strange that none of this Power/Standing info ever came out in the Power vs Jed ownership court case but hey ho.

Football at our level is going to materially change in the coming months so impossible to know what is going to happen, you certainly wouldn't want to be buying a club at the moment unless massively on the cheap but with the current players all claiming significant sums I can't see that happening. The club getting out the other side of the COVID19 crisis is still the immediate concern.....

As for all the trolls like Kostiuk patting themselves on the back saying this proves them right, a stopped clock is right twice a day. Lets not forget their accusations included that we deliberately threw the play-off final, Reading U23's using the CG etc so I think its safe to says they know fuck all.
I agree 100%.

The only real concern for me is that the EFL do not take kindly to players/agents having shares in clubs and could possibly deduct points or other measures to deter any other club doing similar, as far as I know we could well be the first to be in this situation?

This sounds like "he said she said" usual owndership battles at clubs but we as fans, specifically of Swindon, have seen the clubs name dragged through the mud so many times its natural to be on edge about how it will affect the club as a whole.

The timing is also not great after Promotion*/Championship* season, but then there is never good time for legal battles.
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« Reply #103 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 10:03:57 »

Stupid question alert.

So what was the actual outcome of the 2 cases?

They concern interim applications.  The main legal claims will be determined in due course.
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RedRag

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« Reply #104 on: Wednesday, May 20, 2020, 10:31:29 »

Stupid question alert.

So what was the actual outcome of the 2 cases?

So far as Clem/Axis is concerned, they succeeded in obtaining an injunction, pending trial or further interim order, that

 1.  no sale could be made without their consent,
 2.  any prospective purchaser be notified of Clem/Axis's 15% interest and
 3.  Power be prevented from taking any active steps to have the club/Swinton Reds wound up.

Costs will be determinable according to the outcome of any final trial (or agreement)

So far as Standing/FTPM are concerned, they already had an interim injunction requiring Power to obtain their consent and involve them in a sale.  

In this interim hearing, Power had requested they put up more money (fortification) to cover Power's potential losses were this consent and involvement later be found to have wrongly caused him loss, ie because Able's offer did not proceed or because STFC became insolvent*.  Power's claim for fortification was dismissed and he has incurred a costs liability to Standing/FTPM for the failed application.

*The judge was not satisfied as to the evidence regarding any likely insolvency or indeed of any real prospect of any sale to Able, let alone for any particular amount.
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