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« Reply #60 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 16:06:17 » |
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Oh and as for doom mongering... We know we overspent and have to hack at the wage bill so why people seem so outraged is beyond me. Whatever happens, the players we brought in were due to be either younger or a lesser profile than the players we've had and moaning was inevitable. The fact that a lot of the players coming in have all been from one club has given the whingers something else to complain about... for some reason.
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kaufman
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« Reply #61 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 17:45:28 » |
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horlock07
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Lives in Northern Bastard Outpost
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« Reply #62 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 17:51:41 » |
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To be fair, the situation at the club is now vastly different to what it was when a good majority of season ticket holders renewed back in April/May time. I know an awful lot of people who wouldn't have renewed if the current situation was as it is then.
If things do go a bit wrong this season, all the additional people that have been pulled in over the last few seasons will quickly disappear again. And if as some are concerned, we end up effectively being a second string Spurs side, they'll start losing some of the longer term fanbase.
PV mentioned in relation to Collins and Caddis that we only want players here who want to be here. Fully agree, but how do we know the ever increasing Spurs contingent all do? They could be being made to come here through no choice of their own?
Seriously how did people expect it to go, it was blindingly obvious that huge cuts were necessary to get costs down, and player wages were also known to be the huge problem. Bloody hell if we can't offload players to the a championship team that were recently in the premier league is a bloody huge clue at how close the club was to the brink! Jed et al may be a bloody shambles but I didn't (and still don't see) a huge queue to take over from them. |
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Bob's Orange
Has brain escape barriers
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« Reply #63 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 18:12:15 » |
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An important point Horlock. When black decided to sell up it would have taken someone with massive wealth to come in and continue to support our overspend, or a new board willing to take on the reins and completely restructure.
Jed and co have come in at very short notice and clearly don't have the wedge to carry on as we did before. For Christ sake we had players on 3,4,5 maybe even 6k a week under the old board!!
He may not be the best person in the world but jed had the balls to take over and try and run the club sustainably. Some people really do appear to want the moon on a stick but the reality is, without jed doing what he is currently doing, we might be in admin, or worse.
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we've been to Aberdeen, we hate the Hibs, they make us spew up, so make some noise,
the gorgie boys, for Hearts in Europe.
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RobertT
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« Reply #64 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 18:17:31 » |
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To be fair, the situation at the club is now vastly different to what it was when a good majority of season ticket holders renewed back in April/May time. I know an awful lot of people who wouldn't have renewed if the current situation was as it is then.
If things do go a bit wrong this season, all the additional people that have been pulled in over the last few seasons will quickly disappear again. And if as some are concerned, we end up effectively being a second string Spurs side, they'll start losing some of the longer term fanbase.
PV mentioned in relation to Collins and Caddis that we only want players here who want to be here. Fully agree, but how do we know the ever increasing Spurs contingent all do? They could be being made to come here through no choice of their own?
Actually, our season ticket sales are pretty consistent now, since the price promotion season. That was one of Fitton's great successes. He got more than double the number we had been getting in recent years and the past 4/5 seasons it has now remained quite high. Certainly well above the historical norm for the club which had always teetered between 2k and 3k even in good times. By having the renewal price, people will continue to get hooked in, it is not like "new" fans were found to take up the season tickets. Overall it probably means we make a little less through the gate in average to good seasons, where on the day purchases would have made good money for us. But, it brings certainty and off season income. It also prevents really bad seasons like 05/06 where we dipped close to going under 4000 turning up. Every year where things are not just tickety boo you here people saying they won't renew etc. Every year we get the same uptake no matter what. Fortunately that number is at a much higher starting base now. 80%+ of our fans probably pay little or no attention to what goes on the media, behind the scenes in the boardroom etc. It's just us idiots on the internet who get all uptight about life as a fan. Mind you, experience suggests they more than make up for not letting off steam on the internet by doing so mid match! Oh, and I thoroughly enjoyed the past couple of years, but we didn't get any real surge in season ticket sales because of it, so everyone who was a season ticket holder the last time we got relegated will have had them in the past season. Why would they not renew because the club has sold some players and got some youths in? They stuck around even after watching one of our most abject season ever, I doubt ther past few months has had much impact on their lives. |
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RobertT
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« Reply #65 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 18:21:57 » |
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An important point Horlock. When black decided to sell up it would have taken someone with massive wealth to come in and continue to support our overspend, or a new board willing to take on the reins and completely restructure.
Jed and co have come in at very short notice and clearly don't have the wedge to carry on as we did before. For Christ sake we had players on 3,4,5 maybe even 6k a week under the old board!!
He may not be the best person in the world but jed had the balls to take over and try and run the club sustainably. Some people really do appear to want the moon on a stick but the reality is, without jed doing what he is currently doing, we might be in admin, or worse.
It's worth adding some balance, in Black's defence. We were not overspending until the start of last season it seems. Up until then, any shortfall vs income was sanctioned with equity/loans being granted. It was the overspend he didn't sanction that got us into trouble. We still would have had to cut our cloth once he left, but last season was accident waiting to happen once the Board started agreeing to demands they didn't have the cheque book to sustain. From Black's leaving tweets, it does seem that he got pretty pissed off at that point, hence the quick sale being pushed through in the end. He didn't want to be left holding the increasing cash shortfall that we'd been signed up to, especially as he'd underwritten the losses before that. |
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kerry red
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« Reply #66 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 18:44:10 » |
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An important point Horlock. When black decided to sell up it would have taken someone with massive wealth to come in and continue to support our overspend, or a new board willing to take on the reins and completely restructure.
Jed and co have come in at very short notice and clearly don't have the wedge to carry on as we did before. For Christ sake we had players on 3,4,5 maybe even 6k a week under the old board!!
He may not be the best person in the world but jed had the balls to take over and try and run the club sustainably. Some people really do appear to want the moon on a stick but the reality is, without jed doing what he is currently doing, we might be in admin, or worse.
Can't see how Jed 'had balls' in taking over. He got the club for nowt and has not had to invest a penny of his own. There are plenty on this forum who wouldn't mind a bit of that |
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RobertT
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« Reply #67 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 18:51:28 » |
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He got it for £1 because we were staring at a good £2m+ set of losses for the year.
That is a big risk for someone without serious cash to take on. We as fans knew we were for sale, but I don't remember us pulling together and creating a viable option?
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kerry red
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« Reply #68 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 18:53:15 » |
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That may well be true - but it doesn't change the fact that he got a decent business for bugger all and with no risk for himself
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RobertT
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« Reply #69 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 18:57:59 » |
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That is massive risk kerry. As a director he is personally liable and without a wedge of cash sitting around burning a whole in your pocket, our monthly losses could easily have dragged a man down.
I think he took a calculated gamble on the basis our losses the year before and the in the previous few years suggested the club could be run close to break even. Where they hit a snag is probably finding the massive gulf that been allowed to open up in the previous 6 months in terms of costs vs income. As that would not have been fully accounted for at the time of the sale, they probably were a bit shocked once the full extent became clear. Hence the 2/3 month period of panic in trying to get investors in to help them and now the the need for a complete clear out.
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Flashheart
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« Reply #70 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 19:01:33 » |
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That may well be true - but it doesn't change the fact that he got a decent business for bugger all and with no risk for himself
Anybody that picks up a business with running losses does not pick it up for bugger all. If he bought it for 1 quid the cost would be 1 quid + the difference that has to be made up for. If the club was losing 2M a year then the new owners stand to lose 2M a year if the cannot reduce the deficit so how is there no risk? |
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RobertT
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« Reply #71 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 19:07:21 » |
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If I do have a problem with the new owners, it's that they didn't outline the potential of their ownership and what it could mean to the club really early on. By that I mean:
State what sort of expenditure they could support with their current level of investment
Make it clear that if expenses at the club exceeded this, what their plan was going to be to rectify it
They clearly thought the club was spending a little less than they found.
The should have come out and stated that outside investment would be sought, but if it was not forthcoming by the end of the season then a cloth cutting exercise wouldbe needed.
I think if they had done that early on, they'd have people onside like Fitton had people. There should have been no shame in coming out and saying we simply cannot fund the gap we have found. We'll work on new revenue, be it investment or concerts etc. but in the short term some tough decisions are going to need to be taken and it might take a year or two to get the club back to break even again.
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Flashheart
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« Reply #72 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 19:11:39 » |
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What am I doing
Will not allow myself to get drawn into this repetitive, tiresome shite again. That's not a dig at anybody.
I for one am looking for the new season to start. The off the field politics is fucking boring. The football is way overdue.
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kerry red
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« Reply #73 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 19:13:15 » |
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Anybody that picks up a business with running losses does not pick it up for bugger all.
If he bought it for 1 quid the cost would be 1 quid + the difference that has to be made up for. If the club was losing 2M a year then the new owners stand to lose 2M a year if the cannot reduce the deficit so how is there no risk?
STFC is a limited company. Unless an individual has invested their own money - which Jed has not - he has no personal liability. If it all goes tits up, it's just hard luck Swindon Town Football Club. Jed just returns to being a town crier |
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kerry red
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« Reply #74 on: Sunday, July 21, 2013, 19:18:25 » |
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What am I doing
Will not allow myself to get drawn into this repetitive, tiresome shite again. That's not a dig at anybody.
I for one am looking for the new season to start. The off the field politics is fucking boring. The football is way overdue.
I agree that whatever we all prattle on about on the forum will not make a jot of difference to what happens. But it is relatively healthy outlet for people' concerns |
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