Thetownend.com

Is fucking great. Ok it gets a bit heated but when was the last time fans were split on something happening on the pitch. After a few southern comforts it has hit me how good it is to actually be debating football and not bankruptcy and cva's

fuck off you cunt

Every time Christian Roberts got near a pitch it tended to create similar splits :D

Its shit and its poisonous.

I hate it.

Fuck you you wannabe slanty eyed cunt

 :D

Seconded

Its boring.

It reflects badly on the Clubs fans.Ive no problem with a bit of reasoned arguement about it all but Swindon seems to have an embarrasing amount of complete clueless nob head fans.

And why did you not like sturrock haha

Tbf facepainting dickheads thats pathetic. Well reasoned debate is fine but the adver forum for example just proves your point yeovil

I just didnt like him,im fickle what can i say!

Bring back andy king.... ::)

It's rubbish, the vast majority of the good feeling around the club which came with the arrival of Fitton, has evaporated.

FWIW, i'm enjoying the type of football MM is trying to play, it's not his fault the defence/keepers are making basic errors..... or is it?  ::)

Nope its the fans apparantly.

Its down to concentration. If MM knows things are going wrong in the defence then he needs to use training to eliminate these mistakes...

A couple of sessions a week on "Brain Train" should do the trick

Yeah it's great fans arguing with each other.

Arguin? Aint seen that on here batch. All i have seen is people wanting people to provide reasons for why they waant malpas out. Must admit though the people who want the reasons dont seem to have many reasons why he should stay though.

I still believe that, given time, Malpas could be a success here for the following reasons:

Style of play is attractive and despite some poor results we've only really played badly once this season.

His signings seem to be ok. Nalis is probably the best signing we made in the summer and unlike Cox and Mcnamee he can't be attributed to anyone else.

We need stability, if we change managers now does anybody really think we'll shoot up the league?

A three year plan is just that. Aiming for promotion is great, but most clubs in this league are aiming for that. We need to be realistic in our expectations. If we finish in the top half this season it's progression.

I don't really understand why some think he's so bad.......

 :clap: good post

The style of play is better i cant argue with that. As you know steve through the 90 mins i will support them. The time issue is a strange one as personally i think it will we wasted with this mangagment team in charge. One question can anyone see malpas,byrne etc ever managing above league 1 level

Dunno about Malpas, but I don't think Byrne should be involved with first team now....

Seconded (or is it thirded?)

Exactly, people seem to forget that we are a few months in to that plan, and to be honest that's probably unrealistic, it took Reading 7-8 years to get a solid foundation and move up. But in todays "want now" culture, people start whining because we aren't top, pretty pathetic really. A lot of the supporters now didn't have to sit through the early 80's dross to benchmark against, that was bad. A big dose of realism is required from all, and that doesn't appear likely. If i was AF i would be seriously questioning why i bought in, as i suspect is all it might take is a few of our more vitriolic "fans" to start on him if MM stays and we are still struggling, and he will be be having second thoughts pretty rapidly.

 Yes, why not, all you need to do is look at the career of Tony Pulis.

  Usually ends up getting revilled at the clubs he manages, with the exception of Gillingham...because of his anti-fotball style of play. The Gills fans put up with it, because they'd never known anything better.
 
 Hertab's reasoning is faultless....

Yeah, but some people are just looking for it!  Look at the stick Pook gets, at the start of the season it was Paynter - but he proved his worth to the team and those supporters who slated him had to let go, but then they started to pick on Aljofree!!  As many other threads have stated we do have some strange supporters - but they pays their money and are entitled to their opinion - or are they?

No that is silly ronnie

What, they are not entitled to an opinion?

I've supported Malpas as much as I've slagged him off. I haven't said he has to go (yet).

The problem is, us fans expect promotion. I don't care if we play anti football to get there, I want promotion as per Fitton's 3 year plan. This season it doesn't have to happen, but I need to see something that I feel will get us there next time round.

Up front we've got it cracked, but I do wonder if this is simply down to the skills of individuals rather than a style of play. I think it's only fair I credit Malpas with our attacking success though.

 I want to see Malpas sort out the following as priorities:

1) Defence - organisation/marking.
2) Set pieces - fuck knows how they train for them at the moment (attack and defence), but it aint working!
3) Team spirit and confidence.

Do those three things and I'll be singing his praises because I think that's all we need to do to get promoted.

In my view thats a totally wrong assessment of how Reading have got the success they have.

Pardew was highly rated, but he really isnt up to the hype. He spent loads of money to get them out of League 2, millions. In transfers and wages.

Then, purely by luck, Pardew went to West Ham, and Reading got Coppell. A class act, who has managed to players like Shorey to England caps. Under him Madjeski has re couped a lot of his investment. Coppell is very very clever, he has sold players at a massive profit. Turned Pardews team into top flight players who romped to the Championship title. They absolutely thrashed it.

The season before Reading went up from this league under Pardew they needed 18,000 every home game to break even. They were getting about 13,000. If Fitton is ready to back his mistakes with millions, then fine.

My dose of realism is that this will be another very dull season, and I wont be going to many away games next year if things are not sorted out. We are a shambles at the back, the players are starting to turn on each other and the fans are loosing interest because we show no signs of the determination that will bring us a decent campaign. You cant compare it to when the club was absolutely skint, you cant expect the fans to have the same expectations. Its never going to happen. We have to start looking like challengers for the play off places. Weve conceeded 3 goals at home in our last 3 games for fucks sake.

We are only 7 matches in,you are always going to get Town fans who dont agree with each other.
I like MM,this is first job for gods sake,as for Aljofree you always get a player who takes the brunt of a few wankers.
I started a thread about Morrison starting..i for one applaud MM for dropping Ifill and starting him,Ifill will be back.
We have a good squad and once we get our home performances sorted we will start going upwards.
Ido think Brez is the best keeper and was dropped after 1 bad performance so wasnt Smith?...but thats just a minor point.
We as fans are part of the team,we are the extra player,Millwall next a win against them and we will be top ten...weve all got opinions and in my humble i think when the team is playing support em.....then if ware not happy we can express ourselfs on places like this.....and this is a great forum in IMO.

It's not his first job.

Its his first job in England then...Managers like Moyes,Fergusson were given years to show they can manage...not 7 matches.

He's had half a season.

And thats enough Sie?

This is utter rubbish. Moyes won Manager of the year in his first season at Everton.

Ferguson finnished second with Man United in his first full season with the club.

Both these managers showed great potential. They were then allowed mediocre seasons to consolodate. They werent allowed to be average. We are mid table, looking like being mid table for the forseeable future.

How long do you think he should have Si? He's not had half a season. The tail end of last season, with players he didn't know and who didn't know him?

People were happy to judge him (So they said) on how he does this season, after bringing players in and a full pre season.

We're 7 (SEVEN) league games in. Is that enough time to judge a manager?

In my opinion, is it fuck.........

I think it's very subjective. He has had half a season to sort out certain things like defence and set pieces. This is stuff that can be worked on in training, but clearly haven't been improved.

Other than that, I'll judge results based on a longer time frame. The way we are playing can be judged on a shorter basis though I feel, and if we are playing in a consistent manner, even poorly in key areas, then that is definitely a matter for judgment.

To compare ourselves with Man Utd and Everton is a bit silly Spence.

Ferguson was a very experienced manager at Aberdeen and Moyes had done his apprenticeship at PNE.

Malpas, in football manager terms, is a bit of a newbie. A short, unsuccessful spell in Scotland shouldn't preclude him being given a chance here (Although some decided it did)

Fucks sake Leefer started it!

I know it was a useless comparison. That was the point. Just wanted to set a few facts straight.  :busted:

Actually Fitton was the one who talked about Ferguson when he appointed Malpas. So he started it.  ;D

This whole debate is irrelevant anyway! Unless we are entrenched in the relegation zone after Christmas then Malpas isn't going anywhere.

I think people need to realise that established management teams like the one we had under Sturrock cost a lot of money, more than we can afford, which is why he had to go the last 3 months of his time here unpaid.

And you did Spence...very well,Si knows last seasons end dosnt really count for MM...on and off the pitch the club was in turmoil....MM has had 7 matches in reality....

out of interest, is anyone else bothered that andy king was our last manager to have a full season in charge? admittedly this is partly because wise/poyet and sturrock scarpered but i don't want to go back to another season in new manager limbo

Ok, I'm judging after 7 matches. We're shit at the back, shit at set pieces (attacking and defending) and we've lost our winning mentality at home.

1. We weren't shit a.t the back yesterday.

2. When were we good at set pieces?

3. 2 home league games Si, one against a team that beat Carlisle at their place yesterday.

Its time everyone took a long look at themselves and decided what they want from this season. Do they want an easy season, mid table, nice pay packet every month? Or do we want to try and do something, get somewhere?

Yep. All the way back in 04/05. Parkin's last season. Bad.

1. I'm pleased with how it sounded yesterday. It seems like we've made a bit of progress and that's what I'm judging. I said after Leeds I wanted to see progress in the next 4 games. If it wasn't forthcoming I would then conclude he wasn't right for the job. If it was forthcoming I would conclude he could progress us on the field.

2. Irrelevant point. If we're crap at it then make it better. How hard is it to work on set pieces in training? Sounds pretty simple to me. Also, they clearly have worked on attacking set pieces because they do a silly corner routine this year that I have never seen before. It's comedy gold.

3. At no stage did we look like we wanted beat Colchester and about 70 minutes of the Leeds game was the same. If you don't want to win games you won't win them. We should have at least got a point out of the Leeds game. If we had the right attitude we would have.


I do not wish for Malpas to be sacked now, I'm simply pointing out the things that need putting right. If they cannot be put right then he needs to go. When will that time be? I guess it all depends how long I think it takes to work on these issues.

How long do you think it takes to work on these issues? And do you start counting from when he was appointed, the start of this season, or now?

We werent at Hereford either. Another shit team.

I admire your defence of the team. But I hope the playing staff are not in denial about the defensive crisis we have at the club.

On the subject of set pieces, I recall Malpas asking the players for ideas.

Which is why I've said he's had half a season. These are things that are worked on outside of match day, in the training ground and the changing room.

In fairness Si, at least he's trying! Sturrock said we were poor at set pieces and I don't remember him getting the stick that Malpas gets about it.

The reality is that people are not prepared to give him any time, nor are they prepared to give him the leeway they'd give to Sturrock (Remember the shit spell of games in league 2?)

This is where I differ with that opinion, because I don't compare Malpas to Wise, Sturrock, King or Onuora anymore. I had done in the past when everyone else was, but we've moved on as a club sufficiently for the past to be the past.

I don't care about Sturrock. He isn't here, he's not part of the Fitton 3 year plan and he isn't responsible for how we are playing right now.

Lets be honest though SI.....his hands have been tied in certain aspects and what he has to manage isnt great IMO,but then he knew that when taking the job....but shall we wait untill the end of season at least.

Where have his hands been tied?

No choice as to his back room squad

Do you know this as a fact?

Apart from Cox....he hasnt been able to buy anyone he wants..FACT....you cant build a team on loan signings and lightweights who keep getting injured.

A very tight budget when it came to attracting players (Which is no bad thing imo, but does make it difficult to get players in)

Why did Malpas say there was money available in June then? Why did he say he hadn't asked Fitton for more money because he didn't want it?

Thats a very good point....but ime sticking to my guns Si...i like him,hes trying to play football and i think we will reach the playoffs easily.....weve only played 7 matches in another 35 i might be agreeing with you.

Out of all those issues? I think the only one that I expect not to be there from the start of this season is the winning mentality. Realistically it may take a couple of decent results or the fans getting fully behind the team to achieve this. Unfortunately the fans react to how the team does more often than not, so it can end like a vicious cycle. I don't think the fans have been behind the team from the first whistle of the season either.

The other things should be improved from when Malpas was appointed. I've not seen an improvement and he was appointed 9 months ago.

Like I said earlier, in as little as 3 or 4 games I may be back to agreeing with you, or going to the more extreme opinion of saying he isn't going to progress us so perhaps we should cut our losses.

I only want to see progress. We may have started below some people's expectations and that's just the way it is. But if we are serious about getting into the Championship then we'll have to make good these issues eventually.

I'm not sure Fitton is ever going to splash the cash in League One. Perhaps we should be marauding him instead!  ;D

I thought it was common knowledge he got given the job on the proviso he works with byrne and williams?

Yes. That also makes good sense at the time as they know the team and could integrate Malpas with the players even quicker than if that link was never there.

What I was getting at, if Byrne and Williams aren't good enough (or peceived so by Malpas) then why are they still here? Is he not allowed to get rid of people as he would do with a player?

I'm not saying there wasn't any money available. As to not asking for any more, I think a lot of us thought we had a pretty strong squad this season......

Ah right. I cannot comment on them

i'd rather we got shot of byrne and williams than malpas tbh

I don't see your initial point as to why Malpas has been restricted then I'm afraid.

I think we'll have to take the view of differing opinions (much like Leefer and Dave as well). Going back to the initial post by DRS, this is a good debate because people aren't simply making stupid points, there is some decent reasoning behind their thoughts, unlike the usual bollocks of "Malpas has no charisma" etc. etc..

money is tight we all know that.fitton isn't going to throw money at players so the budget is what it is.what is vitally important is to have a management team who can get players within that budget, and to get the best out of them.i'm not sure malpas is capable of doing this.i back him for now but some players seem to be off the pace this year.i hope maplas can lift the team so a change of manager wont be needed.all it would do is set us back again.

The budget isn't small either! We should be able to put a more than capable group of players together for the money available.

Does that help highlight my initial point?

Spence,

A lot of your posts mirror my feelings at the moment.With regards to Reading and the Pardew period,
he was indeed given a large budget and it took him ages to get things right.Remember when their fans
thought the team were "pants" and designated a particular home game,for fans to turn up and wave
underwear at the team?

The key is to have resources and to spend well,without being extravagent.Bristol City under Johnson
showed how to do this,also Cardiff in League 1 and Plymouth,the first time under Sturrock.Better players
bring a greater level of consistency and we need to see an ongoing improvement as the season goes on,
we also need to keep and improve/build upon the fanbase.

I do feel that Andrew Fitton should give MM the resources for a couple of loan signings.I know that we
can't offload the likes of Pook and Sturrock,but sometimes you have to bite the bullet.In 1985 Macari's
team made a very indifferent start,but the loan signing of Nicky Coleman (Millwall left back) made a huge
impact upon the team and results picked up and we had a season never to be forgotten.I don't expect
us to be promotion candidates,but i don't want us to be treading water,constantly looking at the bottom
of the table and worrying if we might be dragged downwards.

at the end of the day we are only 7 games into the season.

Andy King had a run of defeats greater than that before he got the sack!

Our team is under performing. Thats clear that part to do with the manager and part to do with the players. I dont think bringing in a new manager, with new idea, wanting new players will help our current players perform better. Maybe for the first game or two to prove a point.

We have look at the results a bit more as well. We've conceeded 3 in the last 3 home games. Ok, fair enough....lets see the last home game was Leeds who are one of, if not the best team in this league. They'll out play and beat most teams this year.

Colchester havent started the season well, so fair enough and the other team was QPR who are a top 6 championship side with a huge budget and millions worth of talent.

Ok, so we havent beaten teams like Hereford, Cheltenham and Stockport away from home. 2 draws is alright better than we would have done last season where we had a truely awful away record.

The problem is takeover = money = fans expecting money to be spent = fans expecting promotion. We seem to be setting our sights way too high this season. I see Spencers point of view and I'd love us to be good, win games and challenge this season but in truth you need to add a bit of realism.

We finished 13th last season and if we finish higher this season with more points I'll consider that progress. If we finish lower with less points we need to look at why we have gone backwards and make decisions about the playing staff, coaching staff and manager then.

Unless we go on a mad winless run and find ourselves in the bottom 4 or 5 around Christmas I think Malpas will see out the season.

DeeVee makes good points, perhaps a touch of realism and patience is what we all need.  Some people have, no doubt, been carried away on the euphoria of the takeover when they thought there were untold millions to spend, but Andrew Fitton never promised that.  They have forked out (Simon Cox) on various players, it is now a case of getting the blend right.  My only problem is that I cannot accept performances of my team like we witnessed against Colchester and Leeds.  Defeats yes, but those performances NO!

Agree ronnie its the performances i cant accept

I'm not convinced that would help right now - the most obvious area needing improvement is at the back, and are there really going to be any experienced defenders available who can give the leadership required at this stage of the season? What's likely to be available for loan is going to be kids on the fringes of Prem sides who need experience who won't fit the bill or (in the experienced camp) older players who can't get in Championship sides. I don't see either of those categories as helping out with what we require.

It was not euphoria either, i just think it was not too much to expect a manager with expierience who's right hand men were not mediocre players forced upon him.

Very true. But things have improved on the road now. MM has done a good job with that. We just need to build on that at home and if we do we'll be doing OK. Top half anyway. That's an improvement on last year so that's fine with me.

Paul,I fully understand what your saying,but the points that i was raising were that Fitton needs
to be more flexible.MM has frequently said that he can't bring anybody in,until players go out.He's
tried but there haven't been any takers for the likes of Pook and Sturrock.Is such a financial
straightjacket realistic and wise until january? Between now and the january transfer window we
have 16 league games,that eqates to half the season being over by then.Are you suggesting that
we go with the players that we have? Not bolstering the defence could be disasterous.

My point about Nicky Coleman in 85, was that his arrival had a dramatic effect upon the team and
upon his career.There are always players available out there,it's a question of doing your homework
and seeing if they're prepared to come,for experience or to put themselves in the 'shop window'

Simon Walton has had a major bustup with Sturrock at Plymouth and others are available.Would
he come and put himself in the 'shop window' who knows? We could also do a realistic deal upon
his wages with Plymouth,maybe a 40/60 deal? Walton can play either at Centre Half or defensive
midfielder.

Ideally we need a tough centre half who's a leader in the mould of Breckin (Forest) or Tate (Swansea).
I doubt whether we could get either,but if you don't ask, you don't get.

On a side note,how much is in the RAF surely that would fund a loan?

All fair points AM. No, I wasn't suggesting we absolutely must go with the players we have until then, just suggesting a reason why loans might not be the instant answer. FWIW, I'd like to think the management can get enough out of the players we have to avert the disaster - we should have enough quality in our existing players as individuals to form a solid back line as we did last season. I'm not convinced the problem is with the individuals so much as moulding them into a cohesive unit that's the issue. But, I take your point that there may well be quality out there that could improve on what we have or even if not improve on a one-to-one level, at least bring that cohesion we so obviously lack at the moment. I don't care how that's achieved tbh whether by working with the existing players or bringing in an experienced loan signing, and certainly wouldn't object to the latter if it worked. Just concerned it could end up being another individual who while of sufficient ability in his own right, joins the list of those unable to form a cohesive back four.

About £15k, and yes we have offered if it's needed but I don't think the issue is primarily financial

There's a reason Simon Walton, since leaving Leeds, has played for two clubs and been shipped off on 3 loan deals while barely playing for his full-time employees... and it ain't fitness.

We would merely rock the boat.

If i was fitton and malpas asked me to fund a loan for a defender i would tell him to fuck off

I do realise that Rich,i was just trying to use the example of a Championship player who might be
prepared to come to STFC and put himself in the shop window.I'm sure that there are players with
better attitudes than Walton,poor example on my behalf i'm afraid  :eek:

Agreed. There a plenty of players that would join us - it has to be right though... Bringing people in willy-nilly is wrong.

I wish you were Chairman it'd be ace.

I would kindly say make do with the 9 defenders you already have. Politely of course yeovil

Bollocks. It'd be lead story on the OS - "Chairman tells manager to "Do one" in loan defender bust-up"