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Author Topic: Style of play  (Read 828 times)
The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey


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« on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 07:15:59 »

Nobody can complain itís not, in the main, really good to watch, but . . .

Is our attacking style good enough and consistent enough to compensate for our continuing flaky defending. Are we going to have to accept the occasional misplaced pass or getting caught in possession trying to play out from the back.

We seem very easy to Ďget atí at times.
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Nijholts Nuts


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« Reply #1 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 07:26:10 »

We'll (and already have done) get found out by decent teams, which will make life an awful lot more hard work.
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« Reply #2 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 07:35:43 »

Not sure weíve been found out by any decent side yet. Cobblers were shite and stole 3 points. Weíve dominated top of the league Exeter and Cheltenham with their good home form. Itís only our mistakes - or the officials - thatís seen us drop points.

Which is kind of my point in the opening post. Over the course of the season are we likely to be able to continue giving away chances and still being able to win games?
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kirky69


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« Reply #3 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 08:52:59 »

Nobody can complain itís not, in the main, really good to watch, but . . .

Is our attacking style good enough and consistent enough to compensate for our continuing flaky defending. Are we going to have to accept the occasional misplaced pass or getting caught in possession trying to play out from the back.

We seem very easy to Ďget atí at times.
Good question that. Wellens has the team playing a brand of football which is very easy on the eye, involving dominating possession by playing the ball largely on the deck, with very few aerial passes, other than crosses from out wide. It is not that far removed from what Cooper and Williams served up, which the crowd eventually got fed up with, because latterly we didn't have the quality of player to successfully implement it. This squad however is technically very good so we should win more games than we lose playing this way.

The 7 goals we have conceded in the league thus far have mainly been from crosses in to the box where our full backs have been exposed either by a lack of numbers in support or just by excellent wing play - Carlisles first goal being an example. Yesterdays goal was Rose losing possession in a dangerous area, leaving a 3 on 2 situation. This can happen with such an expansive style of play, but as long as these individual errors are minimalised, I am sure our overall defensive record will be fine. If you ignore the Northampton offside goal we have  conceded 6 genuine goals in 6 games which is decent - only 2 teams in league 2 conceded less than a goal a game last season. Also I cant remember McCormick making too many blinding saves, whilst attacking wise, we have scored 11 whilst missing many more golden opportunities - eg Exeter away we could have scored 4 in the first half alone. We should really be sitting top on 16 points based on clear goal scoring opportunities at both ends.

So overall, loving the style of football, which I believe is good enough to get us a top 3 spot, subject as always to injuries, suspensions and a good dose of lady luck.
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Peter Venkman


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« Reply #4 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 10:06:04 »

Pretty much what Kirky says for me too.

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singingiiiffy


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« Reply #5 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 10:17:43 »

Yesterday was a very poor game in terms of style. our strikers were extremely isolated and always had to cut back waiting for support. im happy with the style except the 2nd half yesterday- goals are coming from mistakes/officials. Wellens would have seen it fantastically from being in the stands yesterday- over playing at the back- need to know when to play and when not to- its actually quite an easy fix and wellens said they would be looking back through the tapes
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kirky69


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« Reply #6 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 10:43:28 »

Yesterday was a very poor game in terms of style. our strikers were extremely isolated and always had to cut back waiting for support. im happy with the style except the 2nd half yesterday- goals are coming from mistakes/officials. Wellens would have seen it fantastically from being in the stands yesterday- over playing at the back- need to know when to play and when not to- its actually quite an easy fix and wellens said they would be looking back through the tapes

Yesterdays 2nd half performance was to a large extent driven by the state of the game. At 3-1 up it was a case of hold what you have rather than being too expansive and risking conceding on the counter. Dour as a result, but controlled, even if it was much less pleasing on the eye. So I wouldnt be too concerned by it at all.
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Reg Smeeton
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« Reply #7 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 11:18:25 »

It's a good question....

Look at someone like Norwich last season, apart from Villa and 2 of the relegated clubs nobody shipped more home goals than them but won the league. They conceded 11 fewer on the road. Including FA Cup they had 4, 4-3 games either for or against. So it can be done.  Of course you have to be at the right level and this season they'll likely still win some, but be picked off in many others.

It could be that we can get away with it a bit at the back at this level, as long as we keep scoring plenty.... really only time will tell us.

It's quite interesting to look at last season's table after 6 games and then 46 games.... and you find that most sides although moving up or down a bit, don't move by that much over the next 40 games.  There are a couple of exceptions mind...notably Yeovil, who dropped 19 places and Bury who rose 13 places.  Oldham dropped 8, and after that 18 clubs rose or dropped fewer than 5 places.
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The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey


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« Reply #8 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 11:26:38 »

Did the switch to, essentially, 4-4-2 contribute to the rather disjointed 2nd half?

We seemed much more fluid with just 1 up front.
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scribblemilk


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« Reply #9 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 11:29:55 »

Good question that. Wellens has the team playing a brand of football which is very easy on the eye, involving dominating possession by playing the ball largely on the deck, with very few aerial passes, other than crosses from out wide. It is not that far removed from what Cooper and Williams served up, which the crowd eventually got fed up with, because latterly we didn't have the quality of player to successfully implement it. This squad however is technically very good so we should win more games than we lose playing this way.

The 7 goals we have conceded in the league thus far have mainly been from crosses in to the box where our full backs have been exposed either by a lack of numbers in support or just by excellent wing play - Carlisles first goal being an example. Yesterdays goal was Rose losing possession in a dangerous area, leaving a 3 on 2 situation. This can happen with such an expansive style of play, but as long as these individual errors are minimalised, I am sure our overall defensive record will be fine. If you ignore the Northampton offside goal we have  conceded 6 genuine goals in 6 games which is decent - only 2 teams in league 2 conceded less than a goal a game last season. Also I cant remember McCormick making too many blinding saves, whilst attacking wise, we have scored 11 whilst missing many more golden opportunities - eg Exeter away we could have scored 4 in the first half alone. We should really be sitting top on 16 points based on clear goal scoring opportunities at both ends.

So overall, loving the style of football, which I believe is good enough to get us a top 3 spot, subject as always to injuries, suspensions and a good dose of lady luck.

Interesting post but i contest that we play a similar brand of football to Cooper and Williams, here are my reasons why:

Firstly under Cooper and Williams possession of the ball appeared to be the primary objective, this was similar to how we played under Hoddle, we flooded the midfield with 5 players to dominate the ball and hence the play. Under Wellens Possession is the byproduct of his primary objective which is to press the player and team in possession of the ball and to retrieve it as quickly as possible.

Secondly under Cooper and Williams once primary objective was achieved the secondary objective was to move the ball side to side to stretch the opposition until a mistake by the opposition or an opportunity presented itself to progressive up the pitch with the ball. Under Wellens secondary objective appears to be to get the ball forward as quickly as possible if the opposition is within our half of the pitch if not then the ball is cycled across the pitch much like under Cooper and Williams.

The main difference is the primary objective, pressing high up the pitch with intensity is something we never did under Cooper and Williams and i feel is much more pleasing for fans as not only do we dominate the ball but we see the endeavour and work rate of the players.

I could go on but that is my basic analysis of the differences, yesterdays game was frustrating but also an interesting, Morecambe played much more like a Cooper team 5 in midfield trying to dominate the possession and sometimes they did. We playing a flat 442 actually struggled a bit with possession, I think our first goal was lucky but set the game up nicely for us, but i think we played poorly at times, i'd like to see more of a diamond shape at home two up top a Lyden playing deeper and three players rotating behind the strikers with width from the fullbacks.

I think we should stick to the 4231 away from home as its worked really well.
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Pax Romana


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« Reply #10 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 11:48:31 »

Yup agree that the Wellens passing game is a far better model than Williams.

Under Williams the main goal seemed to be retaining possession at all costs and waiting for an opening to be created by an opposition error.  Once away teams realised they simply could sit there retaining their shape and watch us endlessly passing around the peripheries we became toothless (and incredibly frustrating/boring).

Under Wellens they are looking to find that killer pass.  It doesn't always come off but we are always threatening to create chances.

I'm pretty positive about this season.  Top 7 and maybe even top 3 if we can reduce the defensive error count.
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Reg Smeeton
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« Reply #11 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 12:04:02 »

 Well next up should be an interesting game for style of play nerds, as we take on Embers' Orient, replete with James Brophy and Sam Ling.

 By my calcs only Iandolo, Conroy and Doughty will have worked with Embers.

 He's going to want this one badly.... basd on what we know, you'd think an away banker, but it's a funny old game.
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jayohaitchenn
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« Reply #12 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 12:09:50 »

It's quite interesting to look at last season's table after 6 games and then 46 games.... and you find that most sides although moving up or down a bit, don't move by that much over the next 40 games.  There are a couple of exceptions mind...notably Yeovil, who dropped 19 places and Bury who rose 13 places.  Oldham dropped 8, and after that 18 clubs rose or dropped fewer than 5 places.

Did Reg just predict promotion?
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theakston2k


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« Reply #13 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 12:18:16 »

Nobody can complain itís not, in the main, really good to watch, but . . .

Is our attacking style good enough and consistent enough to compensate for our continuing flaky defending. Are we going to have to accept the occasional misplaced pass or getting caught in possession trying to play out from the back.

We seem very easy to Ďget atí at times.
I don't think we are 'easy' to get at all. Morecambe scored because Rose made a stupid mistake and put them pretty much clean through. Other than that Morecambe could have played all week and they wouldn't have scored.
Cheltenham was largely Reid having a nightmare and Northampton was a horrific officiating mistake.

Exeter are top and they didn't really get as and we should have beaten them really.

I just think people are so used to moaning about the last few years that there seems to be a need to find the negatives rather than just enjoying the ride and the fact we have a decent team this year.
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donkey
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« Reply #14 on: Sunday, September 1, 2019, 12:34:04 »

I don't think we are 'easy' to get at all. Morecambe scored because Rose made a stupid mistake and put them pretty much clean through. Other than that Morecambe could have played all week and they wouldn't have scored.

Quite right.  I would say, however, that I thought Morecombe took their goal very well.

After Scunny I said if we play like that for the rest of the season, we'll go up.  I saw nothing yesterday to change my mind
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