The Inception (film) thread. Big SPOILERS

[Simon Pieman]

Firstly, if you haven't seen the film and want to then don't read this thread. It will spoil the film's storyline completely.

Second, mega post alert. I'm working by myself most of this week and I'm bored to hell.

Never since Donnie Darko have I seen a film which has been so widely interpreted.

Inception is also ambiguous and open to interpretation, the whole film and the ending tries to confuse so you struggle to differentiate between reality and dreams – just like the characters of the film itself. There are a few plot holes, or implied rules which I think happen as a consequence of trying to make the ideas complicated, but not as many as I would expect to be. Alternatively, it may mean the plot holes are there on purpose to hint that none of it is reality or that we can’t be sure.

When I watched the film I tried to break down the logic step by step which is the basis of my reasoning here. Here’s my most succinct reasoning.

The concept

They’re trying ‘inception’ the planting of an idea in the subjects mind. In this case they’re trying to do it on Fischer. In order to do it they must go down to the third level of dreaming (a dream in a dream in a dream).

How do they do this?

Yusef has created a potent mix of the drug to accelerate the mind and has mixed it with a sedative to ensure they can go down deep without waking up.

What issues does this cause?

They need a kick not just from the level above (like normal) but also in the level they are in. It also poses the problem that if you die in a dream when sedated you won’t wake up like normal, you’ll go into ‘limbo’ which is a shared state.

How does this fit in with what happened?

Each person who receives a kick from the level they’re in and in the level above wakes up. This is timed with the drug & sedative wearing off. Those who don’t (Cobbs and Saito) get stuck in limbo.

How does Fischer get back to reality (wake up)?

Fischer dies and enters limbo. Ariadne works out that if they go under a forth time they will enter limbo. You can only go so many levels deep before you hit limbo, Cobbs says earlier in the film that this is how he and Mal entered limbo before.

They resurrect Fischer by shocking him back to life with the defibrillator. He is now alive in the third level. Ordinarily in limbo you cannot get kicked back to reality (or up a level) but it’s implicit that this is because nobody has ever coordinated the kick in limbo with the kick in the level above. As they timed correctly, it works.

How do Cobbs and Saito end up together?

When I first saw the film this was the only thing which didn’t fit with my reasoning. Initially I thought it was because Cobbs died in limbo from being stabbed but was still under the sedative, therefore he re-entered limbo. Having seen the film again he does not die in limbo at all, he actually dies in the first level when he drowns in the van. This makes him re-enter limbo.

Due to Saito now being in limbo for decades he is old and has shaped limbo how he wants it to be. Cobbs is a little older but has only been in limbo a shorter amount of time. When Cobbs washes ashore in limbo the second time he and Saito can’t quite remember each other and Cobbs can’t work out why he is there. However, the totem forces Cobbs to begin to remember. He recites the line used by Saito earlier in the film “die alone an old man full of regret” and now Saito starts to remember. Eventually they work they are in limbo and can kill themselves to return to reality. As the drug/sedative has now worn off killing themselves will return them to reality and it does.

The ending – what’s it all about?

Cobbs gets back home and spins the totem. In the film he constantly checks reality by doing this. At the end he sees his kids and doesn’t care anymore. That’s why he leaves the totem without looking and goes to his kids.

This also creates the question for the audience – is this now real? I think this is why you hear the totem fall at the end but don’t see it. The Director wanted to emphasise that Cobbs is now content without checking reality but he also wants you to question what was real or not, become confused and face the same dilemma as Cobbs does in the entire film. Given the logic of the levels and kicks and also the sound of the totem falling, I think Cobbs isn’t dreaming.


Anyone else bored enough to read that and agree with it or come up with another idea?

[Chubbs]

I read it and seems pretty spot on, its a film that you need to watch a few times to start to grasp, ive only watched it once so will need to watch it again, as theres so much going on
My brain struggles to stay on track with these kind of films as i keep loosing track where they are, "is this a dream is it reality is it future is it past etc etc.
But still a bloody good film

[Samdy Gray]

Fischer dies and enters limbo. Ariadne works out that if they go under a forth time they will enter limbo. You can only go so many levels deep before you hit limbo, Cobbs says earlier in the film that this is how he and Mal entered limbo before.

They resurrect Fischer by shocking him back to life with the defibrillator. He is now alive in the third level. Ordinarily in limbo you cannot get kicked back to reality (or up a level) but it’s implicit that this is because nobody has ever coordinated the kick in limbo with the kick in the level above. As they timed correctly, it works.

This is one bit I struggled with in the film. I also think the writers struggled to fit this part of the story in with the Cobb/Mal scenario.

I understand that limbo is what happens if you don't awake from a dream before you wake further up the levels.

So Mal turns up and kills Fischer. He therefore can't wake up in the dream level above and is now in limbo.

They go into another dream (Cobb's) where you know Mal will be, but somehow this level of dream is also Fischer's limbo. I can't work out how Cobb's dream and Fischer's limbo are the same thing.

[Gethimout]

I think you're pretty much spot on, made sense to me. I've watched it twice and like Chubbs has said, you need to watch it a few times to grasp everything that is going on!

The ending was given away as reality by Michael Caine.

[Simon Pieman]

This is one bit I struggled with in the film. I also think the writers struggled to fit this part of the story in with the Cobb/Mal scenario.

I understand that limbo is what happens if you don't awake from a dream before you wake further up the levels.

So Mal turns up and kills Fischer. He therefore can't wake up in the dream level above and is now in limbo.

They go into another dream (Cobb's) where you know Mal will be, but somehow this level of dream is also Fischer's limbo. I can't work out how Cobb's dream and Fischer's limbo are the same thing.

I think you're right with this part of the story being very vague.

My issue is that it is Ariadne who suggests they go deeper (limbo being the very final level you can reach). Everyone knows Fischer will be in limbo and thus I don't know why Ariadne would suggest Cobbs dreams another level to get to him. She must surely mean lets go down to the final level i.e. limbo.

Yusef also says earlier in the film that only 3 levels is possible using his drug & sedative mix.

Of course, it could be they tried that but really ended up in Cobbs's dream. This would mean Fischer never got back (he was never there in limbo with them) and thus the mission failed.

[magicroundabout]

i'm going to watch this again at the weekend. i never heard the totem fall so assumed he was still dreaming.

[König]

someone said to me that throughout the film when cobbs spins his totem you never actually see it fall, suggesting hes never in reality but always in a dream state, and that he is stuck in a big cycle (as the beginning of the film is the same as the end of the film) but im not sure about this because i cant remember seeing his totem fall when he spins it, like many ill have to watch it again and look out for it. Also the fact that the totem isnt actually cobbs' in the first place, it belongs to mal, could mean that he never knows if hes in reality or dreaming as it isnt his own personal totem?

[RobertT]

I've only watched it once, and wasn't 100% sure either way, but wanted it to be that we never saw reality, we are always at least one layer down.  If that was the case, given everything we see is a dream level or limbo, it's entirely plausable for information not to stack up at times - the drug levels being irrelevant as it's a dream layer concept anyway.

[Simon Pieman]

The spinning top falls after the failed extraction job on Saito at the start, just before the helicopter arrives.

Whilst it isn't his totem to start with I don't think it matters:

Before Mal died it was her totem but Cobbs doesn't say if she kept her totem a secret. Given that he knew about it and the way it worked I'm guessing she shared her idea. Cobbs does say that the totem thing was her idea. I think Cobbs is super-paranoid about the totem because ultimately that's the thing he used for inception on her and the thing that killed her.

One thing I did pick up on the first time and completely forgot about is that he always has a wedding ring when he dreams but not in reality. He also would project Mal in 'reality' if it was all just a dream ergo I don't think it is. I don't think this should help with the ending though, I think his wearing of the ring is a projection, but by the end he's let go of Mal and thus the ring is gone (hence if he is dreaming at the end of the film he won't necessarily be wearing a ring anyway).

Though I'm sure an equally weighted argument the other way can be made. I'm realising how clever this film is now, but only when you think about it after.

[Gethimout]

It is a very clever film!! I watched it again last night and noticed the ring but like you said, once he has finally let go of Mal, you don't know if the end is in fact a dream or reality. Personally, i want to belive that it's reality.

[juddie]

i doff my cap to you si for a) having the time to do this and b) putting it across succintly.

I watched it for the second time this week and only noticed the wedding ring this time. I think it's a film that can be done again and again, and might even need watching under the influence of something other than a lemsip.

[Simon Pieman]

It is a very clever film!! I watched it again last night and noticed the ring but like you said, once he has finally let go of Mal, you don't know if the end is in fact a dream or reality. Personally, i want to belive that it's reality.

Yeah I think the point of the film is that you can chose according to how you see the 'facts' of the film. That's why my ending theory is just that - a theory.

[Leggett]

Now, a case can be made that the 'real world' level (if you will) is a dream state as well, Cobbs getting chased through the streets by largely faceless security types, and also during that chase he slips between two buildings which get closer and closer together as he nears the escape.

in an interview, michael caine says that if you see him in a scene, its real life, but i'm not so convinced. I really need to see it a couple more times to get a proper grip on it though.

[Gethimout]

Yeah I think the point of the film is that you can chose according to how you see the 'facts' of the film. That's why my ending theory is just that - a theory.

Yeah, everyone has there own theory. It's good to watch it back 2 or 3 times, as you start to see minor details in the film which you may of missed in previous sittings.

I actually read up on about 5 different interpretations. There is a few websites on this. It's an interesting read to see what other people think.

Now, a case can be made that the 'real world' level (if you will) is a dream state as well, Cobbs getting chased through the streets by largely faceless security types, and also during that chase he slips between two buildings which get closer and closer together as he nears the escape.

in an interview, michael caine says that if you see him in a scene, its real life, but i'm not so convinced. I really need to see it a couple more times to get a proper grip on it though.

I think that it's just Leonardo DiCapiro is a fat fucker!

Like you said, Michael Caine gave the ending away saying that if he's there at end (when Cobb finally sees his kid) then it's reality. That's the way i see it.

[Don Rogers Shop]

You bastards i'm trying to find somewhere to watch this online now.