Let's Get Political!

[pauld]

I’ve also never understood how a normal working class person looks at Eton-educated, multi-millionaires and thinks “yep, they’ve got my back”.

This is what the current Tory cabinet (Raab, Patel, Truss) think of British workers:

"Once they enter the workplace, the British are among the worst idlers in the world"

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-19300051

Don't see them putting that on the election posters

[StfcRusty]

This is what the current Tory cabinet (Raab, Patel, Truss) think of British workers:

"Once they enter the workplace, the British are among the worst idlers in the world"

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-19300051

Don't see them putting that on the election posters

 "We work among the lowest hours, we retire early and our productivity is poor."

Not only is that bollocks but what's the alternative?  Work yourself into an early grave to make rich people even richer?

Just confirms what I already thought - why on earth would normal working class people vote for those shower of c*nts.

[michael]

I don't understand why more people are not kicking off about Boris suppressing the Russia report.

Comrade Boris, you mean?

[Pax Romana]

I don't understand how anybody with an ounce of decency and compassion would vote Conservative. Trouble is we live in very selfish times and many people are incredibly stupid too.

just out of interest, do you mean this particular Conservative offering or any Conservative ever?

[horlock07]

Yesterday in the Tory election campaign...

Rees-Mogg suggests that deaths were down to victims lack of common sense;
Bridgen suggests that Rees Mogg is cleverer than the Grenfell residents;
Cairns caught up in rape cover up;
They blatantly faked video of Starmer;
They refuse to publish report on Russian interference.

And yet they will still win.

Edit, shit I forgot....

Backing down on promise to allow vote on length of transition period, just about guaranteeing no deal departure next December if Johnsons capitulation passes;
Building 0 of 200k houses promised.

[Pax Romana]

But the fact that more and more people increasingly can't understand how half the nation could hold a different perspective from their own is very worrying IMO. It's a corrosive divisiveness that is undermining our democracy which is in large part based on consensus and tolerance. We are losing both

Sadly, you are spot on.

When the country voted for Brexit I thought that was as bad as we could get.  As usual I was wrong.  The last three years have exposed such appalling vitriol and intolerance within all of us, not just that other guy over there.  This is far more dangerous for our country than Remaining or Leaving.  Combine that with our rising level of appalling income inequality and we have the prospect of a divided nation for years to come.

My slender hope is that we get a hung parliament which forces a moderate left of centre coalition that has to compromise and work together in the national interest.  

Unfortunately that view makes me simultaneously a EU-loving traitor and a lying fascist.

 

[horlock07]

But the fact that more and more people increasingly can't understand how half the nation could hold a different perspective from their own is very worrying IMO. It's a corrosive divisiveness that is undermining our democracy which is in large part based on consensus and tolerance. We are losing both

The thing is say from 2000-2015 there was not a million miles between the parties in this country which make consensus fairly easy (even in 2015 the Labour manifesto was promoting a form of austerity), it was always fairly clear as a centrist that whichever of the big two got in they were unlikely to trash the economy or promote ideologically driven policies which would could potentiality lead to thousands on unnecessary deaths.

Now we have politics riven by hard line extremists on either side of the spectrum where purity and ideological cleanliness seems to trump just about everything,  ultimately a large proportion of the electorate has been entirely left behind in this process and are understandably getting a bit frustrated and pissed off about it!

[pauld]

Yesterday in the Tory election campaign...

Rees-Mogg suggests that deaths were down to victims lack of common sense;
Bridgen suggests that Rees Mogg is cleverer than the Grenfell residents;
Cairns caught up in rape cover up;
They blatantly faked video of Starmer;
They refuse to publish report on Russian interference.

And yet they will still win.

Edit, shit I forgot....

Backing down on promise to allow vote on length of transition period, just about guaranteeing no deal departure next December if Johnsons capitulation passes;
Building 0 of 200k houses promised.

You missed out:

Forced to pull adverts on Universal Credit after they were found to be misleading (that's taxpayers' money being used to lie to us)
Tried to get civil servants to do hostile analysis on Labour policies (again, abuse of taxpayers' resources for party political advantage)

Although to be fair it is quite difficult to keep up with the scale of the mendacity. That's just in one day. I wonder what's behind today's door in Dom's Advent Calendar of Blatant Lies and Shithousing?
#BritainDeservesBetter

[Reg Smeeton]

The thing is say from 2000-2015 there was not a million miles between the parties in this country which make consensus fairly easy (even in 2015 the Labour manifesto was promoting a form of austerity), it was always fairly clear as a centrist that whichever of the big two got in they were unlikely to trash the economy or promote ideologically driven policies which would could potentiality lead to thousands on unnecessary deaths.

Now we have politics riven by hard line extremists on either side of the spectrum where purity and ideological cleanliness seems to trump just about everything,  ultimately a large proportion of the electorate has been entirely left behind in this process and are understandably getting a bit frustrated and pissed off about it!

It's fair to say that the Tories have lurched into far right territory, but Labour hasn't even produced a manifesto yet on which to judge. Certainly there was nothing in the 2017 version which would have bothered any mainstream Northen European social democrat.

We do know that the Lab position on Brexit, what obviously to you seems an extreme position, is renegotiate and then put to a referendum including remain.  However your lots position of ignore the 16 referendum and just rip up the Art 50 vote, you see as moderate?

[horlock07]

If he 'wasn't due to come and talk to us today' what was he doing in the Sky Studios, does he live there?

https://twitter.com/MattChorley/status/1192013743967932416

[horlock07]

However your lots position

Jesus, I don't have a 'lot', I might have done previously but I am what one would consider a floating voter happy to vote for anyone who does not look like costing me my job or killing the population, one is not tied to one party all ones life you realise!

Corbyns 'renegotiated deal' is as dishonest as Johnson's, what is he going to renegotiate? He keep wittering on about workers rights and the environment (Which is all very laudable albeit very vague), however what is he going to do about the SM/CU etc the parts that will actually affect most of the electorate as much as the issues he is raising and being areas where the EU has been very firm and straight! Why should one give him a blank cheque?

One bloody day, Labour are going to finally realise that to get elected you have to appeal to the electorate rather than just insulting the non-believers, Blair got that and they got elected, will the penny ever drop?

[Reg Smeeton]

Jesus, I don't have a 'lot', I might have done previously but I am what one would consider a floating voter happy to vote for anyone who does not look like costing me my job of killing the population, one is not tied to one party all ones life you realise!

Corbyns 'renegotiated deal' is as dishonest as Johnson's, what is he going to renegotiate? He keep wittering on about workers rights and the environment (Which is all very laudable albeit very vague), however what is he going to do about the SM/CU etc the parts that will actually affect most of the electorate as much as the issues he is raising and being areas where the EU has been very firm and straight! Why should one give him a blank cheque?

One bloody day, Labour are going to finally realise that to get elected you have to appeal to the electorate rather than just insulting the non-believers, Blar got that and they got elected, will the penny ever drop?

I see.... it's always good to clarify your position, especially as someone who pontificates, it helps the reader get some sort of perspective.

At what point did you diverge from LibDemery?  Again you assume that Labour's manifesto won't appeal to the electorate, even though it's yet to be written.

[pauld]

Again you assume that Labour's manifesto won't appeal to the electorate, even though it's yet to be written.

He's not talking about the manifesto, he's talking about Labour supporters, some possibly not a million miles away from here but probably I'd guess more broadly on Twitter etc, who go into attack dog mode at the merest suggestion of deviance from the one true word of St Jeremy and suggesting it might not be the best way to win over support from the floating voters Labour will need to get into government. Which may not be a top priority, seems many in Labour are happier to stay as a purist protest sect than actually trying to change anything?

[Reg Smeeton]

He's not talking about the manifesto, he's talking about Labour supporters, some possibly not a million miles away from here but probably I'd guess more broadly on Twitter etc, who go into attack dog mode at the merest suggestion of deviance from the one true word of St Jeremy and suggesting it might not be the best way to win over support from the floating voters Labour will need to get into government. Which may not be a top priority, seems many in Labour are happier to stay as a purist protest sect than actually trying to change anything?

I see.... I took this

Labour are going to finally realise that to get elected you have to appeal to the electorate

to mean policies.

FWIW I've no idea what goes on in the world of Twitter etc, it's always seemed like complete and utter bollocks to me.  However as an observation I would say that it's fairly obvious that Labour isn't a dictatorship and there are plenty of examples where what Corbyn thinks doesn't become policy.

[pauld]

I see.... I took this  to mean policies.

FWIW I've no idea what goes on in the world of Twitter etc, it's always seemed like complete and utter bollocks to me.  However as an observation I would say that it's fairly obvious that Labour isn't a dictatorship and there are plenty of examples where what Corbyn thinks doesn't become policy.