Franchise v Swindon Town Matchday thread

[Bob's Orange]

I don't think Adeloye is worthy of a bench slot, even if it is currently empty - OK, that is over doing it, but I would go with a youth prospect in the meantime rather than recall him.

Aguiar is a different story.  He is clearly not good enough for a first team spot and a loan seemed like a good idea, but we didn't sign any players.  He is the clear back-up for Kemp, I'd drag him back here as soon as we are contractually able - not sure if we can right now?

I disagree slightly about Adeloye, and I guess the club figured that Abu Kanu was probably our back-up and therefore given his first team experience already weren't afraid to use him in the first team. After he got injured we've had to resort to using Obodo, who can run about a bit but at first team level is basically next to useless - I think kicking a defender in the head is about all he's done so far. At least in Adeloye there is a 'presence' on the pitch. Poor Obodo hasn't had a chance to develop yet.

[DiV]

I don't think Adeloye is worthy of a bench slot, even if it is currently empty - OK, that is over doing it, but I would go with a youth prospect in the meantime rather than recall him.

Aguiar is a different story.  He is clearly not good enough for a first team spot and a loan seemed like a good idea, but we didn't sign any players.  He is the clear back-up for Kemp, I'd drag him back here as soon as we are contractually able - not sure if we can right now?

For me; that depends on whether the youth prospect is a genuine prospect or a kid thrown in to make up the numbers. Obviously it would have been Kanu - who has been involved with the first team, has a decent record at U18. I know nothing about Obodo

Also, does Adeloye deserve a chance under a competent manager. Could Flynn get something out of him? Did we send him out on loan purely because someone offered to pay his wages and/or did Flynn decide he was surplus to requirements *shurgs*

I’m sure Flynn has said they can’t be recalled until Jan. same as Young and Kemp can’t be.

…and of course there is always this possibility making it a moot point.

[Bob's Orange]

On one of the older LS Podcasts, the point was made that Khan looks to have improved this season, almost as if Flynn's coaching has paid dividends. Makes me wonder whether Adeloye or Aguiar could also have seen the benefits of that coaching had they not been loaned out. Obviously we weren't to know we would get injuries/suspensions but had they not been out on loan they would definitely have got game time here - unless they have been totally bombed out by Flynn.

[ChalkyWhiteIsGod]

Everyone saw this coming. If you read my posts I have constantly said that Flynn has chosen quality over quantity.  He has mentioned this plenty of times in interviews he has done on the radio or Swindon advertiser. Flynn has even said in interviews that he is confident of new signings in January which indicates there is some budget to play with. If we don’t sign any players in January then things would look really shit and I will hold my hand up and say that Clem hasn’t backed the manager.

Unfortunately money doesn’t grow on trees. Unless Clem backs the manager out of his own pocket, then our budget is dictated on what we bring in as a club. Swindon strategy shouldn’t be to rely on a chairman to bank roll them. They should be self sufficient.  

Unfortunately you don’t seem to be able to hold an arguement well. As soon as someone disagrees with you, you start to swear at them, call them a wanker or a twat (a big indicator that you are losing the argument). These unnecessary actions sum you up as a person.

RobertT and others have disagreed with my views/comments,  but at least they don’t swear/insult me. They make measured responses. Something you could learn from.

Well that's a lot different from where you were coming from before, where you were clearly trolling. Me calling you a twat was someone losing patience with someone who wasn't arguing in good faith and trolling, or misunderstood where I was coming from so much it was rendered pointless.

I'm glad we're on the same page that if we have another absolute abortion of a January transfer window that Clem is to blame at least, but I feel like you'll just move the goalposts when we lose Kemp, Young, someone else and find cheap replacements if any replacements at all.

[ChalkyWhiteIsGod]

I also wouldn’t believe for one second there isn’t any players out there with enough quality to sit on a L2 bench. I’d argue as of now (Jan might be a different story) that we don’t need players for our XI. It’s slots 12-18 we need to pad out.

This is where the argument completely falls down for me and just looks like Flynn is towing the company line for the sake of it. They don't need to be world beaters, they just need to be good enough to play a game here, 20 minutes there so allow us to manage our squad better.

Jody Morris managed to sign McEachran and Brewitt outside of a transfer window. They are out there.

[ChalkyWhiteIsGod]

I know a lot of people don’t rate the pair but Adeloye & Aguiar would improve our bench. They haven’t been recalled - which is quite damning as to me it suggests the club would prefer to have their (or a % of their) wages off the budget rather than having them sat on our bench.

Also agree with this. Adeloye is fucking shite but would at least be better than raiding the youth team. Aguiar is pretty average but would improve our squad immensely as well.

Are we that fucking skint? These are more red flags shit doesn't add up.

[Mooneyraker]

This is where the argument completely falls down for me and just looks like Flynn is towing the company line for the sake of it. They don't need to be world beaters, they just need to be good enough to play a game here, 20 minutes there so allow us to manage our squad better.

Jody Morris managed to sign McEachran and Brewitt outside of a transfer window. They are out there.

100% Even on a short term deal until January!

[DiV]

Also agree with this. Adeloye is fucking shite but would at least be better than raiding the youth team. Aguiar is pretty average but would improve our squad immensely as well.

Are we that fucking skint? These are more red flags shit doesn't add up.

Potentially we are that skint or perhaps like has been suggested we can’t terminate their loans currently.

I fully get people thinking Adeloye is shite but me personally - still don’t feel like I’ve seen enough to judge.

Aguiar is a very strange one. Came in under Garner & looked the part - since then he has looked more like a competition winner…

…I’d be interested to see if Flynn could improve either whether their poor form has been down to bad management or bad players.

[ChalkyWhiteIsGod]

I still lean towards Clem at least having honest intentions just don’t think he’s made enough of a clean break from the old regime / knows enough about running a football club / has the finances to run us the way he hoped to / expected he could - but that’s a lean and I’m still hella skeptical about the whole thing…

Yeah, despite my criticisms I still lean that way too. But the longer this sort of shit continues, I'll be less so leaning that way.

[horlock07]

I fully get people thinking Adeloye is shite but me personally - still don’t feel like I’ve seen enough to judge.

Aguiar is a very strange one. Came in under Garner & looked the part - since then he has looked more like a competition winner…

Difference being that Flynn will have seen considerably more of both of them compared to literally anyone posting on this form and there is every possibility that he just doesn't think they are good enough.

We've moaned like fuck in the past about the club not getting players out on loan, and now they have we are moaning like fuck about it.

As for not recalling them until January, is it any different to Bradford and MK doing deals with us with clauses stating that they can't recall Kemp/Young till January, or have they just done that 'cos they are skint as well?

[STFC_Manc]

Difference being that Flynn will have seen considerably more of both of them compared to literally anyone posting on this form and there is every possibility that he just doesn't think they are good enough.

We've moaned like fuck in the past about the club not getting players out on loan, and now they have we are moaning like fuck about it.

As for not recalling them until January, is it any different to Bradford and MK doing deals with us with clauses stating that they can't recall Kemp/Young till January, or have they just done that 'cos they are skint as well?

Don't try and bring any logic into this discussion or you will suddenly be called a happy clapper

[The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey]

It’s a requirement for all loans - no recalls for season long loans until January. Clubs have no say in it.

[Mooneyraker]

Difference being that Flynn will have seen considerably more of both of them compared to literally anyone posting on this form and there is every possibility that he just doesn't think they are good enough.

We've moaned like fuck in the past about the club not getting players out on loan, and now they have we are moaning like fuck about it.

As for not recalling them until January, is it any different to Bradford and MK doing deals with us with clauses stating that they can't recall Kemp/Young till January, or have they just done that 'cos they are skint as well?

Whilst Manc inevitably praises your logic here, I think the issue is that whilst people were delighted that we shifted players out for once, it was under the clearly mistaken impression that they would be replaced. When Adeloye went out on loan, not many imagined that we would be relying on Miles Obodo as early as October.

My view is that something has clearly happened between August and the window shutting that means Clem has pulled the rug.

[DiV]

Difference being that Flynn will have seen considerably more of both of them compared to literally anyone posting on this form and there is every possibility that he just doesn't think they are good enough.

We've moaned like fuck in the past about the club not getting players out on loan, and now they have we are moaning like fuck about it.

As for not recalling them until January, is it any different to Bradford and MK doing deals with us with clauses stating that they can't recall Kemp/Young till January, or have they just done that 'cos they are skint as well?

Yes, Flynn will have seen more of them both and I trust his judgement if that’s the case but until it’s said publicly we don’t know exactly why they went out on loan and can only take guesses.

In fairness - with regards to loans (or the lack of) it’s about getting young players out on loan the next level down getting regular first team football to improve them so we can use them. I mean Aguiar’s loan might *just about* meet that criteria but loaning out Adeloye is clearly about freeing up the wages. Getting Minturn playing 35+ games for Woking in the National League is the type of loaning a player out that directly benefits us & the player. So I think your middle point about moaning for the sake of it about loan moves is well off the mark. We definitely do not get our young players out on loan high enough up the pyramid to make a significant improvement: the only time we’ve really done that was with Twine.

All clubs do it - that’s exactly why MK & Bradford have loaned out Kemp & Young, so they can free up their wages to sign different players. MK & Bradford are just like us and most teams in L2 have to keep and eye on their budget & move players around to maximise that. No different to us in that regards but I bet they’ve been able to name a full subs bench without having to resort to school kids.

[ChalkyWhiteIsGod]

Potentially we are that skint or perhaps like has been suggested we can’t terminate their loans currently.

I fully get people thinking Adeloye is shite but me personally - still don’t feel like I’ve seen enough to judge.

Aguiar is a very strange one. Came in under Garner & looked the part - since then he has looked more like a competition winner…

…I’d be interested to see if Flynn could improve either whether their poor form has been down to bad management or bad players.

I think there is definitely more of a chance of that happening with Aguiar. But like you said, we don't need them to be first XI we just need numbers in.

Although CM is probably the one place other than GK we're actually covered well. Every other position is fucking dire for a squad in 2023.