who are you voting in the euro elections?

[pauld]

Apparently in Cornwall, Labour finished 6th behind the "greasy haired twats" in the Cornish Nationalists. Wherever you sit politically, that's pretty fucking hilarious

[flammableBen]

these elections mean jack shit really though.i'm sure many like myself will vote a lesser party in the euros, but not in a local-general election.

Yeah of course.

But It's a shame that the majority of people aren't willing to take the time to understand the affects of the different elections instead of using everything other than a way of hinting dissatisfaction.

It doesn't help that they double up the euro elections with local ones, I guess it's some sort of money saving exercise and one that I think happens throughout Europe; but if you want people to take these elections on there own merits - and I there you can't get much more different in scope between local and Europe - then they should really separate them out.

[pauld]

Very, very sad news.  Even if you don't deplore racism (which of course you should, it's ugly, ignorant and lacking in any substance) how could anyone listen to Nick Griffin trying to make a logical argument for more than one minute and think "good point, well made"?  It baffles me, I really thought the British public was brighter than that.

Never mind Griffin, look at their shiny new MEP, Andrew Brons, a hardcore Nazi for over 40 years. He started out in an outfit called the National Socialist Movement - so we're not talking people winging the term "Nazi" around as a term of abuse here, these nutters were out and proud hardcore Nazis and declared it in everything they said and did. He went on from there to the NF, "rising" to become NF leader, a period where he was vitriocally anti-black and anti-Jewish, before moving on to the "Oh no we're not Nazis, honest guv" BNP. Like I keep saying, you don't have to scratch the BNP very hard at all to find deep hardcore Nazis. Anyone who voted for these shits should be forced to visit the Holocaust Museum and hang their fuckwit heads in shame

[flammableBen]

I think statistically Arriba is right - people do tend to vote for lesser parties more in European elections, and local elections as well.  Come the general election people tend to vote in a more mainstream way.

I think one of the most worrying things, and it has been this way for years, is voter turnout in this country.  Apathy, a potentially dangerous collective attitude, is rife in Britain.  I've met so many people who tell me that "I've never voted" as though they are proud of that.  Is it just me, or does it not make sense that if you choose not to try and make a difference on one of the very few times you can, you lose your right to an opinion? 

Rant over.

I completely disagree on this. If you're not interested enough to vote then you probably don't have much of an opinion anyway, but if you suddenly develop one over an issue is it void because you missed a chance to vote 3 years ago?

It's the same thing with people who make a distinction about people who go and spoil there ballot paper instead of not turning up. It doesn't make any difference and it doesn't matter.

I'm sure most people have a granddad, great uncle, or something who 'died for our right to vote'. It's not a right to vote unless you also have the right not to vote - for whatever reason they want.

[flammableBen]

Never mind Griffin, look at their shiny new MEP, Andrew Brons, a hardcore Nazi for over 40 years. He started out in an outfit called the National Socialist Movement - so we're not talking people winging the term "Nazi" around as a term of abuse here, these nutters were out and proud hardcore Nazis and declared it in everything they said and did. He went on from there to the NF, "rising" to become NF leader, a period where he was vitriocally anti-black and anti-Jewish, before moving on to the "Oh no we're not Nazis, honest guv" BNP. Like I keep saying, you don't have to scratch the BNP very hard at all to find deep hardcore Nazis. Anyone who voted for these shits should be forced to visit the Holocaust Museum and hang their fuckwit heads in shame

To add to the National Socialist Movement madness, I believe that they used to celebrate Hitler's birthday.

[pauld]

To add to the National Socialist Movement madness, I believe that they used to celebrate Hitler's birthday.

They deliberately delayed founding the party so they could found it on his birthday IIRC. We really are talking hardcore fruitcake here

[flammableBen]

It's interesting that the Tories haven't really been the ones to gain where labour have fallen, I guess they'll be using the same EU protest blah blah blah excuse that labour will.

Edit: that might have just been the results I've seen come in though.

[Doore]

I completely disagree on this. If you're not interested enough to vote then you probably don't have much of an opinion anyway, but if you suddenly develop one over an issue is it void because you missed a chance to vote 3 years ago?

It's the same thing with people who make a distinction about people who go and spoil there ballot paper instead of not turning up. It doesn't make any difference and it doesn't matter.

I'm sure most people have a granddad, great uncle, or something who 'died for our right to vote'. It's not a right to vote unless you also have the right not to vote - for whatever reason they want.

People of course have a right not to vote.  But surely those people don't then have a right to complain about the political situation when they have essentially opted out of said system?

[flammableBen]

People of course have a right not to vote.  But surely those people don't then have a right to complain about the political situation when they have essentially opted out of said system?

Maybe they felt that none of the candidates represented them enough. Maybe they don't like the system as a whole and feel that voting will only give it integrity. Either way, if they feel about something strongly now, then they'll probably more likely to vote in the next election.

[flammableBen]

Just noticed the top left counter on the bbc. There's a green 1, is that the green party or one of the welsh/Scottish parties?

[Doore]

Maybe they felt that none of the candidates represented them enough. Maybe they don't like the system as a whole and feel that voting will only give it integrity. Either way, if they feel about something strongly now, then they'll probably more likely to vote in the next election.

I see where you're coming from, but in my experience most people who don't vote do so from a standpoint of "I'm not interested in politics" - and I can't understand that.  Politics affects everyone.  I'm not saying that the sytem is perfect, but as it is, voting is the only time you get to influence to political landscape - I therefore see it as a responsibility.  

[Doore]

Just noticed the top left counter on the bbc. There's a green 1, is that the green party or one of the welsh/Scottish parties?

Confusingly there are two green ones.  The lighter green one is The Green Party.  The darker green one is Plain Cymru.

Edit: I think I was looking at something different to you.  Just turned to BBC2 and there is only one green one.  Now I'm confused.  I'm also pissed and colour blind.

[flammableBen]

But you make an impact to the political landscape by not voting, all of the parties will be desperate to find out what they can do to mobilise the people who haven't voted. It's a big shouting yell of get my attention with something I'll vote for.

[Doore]

But do most non-voters not vote to, as you say, make an impact, or do they not vote through apathy and ignorance?  I think we both know that the majority just aren't interested and can't see how politics affects their life - and I think this is a big problem.  I just cannot abide people saying it doesn't affect them, or that they are not interested, and then complaining about political issues.  We need to somehow get regular people interested in politics.  If the expenses scandal has done nothing else, it has got people in my office talking about politics for the first time in 2 years.  They've even shut up about Eastenders.  This can only be a good thing.

[flammableBen]

Confusingly there are two green ones.  The lighter green one is The Green Party.  The darker green one is Plain Cymru.

Edit: I think I was looking at something different to you.  Just turned to BBC2 and there is only one green one.  Now I'm confused.  I'm also pissed and colour blind.

Same. I think it was the welsh people. Red-Green colour blindness (which I think you have like me) is supposed to make it easier to tell the difference between different shades of green/red, just not green and red next to each other. Or something.

Think the green's might have just won a seat this time.