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Author Topic: So who turns on the lights  (Read 2987 times)
flammableBen

« Reply #15 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 22:42:05 »

Quote from: "Bushey Boy"
Why does it matter, its general because its about christmas lights.

Go ahead and ban me if you want as im quite busy at work and it would help me.


If you want to hire me for a quick bit of admin work I'll do it for a flat fee. Which means that the longer I take to do it the better value you get.

It was aimed at Fred not you Ash. I don't mind the topic just can't be arsed with another deluge of general comment and non-substance. At least I do that with more imagination.

Onto soniques post; I hate Nick Griffin, but I also believe in freedom of speech. But it leaves be with a belief crisis due to the apparent number of stupid and easy to influence people out there
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Bushey Boy

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« Reply #16 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 22:44:03 »

To be fair, NIck Griffin doesnt do anything different to the people outside that Finsley Mosque in London, now that is a joke!  It needs to work both ways.

I personally believe that public and private racism sjhould be banned on all levels
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sonic youth

« Reply #17 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 22:45:14 »

yeah, if anyone wants to offer me a job i'm up for negotiations.



i didn't realise people managed to get inside the union. that's a bit shit. i hoped the debate would go ahead but i can't really see why any intelligent person would even attempt to debate or reason with people like griffin or irving.

i only went to try and pull some fit liberal student types.
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flammableBen

« Reply #18 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 22:45:40 »

Quote from: "Bushey Boy"
To be fair, NIck Griffin doesnt do anything different to the people outside that Finsley Mosque in London, now that is a joke!  It needs to work both ways.

I personally believe that public and private racism sjhould be banned on all levels


I disagree with what you say but I'll defend to the death your right to say it. Well I would but I'm a coward.
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sonic youth

« Reply #19 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 22:48:01 »

finsbury, ash. and those extremists aren't invited to take part in debate at a union which has hosted people like mother theresa in the past - by inviting them you've given them a respected platform which they'll just use to make themselves look legitimate.
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Bushey Boy

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« Reply #20 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 22:48:53 »

so it should be one rule for one and one rule for others?! That bull
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sonic youth

« Reply #21 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 22:51:38 »

no that's not what i mean. griffin and irving shouldn't haver their right to freedom of speech withdrawn, nor should the muslim extremists like abu hamza.

but they also shouldn't be given respected platforms to speak at which serves only to legitimatise their views. nor should they be allowed to speak in public without opposition
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Colin Todd

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« Reply #22 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 22:52:50 »

Quote from: "sonic youth"
finsbury, ash. and those extremists aren't invited to take part in debate at a union which has hosted people like mother theresa in the past - by inviting them you've given them a respected platform which they'll just use to make themselves look legitimate.


I'm no BNP supporter but the muslim extremists are not a legitimate political party.

How can the BNP look legitimate because of this? no one knows what was said!  A surely if griffin and chum are talking total bull then the students at one of the worlds most respected uni's should be able to make them look pretty daft.

Oh the irony of using facism to silence facism
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flammableBen

« Reply #23 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 22:54:06 »

I'm with Ash on this one. It was a debate wasn't it?. I'd hope that some brainy oxford liberal types could argue them off the stage. By protesting against their views in particular then surely you're showing fear that they might be right.
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sonic youth

« Reply #24 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 23:13:11 »

nick griffin didn't accept the invite because he was looking forward to debating with others about free speech - the irony being that griffin and the bnp would only extend that right to white brits - but because it was an opportunity for publicity.

"This event is a big breakthrough for our party to spread its message in democratic surroundings."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/oxfordshire/7111933.stm

anyway, as i said i hoped the debate would go ahead and it would seem that it did, although not as smoothly as planned. by all means let them speak, doesn't mean they should be allowed to do it completely unopposed.
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redbullzeye

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« Reply #25 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 23:30:34 »

Freedom of speech should be encouraged.  We have laws to stop xenophopic views.  Nick Griffin will always come over as a cock because he is a cock.
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sonic youth

« Reply #26 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 23:39:52 »

indeed. doesn't mean that we can't disagree with those who are using their freedom of speech though!
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flammableBen

« Reply #27 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 23:45:47 »

Quote from: "redbullzeye"
Freedom of speech should be encouraged.  We have laws to stop xenophopic views.


Isn't that a bit of a bit of an oxymoron? (I might be using the wrong words again). Surely you can't have Freedom of Speech and ban people from having xenophobic views?
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redbullzeye

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« Reply #28 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 23:51:45 »

Quote from: "sonic youth"
indeed. doesn't mean that we can't disagree with those who are using their freedom of speech though!


do you mean abusing their freedom of speech Sonic?  I still struggle with this - I think people should say what they like but suffer the consequences if the majority hate their views.  But then we fall foul of other laws ... like if Bob Holt stcks the V's up to me cos I'm protesting outside the ground, I should be allowed to kick his bollox off because he's obviously dissed me in a severe and public fashion.
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sonic youth

« Reply #29 on: Monday, November 26, 2007, 23:55:19 »

abu hamza abuses the right to freedom of speech. i don't think griffin does. irving treads a dangerous line.

i suppose it'd be like some STFC supporters holding a pro-board demonstration, we'd disagree with them and voice that disagreement but wouldn't try and stop them.

i don't agree with those who wanted to stop the debate tonight. i disagree with the idea of inviting someone like griffin to debate free speech, it seems absurd but nevertheless i wouldn't try to stop it.
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