Bob Crow

[sheepshagger]

Yeah I am saying that - which is piss poor as overall 30% of the workforce "could be bothered"

The other 70% obviously couldn't give a shit

That's what makes unions out of date and fucking pointless......

[Levi lapper]

Yeah zero hours contracts for all. Zero pay rises for people in The public sector, and million pound bonuses for bankers paid for by the public sector. Who needs unions they are so out of date and pointless.

[Peter Gibbons]

Yeah zero hours contracts for all. Zero pay rises for people in The public sector, and million pound bonuses for bankers paid for by the public sector. Who needs unions they are so out of date and pointless.

Using Lloyds Banking Group (Accord) and Santander (Advance) as examples, it appears that union membership in banks is around 25%, perhaps they are just doing a very good job for their members

[Cookie]

The State is busy protecting the banks so no need for unions. The low paid on the other hand do not receive the same kind of state support. 

[Not that Nice If I'm Honest]

Can't blame him for looking after his members.

But there should be restrictions on what strike action can be taken on a vital piece of infrastructure like the tube.

I also think he used his position to promote/fulfill his out of date political ideals, and the improved benefits for members was a collateral effect.

[sheepshagger]

Yeah zero hours contracts for all. Zero pay rises for people in The public sector, and million pound bonuses for bankers paid for by the public sector. Who needs unions they are so out of date and pointless.

Fucking hell really ?

You mean that public sector who have been propped up by the private sector for donkey's years ?

That public sector with unrealistic pensions paid out of the private sector ?

Zero pay rises - ahhhhh poor public sector workers ! They should try living in the real world like the rest of us - I would LOVE a pay rise but unfortunately I also understand that when things are bad in the economy I have to suck it up and wait until things improve

And yeah the bankers -- it was ALL their fault that we took more credit than we could afford - fuck me personal responsibility went right out of the window in the Blair/Brown Bust years didn't it......

[Batch]

The government were fairly fucked when it came to banks. Very difficult not to have an even worse outcome by letting them go under.

Should they have been allowed to get into that state, regulatory speaking.... thats different argument.

[Honkytonk]

And yeah the bankers -- it was ALL their fault that we took more credit than we could afford - fuck me personal responsibility went right out of the window in the Blair/Brown Bust years didn't it......

Well, to some extent, yes, yes it was. I'm no expert, but it seems to me that lending money to people who can't afford to ever pay it back is not a great way to do business. Especially when the money involved is, at the end of the day, someone else's.

Spending more than the GDP of a small country on bonuses wouldn't exactly help either.

[sheepshagger]

Well, to some extent, yes, yes it was. I'm no expert, but it seems to me that lending money to people who can't afford to ever pay it back is not a great way to do business. Especially when the money involved is, at the end of the day, someone else's.

Spending more than the GDP of a small country on bonuses wouldn't exactly help either.

And knowingly taking that money from the bank when you know as an individual you cannot afford to pay it back is OK then ?

Of course the banks are at fault as well - I'm not disputing that, but individuals have to take on some responsibility too.....

I think it was the unions we were discussing first though -- and I have to say I see nothing from them which makes me think they are anything more than a complete leech on society....

The NUT are next at it -- poor old teachers having these terrible working conditions forced upon them -- some of the highest paid teachers in Europe that is, you know the ones with really shit holidays as well, not to mention their massive final salary pensions  -- but fuck me they are going on strike ! 

I went to my local school to be told it was IMPERATIVE that my child did not take a day off in years 10 or 11 - or basically the whole world would collapse and implode, and my child would fail their GCSE exams

What do they announce next ?  Oh yeah, fuck your kids -- it's one rule for you, but we do what the fuck we want !  We are going on strike - not during their vast holidays, not during their many Teacher Training Days per year which all seem to always happen on a Friday or a Monday (convenience I'm sure!!), but during the school week, and yeah you all need to take a day off work or make other arrangements and frankly we don't give a shit....

Fucking Unions.............

[Batch]

To be fair there are a number of union teachers that voted against and ignored industrial action.

What gets me is that they aren't obliged to let the school know they are striking until the actual day of the strike. How is a school supposed to plan properly, which the unions will argue is the whole point. In fact the silly bint NASWUT rep was actively encouraging members to do just that. Max disruption, Fuck everyone else as long as we get what we want.

[chalkies_shorts]

Strikes are a pain in the bum but thats all - nobody dies. If they didn't cause disruption there's no point doing it. I'm a member of a union and proud of it. They do more good than bad but don't always get it right. It would be a hell of a worse world if they didn''t exist.
They're not all about strikes. The individual representation they provide is very important and the general advise they give their members is often invaluable. 

[Anteater]

Fucking hell really ?

You mean that public sector who have been propped up by the private sector for donkey's years ?

That public sector with unrealistic pensions paid out of the private sector ?

Zero pay rises - ahhhhh poor public sector workers ! They should try living in the real world like the rest of us - I would LOVE a pay rise but unfortunately I also understand that when things are bad in the economy I have to suck it up and wait until things improve

Glad you're so very sympathetic !  

I work in the public sector and last year had my first rise 1% for 3 years (before that 5 years of low rises all below inflation rate), arguably not  a rise in real terms, looks like 1% this year (whoopee) and bonus related earnings irrespective of how well personally I have performed do not exist in my area.
I knew this when I started working in the public sector and have not winged or ever gone on strike as a result but I would like to think I 'live in the real world' along with you. I know I also have to 'suck it up' as have some friends that are now out of work due to cuts. Not all people that are members of a union are Bob Crow clones.

[sheepshagger]

Chalkie I get that, but how much of that advice is ultimately for their own devices ?

I'm not saying it all is, and I am sure there is some good in the workplace for representation to the management

But unfortunately the way they go about things (striking in particular) is going to get on a lot of peoples tits (mine included as you may have guessed)

I think it's just plain wrong to A. basically bring the Capitol City to a grinding halt when only 30% of the workforce voted for it and B. Be complete hypocrites when it comes to kids education and stick two fingers up to all the hard working parents who have to make alternative arrangements and screw their working day up, when let's face it they haven't got it bad at all !!

[fuzzy]

Fucking hell really ?

You mean that public sector who have been propped up by the private sector for donkey's years ?

That public sector with unrealistic pensions paid out of the private sector ?

Zero pay rises - ahhhhh poor public sector workers ! They should try living in the real world like the rest of us - I would LOVE a pay rise but unfortunately I also understand that when things are bad in the economy I have to suck it up and wait until things improve

And yeah the bankers -- it was ALL their fault that we took more credit than we could afford - fuck me personal responsibility went right out of the window in the Blair/Brown Bust years didn't it......

I've got one of those supposedly magic pensions. I started paying my pension 26 years ago at 11% of my salary. It slowly went up to 13.75%. I am about to start paying 14% of my salary for the privilege. Thats 14% of my hard earned before I even get a sniff of it. Then the Gubbinsment take a not insignificant slice. The rises in my pension contributions have outpaced my pay increase so I am actually worse off than before the crash. Just like everyone else but the Bankers and the Grand High Fucky Mucks so, fuck off with all your bitter bollocks about public sector pensions. The teachers final salaray pension- what final salary is that based on then? Head Teachers and the like may have a good final salary but, your average teachers isn't paid a shitload.

Your average public sector worker spends their life being paid not a fantastic wage but contributing a good proportion of their income for a pension so that they can be comfortable in retirement. What the fuck is wrong with that?

[sheepshagger]

Glad you're so very sympathetic !  

I work in the public sector and last year had my first rise 1% for 3 years (before that 5 years of low rises all below inflation rate), arguably not  a rise in real terms, looks like 1% this year (whoopee) and bonus related earnings irrespective of how well personally I have performed do not exist in my area.
I knew this when I started working in the public sector and have not winged or ever gone on strike as a result but I would like to think I 'live in the real world' along with you. I know I also have to 'suck it up' as have some friends that are now out of work due to cuts. Not all people that are members of a union are Bob Crow clones.

Sorry but I'm not very sympathetic and won't be......

It was under labours watch that all this shit happened - I'm not saying it's all their fault but they did largely fuck all about it until it was too late, and they sold off the Crown Jewels in the process (gold reserves being a biggy)

The public sector is just too big and too expensive - it's bloated and needs to be cut - that is unfortunately the real world.  Hopefully when that has been tackled and the economy is on a better footing people will be able to achieve higher than inflation pay rises because there will be fewer people to pay.

The unfortunate truth is that under labour, half the jobs created in the uk were publics sector ones - given that the public sector employs around 6million people and the private sector employs around 23million people it might be understandable to see why the public sector is now a little bit bloated, and therefore it's pretty hard to increase the pay.....