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25% => The Reg Smeeton Match Day Action/Reaction Forum => Topic started by: 4D on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 16:21:11



Title: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 16:21:11
I'll be hoping for a pub get together to watch this next week. I've got blue, not sure I have anything Amber though  :hmmm:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Batch on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 16:32:03
not for me. To painful. Will check the result


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Posh Red on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 16:36:12
I’m at Wembley that night, albeit in the Arena watching a gig.

Won’t watch the game, but will look out for the result.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 16:40:43
I'll be hoping for a pub get together to watch this next week. I've got blue, not sure I have anything Amber though  :hmmm:

A pint of Thatchers is Amber :pint:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: DiV on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 17:31:26
Couldn’t give a single fuck about the result.
Made that mistake in 2004 and those cunts from Brighton.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 17:41:54
Same here no interest in the game and can remember Mansfield fans were pissed off in 85 when we stole Calderwood from them!


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 17:54:53
I’m an honouree Stags fan that day. Hope they stuff them. You know in a years time we’re likely to pass the winners going in a different direction to the ones they hope for next week.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: JBZ on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 17:55:54
Not interested.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Swindon Please Win on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 18:39:50
Not watching, hopefully Mansfield win. Wouldn't ruin my day if not.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Nomoreheroes on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 18:47:04
Don't care. Won't watch. Will no doubt see the result on here.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 19:36:40
I’m an honouree Stags fan that day. Hope they stuff them. You know in a years time we’re likely to pass the winners going in a different direction to the ones they hope for next week.

PS. Doubt I’ll watch the game, I don’t have Sky and I’m not going over the pub spending money to watch it.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Benzel on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 20:15:58
I'll be washing my hair

Sent from my CLT-L09


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: NotHarryAgombar on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 20:22:13
I have no interest in watching this game.
Having watched PV 3 times (1 on tv, 2 live) and Mansfield twice (1 live, 1 on iFollow) my view is Mansfield are a better team and if asked to predict a winner I’d go for them
It will be tight however, and a physical battle without much proper football played.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Super Hans on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 21:02:46
Only wish is any Vale fans that acted like cunts on Thursday have a shit day. Whether that be breaking down on the way there or simply getting stuffed on the pitch.

Hope the more level headed ones enjoy it though. Kids etc.

Personally won't watch as it'll be a shitter knowing we were one pen away from being there. Didn't watch the League 1 final today for the same reason.

Though i'm there for a Coldplay gig in August (keep your comments to yourselves) so won't be able to avoid Wembley for too much longer anyway.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Batch on Saturday, May 21, 2022, 21:56:25
oh yeah, I hope Vale get thumped, but ultimately if they win it'll be regret it wasn't us that's the overriding factor


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Peter Venkman on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 09:39:16
Couldn’t give a single fuck about the result.
Made that mistake in 2004 and those cunts from Brighton.
This.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 09:43:08
I could. A Mansfield win would cheer me right up. A loss at Wembley is worse than a loss in the knockouts.  More expensive too  :)


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 09:45:34
And smash the horrible fuckers in the first game of the season


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 09:46:57
Same as


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Wobbly Bob on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 10:56:01
Probably in the minority, but taking the longer view, promotion followed by a miserable season of struggle would be fine by me.

Mansfield is the better trip overall, albeit the locals are not the most cheerful but nowhere near as miserable as a Stokie.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Nemo on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 11:00:48
Probably in the minority, but taking the longer view, promotion followed by a miserable season of struggle would be fine by me.

Perhaps with a midseason managerial change to a relegation firefighting specialist - perhaps John Sheridan would consider bringing his very specific talents to the role.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: JoeMezz on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 11:03:17
Like many would prefer Mansfield to win but not too arsed. Port vale will be irrelevant to us in a few seasons as this club builds up


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Peter Venkman on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 11:06:11
Like many would prefer Mansfield to win but not too arsed. Port vale will be irrelevant to us in a few seasons as this club builds up
Agreed.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: adje on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 17:57:45
I hate both teams. Nigel Clough is an absolute prick


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Sunday, May 22, 2022, 18:21:47
Mansfield always seem to have a bit of money so the bigger threat next season. Vale more likely to bomb next season so with that in mind combined with the events of the last couple of weeks a Mansfield win for me.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: thedarkprince on Monday, May 23, 2022, 07:38:06
Any heard what’s happening with Darrell Clarke after his sending off? Don’t think I’ve seen anything about it other than some feeble apology saying his emotions got the better of him.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Bob's Orange on Monday, May 23, 2022, 08:19:22
I think whoever loses on Saturday are likely to be battling it out with us towards the top of the table next season. Based on the games last season I was quite impressed with Mansfield both times, we were quite fortunate to beat them at the CG and Oates and Bowery gave us the runaround at their place. (although it was at the time Reed was suspended and we were reorganising a bit after the loan recalls I think)

Vale, obviously we saw 4 times and we had 2 wins and 2 defeats. The win in the league at Vale Park was a bit of a stroll for us, but the other games were relatively tight affairs and putting aside the nonsense from last week, they have a decent side. James Wilson is clearly a good player and their midfield is decent.

For me the game is a bit of a toss of a coin, I suspect Wilson might do something to make the difference at Wembley.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: horlock07 on Monday, May 23, 2022, 08:45:18
Like many would prefer Mansfield to win but not too arsed. Port vale will be irrelevant to us in a few seasons as this club builds up

Generally this although there is part of me that would like to see Vale win just so we don't have the inevitable absolute pantomime of playing them next season, with threats of revenge, ticket sale talk and generally posturing bollocks which would probably break the internet.

Two nothing teams whose recent historic place within the pyramid is broadly on a par with ours. Will I be watching it, nope, will I keep an eye on the score, nope will I look it up specifically afterwards, probably not. 


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Monday, May 23, 2022, 08:56:17
As previously stated if Vale don't go up this could become the new Gillingham fixture for the mindless few.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Monday, May 23, 2022, 09:10:44
Nah, Vale will be back to bringing 150 fans and 3/4 empty VP.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Monday, May 23, 2022, 09:14:09
Nah, Vale will be back to bringing 150 fans and 3/4 empty VP.

Don't forget the away fixture that's when the cowards would be looking to attack innocent fans


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Tails on Tuesday, May 24, 2022, 09:05:51
Ultimately I don't really like either of the clubs. Watching Mansfield continue to pump money in and fall short is quite amusing. Vale for obvious reasons. I think Vale are the better side. No real decent stand out players but a solid organised unit who will rough it up to get the win.

Having said that, having Vale at home next season will be spicy and I love a bit of theatre. Sure the players will be fired up for it given the fact they got a smack from the Vale coaches / fans / players.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Tuesday, May 24, 2022, 09:14:34
The Vile forum is quite amusing at the moment. They take the piss for us harping on about tickets and attendances, but they are keeping a running total of ticket sales for Wembley. Loads of moaning about prices, even diesel for coaches  :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Wobbly Bob on Tuesday, May 24, 2022, 09:27:05
A 25,000 ticket allocation pretty much covers the whole population of Burslem doesn't it?


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Batch on Tuesday, May 24, 2022, 09:41:10
Everybody keeps track of ticket sales and moans about Wembley prices!



Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Bob's Orange on Tuesday, May 24, 2022, 09:48:34
Everybody keeps track of ticket sales and moans about Wembley prices!



Yep, I'm sure this forum was the same when we got to Wembley, I'm sure there was a fairly regular update on tickets sold.

I suppose it might be a forlorn hope that we might be able to move on from the game last week?


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Batch on Tuesday, May 24, 2022, 10:03:57
I'm hoping to put it to bed after the final whistle on Saturday Bob


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Abrahammer on Tuesday, May 24, 2022, 10:30:54
People count empty seats on our ticketing site when we are have a big game coming up  :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Tuesday, May 24, 2022, 10:32:45
Yep, I'm sure this forum was the same when we got to Wembley, I'm sure there was a fairly regular update on tickets sold.

I suppose it might be a forlorn hope that we might be able to move on from the game last week?

Ignore this thread instead?


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Thursday, May 26, 2022, 15:08:18
A 25,000 ticket allocation pretty much covers the whole population of Burslem doesn't it?

Home from home, about 9,000 empty seats  :)


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: kaufman on Thursday, May 26, 2022, 15:18:01
Clarke is banned from the touchline on this match correct? the lack of any info post game regarding game trouble and such has been limited.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Thursday, May 26, 2022, 15:19:59
Don't think so.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Thursday, May 26, 2022, 15:37:05
I see both clubs sales have stalled around the 15k mark. It’s always enlightening when reality doesn’t reflect supporters perception of club size. Using Vale as example, they seemed to genuinely believe they had a substantial fanbase and they would shift any tickets they get for any match. Clearly however, these supporters were fictitious and their fanbase is significantly less than existed in many of their heads.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: reeves4england on Thursday, May 26, 2022, 15:44:42
I see both clubs sales have stalled around the 15k mark. It’s always enlightening when reality doesn’t reflect supporters perception of club size. Using Vale as example, they seemed to genuinely believe they had a substantial fanbase and they would shift any tickets they get for any match. Clearly however, these supporters were fictitious and their fanbase is significantly less than existed in many of their heads.

Quite. Vale fans got pretty irked by Town fans saying we'd sell out larger allocations and joked about how we probably think we'd take more to Wembley, but the numbers don't lie. 1600 on a weekend vs 2200 (sold out) on a Thursday night. And 15k to Wembley vs our various (much higher) totals.

Caveat: larger levels of support do not guarantee success on the pitch, but I'm not sure anyone is claiming they do.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Thursday, May 26, 2022, 19:21:53
I see fail have given Clarke a new 5 year contract.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: kaufman on Friday, May 27, 2022, 05:29:05
I don’t wish ill of Clarke, after what he’s gone through but I’ll write to my MP if he’s in that dugout on Sat. Like Wellens often did though, he’ll probably get a better idea of shape from higher up the stadium.
Edit- I’ve just read on the BBC that even though he was sent off he will take him place on the touch line.
Where’s my 3 years olds crayons and Bluey headed note paper?


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Quagmire on Friday, May 27, 2022, 06:03:25
What did actually happen when Clarke had the time off? I’ve seen so many different things.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: singingiiiffy on Friday, May 27, 2022, 08:29:16
I'm surprised more wasn't made of the Clarke Red card. did sky show any footage of it at all? I haven't seen any twitter clips or anything online. he went into conroy with his elbows raised. imagine if joey Barton had done that


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Friday, May 27, 2022, 08:33:57
I'm surprised more wasn't made of the Clarke Red card. did sky show any footage of it at all? I haven't seen any twitter clips or anything online. he went into conroy with his elbows raised. imagine if joey Barton had done that

It's not very clear

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/12617037/port-vale-boss-darrell-clarke-sent-off-after-scuffle


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: singingiiiffy on Friday, May 27, 2022, 08:36:44
It's not very clear

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/12617037/port-vale-boss-darrell-clarke-sent-off-after-scuffle

unfortunately it happened off camera on that one. you can hear the refs whistles when it starts to kick off. he should be looking at 3 match ban plus


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Friday, May 27, 2022, 08:49:51
But he WAS sent off and apologised for being a twat. That’s evidence enough.

He wouldn’t apologise if he did nothing.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Peter Venkman on Friday, May 27, 2022, 08:50:45
But he WAS sent off and apologised for being a twat. That’s evidence enough.

He wouldn’t apologise if he did nothing.
True that.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Friday, May 27, 2022, 08:53:45
unfortunately it happened off camera on that one. you can hear the refs whistles when it starts to kick off. he should be looking at 3 match ban plus

https://www.skysports.com/watch/video/sports/football/12617121/darrell-clarke-on-sending-off-my-emotions-got-the-better-of-me


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Bob's Orange on Friday, May 27, 2022, 08:57:00
I'm now heading into London tomorrow so won't see the game but I have a feeling it's going to be a fairly even game which may go all the way to penalties. I don't personally have a dog in the fight as both Mansfield and Vale are away games I can potentially do next season but as I did Vale this season and have never been to Mansfield will be siding with Vale to win, although I'm not going to lose too much sleep either way.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Bob's Orange on Friday, May 27, 2022, 08:59:59
Clarke has been given a fine rather than a touchline ban btw.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Friday, May 27, 2022, 09:15:31
Tbh, I’m not overly bothered about the post match shenanigans. It’s those 2 dreadful ref decisions that’s still gripping my shit.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: adje on Friday, May 27, 2022, 09:20:17
Tbh, I’m not overly bothered about the post match shenanigans. It’s those 2 dreadful ref decisions that’s still gripping my shit.
Me too. Can't seem to get over the injustice. That's a stonewall penalty


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Nomoreheroes on Friday, May 27, 2022, 09:25:20
What did actually happen when Clarke had the time off? I’ve seen so many different things.
Bereavement - Close family member. Possibly his daughter.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Peter Venkman on Friday, May 27, 2022, 09:27:01
Bereavement - Close family member. Possibly his daughter.
https://showbizcorner.com/darrell-clarke-daughter-port-vale-manager-wife-family-grief


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Friday, May 27, 2022, 12:33:23
I was looking at our attendances at wembley over the years, we seem to average 34k, lowest being 25k. Coincidentally our average is roughly what the total attendance will be tomorrow  ;D
We even took 30k in 2012 for the paint pot final.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Bob's Orange on Friday, May 27, 2022, 17:33:01
I was looking at our attendances at wembley over the years, we seem to average 34k, lowest being 25k. Coincidentally our average is roughly what the total attendance will be tomorrow  ;D
We even took 30k in 2012 for the paint pot final.

You weren't reading those stats in the female clothes section of tesco in Swindon earlier were you?  :hmmm:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Pericardinho on Friday, May 27, 2022, 17:39:40
Port Vale only sold 16k for tomorrow.

Get us out of this shit league. I understand they're an underdog in their own city but considering they haven't been in the playoffs for donkeys years, that's piss poor.

Absolutely gutted we aren't there. Really think we'd of sold out our allocation.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Friday, May 27, 2022, 17:40:06
I was looking at our attendances at wembley over the years, we seem to average 34k, lowest being 25k. Coincidentally our average is roughly what the total attendance will be tomorrow  ;D
We even took 30k in 2012 for the paint pot final.

Can you give us the breakdown as an average of 34k seems too high unless you're including 1969 which I have no idea how many we took. I may be wrong but seem to remember we took around 30k against Sunderland and 35k against Leicester.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Friday, May 27, 2022, 18:29:09
45k Arse
33k Sunderland
35k Leics
33k Wall
30k Chesterfield
25k Prezzer


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Friday, May 27, 2022, 18:30:22
You weren't reading those stats in the female clothes section of tesco in Swindon earlier were you?  :hmmm:

I'm not in my 40s  ;)


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Friday, May 27, 2022, 18:39:25
45k Arse
33k Sunderland
35k Leics
33k Wall
30k Chesterfield
25k Prezzer

Cheers I had no idea how many we took v Arsenal


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Bob's Orange on Friday, May 27, 2022, 18:42:53
I'm not in my 40s  ;)

Ah thought you were! 😃


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Gnasher on Friday, May 27, 2022, 18:55:53
45k Arse
33k Sunderland
35k Leics
33k Wall
30k Chesterfield
25k Prezzer

I thought it was around 28k for Millwall, 24k for Chesterfield and 20k for Preston


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Friday, May 27, 2022, 19:01:13
I thought it was around 28k for Millwall, 24k for Chesterfield and 20k for Preston

I also thought it was 30k v Sunderland


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Friday, May 27, 2022, 19:04:10
73k v Sun, they had about 40k
Ditto Wall
48k fir Prezzer they brought about 2k less
Deffo 30k for Chesterfield, as per BBC website


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: pantomime dame on Friday, May 27, 2022, 19:23:24
73k v Sun, they had about 40k
Ditto Wall
48k fir Prezzer they brought about 2k less
Deffo 30k for Chesterfield, as per BBC website
and their is your problem. bbc is a post truth news/facts provider. I wouldn't trust them with the weather let alone big numbers 73,000 etc.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: AMayesIng on Friday, May 27, 2022, 20:05:42
and their is your problem. bbc is a post truth news/facts provider. I wouldn't trust them with the weather let alone big numbers 73,000 etc.
Eh? You are talking out of your arse. The BBC isn't perfect, but does a pretty good job at fact checking and balance. It compares very well with most of the worlds media organisations, in fact is looked on as an example of how to do PSB by much of the world. What is your preferred media channel of choice then?


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Friday, May 27, 2022, 20:51:13
and their is your problem. bbc is a post truth news/facts provider. I wouldn't trust them with the weather let alone big numbers 73,000 etc.
Well I  was there in 90, 93, 10, 12, 15. Believe what you want.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Friday, May 27, 2022, 21:03:29
Tinport Vale fans saying the reason Mansfield are taking more fans tomorrow is because of a couple of thousand forest fans boosting their numbers.  :girlgiggle:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Friday, May 27, 2022, 21:12:35
Couldn't they ask the grown ups from Stoke City for some moral support😀


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: JBZ on Friday, May 27, 2022, 21:14:16
I wonder what Bradford make of all this given that their attendance stats make all other div 4 teams look very 'tinpot'?


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Friday, May 27, 2022, 21:17:51
A bit of an unfair comparison considering they have a population of over 500,000 and cheap season tickets.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: JBZ on Friday, May 27, 2022, 21:22:47
So, Nailsworth Village Green are way ahead in the tinpot attendance league as it appears that half their population turn out for their matches.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Friday, May 27, 2022, 21:36:14
Assuming they all live in Nailsworth😀


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Wobbly Bob on Friday, May 27, 2022, 23:22:24
73k v Sun, they had about 40k
Ditto Wall
48k fir Prezzer they brought about 2k less
Deffo 30k for Chesterfield, as per BBC website

Interesting re Preston.
On the day it did look like we were outnumbered.



Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Private Fraser on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 06:45:36
Interesting re Preston.
On the day it did look like we were outnumbered.



From a relaible source:

http://www.swindon-town-fc.co.uk/MatchCentre.asp?Tab=Video&MatchID=20150403


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: DiV on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 06:50:58
Well I  was there in 90, 93, 10, 12, 15. Believe what you want.

Yeah but I bet you didn’t count each individual fan though


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Gnasher on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 06:56:37
From a relaible source:

http://www.swindon-town-fc.co.uk/MatchCentre.asp?Tab=Video&MatchID=20150403


That's what I remembered - we only just scraped 20k


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: pantomime dame on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 07:36:54
From a relaible source:

http://www.swindon-town-fc.co.uk/MatchCentre.asp?Tab=Video&MatchID=20150403

Oh dear, dear, dear. This is very unhelpful. Can you tell us if this figure has been verified by the AMayesIng bbc facts and balance department? Run by the excellent Tarquin Fatsalary.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 08:13:29
Ok so we have established that that we may or may not have had as many fans at our last few Wembley appearances as some had thought or suggested and possibly more than some had thought or suggested. We have also established that Pork Vile and Mansfield are two tinpot clubs with big and unsubstantiated ideas about their respective clubs standing in the football pyramid. We have without doubt established that we are a bigger club on many levels than today’s play off final teams. We have also established that in reality we over achieved this season but fell just a measly three point away from promotion on GD.

Up the Stags, for today at least.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 08:23:52
Hope they both lose!


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 08:45:36
Hope they both lose!

You going to have a bet on that Jim? 🤣


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 08:47:08
You going to have a bet on that Jim? 🤣

Which one would I lose more on😀


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: TheDukeOfBanbury on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 09:35:48
Which one would I lose more on😀

Jimbo your nasty streak.
Hoping they both lose on pens.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Super Hans on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 09:45:38
From a relaible source:

http://www.swindon-town-fc.co.uk/MatchCentre.asp?Tab=Video&MatchID=20150403

Wish I didn't watch the lowlights. What a depressing day that was.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 10:21:48
There's no way Preston had 28k there.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Nemo on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 10:34:56
There's no way Preston had 28k there.

There would have been club Wembley types as well right? Don't think the Preston attendance will be just the total minus the Swindon fans.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Peter Venkman on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 10:39:21
There would have been club Wembley types as well right? Don't think the Preston attendance will be just the total minus the Swindon fans.
I am sure that Prestons official figures were around 18,000.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Batch on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 10:42:44
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

https://twitter.com/mathbaudry5/status/1530494114831147009?t=WEXo-7XoMrb1IJCXD9mq_g&s=19


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Nemo on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 10:43:28
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

https://twitter.com/mathbaudry5/status/1530494114831147009?t=WEXo-7XoMrb1IJCXD9mq_g&s=19

I believe the kids call this 'choosing violence'.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Peter Venkman on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 10:44:04
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

https://twitter.com/mathbaudry5/status/1530494114831147009?t=WEXo-7XoMrb1IJCXD9mq_g&s=19
Brilliant from Frenchie.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Posh Red on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 11:06:49
On the train on my way to Wembley.

Kick off is about 18:30 tonight


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Private Fraser on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 11:13:59
I am sure that Prestons official figures were around 18,000.

The Lancashire Post claims it was 24,000:

https://www.lep.co.uk/sport/football/preston-north-end/six-years-ago-today-that-preston-north-end-won-the-league-one-play-off-final-at-wembley-3247100


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 11:14:14
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

https://twitter.com/mathbaudry5/status/1530494114831147009?t=WEXo-7XoMrb1IJCXD9mq_g&s=19

He ain't wrong  ;D


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Nomoreheroes on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 12:51:50
I'd rather watch Ant and Fucking Dec than this game!


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 13:13:03
The Lancashire Post claims it was 24,000:

https://www.lep.co.uk/sport/football/preston-north-end/six-years-ago-today-that-preston-north-end-won-the-league-one-play-off-final-at-wembley-3247100

Which makes ours 25k  :D


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: WestYorksRed on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 13:40:43
32 years ago to the day....still bittersweet memories
No game footage in this bbc newsclip
But does have the confetti and Chalky White I think drinking a pint in the dressing room post match
https://youtu.be/ES-982bfDXM
RIP AlanMac


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: WestYorksRed on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 13:42:10
IT capabilities beyond me to embed the youtube clip, worth a look if you can find it and bear it given what happened three days later


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Private Fraser on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 13:51:36
Which makes ours 25k  :D

Less nuetrals 😀


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 14:30:39
I missed the goal as I was taking a Waz :eek:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: TheDukeOfBanbury on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:04:11
Shite


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Batch on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:04:42
oh FFS Mansfield. you had 1 job


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:05:00
Early days. Mansfield have to press now.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:09:38
3-2 will do


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:10:03
This makes it even more frustrating, Mansfield haven’t turned up. 2-0 FFS


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: TheDukeOfBanbury on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:11:10
Mansfield look frightened of the experience.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Super Hans on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:13:31
Opportunity missed or what. Mansfield all over the shop.

Vale blowing it from here would be painful though... :shifty:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Nemo on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:13:58
Looking rather like our performance against Preston this.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: bigbobjoylove on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:14:59
Looking rather like our performance against Preston this.
Was thinking the same.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Batch on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:18:53
hey ho. what could have been.

best we don't come over the vale gobshites for a while.

(hopes to check back at 5:45 and see they've stuffed it)


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: RWB Robin on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:19:46
Mansfield red card....u


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Berniman on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:19:55
Haha, you have to laugh, Mansfield down to 10 - we missed a massive opportunity by some players just not showing up in that 2nd leg semi final


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Super Hans on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:20:39
Mansfield playing a striker at CB finally caught up with them. Shocking decision making there.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Mr Stevens on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:26:01
Leaving aside the post-match bollocks at Vale Park, they were the better side on the day, as they are today (so far).


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:27:15
Haha, you have to laugh, Mansfield down to 10 - we missed a massive opportunity by some players just not showing up in that 2nd leg semi final
Felt like we had zero game plan especially 2nd half which didn’t help. Hey Ho I suppose a relegation battle for Vale next season and Mansfield are destined to never get out of this league.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: DiV on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:31:40
Leaving aside the post-match bollocks at Vale Park, they were the better side on the day, as they are today (so far).

They were but what did us in was the sloppy goal we conceded in the first leg when we were the better side.

We see that out at 2-0 going into the second leg and it’s a different game.
…and what was doubley annoying was we conceded that goal whilst Conroy was off the pitch after getting treatment after a challenge that didn’t look all that bad. Which makes it really fucking annoying if him staying down and getting treatment was gamesmanship/time wasting. I’m not saying it *was* im just saying it feels very self inflicted if it *was* and to me that Wilson goal at the CG is what turned the tie.

Even if they score as quickly as they did in the second leg they still need to go all out to get another one and that probably would have suited us to counter.

After that, the handball whilst the second legs was at 0-0 was also frustrating


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: TheDukeOfBanbury on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:33:46
Haha, you have to laugh, Mansfield down to 10 - we missed a massive opportunity by some players just not showing up in that 2nd leg semi final

Unfortunately all ifs, buts and maybe’s.
That Davison miss at 2-0, those pens from McKirdy and Davison.
Both shocking......all rather haunting watching this.
Mansfield might as well catch an early train.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:36:11
Unfortunately all ifs, buts and maybe’s.
That Davison miss at 2-0, those pens from McKirdy and Davison.
Both shocking......all rather haunting watching this.
Mansfield might as well catch an early train.
Ultimately Davison cost us massively over the 2 legs and a striker with some ability would probably have made the difference.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:38:02
I wonder if Garner would have him in South East London


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Posh Red on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:40:09
In a pub just outside Wembley at half time and there are Mansfield fans in here that have left already


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 15:43:36
In a pub just outside Wembley at half time and there are Mansfield fans in here that have left already

Rushing to get home to watch their favourite team in action in Paris😀


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:21:13
We fucked up at Vale, they are dog shit but getting promoted. Ah well, hopefully pass each other next season.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Whingy the poo on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:21:53
Well if the results stands as least we won't have to visit Vile Park next season.  :toocool:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Private Fraser on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:29:58
He crossed that from Row B!


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:30:20
37k at Wembley....massiveeee support!

Think Town would have taken 30k+  alone.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Nick Bamosomi on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:30:33
A plus for me (selfishly) is that Mansfield is an easier trip next season.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:31:04
Just need Madrid to bring a smile back later


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:31:05
Port Vale are still a bunch of cunts.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:31:48
37k at Wembley....massiveeee support!

Think Town would have taken 30k+  alone.

They could have put both sets of fans behind one goal and shut the other stands😀


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:35:25
Would've saved on security and police....  ::)

On another note; is Mal Benning the first Asian to score at Wembley?

He's the only decent thing about Port Vale!


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:37:28
37k at Wembley....massiveeee support!

Think Town would have taken 30k+  alone.
Obviously we don’t know what it’s like to be the second team in a city but it must hurt that Stoke City get more for normal home games than Vale can muster up for a Wembley appearance.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:38:42
They might get average gates of just over 5k in league one.
Advancement.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:39:05
Obviously we don’t know what it’s like to be the second team in a city but it must hurt that Stoke City get more for normal home games than Vale can muster up for a Wembley appearance.

Even the Stoke Sentinel had their headline with Vale as being the "home" side at Wembley. Really have a fucking incredible dislike for that club now.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Whingy the poo on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:39:46
Would've saved on security and police....  ::)

On another note; is Mal Benning the first Asian to score at Wembley?

He's the only decent thing about Port Vale!

The same git that handled the ball on 6 minutes in the 2nd leg.  >:(  


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: JBZ on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:41:15
They might get average gates of just over 5k in league one.
Advancement.


But, sadly, will be enjoying 3rd tier football


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:42:22

But, sadly, will be enjoying 3rd tier football

Or not hopefully. Relegation fodder.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: adje on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:44:43
Wonder if Clough's after match interview will be as whiney as the one after our Sheff Utd semi?


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:47:37
Only good thing is that this result stops Carolyn Radford flaunting herself all over social media now.

Ideally we go up next season, they go down and we don’t play them again any time soon.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:50:22
Or not hopefully. Relegation fodder.
Can’t say I enjoyed the last L1 football


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:50:28
Along with Gas & Pox


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Wobbly Bob on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:53:05
A case of out of sight, out of mind next season. Good.
Our paths will cross again, they always do.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:57:27
Ah well that’s season over, next season need to be aiming top 3 at the very least.  The league was poor this season, but we were obviously less than prepared for it. League looks weaker next season so no excuses.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 16:58:08
Salford early favourite with the bookies for next season

Salford 7/1
Bradford 8/1
Stockport 10/1
Swindon 14/1
Orient 14/1
Doncaster 16/1


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: JBZ on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 17:18:28
Salford early favourite with the bookies for next season

Salford 7/1
Bradford 8/1
Stockport 10/1
Swindon 14/1
Orient 14/1
Doncaster 16/1


Wellens' many admirers might put a couple of quid on Orient.



Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 17:22:14
I'm surprised Tranmere aren't fancied


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: JBZ on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 17:28:16
I think I will put a couple of quid on Stockport to get promoted


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 17:30:41
I agree they look a good bet with their momentum and financial backing


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: adje on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 17:37:30
I'm surprised Tranmere aren't fancied
I'm surprised we aren't


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 17:38:49
I'm surprised we aren't

The bookies are probably holding back until our managerial situation is sorted.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Mr Stevens on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 17:42:24
I agree they look a good bet with their momentum and financial backing
Like Wrexham this season!


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 17:48:39
Watching escape to victory now  :)
ITV4


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 17:52:06
Watching escape to victory now  :)
ITV4

Fab film just like another classic bridge over the river Kwai😀

Champions league final live on YouTube if you don't have BT sport


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: dalumpimunki on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 18:13:38
Salford early favourite with the bookies for next season

Salford 7/1
Bradford 8/1
Stockport 10/1
Swindon 14/1
Orient 14/1
Doncaster 16/1

Salford? Punters clearly missed the events of this season, or last season, or the season before that. They've found their level FFS. Haven't looked like promotion candidates in any of the 4 seasons they've been in this league.



Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 18:16:44
Unless the bookies know they will be spending big😀


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Crozzer on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 18:32:51
Maybe the EFL wanted to know the result of the playoff final before deciding on the points deduction, just a thought.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 18:42:44
Maybe the EFL wanted to know the result of the playoff final before deciding on the points deduction, just a thought.
To be honest it’s now been almost 12 months of new ownership so to go with any kind of points based penalty would be beyond farcical. You either do in a timely manner or not at all, surely non financial penalties have a time limit relating to how long after an alleged offence they can be imposed.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Bob's Orange on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 18:56:21
Fair play to Vale, they've been through a shit time ownership wise and whilst what happened at Vale Park wasn't pleasant, for the vast majority of their fans I'm happy enough. And looking outside of football for what Darrell Clark has been through I'm pleased for him.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: TheDukeOfBanbury on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 18:56:37
To be honest it’s now been almost 12 months of new ownership so to go with any kind of points based penalty would be beyond farcical. You either do in a timely manner or not at all, surely non financial penalties have a time limit relating to how long after an alleged offence they can be imposed.

We have breached rules but like you have pointed out I can only hope that the length of time and if we can demonstrate that we have been clean we might get away with lesser charges.
My biggest concern is that the owners and regime (ex Power of course) still have involvement at the Club.

Nothing us loyal Supporters can do other than wait for the outcome.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: TheDukeOfBanbury on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 18:58:49
Fair play to Vale, they've been through a shit time ownership wise and whilst what happened at Vale Park wasn't pleasant, for the vast majority of their fans I'm happy enough. And looking outside of football for what Darrell Clark has been through I'm pleased for him.

Always liked Vale, clearly tarnished by the events of last week.
Not forgetting their Chairlady was very supportive of us winning the league on average points per game In the Covid season. Pleased for her and the football gods clearly in support.

Time to move on.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Bob's Orange on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 19:03:09
Always liked Vale, clearly tarnished by the events of last week.
Not forgetting their Chairlady was very supportive of us winning the league on average points per game In the Covid season. Pleased for her and the football gods clearly in support.

Time to move on.

Agree Duke.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Crozzer on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 19:21:17
To be honest it’s now been almost 12 months of new ownership so to go with any kind of points based penalty would be beyond farcical. You either do in a timely manner or not at all, surely non financial penalties have a time limit relating to how long after an alleged offence they can be imposed.

I was thinking that Vile might have a points deduction for their fans assaulting Swindon's players and supporters.  How is a repeat going to be avoided?


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: theakston2k on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 19:48:32
I was thinking that Vile might have a points deduction for their fans assaulting Swindon's players and supporters.  How is a repeat going to be avoided?
No chance, Man City would then need to get one and no one at are the authorities that brave


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Outletred on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 20:25:02
Giving us a points deduction for something that happened in 2013 under different owners would seem ridiculous


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: THE FLASH on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 21:24:57
Well well well...

Funny old game...

Season over...move on...


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: 4D on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 21:30:48
Well, 2 good results out of 3 today


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 21:32:51
I thought Liverpool were lack lustre second half


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Batch on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 21:40:35
Courtois was the difference.

looks like TAA was caught napping on the goal


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 21:55:33
Definitely caught napping and surprisingly Liverpool were poor in the final third


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Formerly Drummer Boy on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 22:30:55
Salford early favourite with the bookies for next season

Salford 7/1
Bradford 8/1
Stockport 10/1
Swindon 14/1
Orient 14/1
Doncaster 16/1


let's not forget what the bookies had us favourites for last season.. They know 'naffin  ;D


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Jimmy HaveHave on Saturday, May 28, 2022, 22:35:56
let's not forget what the bookies had us favourites for last season.. They know 'naffin  ;D


 :clap: :clap:


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Sunday, May 29, 2022, 07:13:05
Courtois was the difference.

looks like TAA was caught napping on the goal

He was and he will wince every time he watches it.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: TheDukeOfBanbury on Sunday, May 29, 2022, 08:05:20
Well well well...

Funny old game...

Season over...move on...

Agree - Final closure yesterday and all about us again now.


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Benzel on Sunday, May 29, 2022, 08:39:04
Baudry looks to be embracing retirement after going in on Vale on twitter yesterday.

Sent from my CLT-L09


Title: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: DiV on Sunday, May 29, 2022, 08:42:17
Baudry looks to be embracing retirement after going in on Vale on twitter yesterday.

Sent from my CLT-L09

Not sure he’s retired has he?
A lot of people certain he is going to and a lot of people aware of his supposed post football career.

I reckon he’ll be here next season but what do I know?


Title: Re: Re: Super Stags v Pork Vile
Post by: Benzel on Sunday, May 29, 2022, 08:50:31
Not sure he’s retired has he?
A lot of people certain he is going to and a lot of people aware of his supposed post football career.

I reckon he’ll be here next season but what do I know?
Not officially but he said this was gonna be his last season and with this sudden burst of activity on social media I'm just putting 2 and 2 together.

Sent from my CLT-L09