Busy Bodies

[ghanimah]

Perhaps, maybe, excess speed is not the biggest killer because people are limited to how fast they are allowed to drive. Which, unless I am mistaken, is pretty much the point.

I didn't say it wasn't the biggest killer - I used the words 'cause' of accidents.

[Flashheart]

Killer/cause of accidents

My point stands. It's like saying people should be allowed guns in Britain because so few people are killed by them.

[ghanimah]

Killer/cause of accidents

My point stands.

Clearly not - given that 95% of motorists admit to breaking speed limits, yet the cause of accidents by excessive speed is so low and that Swindon has the safest roads despite no fixed speed cameras

[nochee]

A majority of speed limits are ridiculous. Tewkesbury way for example, why a boring 40mph? As long as you slow down before the roundabouts, why not 50 or 60mph?

I got caught speeding in Mozambique yesterday. The limit was 60kph whilst driving through the village, which I adhered to. Then once the houses and people disappeared I sped up, only to be caught 50 metres before the national speed sign by the plod with a radar gun. The policewoman wrote me a ticket for £88 and then she drove me back to the village to pay the fine in her car. She was speeding herself and pissed herself laughing when I pointed it out to her. Cunt.

[DRS]

A majority of speed limits are ridiculous. Tewkesbury way for example, why a boring 40mph? As long as you slow down before the roundabouts, why not 50 or 60mph?

I got caught speeding in Mozambique yesterday. The limit was 60kph whilst driving through the village, which I adhered to. Then once the houses and people disappeared I sped up, only to be caught 50 metres before the national speed sign by the plod with a radar gun. The policewoman wrote me a ticket for £88 and then she drove me back to the village to pay the fine in her car. She was speeding herself and pissed herself laughing when I pointed it out to her. Cunt.

My mate was run over of tewksbury way so i am inclined to think 40 is good enough

[Flashheart]

Clearly not - given that 95% of motorists admit to breaking speed limits, yet the cause of accidents by excessive speed is so low and that Swindon has the safest roads despite no fixed speed cameras

Oh come on

Are the roads full of people speeding at dangerous speeds? No, they are not. Most people do drive sensibly. People may go over the limit from time to time but you can't make it out to be some anarchic state on the road where no fucker pays attention. It just isn't like that. The vast majority of road journeys I have made as a driver or passenger have been within the limits. Remove those limits and you'll have unskilled/inexperienced drivers as well as careless fuckers going much faster putting lives at risk.

Speeding does actually put other people's lives at risk. Of course it fucking does, it really isn't rocket science. I really can't see how people go moaning about speed cameras/paying fines etc for committing what is an irresponsible and potentially dangerous act.

[Chubbs]

Works both way, Id say people who drive too slow are just as much a risk as speeders, if you are not confident to drive at the speed limit you shouldn't be on the road.

[Bogus Dave]

I always thought the argument wasn't about the existence of speed limits, its that they are generally set too low.

[ghanimah]

Oh come on

Are the roads full of people speeding at dangerous speeds? No, they are not.

Er... quite clearly they are

Overall, drivers have been hit for almost a billion pounds in speeding fines in the last decade with at least two tickets handed out every minute.

Some police forces have seen a thirteen-fold increase in the number of fines handed out.

But then what's a dangerous speed? Is 69mph following a car 1 foot from its bumper in the fog better than 79mph on an empty clear motorway in good weather conditions at 2am? Speed limits are an artificial arbitrary limit. And as Govt stats show they are not the cause of circa 95% of accidents, how much you wish to ignore it.

[Honkytonk]

Works both way, Id say people who drive too slow are just as much a risk as speeders, if you are not confident to drive at the speed limit you shouldn't be on the road.

Hugely agree with this. In some states of America they have minimum speed limits on freeways etc. (typically about 20mph less) Anyone not able/willing to keep close enough to the speed limit is as much a risk as someone who exceeds it, if purely for the fact people get fed up and act stupidly trying to overtake them (see how many people overtake cyclists round blind bends/into oncoming traffic etc.)

I'm with Flashheart regarding speed limits, if you exceed them you're wayyy more dangerous than someone keeping to it. It's stupid to claim otherwise. Not because you're 100% going to cause an accident, but that if you do have even a relatively minor one, when you factor in going faster than the speed limit you're askign or some serious trouble. There's also factoring in keeping a sensible speed - i.e. don't drive 60 on a narrow windy country road with high hedges and numerous fields about, even if it says you can. I know some people who have had to flourescent vest up and get out the speed cameras to get the speed limit changed in their village because of this.

I do think that speed limits (particularly on Motorways and Dual Carriageways) need to be looked at more closely though. Back when speed limits were first set 70mph was beyond the comfortable reach of the average car, nowadays pretty much anyone can reach 80/90 on a dual carriageway if they want to. Maybe increasing speed limits during off-peak hours, such as 12-6am or similar would be a step forward. The unrestricted autobahns in Germany are a great model of the system. It would also give people a sense of freedom which they don't really have now. It's hard as someone who enjoys cars and speed to find anywhere where you can go for an afternoon and just dick about (safely) without spending stupid money. I was pretty pissed when we drove all the way to Pendine Sands this year (on a horrid day in March with my Mum so she could safely and legally hoon about in my car without needing insurance) only to find that Cars aren't allowed on the beach anymore because they are 'a danger to bathers and other beach users'.

As far as Busybodies with cameras are concerned, sometimes they're needed, sometimes not. I generally find waving at them fun. If you're speeding through a village or small town where there's all likelihood of hitting kids/dogs/old people/cars pulling out of driveways you're probably a bit of a dick anyway, so being pulled up by another set of dicks is kind of just desserts.

[Flashheart]

250k a day taken in fines?

Taking the lowest fine of 44 quid (so google tells me), that equates to about 5,600 individuals getting caught. There's an estimated 45 million car owners in the UK.

That equates to about 1% of of people being caught speeding.

Now of course not everybody drives every day and not everybody will drive by a speed camera. However, there is no way the average fine will be 44 quid and a lot of those people caught are sure to be marginal cases (which seems to be a common complaint).

By my back of a fag packet calculations there's about 1% of people being caught speeding. That means that either the roads aren't full of people driving at dangerous speeds, or it means that more speed cameras are needed.

[Batch]

I'm with Flashheart regarding speed limits, if you exceed them you're wayyy more dangerous than someone keeping to it.

That's not correct is it. On the Motorway today I saw a tailgator about 4ft from the car in front and a lorry transporter nearly sideswipe a Micra by indicating and moving before looking. Neither were going more than 65, but both were going slower than the car that later overtook me in the clear outside lane at 85. Which was more dangerous?

If you get caught speeding you rightly get a ticket. But lets not pretend speeding automatically makes you more dangerous.

[Flashheart]

That's not correct is it. On the Motorway today I saw a tailgator about 4ft from the car in front and a lorry transporter nearly sideswipe a Micra by indicating and moving before looking. Neither were going more than 65, but both were going slower than the car that later overtook me in the clear outside lane at 85. Which was more dangerous?

If you get caught speeding you rightly get a ticket. But lets not pretend speeding automatically makes you more dangerous.

Yet if that lorry transporter was doing 85 the outcome may have been very different.

There's lots of accidents caused by drivers that don't pay attention. What if they were not paying attention while driving at high speeds?

[Honkytonk]

That's not correct is it. On the Motorway today I saw a tailgator about 4ft from the car in front and a lorry transporter nearly sideswipe a Micra by indicating and moving before looking. Neither were going more than 65, but both were going slower than the car that later overtook me in the clear outside lane at 85. Which was more dangerous?

If you get caught speeding you rightly get a ticket. But lets not pretend speeding automatically makes you more dangerous.

I think you've paraphrased me slightly, either that or I've explained myself poorly: in my original post I said:

I'm with Flashheart regarding speed limits, if you exceed them you're wayyy more dangerous than someone keeping to it. It's stupid to claim otherwise. Not because you're 100% going to cause an accident, but that if you do have even a relatively minor one, when you factor in going faster than the speed limit you're asking or some serious trouble.

By which I mean that speeding itself is not necessarily dangerous in of itself, but through simple fag-pack maths you're much more of a risk to yourself and other road users if you're going at an increased speed.  I'm not saying speeding is more dangerous than tailgating or sideswiping, but that if you're doing it and THEN have an accident it is a major factor in causing an almighty horrific smash-up.

Swooshing past at 85 in the outside lane is yes, probably less dangerous than tailgating or sideswiping at 65. But tailgating or sideswiping at 85 is a hell of a lot more dangerous.

[Flashheart]

It's not just about how 'well' the speeding driver is going either as they have less time to react to other people's mistakes.