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Author Topic: Sale of the Club  (Read 309840 times)
lambourn red

« Reply #1935 on: Thursday, February 14, 2013, 19:16:31 »

While we await the deal news I do like to pop over and take a look at our pox friends site this latest thread is a classic of them spouting about our impending sale the last post is particularly good they must wank over this stuff

http://www.yellowsforum.proboards.com/thread/13143/wants-buy-club
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thedarkprince

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« Reply #1936 on: Thursday, February 14, 2013, 22:20:48 »

Where do they get this shit from?
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TheMajorSTFC

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« Reply #1937 on: Thursday, February 14, 2013, 23:57:31 »

I suppose they are diverting the fact they are well over £40 million in debt (is that correct or is it more?) and also their impending relegation to the conference...again!
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#VivaKenBarlow!
fatbasher

« Reply #1938 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 08:09:41 »

While we await the deal news I do like to pop over and take a look at our pox friends site this latest thread is a classic of them spouting about our impending sale the last post is particularly good they must wank over this stuff

http://www.yellowsforum.proboards.com/thread/13143/wants-buy-club

Fear not. I am sure whitehorse red will put them right soon enough.
« Last Edit: Friday, February 15, 2013, 08:16:19 by fatbasher » Logged
Bob's Orange
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« Reply #1939 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 08:15:03 »

What's wrong with our club, why does nobody like us? Boo fucking hoo, lame ass.
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Ardiles

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« Reply #1940 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 08:43:19 »

It's a common misconception that the Club does not own the County Ground.  It does.  It owns the stadium and the stands, but not the freehold of the land that the County Ground is built on.  That is owned by Swindon BC; so the Club pays a rent to Swindon BC (the freeholder) in just the same way that I used to pay a nominal ground rent to the freeholder of the flat I used to own in Wimbledon.  (The bricks & mortar of the flat, however, were mine - which was why I was able to sell it on to someone else when I moved on.)

When we talk about buying the ground from the Council, we are talking about buying the freehold of the ground, but not the ground itself (which we own).  This is very different from the situation that Oxford United are in.  Firoz Kassam owns not just the freehold of their ground, but the stadium itself as well.  Which goes some way to explaining why the rent that they pay - reputed to be in the region of £400k per annum - is several times greater than the rent that we pay to Swindon BC.

I could, of course, have got all of this horribly wrong...in which case someone (probably Messrs Davis or Tuck) will soon correct me.
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jayohaitchenn
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« Reply #1941 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 08:45:13 »

It's a common misconception that the Club does not own the County Ground.  It does.  It owns the stadium and the stands, but not the freehold of the land that the County Ground is built on.  That is owned by Swindon BC; so the Club pays a rent to Swindon BC (the freeholder) in just the same way that I used to pay a nominal ground rent to the freeholder of the flat I used to own in Wimbledon.  (The bricks & mortar of the flat, however, were mine - which was why I was able to sell it on to someone else when I moved on.)

When we talk about buying the ground from the Council, we are talking about buying the freehold of the ground, but not the ground itself (which we own).  This is very different from the situation that Oxford United are in.  Firoz Kassam owns not just the freehold of their ground, but the stadium itself as well.  Which goes some way to explaining why the rent that they pay - reputed to be in the region of £400k per annum - is several times greater than the rent that we pay to Swindon BC.

I could, of course, have got all of this horribly wrong...in which case someone (probably Messrs Davis or Tuck) will soon correct me.

Source?
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Stegenfreud

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« Reply #1942 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 08:46:30 »

I'm pretty sure we pay between 100k-150k a year, some of which goes straight to the FITC trust via the council, about 10% I think.
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« Reply #1943 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 08:54:34 »

Source?

I don't have one really.  Just my understanding of the situation over a number of years.

Makes sense if you think about it.  Occasionally (very occasionally!) we have undertaken capital investment projects to improve the stadium.  Why (for example) would we have paid £1.8 million to demolish the Shrivenham Road Stand in 1994 and then replace it with (what is now) the Don Rogers Stand - if we weren't actually going to own the asset aftewards?  Would we really shell out all that cash only then to hand the resulting asset (the DRS) straight over to Swindon BC?  Don't think so.
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suttonred

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« Reply #1944 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 09:02:36 »

Yep you are correct.
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horlock07

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« Reply #1945 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 09:04:11 »

I don't have one really.  Just my understanding of the situation over a number of years.

Makes sense if you think about it.  Occasionally (very occasionally!) we have undertaken capital investment projects to improve the stadium.  Why (for example) would we have paid £1.8 million to demolish the Shrivenham Road Stand in 1994 and then replace it with (what is now) the Don Rogers Stand - if we weren't actually going to own the asset aftewards?  Would we really shell out all that cash only then to hand the resulting asset (the DRS) straight over to Swindon BC?  Don't think so.

it would normally depend on the ;ength of the lease, if the lease is say over 75 years unexpired you would complete such improvements even if they passed back to landlord on reversion as the asset would have deprecited to such an extent by reversion that it would be essentially worthless.

However I recall that we seem to operate on 10? year leases (I seem to recall multiple renegotiations since I have been taking an interest in boardroom issues) therefore I would expect the town to retain the asset although lets be honest its all a little pointless, its not like its going to be viabkle to pick the stand up and move anywhere else!
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Ardiles

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« Reply #1946 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 09:08:28 »

So returning to john47's post on the Oxford forum...

'Its a catch 22 with Swindon Town and Swindon B Council. Swindon BC own the ground but Swindon owe them a hell of a lot of money in business rates etc. If they evict the football club then the club will not be in a position to repay the debt.'

..and taking each point in turn:

'Its a catch 22 with Swindon Town and Swindon B Council.
It isn't really.

'Swindon BC own the ground...'
They don't.  Just the freehold.  The football club owns the ground.

'...but Swindon owe them a hell of a lot of money in business rates etc.'
We don't.

'If they evict the football club...'
They won't.

'...then the club will not be in a position to repay the debt.'
Not true either - mainly because the debt doesn't exist in the first place (please see above).

But other than that, a cogent and well-reasoned post.  Thanks John.
« Last Edit: Friday, February 15, 2013, 09:13:18 by Ardiles » Logged
Samdy Gray
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« Reply #1947 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 09:10:07 »

although lets be honest its all a little pointless, its not like its going to be viabkle to pick the stand up and move anywhere else!

I wouldn't be sure about that. Maybe flammableBen could see the future:

[url width=550 height=400]http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d35/flammableben/standfight.gif[/url]
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Dostoyevsky

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« Reply #1948 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 09:14:30 »

I'm pretty sure the Shrivenham Road Stand was moved lock stock and barrel from Aldershot.
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Ardiles

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« Reply #1949 on: Friday, February 15, 2013, 09:31:06 »

it would normally depend on the ;ength of the lease, if the lease is say over 75 years unexpired you would complete such improvements even if they passed back to landlord on reversion as the asset would have deprecited to such an extent by reversion that it would be essentially worthless.

However I recall that we seem to operate on 10? year leases (I seem to recall multiple renegotiations since I have been taking an interest in boardroom issues) therefore I would expect the town to retain the asset although lets be honest its all a little pointless, its not like its going to be viabkle to pick the stand up and move anywhere else!

Absolutely agree.  I think I heard recently that the terms of the lease were up for review very soon (next month?) and that the Club was looking to have the duration extended - was 99 years mentioned somewhere? - so that development of the site was viable from the Club's point of view.
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