New Ground Shelved!!!

[RobertT]

anyway, back to the point, Listen to MD this morning he seems to ahave answered all the questions. SBC wouldnt just be giving us the land, they could be co-owners of the new facilities and will be getting money bakc from that.

Sorry, but that just won't fly with the auditors, never mind the electorate. Fact is the current plan involves SBC giving up a large chunk of land with (apparently) a developed value of £25m, which gets developed for housing, developer takes a big cut, some dosh gets put into stadium and in return SBC get a part share in a stadium that they already own. That is not going to be seen as "best value" which councils are legally obliged to seek in this kind of deal.

He's right you know  

If the council do wish to dispose of the land in this way, they could make a value built case, with estimates of value in kind and future value or improvement savings. But it's difficult.

The ideal situation is that the auditor would like to see the land sold on an open market to achieve price, but we'd also be interested in the value that it can bring the community - often a lower price can be taken, if there is clear benefits to the community of the lower priced bid - I have thought that the lower priced 'bid' from STFC would achieve this, but Hilton or someone could also put in a good argument (employment, leisure, temp accom spase, regen) and could offer a higher price on the open market

I'll do some digging and find out a DA's take on this.....

All this would remain a mute point if the Council took responsibility to sell the land, whichever way they felt best.  This would provide the Council with a lump of money that could, within all rules etc, be used for the development of a Community Sports Stadium - including other sports and educational facilities.

This is how the other Councils have approached the development conundrum it seems.

As far as I can see, it's close to a win win on every side.

Council has new and improved facilities for the Community as a whole, just the loss of a bit of land (nothing new for them).

Community gets better leisure facilities, local residents groups etc could be attracted as tenants of some of the new office space.

Buiness Ops for employment in the area - new hotel and retail space.

Football Club get improved facilities and ability to sub let properties within the new ground, or hire out function rooms etc.  This improves the turnover opportunities for the club.

No doubt some financial stuff can be sorted between Club and Council over the grant funding the club would attract to the deal.  This could in fact be arranged on the same basis as now- Council own the land, club own the stands - obviously they get nice new ones.

[pauld]

anyway, back to the point, Listen to MD this morning he seems to ahave answered all the questions. SBC wouldnt just be giving us the land, they could be co-owners of the new facilities and will be getting money bakc from that.

Sorry, but that just won't fly with the auditors, never mind the electorate. Fact is the current plan involves SBC giving up a large chunk of land with (apparently) a developed value of £25m, which gets developed for housing, developer takes a big cut, some dosh gets put into stadium and in return SBC get a part share in a stadium that they already own. That is not going to be seen as "best value" which councils are legally obliged to seek in this kind of deal.

He's right you know  

If the council do wish to dispose of the land in this way, they could make a value built case, with estimates of value in kind and future value or improvement savings. But it's difficult.

The ideal situation is that the auditor would like to see the land sold on an open market to achieve price, but we'd also be interested in the value that it can bring the community - often a lower price can be taken, if there is clear benefits to the community of the lower priced bid - I have thought that the lower priced 'bid' from STFC would achieve this, but Hilton or someone could also put in a good argument (employment, leisure, temp accom spase, regen) and could offer a higher price on the open market

I'll do some digging and find out a DA's take on this.....

All this would remain a mute point if the Council took responsibility to sell the land, whichever way they felt best.  This would provide the Council with a lump of money that could, within all rules etc, be used for the development of a Community Sports Stadium - including other sports and educational facilities.

It's a nice idea Rob but not very realistic. When the council is slashing budgets, axing jobs, closing schools, has the worst social services dept in the history of the universe etc etc if it said "Right we're going to flog the CG to a developer for housing and then we'll have £25m to spend on a Community Sports Stadium" there'd be uproar. 90%* of people in Swindon would be demanding that if that kind of dosh is available, it should be spent on schools, teachers, social services for the elderly, a library, reducing council tax to a less eye-watering level etc. In fact the way the whole debate has been conducted in the past couple of weeks may have served to alert some taxpayers and councillors that the CG is potentially a little cashpot they could flog off and waste the proceeds of on something inane.


* Figure plucked completely out of mid-air, obviously

[Melksham Red]

It doesn't help when the residents of Swindon don't give a shit about the club or improved sporting facilites. I bet in the places mentioned such as Hull, Reading etc the local electorate were 100% behind the schemes and didn't mind a small portion of their taxes help fund the developments. There again they don't have a council as totally useless as SBC.

[Leggett]

RIGHT. I've just had a very fruitful phone conversation, with a very reliable source.

If we can't redevelop on the county ground site, we're jumping into bed with Supermarine.

I've been running this through in my head last nite whilst driving up to East Mids Airport for work, and what I've just been told pretty much confirms my thoughts.

We all know Rikki Hunt and Cliff Puffett headed a consortium to buy Supermarine's ground. Now i have it on very good authority that mr Hunt recently purchased a large slab of undeveloped land somewhere around the swindon area. It could well be that the land he bought is the farmland bordering the Supermarine facility, but I dont know if there are developing restrictions around the South Marston area, where Hunts Copse is, so can't be sure. I'm almost certain South Marston is outside the borough of Swindon though...

I dont believe for one second that 2 ex-chairmen would watch 'their' club die and do nothing to help. It makes sense to both parties to help eachother out really!

And as for the sizeable chunk of money that's missing from the project, you've gotta look at local property developers. large, national developers wouldn't touch it as there isnt enough profit, but smaller, more local ones would be far more interested. I've got a couple of names in mind, but one is far more suited than the other.

Gail McKenzie is a possibilty, but i'm not sure he's got the funds or the inclination! The one that fits much better is Matthew Singh, the guy who bought the Mechanics Institute with a view to turning it into a hotel, and then flogging it to a hotel chain for major profit. As far as I know, that plan is dead in the water (due to SBC, again), but Singh is still knocking around swindon apparantly, looking for a decent project. Any new development he'd be interested in would involve a 120-ish room hotel (any less and the major hotel chains wont touch it, as it wouldnt be profitable enough) and STFC wants a hotel in any new stadium.

The main point is SBC wouldnt be anywhere near as involved as they would be in a redevelopment of the county ground. Which can only be a good point.

[Northern Red]

Leggett, a very informative and well written statement

It'd be more honest and better if it didn't have that stupid women at the bottom of it - nice joke, can you get rid of it now?

It's just that its a good statement there, but hard to read while sat among a bunch of grey suited auditors with bananawomen there   :-))(

[SwindonTartanArmy]

RIGHT. I've just had a very fruitful phone conversation, with a very reliable source.

If we can't redevelop on the county ground site, we're jumping into bed with Supermarine.

I've been running this through in my head last nite whilst driving up to East Mids Airport for work, and what I've just been told pretty much confirms my thoughts.

We all know Rikki Hunt and Cliff Puffett headed a consortium to buy Supermarine's ground. Now i have it on very good authority that mr Hunt recently purchased a large slab of undeveloped land somewhere around the swindon area. It could well be that the land he bought is the farmland bordering the Supermarine facility, but I dont know if there are developing restrictions around the South Marston area, where Hunts Copse is, so can't be sure. I'm almost certain South Marston is outside the borough of Swindon though...

I dont believe for one second that 2 ex-chairmen would watch 'their' club die and do nothing to help. It makes sense to both parties to help eachother out really!

And as for the sizeable chunk of money that's missing from the project, you've gotta look at local property developers. large, national developers wouldn't touch it as there isnt enough profit, but smaller, more local ones would be far more interested. I've got a couple of names in mind, but one is far more suited than the other.

Gail McKenzie is a possibilty, but i'm not sure he's got the funds or the inclination! The one that fits much better is Matthew Singh, the guy who bought the Mechanics Institute with a view to turning it into a hotel, and then flogging it to a hotel chain for major profit. As far as I know, that plan is dead in the water (due to SBC, again), but Singh is still knocking around swindon apparantly, looking for a decent project. Any new development he'd be interested in would involve a 120-ish room hotel (any less and the major hotel chains wont touch it, as it wouldnt be profitable enough) and STFC wants a hotel in any new stadium.

The main point is SBC wouldnt be anywhere near as involved as they would be in a redevelopment of the county ground. Which can only be a good point.

If Highworth is SBC then surely South Marston is aswell.

[Leggett]

as i said, i dont know where the land that Hunt has bought is, so it could be that both clubs are moving to a new home.

[janaage]

I miss the banana already  

Let us know of any more news Leggett!

[Northern Red]

Cheers Leggett - avatars are small enough - but bananawoman was just in the middle of the screen bouncing up and down that banana.

It was a little difficult to explain, like a certain picture of Chuck Norris  

[McLovin]

Yeah, i had some explaining to do while reading the Chuck Norris thread.  I found it hard to link anal passages to my line of work without insulting certain colleagues.

[pauld]

The main point is SBC wouldnt be anywhere near as involved as they would be in a redevelopment of the county ground. Which can only be a good point.

If Highworth is SBC then surely South Marston is aswell.

Yes, but the point is that SBC don't own the land as they do at the CG, which is what the sticking point is there.

[Reg Smeeton]

RIGHT. I've just had a very fruitful phone conversation, with a very reliable source.

If we can't redevelop on the county ground site, we're jumping into bed with Supermarine.

I've been running this through in my head last nite whilst driving up to East Mids Airport for work, and what I've just been told pretty much confirms my thoughts.

We all know Rikki Hunt and Cliff Puffett headed a consortium to buy Supermarine's ground. Now i have it on very good authority that mr Hunt recently purchased a large slab of undeveloped land somewhere around the swindon area. It could well be that the land he bought is the farmland bordering the Supermarine facility, but I dont know if there are developing restrictions around the South Marston area, where Hunts Copse is, so can't be sure. I'm almost certain South Marston is outside the borough of Swindon though...

I dont believe for one second that 2 ex-chairmen would watch 'their' club die and do nothing to help. It makes sense to both parties to help eachother out really!

And as for the sizeable chunk of money that's missing from the project, you've gotta look at local property developers. large, national developers wouldn't touch it as there isnt enough profit, but smaller, more local ones would be far more interested. I've got a couple of names in mind, but one is far more suited than the other.

Gail McKenzie is a possibilty, but i'm not sure he's got the funds or the inclination! The one that fits much better is Matthew Singh, the guy who bought the Mechanics Institute with a view to turning it into a hotel, and then flogging it to a hotel chain for major profit. As far as I know, that plan is dead in the water (due to SBC, again), but Singh is still knocking around swindon apparantly, looking for a decent project. Any new development he'd be interested in would involve a 120-ish room hotel (any less and the major hotel chains wont touch it, as it wouldnt be profitable enough) and STFC wants a hotel in any new stadium.

The main point is SBC wouldnt be anywhere near as involved as they would be in a redevelopment of the county ground. Which can only be a good point.

 I've run by this theory before, it makes a lot of sense.

 Although Hunt's Copse is in the BoS it is outside the built up area, which might explain Devlin talking of something outside Swindon.

[Simon Pieman]

It would be quite an irony if RH came to the rescue of STFC

[SwindonTartanArmy]

RIGHT. I've just had a very fruitful phone conversation, with a very reliable source.

If we can't redevelop on the county ground site, we're jumping into bed with Supermarine.

I've been running this through in my head last nite whilst driving up to East Mids Airport for work, and what I've just been told pretty much confirms my thoughts.

We all know Rikki Hunt and Cliff Puffett headed a consortium to buy Supermarine's ground. Now i have it on very good authority that mr Hunt recently purchased a large slab of undeveloped land somewhere around the swindon area. It could well be that the land he bought is the farmland bordering the Supermarine facility, but I dont know if there are developing restrictions around the South Marston area, where Hunts Copse is, so can't be sure. I'm almost certain South Marston is outside the borough of Swindon though...

I dont believe for one second that 2 ex-chairmen would watch 'their' club die and do nothing to help. It makes sense to both parties to help eachother out really!

And as for the sizeable chunk of money that's missing from the project, you've gotta look at local property developers. large, national developers wouldn't touch it as there isnt enough profit, but smaller, more local ones would be far more interested. I've got a couple of names in mind, but one is far more suited than the other.

Gail McKenzie is a possibilty, but i'm not sure he's got the funds or the inclination! The one that fits much better is Matthew Singh, the guy who bought the Mechanics Institute with a view to turning it into a hotel, and then flogging it to a hotel chain for major profit. As far as I know, that plan is dead in the water (due to SBC, again), but Singh is still knocking around swindon apparantly, looking for a decent project. Any new development he'd be interested in would involve a 120-ish room hotel (any less and the major hotel chains wont touch it, as it wouldnt be profitable enough) and STFC wants a hotel in any new stadium.

The main point is SBC wouldnt be anywhere near as involved as they would be in a redevelopment of the county ground. Which can only be a good point.

 I've run by this theory before, it makes a lot of sense.

 Although Hunt's Copse is in the BoS it is outside the built up area, which might explain Devlin talking of something outside Swindon.

I thought he was talking about outside the border of control of SBC seeing as everytie we propose a site they pull the rug from under us.

[Cookie]

As it's not SBC land then they do not have as much control, however, they are still the planning authority :-))(