Thetownend.com

http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=66543

Of Swindon,bit of a long read but some interesting facts never the less.

Did you know that the Duke of Edinburgh pub was origanally called The Tabernacle,do you care :D
Just for you old Swindon history buffs.

In the French parts of Canada, "Tabernac" is THE most offensive word you can say.

Shocking when you look at past and prsent photo's to see the amount of old buildings that were demolished post-war. Funnily enough, the council seem to be knock the buildings that replaced them down now.

Shame, from what I gather, Swindon was a very nice town with a great deal of character prior to 1960. Now it's just a shit-hole.

"As telling a reference as any to its lack of importance occurs in a newspaper of 1798, when the inhabitants of Wroughton referred to their village as 'near Marlborough'"

Wroughton scum!

There are some pretty good photos of the not too distant past on Facebook too. Close to where I live it had a picture of the Moredon power station and the construction of Safeway (now Morrison). The latter must have been late 80s and there is a surprising amount of green land not just in the immediate surround but also in the background. I suppose this was just before the boom and tag of "fastest growing town in Europe".

I think one of the posters had it right " Say what you want about Swindon borough council, they sure know how to concrete things".

I usually walk to the match and like to take different routes, preferably down the old canal routes or disused railways.

Before Christmas I was walking down the route of the North Wilts canal, now the footpath beween Hawksworth/Oasis that runs from just off Bruce Street bridges to just west of the railway station when I noticed these old ornate cast iron gates. They are behind the Doeflex Vinyl factory.

(http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp99/swindon_alan/2013-12-01-340.jpg)

(http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp99/swindon_alan/2013-12-01-343.jpg)

(http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp99/swindon_alan/2013-12-01-344.jpg)

They are on what was the Clares side of the canal and looking at old maps there was a footbridge over the canal in the railway works days. However, it didn't seem right that an entrance to the carriage shops should be quite so elegant. I found an older map - before the GWR built on that land and it looks as though it was a public park. More likely I guess.

Has any local history buff got any further info (Reg?), or has anybody noticed them before?

I know of these gates, and always assumed that they were an entrance to the works....but now you mention it, I've had a quick check of my 1925 map and it shows a Recreation Ground, just to the north of the sidings and sheds approximately there. I always thought they were a bit ornate, but GWR did always like to do things properly...but I'd lean to your park theory.

But what was the cyclist doing?

I suppose it is possible that there was a country house or estate there before it became a park and that was the canal  entrance? Perhaps it was donated when the land was sold off for housing (I'm thinking of the Ferndale Road houses).

Oh Sam - yes, it was a very surprised cyclist, I think he had been taking a leak in the bushes as he scurried off pronto  ;D

Those gates are beautifully decorated  ::)

They must be obscured from the main pathway as I used to cycle that way every day for years and never noticed them.

I found this bit of info, however.

http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/985737

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7016/6641183397_3dd12a1057_z.jpg)

 Man with stick, takes me back to my long standing assumption they were gates to the Works...

The contrast between the two pictures is amazing. This is why I love history.

Good find that, I found that image on this page, there's loads of great photos.

http://www.flickriver.com/photos/swindonlocal/tags/brwr/

Is that a Beret he is wearing? Is he military? Why is he pointing at the gate pillar with his pointy stick?

Don't you just love it when answers create more questions?...

All the answers can be found in an article in the second edition of Swindon Heritage magazine. Something to do with Ordnance Survey I believe.

Nah, that's Frank Spencer

Ah. The plot thickens! I am like a dog with a burglar's arse on this one  ;D

Right then, some more investigation. Here we have GWR's 1935 map of the railway works:

(http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp99/swindon_alan/1935map.jpg)

The canal has nearly been filled in completely. The gates are just above the building marked as "Motor Shed". Si's picture was taken in March 1953 so this is twenty years before that. Note the line of trees above the carriage shop which are part of the "Recreation Ground".

Let's go back to 1899:

(http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp99/swindon_alan/1899map.jpg)

Here you can see that the canal is still intact, including the locks and the keeper's cottage further north. The GWR has not yet bought the land for the carriage shop. This is the original size of the recreation ground, note the line of trees. The footbridge over the canal leads to the exact location of gates which are at the corner of the recreation ground and the railway works. There is a footpath that leads across the rec at the same angle that the gates are to the canal. This strongly suggests that they existed before the works.

So perhaps they were originally the gates to something else? Well if we zoom out slightly:

(http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp99/swindon_alan/1899mapsouthbrook.jpg)

There is a collection of buildings called South Brook at the top right. Was this the original instigator of the gates? Was it a farm or an estate perhaps? Did they subsequently sell off the land?

Let's go further back to the first Ordnance Survey map of 1828:

(http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp99/swindon_alan/1828map.jpg)

The railways have only just arrived here. No railway works, no Swindon New Town, just fields. South Brook is here, but there is no sign of a path or road where the gates are (the one further north is Iffley Road, leading to what is now Bruce Street Bridges).

I think that a map between the two (somewhere around 1860) would provide the final answer as to when the gates appeared and what they were for. However, I would dispute that the GWR made them and that they were in fact for the park and they were just incorporated into the new entrance for the carriage shop. If you look at the style of railing on the left and then compare it to the gate in this picture:

(http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp99/swindon_alan/2013-12-01-343.jpg)

You can see that the gates are finished much more finely. The railings are typical railway style with curved tops and no embellishment. It also looks as though the railings have been attached to the gates with brackets. This is even more obvious in Si's picture:

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7016/6641183397_3dd12a1057_z.jpg)

I rest my case for now  :D

Look at the angle of them compared to the road/fenceline in that photo as well. There's very little to suggest the gates were built at the same time as the fence. Definitely seem like an earlier feature that have been incorporated into the fence.

It's a good case...I'm back with leaning towards a park feature.  Here's a little beauty...

 
http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/11085038.Hill_figures_brought_to_life_for_first_time_in_centuries/

I found this on an old map web site. It's not very clear but it's 1889 and shows how it was before the recreation area was created:

(http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/pp99/swindon_alan/1889map.jpg)

So the footpath existed before the rec and presumably so did the footbridge over the canal from the towpath on the south west side. The works must have expanded in the ten years between 1889 and 1899 to move up to the corner where the gates are. It doesn't answer the question of when they appeared but it's interesting!

The owners of Eastcott Lodge must have seen their doom coming at this point (it was still there in 1899 - have a look at the South Brook map where it was nearly overwhelmed by the works, they must have been towering over them!)

Oooh, are you going to the lecture Reg? I can't as I am away for the weekend from tomorrow lunch time.

South Brook was indeed a farm.


http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/community/neighbourhood/ferndale/guide/ (http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/community/neighbourhood/ferndale/guide/)

I didn't even know that the Southbrook Inn existed, is it still open? Has anybody frequented it?

Yes its open. Workmate goes in all the time. Not been in myself for a few years

I used to go there all the time when I was little. They had an ace slide & play area that was like a tree

The main bar is like a village pub.  Has a hall on the side which is a bit bland but seems a nice enough place whenever I have been in.

Obvious point, I know, but I love the way that the modern day arterial road network of a large town like Swindon pretty much follows the line of the country lanes existed hundred of years ago, running between the villages that now make up the suburbs.

Fuck me. It's a fucking gate.

Yep, it is quite a popular pub, run by a great couple - Bob and Gina.  Do some great meals in there, decent food and value for money.  Bob tried to get permission to extend the pub's kitchen but got refused as the building is, in fact, listed!

But isn't the cast iron so ornate?

(http://i.imgur.com/j3G6aYK.gif)

That's brilliant.  Never in a million years would I have imagined that there was a building like that in Ferndale.  Lovely looking place.

Nevertheless, it throws up a fascinating insight into how we interpret the past and evidence for making those decisions...the epistemology of history...

As a relatively newcomer to Swindon I find this type of thread most fascinating, keep it coming  :)

Yeah went to the lecture....certainly has thrown up more questions for me than provided answers.  It's a very difficult subject for study as the available evidence is so evanescent...essentially some aerial photos from 1966, and a further corroborated photo seen in the 70's but now mislaid possibly in the Swindon Museum Archive.

Geophysics has not seen anything, but computer enhancement can do stuff....so a bit of a leap of faith required, but I'm quite happy to do that, as I like the idea of standing on the long barrow near Liddington on the end of Shuger Waie...looking over the valley and seeing 2 monumental chalk figure there.

I've always regarded Liddington Hill as a special place, possibly the site of the Arthurian, Battle of Badon...and so possibly at least one of the figures might be connected to that event.

Was there a free bar Reg

Glass or two of wine available at the end.