Thetownend.com

Andrew black no longer investing in to the club. Could we be facing the strong possibility of administration?

Where did you see this?

Bbc wiltshire

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21047858

This makes me so angry! Finally looking like we could get to the championship and this happens!!! Finger crossed for new investors. Pdc to walk? Why wray left probably?

Fuming with this news today

Nothing like being dropped in the shit from a great height

Unbelievable. What atrocious timing. Plug offically pulled.

Several interested parties interested in purchasing the club.

Interesting times ahead again!

Why did we sign Ward and re-new the loan players if this was in the works? Must have been a very recent decision by Black.

I guess admin is to make the club more attractive to buy, lets hope it doesnt take that to sell it

FFS. Can I officially be fucked off now?

How can the same shit happen again. Fucking joke. What is the fucking point of supporting this tinpot shit.

Ten points extra to help us on our way or a 9 million discount on the purchase price.

I know what most will want :(

Where's an oil rich Arab sheikh, or a Russian oligarch when you need one?

A football club that doesn't shoot itself in the foot,, knee and bollocks every fucking time, A football club where you can just go and watch football.

I'm sure I'll calm down soon, but it this very second I want Bob's Orange to pack the club up and give it to a Swiss clinic on his way home. I'm sick of the whole boom and bust, fight for survival and shit owners.

It only says they are "considering" it,they are buisness types I'm sure they are considering lots of options.There are no new quotes in the article that I can see?

however now we are officially a club in crisis I'll start going to games again,see you Saturday

Yeo, the voice of reason......it's worse than I thought!

Really disapointed with the board after all the talk of redevelopment and being here for the long run. I really hope the football league get very strict on club finances; and clubs need to stop paying tin pot players ridiculous amounts of money. .. they're just not worth it.

haha

This is just typical Swindon i suppose, on the brink of something great then BAM fucked over.... thanks Black thanks for this  :smugfu:

Bollocks. The club can choose not to pay players wages. We juat get cheaper players. All the board has said from day 1 is that they'd be prudent and put the club back to being a going concern. I've done, as most on here have, 2 admins. Not sure I can stomach a 3rd. We're back to square one.

Diamandis?, for a laugh of course.....

Surely now is the time for the club to be owned by the fans.. It's not rocket science to run a business. I'd rather see us scrapping fairly in league 2 than having to put up with crap like this every few years.
Wouldn't it be great if a fans 'group' could get a low/ no interest loan to buy the club, and just run the the fucking club PROPERLY!

New chant for Saturday? 'We're not sustainable, we're not sustainable...'

What the fuck?

Given our history I'll believe we have these so called purchasers when I see them.

Club need to counter the (no doubt) sensational headlines this morning. Time for Patey to earn the money we are paying him. First and fore most will there be a firesale this window, or have BBC W overegged the situation.


It doesn't fit the right tune of the day. "Go bust when we waaaaant..]

Typical hysteria. You ought to thank him and others for saving the club first......Then take a deep breath and see what happens.

Administration is a reality check for fans - Black pulling out has been on the cards for some time (he apparently wanted  out in the summer but the buyer couldnt prove he had the funds so he continued to support the clib u til a new buyer was found) and calling in the accountants is sensible as any buyer would want to know the true financial affairs so its better we found out the true state and deal with it rather than let an investor pick holes in it ....

No news here... Move along...

I think my orange hat is somewhere in the loft better go and dig it out

We'll file when we want, we'll file when we want,
We're not in admin, we'll file when we want

Agree with this totally. What a kick in the bollocks to wake up to on a Thursday morning.

Hopefully more details will be forthcoming after this board meeting at the weekend and the threat of administration isn't as great as feared.

Shit.

The reason for Patey's appointment would now appear to be obvious. Remove those culpable for the spending (Wray) and bring in a shield to face the music (Patey).

To you maybe, I think not for most of us.

There was always the call for new investment long term (beyond this season), but to us normals that are not party to the whispers from the corridors of power dysfunction - to have even the merest suggestion of Administration this season has come as a bit of a shock.

We stupidly assumed the owner knew what it was doing when funds were released to buy players this year, and the extra put in to exit the um-bongo.First I heard of any short term danger was a Patey interview the other week.

It is news here if we enter admin, pay our creditors a fraction of their debts, sever all commercial relationships in the process, and take a points hit.

Ladles and Jellyspoons.

Please get a grip on yourselves.

Firstly, don't abuse the owners. If it wasn't for them we'd be looking up to the scum up the road and saying if only....

Now you know the real reason JW was relieved of his post. You should also have put the redevelopment jigsaw pieces together. We're not in admin yet, we have not been docked 10 points, Paolo is still the manager, apparently we are in talks with "new investors/owners" delete as applicable. No, Honda won't be interested again, if they ever were. The pies will still be cold or sold out on Saturday if the game is not snowed off. Lastly while I go out on this freezing day to west Dorset please keep off the scum forum, you'll only get upset.  

I reckon Shebby Singh is putting together a consortium to buy the club.

What happened to Sir Martyn Arbib?

haha i see what you mean. calmed down now. was half asleep when i read it and have an important exam today so wasnt the best way to start it

What the fucking fuck? Oh well, Pox and Shrews might get their wish.

Bring on the drama.

I don't think he's been investing in the football side of things. 'Just' infrastructure

Grabbed the last parachute?

Sounds to me like it is a preparing for sale strategy. I'm not sure administration would be the best solution, the club owes the holding company and investors the majority

Assuming worst case of entering admin: One question, who owns most of the debt that going into administration would knacker.

If its suppliers, council and the normal person = very much blame the owner.
If its the holding company then that may be different.


edit: si pie seems to have answered it before I hit "post." I was wondering, no clinging to the hope, that this isn't brinkmanship because they couldn't negotiate debt write off with Fitton. Probably isn't but I can hope...

Lastly, I must go.

Our biggest asset is Paolo!, not the players.

That was my first thought too. Get the debt off the balance sheet to make it more attractive to buyers. The majority of the debt is to the holding company, of which Black owns the biggest stake and will take the biggest hit. I think this has more to do with Fitton not giving up his loan/share holding that was talked about a few months ago.

What a gigantic pile of cock, why do we have to keep doing this? Black loses his nerve and the fans get shafted again. Brilliant.

Isn't Black the one who would lose the most with us going into admin anyway?

Also nothing directly from the club as far as I can see...

Someone call Bill Power...

Why invest to this point only to stop and chuck your dosh away?

Doesn't make sense!

 :hmmm:

Tits. Not the best start to a Thursday morning.

Seems a bit of a joke that the powers that be could let this happen, again.  ::)

These are gambling men...they have had a bit of fun in the casino....and now want to go home to bed before they lose any more dosh.

They will pop back in again for a bit of fun when they feel like it.

Oh FFS, it's like fucking groundhog day. As an aside I thought we were barred from going in for a 3rd time...or did that only apply to the previous incumbents?

What is the article telling us that we don't already know? The Club have made no secret of the fact that they are looking for new investors. Now the Adver is telling us that Administration is a possibility - of course it is, it always has been. This is a key sentence...."Neither Black nor chairman Sir William Patey has been available to speak to the Advertiser in recent weeks, as they look to secure Town's future." Let's hear what they have to say before we start pissing our pants.

Edit: As I said yesterday - The Adver is turning into The Sun.

Oh for fucks sake....

Oh well, guess we just have to sit tight and find out whats really going on.

just heard the Jeremy wray interview on bbc , eased my fears. hopefully they'll play it later

It ok guys, I am going to pack the club up and give it to a Swiss clinic on my way home this weekend.

Any chance you could summise what was said Kaufman?

I just feel utterly let down and deflated.

On the opening day of the Malpas/Wilson season, Fitton stood on the pitch and said a lot of things about what it meant to own the football club, which I bought into totally. I genuinely believed that the new board wouldn't let the financial side of things become a problem again and at the end of their tenure we would be left with a club that was a viable concern.

Crock of shit.

Adver are now reporting that the debts are to the Black consortium, not banks etc - Therefore future is effectively in their hands, and this is not like previous difficulties..

[url width=500 height=282]http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/126/314/3cd8a33a.png?1306264975[/url]

Sad face :(

FUCK SAKE

This sounds crazy timing to me almost to the point its a bit of brinkmanship on Andrew Blacks part for some reason. If he wants out, the best point at which to do it would have been if we were in the championship, which at this point is a very real possibility. He could have asked for a higher price, the revenues would have all been bigger and just the achievement of promotion would have brought an income in, all of which would have helped Andrew Black get some of his money back if he wants outs. Crazy timing! If there are interested buyers then that also could be very positive and any new buyer with money or not would much prefer not taking on the 9m of debt if it does not need to. Any new buyer will want to move the club forward its in their interest. Could work out for the best, a chairmen with money who wants to take the club forward. No point with taking over the club and have it languishing in the status quo. The investors, Fitton, Martin and Black all have the most to loose, something is not quite right with this news

he just said we pay our bills on time we've not overspent budget wise this season as far as
he's aware. positive talks are going on with potential new owners.
it's different this time and told fans not to panic at all

Wray - very positive noises coming from the club regarding new investment, already well in to talks with interested parties from what he knows. Black has a social responsibility not to just dump us in to administration. The theme seemed to be DONT PANIC

BBC trying to get hold of the illusive Mr Patey

It’s all a bit weird! Seems counter intuitive that the creditors would put the club into admin – when most the debt is owed to shareholders (namely Black). He would lose out.

Maybe he just wants out at any cost - needs to sell the club, cant with the other shareholders debt and everyone else unwilling to write it off...

Is Wray making a comeback, Dicanio and Wray back together. Awesome!! Maybe?

Thanks Kaufman.

Sounds like there are options on the table. Lets take a step back and see what happens over the next few days.

Of course going into Admin is a possibility, but at the moment is just that.

I do not fear admin as the debts are mostly to Black & Arbib so they would lose the most, I'm sure they are not prepared to lose everything, they may be prepared to take a loss if there are genuine investors out there.

I beleive that both Wray & Fitton had stfc at heart but something happened for certainly Fitton to walk away, whether we will find out who knows, and if things were that bad with Wray spending why did Black not rain him in sooner surely it was his money being spent.

If things carry on though Paolo will walk if he's not already considering his position, surely if we kept going and made it to the championship (IF) then that brings it own rewards, but I suppose in the flipside money would have to be invested to ensure it was not a season of struggle.

Every time a new investor comes in it's all about building a new stadium and the profits from that.

I wonder if negotiations over rent renewal etc have gone badly?

Patey on BBC Wilts in next ten mins

Yes Wray seemed positive which is good as he's got to be closer than most.

Biggest worry that needs to be addressed is regarding the  current monthly (wage) costs, i.e. whether Black has said - "no more money at all" or "current budget is OK, no more money for new players" which is what I until today I thought was the case but now I have no idea.



No.

Sir William Patey's going to be interviewed in a few minute on BBC Radio Wiltshire

Link here ~~~~>http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/england/wiltshire/ (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/england/wiltshire/)

click on listen Live

You know the reason why Wray was effectively let go don't you?

I'm confused.  (Often happens.)

Chairman: unavailable for comment.
Ex-Chairman: don't panic!

Is Jeremy Wray still involved then?  Or was he speaking in a personal capacity as someone close to Andrew Black?

My understanding has been for some time that the club's debts are 'soft' debts (ie to the owner himself).  Under these circumstances, not really sure what Admin would achieve.  If Andrew Black wanted to write off some of that debt, he could probably sort it before lunchtime.

So much I don't get here, so I'm sitting tight and will try to give all this a wide berth for the next day or two.  In the meantime, Join TrustSTFC!

JW might still be on the board of the holding company?

Presumably Black wasn't the sole investor and hence the debts to the holding company are not just owed to him?

Nope pray tell?

Not the best news to wake up to !!

Reading this thread has given me a tiny glimmer of hope. We need a message from the club for sure.
Its difficult getting motivated though.

Patey sounds out of breath and evasive. Not doing himself any favours with this interview.

Patey:

- Yes club is for sale. No secret. Had encouraging talks.
- Better to sell club in current state (chance of promotion, good players)
- Q, Are we bringing in administrators (not necessarily going into administration)?
   Bringing in professional advisors, help to get potential buyers to due diligence stage
- Patey wants to do best for the club, even if he isn't lifelong fan.
- People are getting ahead of themselves regarding Administration
- Paolo has been briefed on clubs position of club. He took job on basis of budget, which has been used this season.
- Can't rule out administration - no club can do that.
- (Swindon) need to pay its way - that's financial reality but not unique to Swindon.

(Rubbish interviewing from BBC RS. No far reaching questions made)

   

Couldn't say no to Paolo's every request

And there we see Patey's diplomatic side. Either he didn't say a lot because there's nothing to say at this stage while talks with new investors are ongoing OR he didn't want to say anything and was more concerned with being late for the dentist.

Either way he hardly allayed any fears. Plus i don't want to hear about other clubs and their chairmen. I know all that but then so did the board when they took this project on. I want to know what's happening TO US, RIGHT NOW!

This is my concern. I think that the CG cannot be upgraded or profited from is the main problem. Until this changes, were in Groundhog Day

*closes Betfair account in teenage strop*

in that case i did know. cheers

Really appreciate you posting that......Can't get any coverage "up here" so any info sharing is well received.

Que the oxford brigade. :doh:

Its never an easy ride being a town fan, lets see how this all plays out before we hit the panic button.

To be fair to him he was walking whilst on the 'phone so i wouldn't read so much into that.

To be fair, some of them did call this correctly a few weeks ago.  (Although probably more a case of wishful thinking that turned out to be correct, than educated guesswork.)

This is the conundrum. We're only in debt to our owners who have had a change of heart and want out. The purchase price is whatever the buyer will pay, and Black's debts (or a proportion of them) are wiped out that way. Why admin?

Not a clue, which is another thing Patey should have clarified.

Always a danger I missed/missheard something, so its best to listen again when/if its online later.
---
FWIW: for me its not clear if Black said  "no more money, end of", or "I'll continue to bankroll the agreed budget while investor talks are ongoing". The fist one would mean the panic button because we can't pay the wage bill, the second a wait and see - put the panic button on ice.

I'll assume because someone is more likely to want to buy a business that doesn't come with a -13m on the balance sheet.

I'll throw one more thought in to the mix before stepping away from this for the day.  Renegotiation of the County Ground leasehold will be well underway.  Put a ?? over the club's ownership might just remove some of SBC's bargaining power?

Spot on. Patey probably didn't want to say which, as it will most likely affect Black's bargaining position with potential buyers. With the board meeting Saturday i expect they're pissed that this was reported today.


Well yeah but the point was if most of that -£13m is owed to the director's of the holding company then surely a price can be negotiated accordingly without the need for the dreaded administration (and subsequent 10 point deduction). No?

I'll happily take that as a potential positive. I'm a glass half full man but waking up to this today has severely pissed me off.

Whether or not administration is a realistic possibility - still looks like it'll fuck us for this season if our more valuable/expensive assets get flogged before the end of the transfer window.

Assume the more recent signings will be on bigger money than the likes of Ferry and Ritchie, wouldn't be surprised if they try to offload Navarro, Miller, Williams maybe over the next few weeks.

Unless there is money in the bank from this seasons budget to pay for what we have. This needed to be clarified, but BBC RS copped out ( unless directed to by the club/Patey pre-interview)

It's all at wait and see by the looks of it. We don't know we're selling anyone - yet!

I don't know why but I get the impression Wray may be involved in a potential takeover.

In any event I'm not sure how publicising all this now helps? It seems destabilising to fans, manager, players. If they are advanced with new investors why discuss administration publicly now?

I don't know why but I disagree

Maybe JW and brother Ed Wray?! wishful thinking perhaps :)

Guess we'll wait and see eh...

Reading back through what Patey has actually said I'm less concerned than I was.

Seems to me that there is a combination of two things going on here.

One - 'administrators' being brought in to give a detailed account of the club's finances and prepare the books for due diligence with potential new owners - due to talks being past the initial stages.

Two - A degree of brinkmanship on Black's part, to float the idea of Administration (and an almost total loss of investment) in order to get the other creditors of the club to agree to wipe some of the debt off (but presumably protect some of it) as he indicated he wanted to do through Patey after SWP's arrival - again to ease the sale of the club.

Whilst not wholly positive, maybe the situation isn't as dire as some on here (myself included) and the press have concluded.

Surely Black could have waited until the end of the season to see if we were in the Championship - which would make the club much more valuable to investors than it is today. He invested heavily in players contracts over the summer, so what's changed?

Hopefully player sales won't lead to PDC walking. I'd imagine he'd be off if we entered administration for a 3rd time, which I can see being a 20 points deduction or relegation penalty. And you couldn't really blame the FA if they did impose this.

would be nice if he fronted a new group of investors - he's a good guy for a fans to have around.

I think it would also be good if any new principle shareholder was also the chairman of the club

It does seem that JW is the one that has brought this out into the open for what ever reason we can only speculate, a friend of mine who sees him now and again spoke with JW over a week ago and he was quite open in telling him that the finances were not great and there was going to be a board meeting called, on the positive side he also told him that he did not think PDC would be going anywhere or any 1 st team players as the club is determined to get promotion. I did not post anything on forums etc as it would only be followed by a torrent of abuse and I thought it was not the sort of thing the club needs to have public. All  very strange why this needed to be put in the public eye surely it could have been kept under wraps as it only serves to undermine the image of the club.

Just settling down for a relaxing morning's arcade game play and ..................  :doh:

Off on an extended holiday shortly with no internet, so hopefully when I return in March it will all be sorted or normal service will be resumed and we will be in the SH1T again.

Have fun guys & gals  :no:

Will we even be allowed to go into administration?club owes no money to anyone apart from owners who have more than enough money to cover the debt ,football league are not stupid.

If we can wipe £9 million out of debt and only suffer a 10 point deduction, then surely that would be a good thing?

But how many millions will the club lose if those 10 points cost us promotion? And what if the FA impose a larger penalty? It would be a huge risk.

My levels of concern/worry over this are at about 3%. It's not great news, but in fact it's hardly news at all. Seems that one or two people have decided to throw around the "A" word to cause a bit of panic, when realistically it's far from likely to happen.

But for the future of the club, I'd happily give up promotion this year.

Nothing changes.

 :no:

Haven't read through this whole thread yet but I'm more angry at the Adver this morning than the board. Sensationalist and unhelpful headline writing. I'm sure everything will work itself out, these are not crooks and idiots running our club, they'll find a suitable buyer and hopefully it'll be a smooth transition.

I'm sure Paolo will give an interesting interview when he gets chance to

That's was what I thought and hence the reference to wray and pdc. Seemed strange he would make a comment about it. Could have also been part of the reason he did not stay on the board. Wishful think but hey it's a nice thought

We just aren't going to go into admin. The end result of administration would be that Andrew Black loses all the money he has put in. If he was going to do that, why not just write off the debt? It's bullshit.

Had a quick look at the yellows forum. It's a good laugh. Half of them on there seem to think we've already gone under, and the "knowledge" they have of our finances is quite amusing.

As I said before, I'm not worried yet. Quite possibly a very small storm in a teacup.

Get Kassam to invest, he is minted with all that rent the Pox pay him for their dump!

Or maybe not!

:no:

Where's Bill power when we need him?

I'd imagine jw was phoned by bbc rs and just gave his view. Obviously being sacked and then financial uncertainty could lead people to a conclusion, but he didn't really come in the radio all guns blazing to defend his tennure.

 I think he was just giving an Opinion and being supporting of the club/ black. Nothing more.

You would like to think the club would speak to the FA first before making any decision, the club with 20/30 point deduction or relegation would be to a degree as unapealing to investors as huge debt surely.

The "A" word regardless of how it is done could destroy bridges the club have made in recent years with local business, EA Sports, 442, Samsung, it may also alienate fans who have just supported the club or just returned to supporting the club after the last board put us through it.

Indeed - the only person to lose out is Black himself and if he is happy to lose out then he could as you say just write it off...and be in exactly the same position

THIS (hopefully)

I like the way other teams are all saying we are a disgrace and owe money to the taxman, hmrc etc.

Black must have his fingers in many pies if that is the case.

To be fair it was BBC Wilts that sensationalised it and went public without even contacting the club or chairman the Adver have just jumped on the bandwagon

Black, fitton, wray, arbib - didn't they all invest and hence all potential losers come administration?

Someone set me straight.

Where's that shaun of the dead, im just going to the winchester until this all blows over gif when you need it?  Sonic?

Jezza Wray to the Adver, this morning:

"The club doesn't owe a penny, doesn't have an overdraft, doesn't owe the taxman - any debt is only to its shareholders and to its owners and as a result everything that's out in the open now is what's been known for a long time.
 
"That is that Andrew Black is looking for a change in ownership of the club."

As far as I am aware yes they are all owed money in different proportions, the fact that Fitton and Wray would not write off the debt is obviously what has brought this to a head.

According to Patey (I think it was) he stated that Fitton and Wray were unwilling to write off their debt, without them writing off their debt then the club are obviously a harder proposition to sell.

Exactly what I thought. Which is the reason black alone can not write off debt - there are other shareholders to consider.

And to be fair I can see their point should they not want someone walking in and benefiting from their investment.

Assuming that's what had happened... Which it may not.

From what has been said on the radio (I’ve only read the summaries on here) it would seem as though admin is only a possibility because Andrew Black won’t put any more money into the club if it needs it to meet day-to-day bills. It doesn’t sound like a method for wiping out inter-company and related party debts which is what the BBC article infers.
My two pence is that Andrew Black is trying to push through the sale quickly whilst we’re still in a good position. A points deduction would seriously hinder the potential new owners /investors if aspirations are Championship football, or even a league 1 side. If I recall the rules correctly, if we did go into admin and didn’t come out of it I think we could get points deducted next season too, not to mention sale of our best players at a probable reduced value. I think he’s trying to force the sale.
There was a lot of controversy regarding di Canio saying it was a hostile environment a little while ago. Perhaps he was closer to the mark than many people thought.
I think we can all appreciate how spoilt we were under Fitton and Wray’s chairmanship – certainly from a transparency perspective. Patey acts as a spokesperson, not a chairman in my opinion, although none of us really know his real role behind the scenes.
All of the above is just my educated opinion.

From what I can see it's not because we've run out of money, or the club is going to collapse- it's the simple fact that our current majority shareholder (i.e. owner), Andrew Black, doesn't want to be the owner anymore. They are searching for new owners. They might bring in some people who know how football finances work to make the place look more attractive to potential buyers, but it's not Administration, and it shouldn't be.

We don't owe any money to anyone other than our investors/shareholders- the majority shareholder wants to sell his share in the club. We're looking to bring people in to replace him. Simple as that.

Patey, it seems, doesn't fully understand the fear that the A word puts in football fans- particularly us.

Can we all chip in and buy a TEF Euromillions ticket ?

Problem is, we have history. Somebody mentions the dreaded A word and all hell breaks loose, despite the facts being known to all.

And lets face it, most fans of those clubs wouldn't want to let facts get in the way of berating us.

Interested in the Trust position. Until then, my read on this is storm in a teacup.

I see it exactly as you do Si.

And also spot on Honkytonk.

Yeah pretty good synopsis Si.

I knew i was enjoying football too much lately.

However what do we do while a sale progresses, if black is no longer covering day to day loses? We are hardly breakeven. Sales can defrag on.

Or do I nissunderstand.

We are getting a lot of hate from the football world this morning, mainly from people who don't understand the situation.

It is all a bit concerning, I just hope as many people as possible get down to the CG on Saturday and really get behind the team!

This seems a pretty fair assessment.  However it's hardly surprising with our history that the story has caused panic and the feeling of 'here we go again'.  It would have been useful to get the full facts before the story ran.

The real risk at present is the effect on PDC and the players.  Will we now see departures?

I'm trying not to panic, but my feeling at the moment is FFS and I can't help but feel pissed off.

So don't read it!  The pre-internet age had a lot to recommend it.

Admin doesn't wipe out debts anyway, it is a CVA

We're used to that by now...When (hopefully) the situation resolves itself it won't be us with egg on faces...

mountain out of a molehill, we'll be OK

I've not been on any other forums but i suspect we're still in a better position on and off the pitch than most of those laughing at us. Especially those Oxonian cunts!

Who cares what other teams think?
Mickey Mouse clubs like O*ford and Shrewsbury can sod off

That is the problem these days the media latches onto internet forum / social media mumblings and the whole thing gains momentum with more and more mis information being added by people speculating. It is like Digital chinese whispers.

I think this is all being done to force Fitton's hand in writing off a large part of the debt as Arbib and Black want to. Am I right in thinking administration would mean creditors vote on a CVA to payback a percentage offered by the club (25% of what owed say) meaning Arbib and Black vote yes and Fitton votes no, majority rules and 75% of debt is wiped out and Fitton's hand is forced?

At least all of the county ground redevelopment threads will stop now  ;)

I really can't believe this could potentially happen...again...gobsmacked this morning! :eek: We've had some words this season the 'e' word and now the dreaded 'a' word!

I'm gutted, you'll have to understand this us my first termoil I've experienced as a fairly new supporter and season ticket holder. Work in Oxford and I'm getting loads of texts

I see weekend opponents are having a jizz-fest about this:

All of a dither about their James Collins' appearance fee. They think we'll sell him to avoid paying their measly clause,
which comes into effect on Saturday if he plays

http://blueandamber.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=82286

Tell all the Chelsea fans to poke it and remind them that Benitez is god.

I suspect you're half right. Suspect that it is largely as it's been told - Black wants to sell and to make the club more attractive, they need to reduce the amount of debt in the club and that's owed the holding co. Black's happy to write down his portion but Fitton and Wray don't want to write off their proportionally much smaller but still substantial (and probably less affordable to them) debts.

Where I think you're half right is that I suspect it may be Wray et al who are trying to use the "A"bomb on Black by going public with it as a possibility - "Black wants out and he's even prepared to put us into admin to achieve his own ends". Patey may be unaware of the chilling impact of that word on Town fans, Wray and Fitton have always been much more in tune with the fans. And it appears to be working, looking at the reaction here and elsewhere.

Yep, totally agree.  The headlines at 6-30 on Radio Swindon said that STFC are "considering" administration which would only be a last resort, so every cunt in the land has jumped on the bandwagon - perhaps Chris Wise has some questions to answer!!

As far as I can see it's all come from this one quote.

When asked if he could guarantee the club could avoid administration, Patey responded: "Not a single chairman in the country could do that."

Initially I was worried, but the more I read, the more it looks like sensationalism. No doubt there are issues to resolve etc, but it doesnt seem the headlines warrant the panic.

No at first they couldn't get hold of Patey who appears to have been caught on the hop by this. The initial info came from a chat with Wray. But I think you're right that this is shit-stirring, just deliberate shit-stirring as parties maneouvre themselves in a negotiation

Another news story that has been handled poorly by local media leading to panic and hype. There is nothing in this news that we didn't know already, the only new thing here is the word "administration".

The local media, particularly Morshead, should be far more aware of what this club has been through in the last 10-15 years and that news reported in this manner is going to cause alarm amongst fans.

IIRC Pompey have gone into admin 3 times now, or will when it is finalised.

I have to agree with this, it is scaremongering of the highest order.

It's really not. It's local journalists reporting news. When the ex-chairman of the football club says the current owner is definitely looking to sell but a club with our history may have to go into Administration to enable that, that is news. People really need to learn to interpret the "cui bono"s on these things and stop shooting the messenger all the time

I will just post this on the issue:

If, and when, administration happens - panic then.

Until then just enjoy the football FFS

I don't feel it is shooting the messenger so much as shooting the boy who cried wolf.

Yes maybe it could come down to that but at the moment it actually isnt anywhere near admin. If you throw enough shit out there some of it may eventually stick.

Well I would like to think so anyway :D

Well, that's Wray, not the BBC

I thought the league rules ensure a wage cap in order we don't live beyond our means. The only things it does not include is the transfer fee. Now assuming all our players are paid for out of the holding companies money it should only be wages that we now cover. This should only amount to 65% of our income. It has to do with money owed and political games between the investors. Providing our team does not get asset stripped any new investor will look to make money and this can only happen by improving what we currently have. I for one will look forward to a new owner as this one clearly has had enough. Positive that their are other investors interested. I will save thanking the current owners until I see what state they leave us in.

Looking at Venkys, Watford, the various scumbags at Pompey, and our own brush with BEST, I'm significantly more concerned by the prospect of a rushed sale to new owners with arms being twisted than I am that there's any real threat of administration

My point was more that it was completely misguided.

Did anyone see that twat Adrian Durham on twitter this morning? What a bellend.

Best I can do

Yea, I've just set him straight.

Utter shit from him

Came into this very late as have been out all morning and first impressions were here we go again.

On reading through the thread though, it appears to me that Mr Black has done enough for the club and wants to move on and tbh who can blame him as anyone who puts shedloads of money into a football club needs their head examined unless they are on the Premiership gravy train.

Obviously the media have jumped on the explanations given and makes me wonder where the "leak" came from and are now making two and two five because it is what they are paid to do and imo the "A" word was used totally out of context as the explanation given for it is:

"Administration is a very powerful process for gaining control, when a company is insolvent and facing serious threats from creditors."

I do not see that as happening and would like to think that the people currently in charge are far more astute than some of the previous incarnates and if we need new owners then so be it.

[url width=640 height=272]http://i.imgur.com/lEnDQ.gif[/url]

Thankyou!

This is what we should really be worried about, someone coming in that says they have a few quid and we end of the next Blackburn

This. A thousand times this.

Adver live: "At no point has it been reported that Swindon Town are going into administration."

There is more to this (or less, dependent on how you look at it) than meets the eye. It's some form of pissing match dispute between the owners and what the outcome will be or what they want from it remains to be seen. But I find it hard to see administration as a possible outcome, if only because it doesn't make any sense - all the debt is to the owners.

We know that Black has been funding the club and that he wants a write down of the original funding, either to increase his ownership and control or to make it more attractive to new investors. They stated the debt on the radio as; initial £9m (Fitton, Arbib, Black £3m each) unsecured, further £4m (Black £3m, Arbib £1m) secured - fuck knows what they're secured it against though.

None of this really makes sense when you consider the additional funding that (I presume) Black put it very recently. Why would he have done that if he was ready to pull the plug on it? Plus there is no suggestion that we won't make it until the end of the season or that there is any current financial issue.

I still think this is about Black wanting the original investments written down (or off) and nothing more.

No, that quote came from the 9am Patey interview live on BBC RS. The "potential administration" headline was on the 6:30am news

Adrian Durham is a cunt. What a twat

Administration or not, looking to offload the club now has to be a concern for fans and the club. Why plough all that dough in to then try to sell up? I can only assume that they see it as too expensive a project. They have put in loads and the wage bill etc is high.

I was a bit confused when Patey was talking about an administrator as a specialist to help get the clubs finances under control. It's not rocket science though is it, we spend too much on wages and don't have enough income. Besides I doubt there are any better placed people than those at the club to figure out what needs to be done to get us breaking even.

So not sure what the benefit of bringing anyone in is.

Because it used to be a "they" and now it's a "he". Fitton and Wray were always the driving forces on the football side, albeit minority investors, and they were all supposed to be in it together. Now there's been a parting of the ways and what was a fun project has turned into an ongoing (and expensive) hassle

well that worries me then. I have always known that we were relying on them funding us and withdrawing that funding could be a big problem for the club. Just didn't see that happening yet.

If we DID go into administration (and at the moment thankfully it seems a big and implausible if) then, frankly, it would be an absolutely disgraceful and inexcusable f*uck up by our owners having got us clear of debt and putting us back on a secure financial footing.

Going from debt free to £13 million in debt over 3 seasons, during which all the sounds coming out of the boardroom had been about how well the club was now being run and how clear a plan the owners had; would frankly be a catastrophically embarrassing and unacceptable act of mismanagement.

If they weren't planning to either a. write off that debt at a later date to keep the club on the footing they started at or B. see their investment through in the long run with a plan of redevelopment and promotions with the expectation of making some of that money back, then they should never have spent that money in the first place and put our club in jeopardy all over again.

 :badmood:

Watford's an odd one to include isn't it?

Bet their fans are having one of their most enjoyable seasons in ages.

The Pozzo family know what it takes to run two top division sides in a very sustainable way and every chance they'll be adding a third with Watford. Their business model and scouting network at Udinese is a brilliant example of a club being able to punch above its weight and sustain itself

We were never debt free. When they took over they took on £8m of debt, which the club has always owed to the holding company. The debt has since increased by £5m over the seasons they've been in control.

Been out on site all morning, freezing and come in to this... happy days.

Glad to read through all of this and I agree with much of whats been said, there is a lot of brinksmanship happening and its release into the public domain is doing no-one any good.

Couple of things....

The reporting of this is unhelpful, the original release by both the Adver and BBC seems to have been based upon half a story and quotes from Wray, is it really good journalism to base such a wide arching and potentially controversial story on quotes from a member of staff who was removed from his role recently? To give them the benefit of the doubt they may have got excited that they had a story but its just another example of how poor journalism is these days.

Was a little disappointed at the abuse that Black has been getting in certain parts (including at the start of this thread), people need to remember that without him we wouldn't be having this discussion now (or at least not be at the upper end of D1 whilst doing it).

Anyway we shall see, its never dull is it!

That's not what happened though Paul.BBC reported the admin story then spoke the Wray didn't they

Secured against the clubs league share or vote or whatever they call it which I assume has a value along with the value of the ground lease and good will I suppose.

That percentage breakdown is interesting as it suggests that Black only would have around 46% of shares whilst it has been suggested elsewhere that he has 95% - Any ideas.

I was talking about the owner before the Pozzos who was a complete arsehole and nearly took them out of business

I thought when they took over that they were going to write off that debt and take the hit themselves? So does that mean, as it stands, they haven't actually spent in a literal way any of their own money and as a club we have just as much debt as we started with when they took over plus another £5 million?

That may have been the order in which it happened on the radio but that doesn't mean Wray/Fitton weren't the original sauce.

They have spent the money. But yes the club still owes it to the holding company. But it's a "soft loan" in that unlike a bank loan there's less chance of the owners foreclosing on their own company, for example

This is why we will not end up in administration.

We should know from when the consortium first took over the club on how they operate - remember Fitton saying he would walk away when it all looked signed and sealed?

As has now being mentioned several times already today, this is just being used to push through any potential sale quicker.

And now we've got Di Canio's press conference to look forward to.

I'm already hiding under the table.

Fuking hell Paul,bit of a hunch isn't it

This was the point I was trying to make, its hardly good journalism to base a story on only one source, a source that has a commercial interest and potentially an axe to grind.

Not sure the actual share holdings are that important, but like arguing about who owns a dog turd - it's worthless so what's the point. Though you could get the shareholder lists from companies house which would confirm the actual figures, though you'd need to look at the club and the holding company to get the real figures.

Timely article on the BBC.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21058754 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21058754)

The consortium bought shares in the holding company. The holding co then lent this to the club.

4 years of ownership is a very different proposition to what was suggested upon purchase (5 year plan anyone?). Obviously we're not paddling up the brown creek just yet, but if Black did pull the plug today we would be.

They own the holding company, the holding company loaned the initial money (£8m) to the club so it could pay off its debts and the club still owes that money to the holding company. They haven't actually given any money away, they've just loaned it to the club and whilst they've got fuck all chance of getting it back they are still owed it.

And yes, the club still have the original debt and another £5m on top. Most people may have laughed at the plight of Portsmouth and other clubs in a similar position, but we've actually been in pretty much the same state as them all along.

Fan ownership is the way forward, provided the fans accept and acknowledge that the club has to live within it's means - for us this would mean cutting our wage bill in half (say £4m to £2m). Would the fans accept a lower quality of player and a possible free fall through the leagues?

Now might be the time to make it happen. Got to be a possibility that the current owners would hand over control to the fans and write off a lot (or all of) the debt at the same time to make it a viable option.

 whats that fucking halfwit been saying mate?

This only serves to heighten my dislike of the press

Not really. The BBC didn't just pluck this out of thin air, they got it from somewhere. Which of the protagonists it came from is kind of immaterial tbh.

Black 94.55%, Fitton 2.57%, Arbib 2.02%, Wray 0.86% according to latest records.

There has been further investment/issue of shares since the original.

This quote from the Wrexham guy seems especially germane:

it was you wasn't it?

The only facts reported in the article are that we're technically in debt £13 million and that the Chairman wants out. I'm pretty sure the last published accounts showed this level of debt so this could have been reported at any point since then.

Why Chris Wise has waited until now i don't know. The only new information i have gleaned from today is that there is a board meeting on Saturday. Maybe he heard that, put two and two together and came up with a sensationalist article incorporating the dreaded "A" word.

What are those figures based on? Ownership of the club, the holding company, or both?

Move along now.

Or maybe someone looking to add public pressure to one side or another in private negotiations said "Hey, guess what?". I find that more likely than that Chris Wise happens to have had a sudden brainstorm ahead of a regular board meeting on Saturday.

"At the moment". He hasn't ruled it out.

Holding company. Interestingly I'm just looking at the club and a return of allotment of shares was filed at compnaies house on the 11th (only showing up today, form signed on the 8th). I've just downloaded it to have a butchers.

Boardroom politics...marvellous ain't it?

It's not a regular board meeting though. There's potential new investors there - or so we're told. Who the fuck knows what's going on or started it?!

a) Not nearly as much is going on as is implied by the headlines
b) Flashheart started it by ringing the BBC in a funny voice and then claimed to have "been out all morning". Yeah, right.

Like I said earlier JW was very forth coming with this information over a week ago to a friend of mine who see's him now and again so my guesses would be that the BBC have contacted JW who has been honest and open. It has been blown out of all proportion and headlines posted on the BBC website by BBC Wilts have started this snowball rolling interestingly they have changed the sensationalising headline from "Swindon consider administration" to "Swindon Town up for Sale to avoid Adminisration"

A further 32,000,000 1p shares were alloted (issued) and unpaid on the 8th January.

The documents I can download don't have a list of shareholders.

Statement Friday to return?

Haha. Think you're right Paul. The headlines have been ridiculous and have even got cunts like Arian Durham talking about/slating us.

Flashheart - Superb panting on your phone call by the way. Hope the dentists wasn't too painful.

Sam Morshead ‏@SamMorshead_SA
Very positive chats with PDC and Nick Watkins this afternoon. General message to potential investors: 'Come and buy a fantastic product'

For the thickies at the back (me) is this new equity that is as yet unsold?

No, it is new shares which have been issued but not yet paid for. Value of £320,000 in total.

what kind of message does the current board send out though? Such a fantastic product that they want to sell it, 2even though we won the league last year and are chasing promotion again.

Mmm, maybe I'm not the only one who thought it was highly fortunate that JW was available for interview at 8am in the morning, just after the 'news' had broken?  :sherlock:

I think this image depicts todays events

[url width=466 height=480]http://www.idiomsbykids.com/taylor/mrtaylor/class20022003/idioms/idioms2003/Make%20A%20Mountain%20Out%20Of%20A%20Male%20Hill.jpg[/url]

Although there is no need to panic yet, this is not good. The signs are worrying imo

I think the fact the sole investor wants out is anything but a mountain out of a mole hill.

It isn't a crisis yet, it may be the best or the worst thing that can happen to a club. But its hugely significant.

Agreed Arriba. My worry has been building since Wray left.

The only crumb of comfort I have is that I can’t see the current investors all demanding their money back (as they know they can’t get it). Primary concern is Andrew Black – we’ve relied on him too much, even pre di Canio. Strange appointment for a manager though if you don’t want to spend money. I suppose languishing in league 2 makes the club less investment worthy though.

Lets be honest we all knew with the various playing staff incoming/outgoings over the last 18 months we were outstripping the clubs natural turnover and would be relying on Mr Black to bankroll the club out his back pocket, anyone who thought other wise was deluding themselves.

Ultimately putting the club into administration will make it more attractive to potential investors but will see Black lose more money than he already has done. It is promising there are talk of several interested parties already but the prospect of a quickfire shootout between a coiuple of groups would be laced with risk for the long term future of the club.

Am I disappointed at todays events .....Yes
Am I surprised .....NO

If I had the money I'd buy us  :D ...sadly I don't  :(

One consolation is that it looks as though there are some people intrested - just have to hope it not some twats like at Blackburn.

What we don't need now is a fire sale, but I bet the sharks will be circling if this isn't sorted out fast.

I dont really understand the going on in the transfer market of late. If the funding had stopped, why was the signing of Darren Ward and the loan extensions sanctioned? Surely these "football experts" we're bringing in will immediately cancel the loans anyway as a way of cost-cutting.

So Black, or A.N. Other could purchase these and in effect invest £320K in the club?

I assume so, could they also (by already owning 95%) use the creation of extra shares to further dilute the interest of others in the club.

They’ve already been issued, just not paid for. If the acquirer did not want to pay for them they could probably be cancelled, but they're technically owned by somebody (on tick, if you're down with the street lingo).

I reckon it’s probably something to do with bolstering the funds in January to ensure we’re inside the correct criteria for the % turnover. I could be reading into that completely wrong.

Some things never change though......Adrian Durham is a prick.

for the last two years crowds have been very good and at an expensive ticket price, we have done brilliant in the cups and stuck to our wage budget and wage caps. Although we had an embargo that was because of the unexpected advance payments of collins and troy but we used what was being saved for january spending to get us out. imagine what state we would be if we struggled in all competitions?

you say we have been outspending the clubs natural turnover but when have ever had such good sponsorship deals and back to back success in league and cups. 

Sorry to bring TalkSportDrive before your precious eyes, but this is pathetic. First they spout a load of ill-informed nonsense, then come out with childish nonsense when you highlight it.

It's like trying to have a debate with a 5 year old. Going back on his own argument.

Who is that you're tweeting? Adrian Durham?

He didnt reply when i asked whether he liked fisting

Adrian Durham and Darren Gough are the two biggest Trolls in the media. Why are you bothering with those two wankers?

He is on air at 4, a job for the TEF pressure group?

Langers is on the money there.

What?

Prize tool.

Nigel Adderley (@nadderley) is incapable of grasping facts too.

Gough is prick with little man syndrome...to endear himself even more I remember someone saying he has a box at Franchi$e...having met the man himself, he's an arrogant cunt as well!

They are both a pair of pricks. Saw their tweets and was tempted to respond but whats the point? Everyone knows they are pair of tosspots who just tried to piss everyone off.

If I could be bothered I'd ring up and give those cunts the abuse they deserve. Luckily for everyone, I'm too busy panicking.


AAAARRRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHHHHH :suicide:

Don't feed the troll. He just loves the "Me against the world" stuff

Is it Darren Gough that used to play cricket?

Fair point. I guess he got what he wanted today, as we are all talking about him.

Yup and a fair few will listen to his show and/or ring it because they're so outraged by him. And he'll pretend to get all het up when he actually couldn't give a flying feck and the window-lickers who listen will get all het up and that's what makes for "good" phone-in talk radio.

Give him a big kiss....see if he tastes like windowlene.

Oxymoron there pauld.

Good shout, sorry.

I always thought an oxymoron was a deluded Pox fan :D

Getting rather bored of explaining to Shitty, Rovers and scum fans at uni that we aren't IN administration.

Never seen my scum supporting housemate as cheerful as I did this morning

Nah, it's posh for "stupid cow"

given their finances, the point of view is somewhat irrelevant

And yet, they still continue to give it.

Few things in life are given so freely as the opinions of an idiot. As this forum (and my own contributions) so amply demonstrates....

Back to the world ending......

Up to 7 potential new owners apparently and things could come to a head as early as next week.

If I had a stick right now, I'm not sure I'd be able to shake it at that many!

Oooooo interesting, where did you hear this mate?

It was this bloke.  He was called Bob Something.

I have my ways.












(Morshead on twitter)

More money than you can shake a stick at.............. :)

Come on it's been a traumatic day.........You heard it first. Sandy Gray & Bob Holt have been seen at the CG.

They are burning pictures of Paul Davies as we speak  :cry:

Any snow in Swindon yet ?........ Hope we can get the game on Saturday. I'm missing Paolo and need his inspiration and a cuddle.

Sam Morshead ‏@SamMorshead_SA
Watkins also tells me that the club is 15% ahead of its budgeted revenues across all areas in first six months #stfc

True, but he engaged me in debate rather than the other way around. I duly broke down his argument in 4 tweets. Probably should have taken less.

Check out his latest video-interview on Player... Cheered me up bundles  :)

Cant really help with the cuddle, tho...

So up to 7 interested parties.  Ive heard its the following

Best Holdings
Firoz Kassam
The ghost of Robert Maxwell
Paul Hart
Diamond Mike
Carson Yeung
Chanrai + Venkys in partnership

You forgot Ken Bates.

I should be shouting at you but I can't, I just laughed :)

Considering the state they were in he didn't do a bad job at Leeds.

I am not saying in any way, shape or form that I want him within a million miles of my club though!

Once again a nothing story is created by the local media sparking mass panic. Why do these come up with these far fetched stories? Today there was nothing new to report that we already didn't know. We knew they were looking for investment and potentially a sale. The only new info we have is that there are interested parties and that we want to get some specialist advise on any sale.

I can't wait for Bob holt to come out of the woodwork... 'there is no bid!'

Just posted on facebook,

"Swindon Town Football Club
Thank you to all Town fans for your continued support. The club is not in administration nor seeking to be. The best way to show your support for STFC is by attending Saturday's game with Shrewsbury at The County Ground. Your support has been fantastic all season - let's keep it going. COYR!"

The club isn't actually in financial trouble as such. Black just wants out and fast. That's the message i'm getting from it all.

Reading the advertiser stuff from this afternoon are they suggesting that PdC and Phil Spencer especially are directly involved in selling the cub, it all sounds positive, but just how much involvement does Spencer actually have, he seems to be involved in all purchases etc, its almost a Sporting Director role?

I'd hesitate to call what Durham engages in "debate" in any meaningful sense of the word

Quite a big role i'd have thought. After all he's probably pocketing all of these fees.

Bolt out the blue for me...

Fuck it!!!

You forgot Publicity Pete Ridsdale...wouldn't be surprised if he wasn't called in as a consultant.

However the  :clap: want to dress it up, this is a catastrophe.

At the time of the first admin, most were a bit blaze about it..."well we're going down anyway, sell a few players, wipe out some debt, and maybe get in some new investors. Div 3 is our natural territory."  We got the Brady bunch...looking for a quick buck, saddled the club with even more debt, and Ruddock and promptly fucked off into the night. We've not been back to Div 2 since. The second admin, just about saved the club from closure, but we limped on to relegation to Div 4, on the back of Diamond Mike's football entrepreneurship.  The original "Consortium's" comedic incompetence at least galvanised the fans into the "back of the Town End spring"

I'm not sure how much will there is left amongst the fans, if we get shafted again by a sale to some dodgy operators.

Must admit that I did have to do a quick Google this afternoon to make sure he was still in work at the moment.

No, it isn't.  The club going out of business would be a catastrophe.  We're nowhere near that yet.

You are prone to hyperbole, Reg.

To be fair Reg "this" isn't anything yet. It's not administration, it's the current owner's had enough and wants to sell up (and is having a bit of a spat with his former partners as a side issue which is where I suspect today's brouhahah comes from).

It's a worry if he's in a hurry to get out as it makes a quick sale to someone shonky more likely and it's a worry if it becomes a protracted process as that also makes a quick sale and/or pulling the plug altogether more likely but there's been nothing in today's sound and fury to justify either outcome as likely.

Assuming you're not taking the piss...

Always a possibility :hmmm:

I wish it was a piss taking matter, but this is serious....everyone I've spoken to today, whether Town fans, occasional fans, or neutrals, sees it as such.

The point I started to make back up the thread, was that the previous problems were somehow understandable, given the people involved...it was not completely unexpected that things would go tits up.

People had got used to feeling good about the club again, not something to be sniffed at....people had come to trust the Board and employees of the club...now in danger of being thrown away.

Lance Armstrong, taken the heat off him today if our story is all talk sport can talk about!

Oi Shrewsbury, yeh you, yeh you, looking at me right now, I used to live in your town, drunk in every one of your pubs, every day of the week. The Yorkshire House, The Nags House, The Albion, The Hole in The Wall. Always held you in nigglesome disregard. We are the consumate object of your aspiration  :nod: Your boys will take one hell of a beating on Saturday :smugfu:

Speculate to accumulate, he who dares wins, lovely jubbly, thank the day Swindon Town FC are my club. You have always been my numero dos grudge match, I dislike you with a passion. You found a new enemy in us ,you cunts. Don't think you'll be met with a happy welcome on Saturday :badmood:

A taster of what these odious reptillian no marks are saying

Walcotwag-

"there is a golden glowing ring around the county ground known locally as the arsehole of wiltshire "

You are not welcome in our pubs, let that be clear. No bonhomie, no nothing, you insufferable cunts.

He ain't even the biggest story in the US sport rich now, this mental story is http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-21064161

Dossys off on another mad one.  :pint:I

"Abrahammer", on their forum


http://blueandamber.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=82286&page=2

GOING BUST GOING BUST GOING BUST!!!

That League 2 title is effectively ours!

Even with all the MASSIVE over spending, it took a disgraceful referee for them to win it

Paolo who?!

----------------------

Going insipid, and sanitised in your clip-art lion, energy sapped nothingness of an excuse for a club, you Shrewsbury cunts. Going mundane, going anaemic, drudgery of an existence, life-sentence of everlasting nothingness.

You can add the Kuwaiti's at Forest. Just sacked the Chief Exec, Chief Scout and club ambassador Frank Clark.

Is the Shrews anger at us all because we charged them £25 a ticket?

For those of us who do not follow twitter what did the man say?

Hope that helps answer their questions...the more I see things like this from opposition fans the more I have a good chuckle!

Nah its the mccormack foul i should think.

And the fact that the defeat here cost them the 6 points which would have seen them win the league.

Now that Hereford, Chester and Wrexham have slid out the league they are muscling for a rival. Since the Kamara and Jim Melrose incident there's always been an edge to this game. They are another Gillingham, no geographical nouse behind it, just embittered contests down the year. I for one have hated them from day one, but then again I lived amongst them for years. They have it in for us. Let's fuck em over on Saturday

It was funny seeing them try to go all green street at the pub when we played them earlier this season.  Terrifying bunch of about 12 blokes including the 55 year old ex top boy straggling behind like the oldest lion in the pride the zebras are laughing at.

If we did go into admin and we lose 10 points, we'd still be safe from relegation cant be assed to look at a league table.

Death to Shrewsbury C*nts!

Right, now I've got that out of the way it seems that in the absence of Torquay offering us £13m for Paul Bodin's boy, Andrew Black ain't going to get his money back and that he's going to have to find other investors.

We've known that since Matey took over from Wray.

Not sure what the news is therefore or where the A word comes in

Would however be interested to know who persuaded Chris Wise to give the A spin to his [non-]-story

Oh and PDC was very sensible in his weekly interview today on the STFC website  :eek:

Nice one  :)

I said on here at the time, six of their scrotey plastic brummie teeney weenies rounded on me at the car park of Sainsburys near the ground. Soon backed off. Beat them out of sight that day. Narks me that they are trying to tarnish our engraving on that title trophy. They're the sort that selectively identify debatable refereeing decisions that go against them, and whitewash everything suspect that goes in their favour. Mongs.

Once again Shrews, don't come into our pubs :bye:

That's because he knows who's potentially coming in :p

Turner > Di Canio
 :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Collins on 7k a week
 :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Swindle Town
 ::)

Woah, they really are deluded, retarded and bitter aren't they

Shit little tinpot club with tinpot fans.

Like they ever travel......never take many fans away.
They are £34 million in debt with Oxford better off at £33 million. :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Yeah, we could probably do with laying off the 'Oxford are £33 million in debt" joke for a while

Other football fans, of clubs that feel somehow aggrieved by us, are slating us off.
Shock, horror and outrage!

Or, yawn and disregard.

The choice is yours.....

If the powers that be, have it in for you, then they'll just screw you over...look at Looton deducted 30 points, and therefore dumped in the Conference, where they've been rotting for as long as O*ford.

Now you're definitely taking the piss.

Shrewsbury spent 90% of turnover on their wage bill & other cost of sales for the year ended June 2012. They also made a loss of £275k.

They spent years of largesse spunking money on failed attempts at getting out of the basement, completely eclipsing the spending prowess of other clubs, and they have the audacity to pinpoint us as morally wrong in our financial determination in getting to the promised land of the Championship? WTF

I'm really struggling to see what the fuss is. There's nothing here that we didn;t know about. I'm also struggling to see the "bad guy" here. Last time we has the loathesome cunt Diamandis. All i see now are good guys - Fittion, Arbib, Black, Wray. There's obviuosly a pissing contest going on between them but I think we're a long way from disaster.
I reserve the right to panic if we sell Wes for a packet of hobnobs and the best endeavours to give us a loan player. 

I caught a bit of BBC WS this morning, and they alluded to players being sold has there been any more confirmation as to whether that is Cox, Benson etc. or is it some of the prize assest???

I here even mike walsh has been seen at the county ground picking up cones for poalo.

what with all the snow coming tomorrow, it truly is the end of days

http://thetownend.com/index.php/topic,684.msg7069.html#msg7069

What happened to Whits's pictures? :(

There will be no snow. Town fans, come out all the closets and the crevices and crannies, we smell blood, we smell Shrewsbury. Don't let them in any pub, they have made their opinions of us known

http://blueandamber.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=82286&page=1

A broad concensus on their forum. Let's make ourselves heard. They have claimed we are imposters for the title last season, we "cheated" our way to the title. This can't go without reaction.

ScrewBerry fans, don't deign us with your feint gestures of reconciliation, you have made your voices heard. The title is ours, you are fast becoming Oxford's little underlings. Yeh, that's right, this shitty club Shrewsbury have a lasting "friendship" with our enemies.

Once, twice, thrice, you are not welcome here :smugfu:

I hope the new owners sort out the catering.

I hope you have a tin of pop with your fish and chips. Only when we've won though.

Shrews slagging me on their forum. I went to your Priory School, cowardice controls that place, you'll never beat me. I'll roar my throat out to screw the living hell out of you.

How's your famous EBF?

Don't come in our pubs, you've made this personal

Valerioch on Shrews forum

"Their home gates weren't any bigger than ours until their glory hunters saw success coming

Great to see the impression we've made   

Travesty how a team can get promoted by cheating in more ways than one "
 
Always in our shadow, piffling little club, you would know me to see me in Shrewsbury, see you soon. How I will savour our drubbing of you cunts. You are on for a thrashing :pint:
 

Funny how they seem to think we cheated last season, when we were within the financial fair play rules. It's only since we bought Collins and TAH in that we breached them, and that was then rectified with funds set aside for the playing budget.

Idiots.

To the shrews fans saying dostoyevsky lost his head because of today, no just no.

He's just fucking mental.

Should we send him out on loan? He'd have that forum taken down within 3 days.

I'm struggling to get my head around this Shrewsbury thing.

A club that have done fuck all in their entire existence, flirting at the arse end of the league and are probably the perfect definition of tinpot.

Is this all about a penalty they think they should have been awarded last season.

Even with those extra 3 points they would have still been 2nd.

Cretinous Welsh cunts

From Alex on http://blueandamber.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general&action=display&thread=82286&page=3

I for one hope they go bust. I hope the game gets postponed on Saturday just so i can make the replay to see us win in front of w****rs of Wiltshire.

Once PDickanion leaves the better and we can see what they can do with their back to the wall and no major publicity.

I hate Dostoyevsky just because he is acting the big hard man on a messageboard. Nothing like a keyboard warrior who has good knowledge of the Salop pubs. Guess what mate, I bet you won't even attend the game on Saturday if it's on.

Time for them to go bust and try and find another small team to follow and try and take your big club mentality there.

Pilgrims

---------------

Would you say that to me in The Beacon, or Bull in the Barne?

Without exception, you guys are cunts. I will laugh my posterior off when we panel you bastards into Kingdom Come. James Collins Hatrick here we come. He knew, Dosser Knew, he fucking knew!

Don't make any mistake about it, your forum is representative of your arse end fans, don't shmozzle up to us pre-game, you're as welcome as a flea feeding off a Poxford's dirty arse. You have pissed a lot of good people off. You fraudauntly claim our title, go fuck yourselves.

They're like the bits of shit you can't get off the bottom of your shoe. Tiresome and irrelevant, truly a nothing club. They should feel honoured that we allow them to share the same initials as the real STFC.

I lived there and they hate Welsh people, absolutely vile. Full of overspill Brummie/Black Country cunts who think Telford is inferior, but they're one and the same. Everyone of them has relations in that shitty city, Birmingham. None of the surrounding areas in Shropshire like them. Violent, dumb assed fucks.

An outpost of shitty Wolverhampton and Birmingham, they know it. Some of the worst, aggressive people i've had the misfortune to live amongst.

We'll see just how tinpot they are Saturday. A few  hundred last year when doing well on a midweek game.

How many will tear themelves away from a good looking sheep to attend Saturday?

I think shrewsbury also had a disliking of Wycombe fans for a while, because wycombe got given a dubious goal against them in a promotion-crunch game. They seem like an odd bunch.

To any of the fake STFC reading this, you're obsession with us is weird. Stop it. And dostoyevsky is weirder than all of you combined.

Fa Cup Semi Finals 1910-and 12, League Cup winners 1969, what have you done Shrewsbury?

Impartial BBC journalist....

https://twitter.com/EmlynBegley

Fuck me, if Andrew black read the last few pages of this thread you could completely understand him wanting to get the hell out of dodge, some football fans are right twats

He's a cunt.

We'll prevail. The envy is palpable.

Yes, boycott our match you stinking Welsh cunts. I can't even be bothered to join up that dreadful forum, (don't let us down Tans). They are rapidly becoming like the bit of shit that's stuck on the inside of the toilet, and no matter how hard you piss on it, there ain't no chance of it coming off without the aid of some elbow grease.

The impresssion they project leaves me thinking they see us as rivals or something? If this is the case then this is more embarrassing than Gillingham and Franchise claiming to be rivals  :(  Shocking levels of tinpotness

From KL8, Screwsbury forum

Message to Dostoyevsky, you t**t.

Your cheating football club is really up slack alley. You'll end up playing in the cranberry sauce leagues and we'll all have a jolly good laugh at your expense.

Shame you wriggled away at Sainsburies car park. Let's hope your club doesn't escape with such good fortune.

Going bust, going bust...
---------------

How's you clip art badge. You are an embarrasment to the football league. Believe me, come sleet, snow, wind or rain, you are next to Oxford on our hit list. How's your cosey relationship with our accursed rivals? Don't cross Dosser, he knows, he fucking knows.

Guess they won't be partaking in any future Fans United days we'll have

Not sure why anyone would have an active dislike towards Shrewsbury when there are clubs like Leeds and Liverpool in this world.

This Shrewsbury malarky is getting tedious.
Apart from the fact that (weather permitting) we're playing them on Saturday, who really cares?
I would expect that virtually every club's forum will have ill-informed drongos calling us cheats so why get into a slagging match with them just because a few of them perceive some rivalry built on the bitterness of not accepting a poor refereeing decision?

Looking forward to seeing some of the matchday thread score predictions tomorrow evening after this 'spat' with the imposter STFC!

I wanna join dossys firm. He is fucking ace

Seconded.

Haterz gonna hate

What's this shrewsbury shit all about anyway? What's their problem? Thought they were the best side after us last season but we won the league so tough shit. Dossy is gonna smash them anyway(if he aint passed out due to alcohol overdose)

I think they feel we robbed them (with the aid of a referee) of 3 points when they played us at the CG last season. Granted, we finished 5 points clear, but their logic seems to mean we robbed them of the Lg 2 title by stealing these 3 points away from them, and nothing to do with the fact that despite making a dreadful start to the season and not the best ending, we still won the title fairly comfortably, and managed to squeeze in a Wembley appearance and a decent FA Cup run for good measure.

At least they will have the opportunity to win the title they feel we stole from them again, next season.

 They are pretty insignificant to he honest. Not a fixture that has ever whetted the appetite for me.

They might wet themselves over Di canio "wanking his dog". Oh my aching sides, the novelty of it!

Listen here Shrewsbury, it's set in stone, you court us as you're next best thing to Walsall, it's your big day out, I lived amongst you imbeciles, so, so sweet when Collins drives it home to you. Pungent, staid cadaver like Graham Turner, or livewire, oozing charisma Paolo? You love him really, you just can't get enough?

You are in for one hell of a beating.

Keep out of our pubs, don't think we'll make you welcome, that's that, spread the message.

Who knew, who fucking knew? Dosser knew. Would you like gravey on that humble pie?

Dosser is never wrong.

My take on this administration is its a stand off between black, wray and Fitton. Black wanted them to write of their debts and their has been no news of this So i doubt they agreed. I think converting their stake into shares or something similar springs to mind. Black who is easily the most wealthiest can afford to right off his debt and is now trying I force the other two into accepting the the conversion or the writing off a proportion of their debt, with an ultimatum either accept or I will stop funding the day to day running of the club which will force it into administration and you will loose all your stake. Black wants out as I bet he is sick to the teeth of it. It's cost him a personal relationship with wray, god father to one of his children, probably put him on a frosty relationship with wrays brother and now thrust his name very much to the fore front of the media, which as a self confessed media shy guy probably does not fit well with him and hence why wray and Fitton were always the front men of the original consortium. Buy reducing the debt he can sell the club more easily and is basically hurrying up the process. Its a timer now ticking with black now not funding the club with Fitton and wray loosing their stake completely. I would not be suprised if wray ends up on the board with a new consortium as a shareholder. Well I had fun thinking that one up. And relax.

Forget the tinpot Shrewsbury club their not that important just another game that's all. We want five !!

From Blueand amber-

Good old "Kerry red" earns themselves the football version of a " darwin award"



"Is this all about a penalty they think they should have been awarded last season.

Even with those extra 3 points they would have still been 2nd.

Cretinous Welsh..."

Hmm. If we had 3 points more and you had 3 point less.

Epic, angry, fail.

--------------

Whose name is indelibly marked on the trophy cunts? Screwsberry seem to pick and choose what goes for/against them. Stop whining plastic Brummies, fuck off back to your shitty "second city", you obnoxious piff paff, powder puff.

Would love to see Wrexham go beyond their humdrum existence and do a Gary Bennett in their faces. You never lived that down  :clap: Dosser knows everything :toocool:

Wasn't it Conference football? Oh dear, oh dear, the shame of it. How's your club alliance with Oxford going?

Who knew, who fucking knew?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nq0PvbmC8Og

Scrubbers-bury, you can only dream, your hatred can gestate and burn you up, never of this like will you ever experience. Lower league plodders for life, enjoy your conformity into nothingness :cry:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTMYzgrXA7M

First and foremost you do not get a penalty kick for a 'foul' that takes place outside the box. Secondly if the score finishes 2-1 but you think you should have had another goal, that makes it 2-2 - which does not give you 3 points and still leaves us as Champions. Plus, in theory we could go back to the game at Macclesfield where Ritchie didn't get a penalty when we should have and give ourselves 3 extra points and still finish as Champions.

Last of all we aren't in administration and know where has said we are.  Why people can't grasp that I don't know but the football fans are generally thick as pig shit, some of our own included.

If I start a random story about Shrewbury refusing to let gays into their ground will everyone believe it and start hate on them?

Well put, and their forum will neatly swerve the points made. Every referee hates them obviously, nothing ever goes their way. Muppets.

Looking at their forum, they haven't a chance, you can't touch the Dosser. You will be wriggling and burning with embarrasment when we hammer the fuck out of you, Collins going to get you :clap: :clap:

I never knew they had banned gays from attending at Shrewsbury.

And to think their previous ground was Gay Meadow - how ironic.

Really? no wonder their gates are so low!

Those homophobic cunts.

I know!

The things we find out. Don't know what they'll do when they play Brighton

Shrewsbury Town - gay haters!

Phil Spencer (and PDC) is apparently trying to help attract investors to the club.....interesting!

Not got an opinion either way, could we have an owner/manager :) Looking forward to Reg's opinion.

Sorry if this has been mentioned, stepped away from the TEF for most of yesterday.

No gays in their ground?  Shameful.  What a bunch of cunts.

nah, we will have to move the OAPs in the Arkells and open the Bank (pardon the pun) to deal with their huge support

Brilliant.

Suffice to say that I reckon reg is part Mayan :)

I cannot believe Shrewsbury have banned gay people.

Well I was born in May, so there could be something in this. Glad I'm not Julyan. (cryptic reference for those who remember Julian Broddle, permed bouffant striker of Scunthorpe, who used to be mocked by the South Side circa 1983.

I am going to India tomorrow for 2 weeks and ma due to attend a film ceremony which is packed with Bollywood A-Listers.

More than willing to sound a few out about buying into the town.  Or as a result of Venkys are Indian owners not appealing to anyone?

Get Freda Pinto in

Don't need chicken farmers thanks all the same!

 :no:

Pinto and Preity Zinta double team ...YUM!

Has anybody told Peter Tatchell....the backwater Salopians, might discover a new meaning for stonewall penalty.

I was one of those mockers. The first time it happened he actually applauded us at the final whislte (albeit a little shamefacedly)

His name is Emlyn, fucking Emlyn??? What kind of a name is that?

Why such a tinpot club has taken such offence at us is pretty laughable, and in which alternate reality Turner > Di Canio? :fuckingmental:

Turner is not fit to lace Di Canios boots as a player or manager.

I guess thats the wannabe welsh for you.

On their forum they suggest we sign up on their forum and they will give us a good welcome....here twatheads...come join ours instead, you are the ones with a problem against us not the other way round, we don't give a flying monkeys cunt about you lot.

Oh and moanign about £25 for a ticket......just means they will have to sell another sheep at market to pay for it, thats a whole fucking pound more than they have to pay for a match day bought ticket at the Gayer Meadow for a cat A game.

Certain sites seem to attract a certain type of person. Take thisis, for example, some people must visit that site and think the crap on their is representative of all Swindon fans. Of course though it isn't.

That (Shrewsbury) site reminds me of the Torquay site.... they act like a bunch of bitter kids that act according to their own first assumptions without taking the time to actually consider the topic at hand. Any attempt at reason is met with willful ignorance and childish remarks. Even many of the pox fans are more reasonable about the whole thing and see it for what it is, other sites seem to have a membership which is either unable or unwilling.

ShrewinJapan seems to be quite sensible -

It wasn't a penalty anyway, was it? More like a free-kick just outside the box and a red card IIRC?

Needless to say that comment has been totally overlooked.

I like Shrewsbury.  Nice town in a beautiful county.  The only things I really know about the football club is that they are the only other 'STFC', James Collins used to play for them, they were the only side to beat us at the County Ground in the 1995/96 promotion season (I think) and that I remember seeing a woman wearing one of their shirts a couple of years ago at Drayton Manor.  That really is about it.

was it Shrewsbury who used to have someone on standby in a boat to collect footballs that had been hoofed over the stand into the river?

It was.  Bloke in a coracle?

little things like that make it hard for me to hate

Chris Kamara's STFC career was ended by racist abuse received at Shrewsbury...is that enough for you?

Maybe he's got such a tiny cock, when he was born his parents thought he was a girl and named him Evelyn.

Little bit of fudging with a biro on the birth certificate and Evelyn->Emlyn.

The matchday thread for tomorrow is still in production. I generally try and focus on the positive aspects of the opposition but  things could change.

Thank the Lord we've never had any racist fans  O0

Keep it that way, SR.  No reason for us to join in the bilefest.

 :nod:

Had there been 3 points for a win in 78/79, then us instead of Shrewsbury would have been promoted to Div 2. The change was made 2 years later, to encourage sides to be more positive....the dull looking for a point Shrews were managed by Graham Turner...nothing changed there then.

They were also  the years when the NF was at is peak ,  this is starting to paint a very dirty picture of there racist and homophobic club

Unfortunately these are the sort of attitudes, which fester beneath the bijou surface of places like Shrewsbury, I'm surprised that the likes of Ardiles cannot see through the picture postcard veneer.

Screwsbury have always had an active "firm" and are well known to have a nasty element of fans, they are well known on the hooligan circuit.

The EBC (English Border Front)

They can't even get the initials correct!

http://www.shropshirestar.com/news/2008/01/08/raids-target-football-hooligans/

http://www.scunthorpeunited-mad.co.uk/news/tmnw/shrewsbury_police_fear_hooligan_trouble_102898/index.shtml

http://www.mansfieldtown-mad.co.uk/news/tmnw/police_arrest_hooligans_283651/index.shtml

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qwm1WKIED0

I lived up that way when I was 7 or 8, Reg.  I remember the English Bridge and the Welsh Bridge, and the beautiful Tudor beamed buildings in the town centre.  But not anything to do with hoolies and crack dens...although I don't doubt they exist.   :D

I'm sure he said he made that up.

I am loving this hate from you guys and it just shows how that fascist prick has a affect.

The welsh thing. Have you ever seen a map?

Saying that by the looks of things (especially with Dosser) it seems you wouldn't be able to read it.

We will play you next year once you fuck up and most of your players and management up sticks and leave.

Enjoy.

Welcome to the TEF, YOU CUNT! (That's just the welcome all new posters get)

Unbelievable...

probably rhymes with front

Well that told us didn't it. Epic fail you chump

I think you've confused hate with confusion, as in we are confused as to why your fans hate us so much. We couldn't give a toss about your lot and never will...

Scenes like these were condemned by all fans and it has not happened since. Unfortunately it got on you tube and the joke was on us. But I go every game and it was the first time those people went since the meadow opened.

Eh?

Head in sand syndrome.

Hope you start to feel better soon, fella.  It can't be that bad, can it?  It's nearly the weekend as well, so chin up.

Anger is such an ugly emotion.  Learn to rise up above it, and your life will be happier and longer.  Good luck.

Didn't realise how bad Shrewbury's form was until the other day. A real possibility they'll be going back down were it not for even shittier teams.

And the fact we have picked up points against the "bigger" teams. So there's the warning!

[url width=544 height=344]http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b251/TREO123/yikes.jpg[/url]

I like him let's keep him

nice of you to be the "bigger" man and admit we are the "bigger" team

I can't wait until Dossy comes back and sees this one.

Welcome Fallopian Alex.

I wouldn't want to upset you now and tell you the truth.

So ill continue to let you believe your a bigger team ;)

Coming to the game tomorrow?

With the road around me being the way they are I'm going nowhere. But I'll be at the rearranged game when it does eventually (fingers crossed) call the game off.

and i'll let you believe you are the bigger man

Part timer.

In all seriousness I would like fans of other clubs to come on here more often. If not to have an intelligent football conversation, then to add a bit of variety to the forum, which has gone since PNEThor was sent back to the mental institute.

Oh this one.

Awww can we keep the troll, can we, can we pleeeeeeeeaaaaaaaassssssseeeeeeeee.

A troll is for life not just Christmas.


[url width=228 height=300]http://i.ebayimg.com/t/RUSS-TROLL-BLUE-AND-YELLOW-CHEER-LEADER-/00/s/MTYwMFgxMjIw/$T2eC16NHJI!E9qSO8G!PBQlpw6B9y!~~60_35.JPG[/url]

Could we swap Dosser for this one, seeing as it's the transfer window?

He is right, winning the Welsh Cup six times is a far greater achievement than us winning the League Cup

Thus they are the bigger club

i might go on their site and act like a bellend aswell , cos thats the i way i troll

Think he had a heart attack or something and ended up in hospital not long after our game away at their place.

http://www.pne-online.net/forum/showthread.php?74351-PNE-genius-fan-hospitalised. (http://www.pne-online.net/forum/showthread.php?74351-PNE-genius-fan-hospitalised.)

Hopefully back to full health for the return fixture at the CG.

I think he is well enough, he has been trolling around other clubs forums since then, he has a real thing about Notts County at the moment.

I thought he got arrested as part of the savile enquiry

He was by far the funniest troll we've ever had on here. Ah the memories...

He's not a patch on that Preston fan. Needs to improve if we're to turn it into a permanent move.

Aww Bless I like it when fans of tinpot clubs come on here

Surely this mug is just a Smart Price PNEThor? 2/10

[url width=500 height=372]http://i.imgur.com/5rAQq.gif[/url]

Read this on an Oxford forum so possibly bullshit -

A major factor in Swindon's demise have been the actions of Her Majesty's Treasury who have cut a tax loophole that the dirty thieving bastards were using to avoid paying National Insurance and Corporation Tax. Players were being paid 'gifts' from a holding company registered in the tax haven of Lichtenstein set up by Black and fellow wide-boy directors. STFC paid only 0.5% of their income in corporation tax last year. When this loophole was closed Black's enthusiasm for funding Di Canio's wild spending sprees very quickly cooled.

Read more: http://www.yellowsforum.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=fldiscussion&action=display&thread=12793&page=4#ixzz2IL18eu9c

bwahaha

Well that's complete bollocks. You only pay corporation tax on profits and we made a loss. You'd struggle to find any football club paying corporation tax.

They love a good old yarn about the finances of our club on there anyone would think they are actually running the club very very sad and deluded as always and will always be in our shadow

I bet they were all like the 14 year old kid who found his first porn mag last night. I suspect a lot of "women" went sex starved last night as the blokes were locked in the bog tossing themselves over the news.

The dedication they show to making up and talking shit is amusing

Dear Fallopian Tube,

I doubt many Swindon fans honestly think we are a big club in the general scheme of things, but one thing is for sure:

we are a darn sight bigger than you.

If you would like to counter this with some proof of Shewsbury's exploits down the years, please feel free.

Surely proof positive must be your new stadium - the capacity of which is hardly a ringing endorsement of your club's ambitions.

While there is no shame in supporting a 'small' club, it really shouldn't get up your nose when other clubs attempt to better themselves by moving up the food chain.

“Swindon are a big club in this division, but the tendency is for us is to rise to the occasion and that’s what we’ve got to do again,” said Turner.

Sweet that they're all singing from the same hymn sheet..

Poor psychology in an attempt to get their players "up for it". No doubt the Shrews are hard to beat right now but they need to be warned  - Thamesdown transport have suspended buses so bring their own to park in front of the goal. Turnerzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

Graham Turner must be on the monkey glands - he's got to be older than God.

Shrewsbury have got a firm?? I've been up there a few times and only had a run in once, which lasted a few seconds. I thought they were a bunch of fucking gayers which would exclude them from going to home games.

I hope they don't all make excuses like this.Was hoping they would bring more than the 200 last time.Got a feeling we may be awarded one or two spot kicks and Turner will need restraining  ;)

Everytime i see Turner interviewed on the box he is always standing in front of their dugout droning on like some kind of woman waiting to have her period.

So long as they are not Ghai's ... they could be banned from Shrews if we ever play there again after tomorrow.

 :clap: :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick: :clap:

Must have a very good botox surgeon then! He does look like he has a plastic face, or maybe even a mask! Never changes!

Im finding this all a bit weird.  A thread about our financial situation has turned into a thread about some sort of rivalry with some club I really dont give a shit about.  Dosteyevsky has gone from a bit mental into full on charlie sheen on a weekend bender levels of hysterical mentalness.  There seems to be a bit of green street, some racist and homophobia discussion as well.  Its a bit odd.

In the meantime we have our chairman wanting to sell and the football world declaring we are disgusting whilst other examples of football excess go unremarked upon (afcb signing 2 permanent and 1 loan deal today.  How many players and how much in wages do they actually need to spend) ignorant of the fact that all that's happened is that we have run up debt which is about a third of that championship bristol city are run up in one year but we've taken over 5 years to do it.  

Apparently whilst in league 1 Huddersfield (accoriding to one of their own fan) says that their wage bill was not the highest at 7.5mill.  And a doncaster fan reckons their wage bill is 0.9 mill higher than ours this season as it stands.  But we are still villified by idiots as a shocking example of excess.

In the 5 years the current people have been in charge we've had great entertainment (allright we've had paul hart as well but that was still entertaining watching his 4-3-3 not 4-5-1 discussions).

Hopefully someone will buy us, Im not really worried.  Its all part of the rollercoaster of being forever STFC.  

great post Sir

Most of the stupid comments either come from tinpot teams like Shrewsbury or Crawley or local ones so it's hardly surprising. They've been jealous of our success for a long time.

Would we really want an Abramovich-esque, power-hungry owner who did nothing in the fans interest? PDC would not be sticking around for long without creative control :(

Yeah. I'd hate to be bankrolled like Chelsea and Man City and enjoy premiership and European success. Much better scrabbling around the lower leagues, pretending self sustainability is possible whilst at the same time demanding success on the pitch.

I wouldn't want some mega rich foreigner owning the club, they would get bored quickly.

Quicker than our current mega rich English owners?

Im wondering if Im going slightly mad, but havent we got a really small squad?  In comparison to a lot of other teams.  First team squad on the official website including loanees is 23.  A lot of other squads are running at about 35 - 40.  So we have a small well paid squad by the looks of things.

Ah fuck, Im confused by all of this.

At least they know what it's all about, a Russian or Arab would understand nothing about the club, the fans or its history. Look at what Tan has done to Cardiff.

Taken them to the top of the championship? Where we aspire to be?

It is about 23-ish. It's not really small, just about average really. I made a thread about it a while ago and compared with other teams.

It is definitely not the 'massive' squad that some people seem to think we have though. That's another myth that people propagate at every given opportunity.

Surely the sale of the club to someone who will be prepared to pump some more funds in, is preferable to being still owned by a reluctant non-football loving owner.

There is always the chance, of course, of being taken over by a Venkys or Channrai(?) type.

Am failing to see, though, how owning a club on the up, with a charismatic manager the media loves, with no outside debt whatsoever is stressing him out.

Seems that Shrewsbury, who apparently we have a problem with, have a bigger squad than us.  25 according to their official website.

Not as preferable as running the club within its means and not being reliant upon someone pumping funds in, which inevitably ends up in a scenario like Portsmouth and lots of other clubs.

At a cost. If someone came in and gave us shit loads to spend but made us play in yellow how would you feel?

Portsmouth and Blackburn can be countered by Chelsea and Man City.

And raised by Southampton....oh wait.

I think at the end of the day there are good and bad owners no matter how much money they have got or pump into clubs.

Stupid comparison. Cardiff's rivals play in white, not red.
If someone wanted to take us to the premiership, but wanted us to play in blue I may grumble a bit, but it would still be my club playing at that level

I would rather not have those owners, and keep the club's traditions. But that's just me.

It's a wonder the country itself is in the state it's in when there are quite clearly tens of financial gurus sat on the internet in Oxford.

But you are only counting the traditions as being started in about 1970, as most people seem to.

Red isn't even our colour, we shouldn't be playing in it if we go by the rule that we should never change anything.  Which bloody owners made us wear Red anyway? did they get driven out of town?

It's like the people who moan about a good old ruck and throwing of concrete terracing at each other being a tradition we miss.  Reality is, that just 20 years prior to that, in Reg's day, huge crowds would turn up to football games with rattles.

There is one tradition being maintained though, and that seems to be our wage bill.  I saw some account from about 1994 for the club back in the day, and I'm pretty sure the wage bill has grown well below the average for football teams.  If £250k a month is to be believed, that seems likely to be below quite a few in this league and in line with many of the recent seasons based on published accounts.

Black got involved as part of a group, when finances were going well for them all.  5 years on, the finance vanished for the stadium, which in turn put more pressure on their investment.  Now he is left to foot all the cash risk himself, at a time when his shares have dropped quite a bit, I'd imagine he'd getting rather twitchy about his bank balance.  If it comes down to owning us outright or owning his betting company, it was a no brainer who would win that.  So it is no surprise he wants to sell now - although he does want to remain involved, just not the man upfront carrying it all by the looks of it from his interview.

FWIW, wasn't Shrewsbury once part of Wales?  I'm sure it was.

I think it is Chester you could be thinking about Rob.

Shrewsbury was only really part of Wales after it was over run by the Taffs in the 1215 Welsh marches uprising which was soon quashed.

We've played in red without fail since 1918.

But not before?

Long enough, should have let them keep it.

Wembley play off ????

 :D

That was because at school we used to do useful things like woodwork, where you made a rattle..and were given red and white paint.

I would argue that 95 years without fail is long enough to be deemed traditional.

From FF:


 :doh:

How are they any different other than the sums of money involved being vastly higher?

I've never seen anything to suggest that the owners of Chelsea or Man City have written off all the debt.

Are you a bit special? How long has Abramovich been at Chelsea? Compare his length of tenure (and the success they've enjoyed) with the same period at Swindon. People giving it all tradition, or self sustaining seem to be missing the major fact to most fans: success.

I wouldn't want some mega rich foreigner owning the club, I would get bored quickly.

I'd be all for an Abramovich type, with the facet that we aren't left right royally screwed when they leave.

Great post!

There are times - and after the twattery of the last few days, this is one of them - where I want to seek out Tim Berners-Lee and then kick him squarely in the bollocks.  In the pre-internet era, people were nicer and less arsey.  They tended not to give a shit about things they had no business giving a shit about.  Or at least if they did, they kept it to themselves and everyone else was happy.

Some of the ill-informed, poorly thought out, partisan bile posted up on here and elsewhere during the last few days has been embarrassing to read.  This is what happens when you give computers to wazzocks.

Tim Berners-Lee didn't invent the internet  :P Here's his twitter if you want to arrange a bollock kicking @timberners_lee .

This makes me feel stupid. As though it's rubbing off on me. Now I'm not saying I'm the sharpest knife in the drawer but it's like people can't read.

There is something I don't understand though......

Why is administration even being mentioned? Surely the only people that can call in the debt are the people that own the debt, so why would administration be necessary. If things do get that bad, why not just write it off?

Sorry if it's been asked already, I missed most of the action yesterday.

If Andrew Black wouldn't put any more money into the club, it may not be able to pay things like player wages etc. In other words, it couldn't continue to trade. It's a possibility.

Administration doesn't wipe out any debt though.

Ah, that makes sense. So obvious I feel a tad silly for asking really.

Cheers.

I'm confused it had been reported that if we were to go into administration our debt would go from 13m to 4m and 9m would be wiped out. Also today the  adver reported that the owners investors would all loose their money excluding black. I don't know if that was a typo and should have said including.  I'm sure administration does mean that some of the debt is wiped out.

No, as Si Pie said earlier in a thread that its the CVA that would wipe debt. That's an agreement made between those who owe money and those who are owed money, and it requires a certain % of agreement for it to go through.

Administration, as I understand it, is an appointed regulated company (or rather a person belong to one) taking over running of the business and doing what is necessary to keep it trading, if at all possible, in order to sell the company and/or agree CVA. Basically they tend to slash costs as much as possible, and if they can't keep the company trading it goes into liquidaiton.

Oh god....its all reminded me of Andronikou

Thanks for clearing that one up Batch.

Administration, CVAs...you'd think we'd all be experts by now.   ;)

It's good to brush up now and then

I'm sure I've not got it 100% right, but you get the idea :)

Yeah, you can blame DARPA for that one. Bloody yanks.

I told you so.

 :popcorn:

I'm not sure I ever got around to telling everybody so, but unsustainable fascist manager money player signings would have been something I'd have said if I hadn't already thrown all my toys at a different pram.

all of you who have gone along with this shit have killed my football club. I hope you are all ashamed of yourselves.

Should I cancel my tattoo appointment then? I was going to get il duce written on my arm

I assume the writing will be upside down so we can read it correctly when you arm is lofted high ;D

Thought you off the pop Ben? New girlfriend out is she?

Good fishing Ben.

Good attempted fishing. Given my mental state last night I'm surprised I managed to come up with a reply though.

http://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/yournews/sport/10170181.As_Swindon_are_put_up_for_sale__U_s_boss_Wilder_asks___Why_risk_it_/?ref=mr

And this little nugget:

'The situation might be even worse than Andrew Black is letting on. Bailiffs turned up at the County Ground this week to re-possess office furniture because the club are behind with repayments.'

I do find it amusing how they think this stuff up. Still at least it stopped the sister from being fisted for a few hours i guess

Yeah the bailiffs came round last night and took all our snow off the bloody pitch...

I do thinking the gloating is a tad premature, things could work out an absolute dream and plans for the championship and ground development could really be accelerated. At the end of the day we are in a great position in the league,great squad, great manager and the debt we do have does not
look like a massive problem. I'm hoping that pdc and our good form has raise the profile of the club enough to attract a good investor. It could all go to shit as well. The pox and the scallywag scallops should just hold off with their gloating.

[url width=480 height=360]http://i.imgur.com/5qUjy.gif[/url]

http://www.lawgazette.co.uk/news/betfair-founder-backs-new-abs-brilliant-law?utm_source=emailhosts&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=GAZ+17%2F01%2F2013

Explanation.

Bitter Tranmere, still going on about the floodlights in 93.

Haha and this. She must be on heroin

[url width=540 height=960]http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x480/tanswell2010/2013-01-19_23-55-54.png[/url]

When did he change his name from Numan to Lewis?

Didn't waste time correcting him eh?

Who me?

Think we have destroyed him, bless

Think his account will be deleted at 4.55 next Saturday

[url width=900 height=1200]http://i45.tinypic.com/212tnhu.jpg[/url]

i can't grasp how people are so willing to ignore the facts because of some sort of bitterness and hatred

How embarrassing for him (the journalist)

the last line of the article to the right - "less a statement of fact, more an expression of prejudice"
the article below about City, whose debts engulf ours

If I were him I'd concentrate on why Shrewsbury have banned gays

I can he is from Oxford

http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/chris-dunlavy/43/112/41b

I think that article is a disgrace the headline, Swindon the "cheats"who really prospered how can he call us cheats? We are owned by one man who has put money into a football club to become winners and become succsesful, it's no different to any sport, horse racing, the rich man buys up all the best young horses has the best stables wins the best races. The bloke wants sacking complete twat.

The bloke is obviously a cunt! Why let the facts get in the way of a good story.

Who does he scribble for Tans?

Things muist be so tight at The Football League paper that work experience kids get to write articles.

There's more of a likelihood of that paper being in administration by the end of the season that we have.

Any email address for this clown

A measly 115 followers on Twitter.

Lets not add to it.

@ChrisDunlavy
Writer for the Football League Paper, East Anglian TV megastar. All views are my own, except the ones I nicked off people better informed or more intelligent
The Football League Paper

The Football League Paper?!

Fucking hell - if it was the Sun or the Mail then you could understand it. That's a disgrace.

What a cunt. We are no more cheats than man united or man city, one is shit loads in debt, one fucked without a benefactor.

I'll give him something though.  His flagrant disregard of the facts does pretty much guarantee he'll live up to the 'Fresh Take on Football' strapline below his name.  (Here's my 'Fresh Take on the Weather': it's snowing outside and the snow is green.)

Scarily, he'll have been paid to write that.

.... Or his home town team Oxford (coincidence). they have debts of 4 million under the same circumstances as us.

Have fired off an email to it

That's the same bloke that was licking our ring last season.

No that was Jimmy Rimmer.

Dunlavy is the poxford fan on a piece of string

Rich guys sanction signings, PDC does the business then rich guys change mind and want to sell up.

Where is the cheating?

Only rich guys owed money they put in, NO ONE ELSE.

We pissed on Tranmere because they played shit, not because we had eleven world beating superstars playing for us.

Wish these mongs would get their shit correct.

Rant over.

I can understand the general point.  Long term, the finances of football clubs should be self-sustaining.    But the way in which STFC has been gleefully singled out this week as if it is some sort of special case/statistical outlier has been embarrassing.  Our total debt - all owed to the club's owners, I should add - is approx equal to the losses sustained by Bristol City during their last financial year.  We could all give plenty of other, much larger examples.

So where's the perspective?  Nowhere.  That's where.  It's gone.  Fucked off over the horizon because our manager is called Paolo Di Canio.  I expect partisan rubbish from the fans of other clubs on twitter or on message boards.  But in the print media?!  I suppose they are having to sensationalise to compete with the bollocks elsewhere.

Surely this is libelous? I can see a printed retraction being made.

As Ardiles kind of said, his general point (that football clubs who choose to spend big on players etc and let creditors go hang) is reasonable. Sadly in this instance, it's fatally undermined by his abject failure to actually check that those facts apply to us. Our major "creditor" is our owner, the debts are soft debts, [Obi Wan Kenobi voice]this is not the example you're looking for[/Obi Wan Kenobi voice]

Looking at that he is essentially a real life version of Alan Partridge.

All of which should tell you that if we can't find a taker, then the powers that be, will not take a benign view of our situation...we'll be more Looton than Pompey...Patey might not be to everyone's taste, but he's a job to do, if he fails the consequences won't be worth thinking about.

Home town of Chris Dunlavy

So this guy thinks PDC has run up these debts. The 2011 accounts show a £11.5m debt of which 7.75m is the old debt that this board cleared up and not due for repayment until 2015. We lost £1.3m in 2011 despite £1.6m in transfer fees. Suspect we lost about £2m last year as no we didn't sell any players for big money. No different to when Wilson was here.

Basic maths suggests we need to sell a player a season for a million-ish.

If cunts like the above, and that prick on talkshit keep calling the club cheats then I hope the club have instructed their lawyers to sue them.

...which would be one way to balance the books, I suppose.   ;D

Ha ha. Wouldn't that be a beautiful irony.

And that's why pieces such as these, easy to dismiss though they are with just a cursory examination of the facts, are so harmful. The club should take this twat and his "paper" to the cleaners.

Going to court would mean spending money, the exact opposite of what Black wants to do.

Thus the inverted commas...

True. And by the time it got there, any damage would have been long since done and Black et al will most likely have gone. Any new regime is unlikely to want to have legal baggage as part of the takeover package.

One of the most annoying aspects of modern journalism is the 'opinion columns' from young journos.
If i were Nick Watkins i would be contacting Dunlavy's editor and boss David Emery,who is a long standing
sports journalist.

[email protected]

If this paper takes a sensationalist stance then they need to be corrected and isn't it funny that
Dunlavy ignores the current spending by Bournemouth and our promotion rivals from last season
Crawley, who were financed by their benefactor.Why let opinion get in the way of facts Mr Dunlavy?

Maybe AB could put his new law firm to some use.

What sort of editor allows shit like that to be printed? I hope the club are aware of this. No doubt the scummer is reading this having his chuckle, bet its that cunt John Lennon.

The last laugh will belong to us when we are playing Championship football and the inbreds are still floating around in League 2.

His article mentions that every time we added to our wage bill, we knew someone was going unpaid.  Would he care to name a single business, organisation or individual that this applied to?  Just one.  Go on, just one...

How many copies a week does The Football League paper sell?

Yeah, Andrew Black, simples

A retraction has to be issued about the word 'cheat'.

Calling Swindon 'cheats' in massive letters in the headline then offering absolutely nothing to back it up in the article is firstly wrong and second potentially damaging and unacceptable libel on the club. The fact he follows it up by saying 'they bought promotion by not paying £13m bills,' which anyone that follows this story knows is plain and outright factually incorrect, since all those bills WERE PAID by our owners, to whom that theoretical debt (theoretical since it's unlikely to be called in) is subsequently owed, shows how embarrassingly unqualified he is to comment on this subject.

At least if I called this guy an ignorant pre-pubescent floppy haired scum-faced biased twat i could show everyone this article to back it up. I think we should be sending the editor of The Football League Paper a lot of emails and demanding a front page retraction and a lot of prostrate grovelling from the guy wrote it.

 :)

I did think of that, however, Andrew Black hasn't gone 'unpaid' as a result of us signing anyone.  So the challenge to the gentleman stands...Name one!

This is the most concerning thing to me

I think i'm least concerned about the actual 13 million debt than I am about what lies ahead. As said above what if there are no takers? Then we could be up shit creek. The debt sounds like it will be written off if a sale is forthcoming which would be a relief but it's who could takeover now. Let's hope we don't get someone in the mould of the venkys.

Yes but Reg is jumping several steps ahead and looking at the absolute worst, most dire scenario as he rather enjoys doing.

Let's take one step at a time.  Paolo's pretty transparent in his interviews and if he says he is feeling very positive about the situation then I'm sure he has good reason to be.

no harm in looking at worse case scenarios. There are plenty who seem to think there is no problem,and di canio had no idea what was going on a few days ago.

I'm still struggling to come up with a scenario that puts us in administration before the summer.

It would need one of the owners to call in their debt, which appears extremely unlikely in the short term. Or for us to stop paying ongoing bills and one of the creditors to take action, which again appears unlikely as we couldn't run up a debt big enough in the short term to make it worthwhile.

Though I'd feel a lot more comfortable if there was a statement from the owners clarifying all of this - what they're planning to do about their loans (how much they want back and when) and if there is money to see out the season.

Yea, you're right. But at the end of the day, who really knows what's going on behind the scenes? It's all speculation on our part :)

Only the next few days/weeks will tell i suppose..

he does look like 'Tucker' Jenkins from Grange Hill ,

No, I don't suppose it does arriba but Reg always seems to do it in such a gleeful way (sorry Reg but that's the impression I get, whether it's intended or not). On the second point, I'm pretty sure there are not many people who think there's 'no problem'.

I think we all are similarly minded when it comes to 'what if there is no buyer', and this scenario probably highlights the context Wise's 'administration' should be taken in. Fingers crossed, not sure what we can do but wait and see.

Going back to the first BBCWS interview with Patey when he came in as chairman, he said his top priority was to get the debt restructured to clear the finances to attract more investors in.  He specifically mentioned needing to get an agreement with some debt-holders to come to an agreement as in practice there was no chance of the loans ever being repaid.  This suggests to me that the majority (especially Black) would be prepared to write off all of the debt if necessary but realistically will want to get the best deal possible from the new investors.  As others have said over the past few days, it seems that insufficient progress has been made on negotiations with those minority parties.

Absolutely, for a huge national paper, say, I don't know, 'The Sunday People', an enraged group of Town fans might not pose too much of a worry. However a niche publication like that has much more to lose. I'd suggest mass emailing of the editor, and, if that doesn't work, contacting the marketing departments of their main advertisers.

Opinion is one thing, that's an outright wilful misrepresentation of the facts in a essentially a trade paper, at a very important time for our Club.

http://www.theleaguepaper.com/

For anyone wanting to get in touch with this guy to let him know what you think,feel free.

Disgusting piece of headlining.

Chris Dunlavy - 0208 9714333   0208 9714344

[email protected]

Fill your boots

Oxford supporting wanker.

What is all this business of journalists suddenly labelling swindon as a bunch of cheats? What about man u, man city, real Madrid who rack up MILLIONS of debt to chase the dream yet they are lauded for their trophy haul etc.

He forgot to include the biggest travesty that is now inflicted on good old Curley - we now must use Tescos own brand instead of the expensive PG tips

Now THAT is cheating

gonna send him a shitload of gifs.

[url width=500 height=279]http://i.imgur.com/KSJYW.gif[/url]

Made me laugh when I went on the ground tour before a game - the refreshment tables in the dressing rooms each had a few bags of Tesco value range sweets (hard gums or something similar).

I personally don't think we should express our anger towards Dunlavy himself but to his employers, who will have to offer an official apaology and then relieve him of his duties.

Well I've sent my email to the editor:

 :badmood:

'Dear Mr. Emery,

I'm writing about an article written by your staff writer, Chris Dunlavy, headlined: 'Swindon: the cheats who really prospered.'

Mr Dunlavy calling the club 'cheats' in massive letters in the headline, then offering absolutely no factual evidence in the article to back this up, is first and foremost just plain bad as a piece of journalism, and secondly potentially damaging and unacceptable libel for the club.

That he follows this headline up with a subheading that says 'They bought promotion by not paying £13m bills,' which anyone that follows this story will know is either proof of factual ignorance or a wilful fabrication on the part of Mr. Dunlevy, since all those bills WERE PAID by our owners, to whom all that debt is owed but who, as our owners, are not in a likely position to call it in, shows he is unqualified to comment on this subject, let alone publish an article voicing such a strong negative opinion that could have an effect on how we are viewed by fans of other clubs in the rest of the Football League.

Our spending is massively outweighed by clubs like AFC Bournemouth, in the same league, with a smaller turnover than us and a bigger squad on higher wages. Our total debt, 13 million (including 8 million carried over from the old regime), only equals the losses Bristol City are making EVERY SEASON!

Altogether, the costs since Andrew Black's takeover of a season of survival in league 1, a promotion challenge, a relegation and a promotion over the last 4 seasons has been £5 million, bankrolled primarily by one owner who has been incurring those losses over that time period with little prospect of repayment. If I was a fan of another club reading that article the impression i'd get is that we'd paid £13 million in one season getting out of League 2 off the back of various other people's money who we'd never intended to repay ('Every time Swindon added to their wage bill, they knew somebody else was going unpaid.' Who exactly are these 'somebody else's' Mr. Dunlavy is talking about, that money was all out of our owners pocket)!

As Swindon fans, we are already carrying with us enough of a burden from the actions of previous owners without being tarnished by articles of the nature of Mr. Dunlavy's that are the result of outright bad and lazy journalistic practice.

As a staff writer for a paper about the football league, it is Mr. Dunlavy's job to be knowledgeable about the football league, and to properly investigate the facts and details of a story before publishing his opinions on it. It is not his job to just bang away at the keyboard at the slightest sniff of misinformation and rumour floating around the football league while holding a superficial understanding of the subject.

As editor Mr. Emery, it is your job to stop articles with as many factual errors and misunderstandings as this going to press, and in the event that they do go to press, and it is brought to your attention it has been written from a position of factual error, it is also your job to offer a retraction.

Almost no clubs are managing survival in the football league without incurring losses. If that is Mr. Dunlavy's definition of 'cheats,' then his vitriol should be directed at the football league as a whole, not in singling out one club.

Thank you for your time,

Yours Sincerely,

(me).

A Swindon fan.'

In hindsight, could have written it a bit more eloquently, but i did enjoy writing the bit 'as a staff writer/ as editor.'

 :toocool:

I like it when Debra gets angry.

Also has anyone noticed what an unfortunate surname Mr. Dunlavy has?

Being a compound word consisting of contractions of 'Dunny' and 'Lavatory'? I wonder where that name comes from?

 :hmmm:

From a long and illustrious line of arsewipes perhaps? I've always been fascinated by the etymology of surnames and what it can tell you about a person me.

Nick Watkins is aware and has replied to me

Very good. 10/10.

Steady. An apology, yes. Financial renumeration, maybe. But I don't think people should lose jobs over it

Possibly a bit far but he cannot just go round making up stories to suit his own ends.

You going to leave us in suspense?

Is it worth contacting Press Complaints?


http://www.pcc.org.uk/complaints/form.html

He is going to speak to clubs lawyers to see where they stand legally and reitretaed that the debt is only to black

Yep, good work Brucy :nod:

Great letter, Bruce.  There was clearly a failure of editorial control for that article to get as far as publication...and you make that point very well.  I sincerely hope that Mr Emery is required, one way or another, to answer for that - and then to set the record straight with the same degree of emphasis as the original article.

Not that I, or anyone I know, has ever read the publication, mind.

Lets burn his house down

What a ridiculous and infactual article I've just read. I won't repeat what's been said as I share the opinion of everyone here, but Cheats?! That's scandalous! Good email/letter Bruce!

What about the Oxford mail and their article about our furniture being captured by debt collectors? Or did I dream that?

That was just a random muppet on their forum.

Apparently now Andrew Black is in a wrangle with the German government over £25m in unpaid taxes. It is the same person coming up with this nonsense and a lot of them are lapping it all up.

that's all over the newspapers here

It is?

Fucking hell.

Annoyed as I am I thought I would join Bruce as well and send one in:

"Dear Mr. Emery,

I’m writing to you wishing to draw your attention to an article, dated Sunday 20th January 2013, in the Football League Paper headlined: “Swindon: the ‘cheats’ who really prospered”. The sub-heading continues in similar terms; “They [Swindon] bought promotion by not paying £13m bills”. As I’m sure you are acutely aware the use of the word ‘cheats’ is an emotive term that describes actions of deception, lying and dishonesty and thus accusations by your paper are of a very serious nature.

So it is with grave disappointment, and one that should deeply concern you, that the article written by Chris Dunlavy does not appear to have been based on any facts at all. Instead it relies simply on a quote by Swindon’s Chairman Sir William Patey who, when asked if he could guarantee the club could avoid administration for a third time, replied; "Not a single chairman in the country could that”. That does not mean Swindon is in trouble, just that administration can never be ruled out for any limited company - not just football clubs - as a cursory look on the high street shows.

So let us be clear, Swindon are not seeking administration, nor are they close to doing so. Swindon also does not owe money to HMRC, banks nor any other creditors who are knocking on their door. The main creditor is Swindon’s main shareholder Andrew Black and it exists in the form of soft debt of his own money. Swindon’s current situation is that Mr Black for personal reasons has decided to sell, and it’s been that position for many months. However this is a situation your paper has now called ‘cheating’ and ‘immoral’. I would suggest those terms come suspiciously close to libel.

I would expect these kinds of sensational headlines from national newspapers, but from a specialist paper with a relatively low circulation, I would like to think you would take pride in the accuracy of your paper’s journalism, if only for your own self preservation in a very competitive market if nothing else.

I look forward to your prompt reply.

Yours sincerely

Ghanimah"

Link please..

shhh, we want the Pox to read & believe it

Nice try at playing it down.

Thanks for the PM. Front page of Spiegel you say

If only we'd paid attention to what they were telling us all along.

I feel so foolish.

So you're making stuff up again?

Izvestia have reported that Black has asked for political asylum for the time being, with consideration to be given to Russian citizenship if he gets his money back.

You will not find another club that you can buy debt free for basiccally a pound.I reckon it is safe to say we will have no problem selling this club whatsover.Peterborough chairman said on twitter if he was not an owner already we would be in his top 3 clubs he would want to buy.

Hope so! Im basically ignorant when it comes to this kind of thing. If that's true then im disappointed and encouraged in equal measures!

My email to Mr Dunlavy (copied to his editor also), will let you know if I get a response.



Dear Mr Dunlavy,

I have recently been made aware of an article written by yourself in The Football League Paper dated 20th January.

The headline in this article brands Swindon as cheats and claims the club "bought promotion by not paying £13m bills".

As a Swindon fan of many years your claims that the club hasn't paid bills concern me greatly because it was my understanding (having actually read up on this subject and listened to what the club officials have said), that the money "owed" is to Andrew Black and his fellow shareholders only, $8m of which was from 5 years ago when he first took charge.

Your article clearly implies you have knowledge of other parties to whom the club owes money, these must be the people denied money when we added to the wage bill. I quote "Every time Swindon added to their wage bill, they knew somebody else was going unpaid"
 
I'm sure all Swindon fans would very much like you to divulge who these poor people going unpaid are because otherwise it might be that your article gets viewed as extremely lazy journalism that warrants an apology and retraction.

I only wrote a couple of lines, couldn't be bothered with anything more elaborate.

The line that really fucked me off was 'nevertheless the fact remains that the robins have acted immorally'.

Its a fact is it?  This prick wouldn't know what a fucking fact was if it came up to him and said 'hello Im a fact would you like to check me before spreading me all over your squalid little rag?'

Third rate hack, writing for a rag that's circulation can't be much more than the Adver's (if that large).
Problem is morons from Oxford and Shrewsbury (for example) will lap it up.
Don't blame anyone but Chris Wise for this, scaremongering cunt.

Which newspaper?

Ghanimahs mail is the bollocks.

Gerard Depardieu, has shown the way....

Thanks  :-[

Those Pox twats of selective memory.

The Club that was "propelled" into the old Div 1 with stolen Pensioners money from Robert Maxwell.

Never mention that do they.  ;)

Also it was not so long ago that they owed £15m and agreed a CVA which reduced their debt to £6m and then Kassam sold the manor for 6m to pay off the remainder. The rest is history and now Kassam has them by the smallies and they are playing in a three sided shed cut up by the rugby every week. I'd rather have our position any day. Just need to make sure that we don't end up with a Kassam style chairman who was just interested in getting the permission for a offshoot developments rather than doing a proper job with the club.

Poxford fans are in no position to say anything really.  Maxwell, Kassam, Rix, banana man, non league, etc, etc. Won't stop the bitter twats though. Fucking mugs

From The Scum Forum -

"Mr Black seems very reluctant to pay his fair share of taxes, He has recently pulled Betfair out of Germany following a new 5% tax on gambling transactions and is in ongoing negotiations with the German Government over a tax liability of £25m"

Read more: http://www.yellowsforum.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=fldiscussion&action=display&thread=12793&page=5#ixzz2IXK9FtwX

 ;D

Nice one Ghanimah and bullethead.

At the very least we should get the editors attention when he opens his inbox Monday morning. Might make him think twice about giving this guy free rein again if he has to spend his morning sifting through a load of letters from us lot first thing.

The club appears to be pursuing it as well. Or at least considering it.

I occasionally bought this paper think i will give it a miss from now

Personally I would rather let it blow over and have the last laugh if administration never happens.

However, having had a look at Oxford and Tranmere's latest accounts, both of these clubs are 'cheats' too:

Tranmere Rovers

Turnover £3.5m
Loss of £197k for the year; accumulated losses of £5.9m.
Shareholders' defecit of £5.3m (there are more liabilities than assets).
Liabilities include £2.1m in bank loans/overdrafts and £5.1m in 'other loans', of which at least £4.2m is owed to the majority shareholder.

Oxford United

Turnover £3.2m
Loss of £296k for the year; accumulated losses of £5.1m.
Shareholders' defecit of £4.8m.
Liabilities include £3.4m owed to the majority shareholder.


Pot, kettle, black.

Awesome.

I don't know who the quagmire bloke is on the pox forum but he really is wasting his time. He's best off just leaving and come back with this when everything has settled.

This sideshowrob guy is a tool. Here's his latest.


Most of what he says is just a plain lie yet none of them question it. I wonder if he may really be a town fan trolling them to make them look stupid.

Haha good work Si

 :popcorn:

Why the popcorn?

We sue who we want
We sue who we want
We are Swindon
And we sue who we want !!

I don't know too much about UK defamation laws and libel so i had a look (admittedly wiki *cringe*) but i found the following paragraph interesting.

"English law allows actions for libel to be brought in the High Court for any published statements which are alleged to defame a named or identifiable individual (or individuals) in a manner which causes them loss in their trade or profession, or causes a reasonable person to think worse of him, her or them."

Some of Mr. Dunlavy's statements are pretty close to the bone and plain false. It goes on to say a reasonable defence could be  'fair comment'(i.e. whether the statement was a view that a reasonable person could have held), which may be his way out of it?

Maybe someone who knows more could clarify but it'll be interesting to see how this plays out. Incredible levels of sloppy, amateur journalism, i hope folk at that paper are embarrased of Mr. Dunlavy's work (doubt it).