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Author Topic: Mansfield Town vs Swindon Town match day thread  (Read 14959 times)
Pericardinho

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« Reply #360 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 11:18:31 »

Would like to see us go to a 4-3-1-2

Hunt - Conroy (if he stops trying to play like Baresi) - Crichlow/Palace lad - Iandolo (need a better left back)

Reed - Lyden - Grant (ok fat chance but should be playing now)

Williams (Gladwin as sub)

Simpson-McKirdy


We tried the diamond against Bradford at home. On that showing it's not something I'm in a rush to see again!
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theakston2k

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« Reply #361 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 11:31:02 »

I'm sure someone posted way back at the start of the season that Garner-ball wouldn't work so well on slow, heavy winter League Two pitches. Whoever it was is right.
I think a fair few have mentioned it, I said a while back it would be the acid test for Garner and so far that is proving to be the case.

The thing is itís not rocket science. At this level you havenít got multi million pound fast draining hybrid pitches so you are always going to have several months of heavy, bobbly pitches. Setting up to play a style that is basically reliant on decent pitches in the bottom division has always been a recipe for problems during the winter months. He needs to be able to adapt to different conditions, just doing the same thing regardless of conditions isnít sticking to his convictions, itís showing a complete lack of situational awareness.
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horlock07

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« Reply #362 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 11:33:55 »

The experience comment got me thinking and looking at the line-up and the subs last night if you take out Anthony Grant, our most senior player (if I have got this right) is Jonny Williams who is 28?. For some reason I thought Rob Hunt was in his thirties, but he is only 26. This is very much a young, inexperienced side and looks like it in some games.

I was impressed with O'Toole last night for Mansfield, I thought he was their man of the match. He is 33.

Is it age or games played though (from WIKI so probably not 100% accurate).

Williams has played 230 games
Payne 308
Conroy 121 (same as Iandolo)
Frenchie 331
Mckirdy 116
Hunt 176
Reed 205
Grant 626

Its a bloody weird set up as we seem to have a fair few players mid career who due to injuries (or other things) actually don't have a huge amount of experience. One would suspect that  the idea when they were (to be fair) flinging the squad together at short notice, that Baudry and Grant would be calm heads in the team, that has not happened for various reasons.

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Shrivvy Road

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« Reply #363 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 11:47:08 »

It is a weird one regarding the style of play and the pitches because again it was stupid defending that cost us. We didn't play great(understatement) but did create chances and both Hunt and McKirdy both had great chances plus the ellis header. The style of football you can argue going forward works so pitch argument etc doesn't really add up.

We don't have the personnel yet to start smashing it long, their 3rd goal shows that. I think get through this month and hopefully we have recruited the style of players that allow us to mix it up
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Peter Venkman
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« Reply #364 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 12:02:14 »

I think Jake O'Brien has proved that Garner has realised we are woefully inadequate at the back with any height, but I would have prefered someone with a bit more experience to come in at the back.

He was like a rabbit in the headlights for the first 30  mins yesterday, he didnt realise the speed of the game and the strength and pace and knowledge of the player he was marking, it was a baptism of fire.

But he grew into the game and 2nd half hardly put a foot wrong and even had a massive hand in the 2nd goal, I think he will do well for us as soon as he comes to terms witht he players around him and their positioning as they didnt help him too much early doors.

Conroy seems to have gone backwards this season, he is blatantly a good footballer but his timing in tackles and positioning seems all over the place in the last 5 or 6 games, no idea if hes fully over his injury issues but he has been pretty poor since Orient if not a little before then.

He played a couple of good raking passes which we miss when hes not playing but too often those passes are way over hit, we miss him when he isnt there but often he is the one making the mistakes, its a dog eat dog situation its a real contronym.

FWIW Odimayo also played poorly by his standards too yesterday and I don't think Crichlow is the answer either.

We really do need an old head in defence who will do the dirty defending that we seem to need in almost every game this season, although I truly don't think Garner will get in as he prefers the youth model.
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theakston2k

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« Reply #365 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 12:15:02 »

With OíBrian I donít think it helped him settle being on the swamp side first half and still having pressured passes fired at him. Play pretty football higher up the pitch by all means but you just canít do that around our own box on these pitches, itís just asking for trouble and it also seems to set the tone for our actual defending.
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DiV
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« Reply #366 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 12:18:37 »

It is a weird one regarding the style of play and the pitches because again it was stupid defending that cost us. We didn't play great(understatement) but did create chances and both Hunt and McKirdy both had great chances plus the ellis header. The style of football you can argue going forward works so pitch argument etc doesn't really add up.

We don't have the personnel yet to start smashing it long, their 3rd goal shows that. I think get through this month and hopefully we have recruited the style of players that allow us to mix it up

Nothing to do with the pitches.

Itís still our own naivety in defence with regards to when you play it out and when to just kick the fuck out of it & our inability to fight back when we are being bullied.

Our game plan is a Ďweíll win some, weíll lose someí tactic and has been all season.
As the season goes on - chances are more teams will figure us out and weíll lose more.

We havenít got a big squad but I donít think we have a small squad either - what we lack is varied squad. A lot of similar types.

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TheDukeOfBanbury

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« Reply #367 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 12:36:35 »

I think Jake O'Brien has proved that Garner has realised we are woefully inadequate at the back with any height, but I would have prefered someone with a bit more experience to come in at the back.

He was like a rabbit in the headlights for the first 30  mins yesterday, he didnt realise the speed of the game and the strength and pace and knowledge of the player he was marking, it was a baptism of fire.

But he grew into the game and 2nd half hardly put a foot wrong and even had a massive hand in the 2nd goal, I think he will do well for us as soon as he comes to terms witht he players around him and their positioning as they didnt help him too much early doors.

Conroy seems to have gone backwards this season, he is blatantly a good footballer but his timing in tackles and positioning seems all over the place in the last 5 or 6 games, no idea if hes fully over his injury issues but he has been pretty poor since Orient if not a little before then.

He played a couple of good raking passes which we miss when hes not playing but too often those passes are way over hit, we miss him when he isnt there but often he is the one making the mistakes, its a dog eat dog situation its a real contronym.

FWIW Odimayo also played poorly by his standards too yesterday and I don't think Crichlow is the answer either.

We really do need an old head in defence who will do the dirty defending that we seem to need in almost every game this season, although I truly don't think Garner will get in as he prefers the youth model.

Canít disagree with any of this but the movement in front of the back line is poor.
This makes us even more predictable and easy to set up against. We are where we are with the players in the door at present. Losing KkH big loss as lose that attacking intent and pace.
Backline is changing by game at present and coinciding with a patch of poor form. Orient without doubt not at the races.
Times like this the senior players need to demonstrate true leadership qualities.
Hoping for a bounce back against Port Vale but remain extremely concerned that our squad remains paper thin and likely to get even thinner in the coming days.
Need some additional players to freshen it up and add to some opportunity to change the game when required.

Mansfieldís front two actually worked and constantly moving.
Simpson easy to play against last night. That alone made it difficult from the first minute.
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Shrivvy Road

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« Reply #368 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 12:40:08 »

Nothing to do with the pitches.

Itís still our own naivety in defence with regards to when you play it out and when to just kick the fuck out of it & our inability to fight back when we are being bullied.

Our game plan is a Ďweíll win some, weíll lose someí tactic and has been all season.
As the season goes on - chances are more teams will figure us out and weíll lose more.

We havenít got a big squad but I donít think we have a small squad either - what we lack is varied squad. A lot of similar types.


Yep pretty much what i said
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Peter Venkman
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« Reply #369 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 12:40:56 »

Absolutely mate, Lyden made himself vailable a lot and played very well, Reed though seems to have gone backwards in the last few games, Lyden helped him a lot but he wasn't looking for the short pass as he usually does, not making himself available, Williams did well at times but was always looking for the foul but again he wasnt eager to get the ball as he knew he would be clumped by them.

We are outbullied in the middle by a bigger fitter more experienced side that broke with pace.

I know I have said it so often but we need a fit Anthony Grant to break up the play more but that won't happen for whatever reason so we make do with what we have got, we dont really have a ball winning defensive midfielder in the team any more and that shows with us giving the defence little protection.
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RobertT

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« Reply #370 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 13:02:26 »

On the subject of Grant, I did preface my comment about using him with the notion of not knowing if he could even do it given fitness etc.

If Grant was fully match fit and raring to go, I'd be using him right now in the Conroy position.  He should be the "free" central defender, so his defensive ability is more about reading the game when required and organising people around him.  That's what a fit Grant type of player would give you and Conroy is not.  Grant is also pretty good on the ball, another attribute a Garner team would need from such a player.  The problem right now is that free central defender is in fact just one of three, with none of them seemingly aware of who has who.  The third goal last night being an extreme example - Odimayo and Conroy both let the centre forward move five yards away from them.  Neither noticed, neither pressed, neither even looked at each other to determine who was going to go - they simply looked befuddled once he had scored and I think Conroy looked irritated at Ward for the original kick (which was shit and did put us under pressure).

More problematic though, which I do not think will change, is the team does not look like one that is being trained with pragmatism in mind.  Caddis called it out in commentary - the ball down their flank was on all game, but had to be one played behind the defenders to allow Simpson to turn and run and chase.  Not one played into him or to his head to compete.  Both fullbacks had this opportunity open to them the entire game, we hardly eve took it.  Instead they would chip balls forward once the short passes had been taken away.  That seems like the way we are coached because it's a choice being made and we nearly always make the same one.  So even our out ball when pressed is one that is trying to retain possession, rather than turn a defence and create space.
« Last Edit: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 13:11:28 by RobertT » Logged
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« Reply #371 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 13:07:47 »

I can see Grant leaving before deadline day for first team football, there must be a team out there that will appreciate his talents, I'm sure he still has a few season left in him, especially if he wants to keep playing for Jamaica.

Since being here Conroy has not completed a full season, so it may be catching up with him with heavier pitches, not having had a proper pre-season either.

I suppose also he issue with only being limited to a 23 man squad means we cant carry the extra few players that are only squad players, we need more cover across most positions but some are more urgent than others.

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NotHarryAgombar

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« Reply #372 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 20:18:02 »

All of those calling for Grant to play are assuming he will play at the same level / be the dominant player he was in the 2019-20 championship season.
Like most of the others he was off the pace last season in L1 - no doubt the shambles off the pitch and Sheridan probably contributed to that decline.
He also had the issue that the first international break meant he was away for 4 weeks because of COVID quarantine rules, and this would have impacted on his fitness at that point.
Grant is 34 now - who is to say he will still be able to replicate the 2019-20 form rather than be more like the 2020-21 version?
The management see him in training - they are better placed to judge than we are.
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« Reply #373 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 20:34:21 »

still think it's a behind the scenes thing to be effectively frozen out. especially against some of the players ahead of him in some of the squads we had.
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Shrivvy Road

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« Reply #374 on: Wednesday, January 12, 2022, 20:45:34 »

I just think if he trains like he played last season he isn't mobile or good enough. Probably very unpopular but he didn't set the world alight the few times he has played but its catch 22 now as he will be short of match fitness
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