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Title: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 17:22:03 got some serious issues at work and wondered if anyone has experience with the above
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: tans on Friday, September 24, 2010, 17:23:04 You had another pay cut?
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 17:26:03 not as such. but clauses to our contract that they want us to sign upto.
need advise on those Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: ronnie21 on Friday, September 24, 2010, 17:29:01 Could Gazzas Fat Mate be the man you need!
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Samdy Gray on Friday, September 24, 2010, 17:29:34 http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Employees/EmploymentContractsAndConditions/DG_10037116
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 17:32:43 cheers Sam.
here are the clauses they are wanting to add. Quote 1.1 If there is a reduced need for employees to perform work of a particular kind on a temporary or permanent basis, or any other occurrence which affects normal working such as a requirement to cut costs, the Company shall be entitled to lay you off or impose short-time working for such period as the Company shall decide. 1.2 While you are laid off you shall not be required to work and shall have no right to remuneration subject to clause 1.5 below. 1.3 While you are on short-time working your working hours may be reduced as the Company sees fit and your remuneration shall be correspondingly reduced subject to clause 1.5. 1.4 The Company shall give as much notice as is reasonably practicable of lay-off or short-time working. Thereafter it shall give as much notice as is reasonably practicable of any further change to your hours including a return to normal working hours. 1.5 During any period of lay-off or short-time working, depending on the circumstances you may have a statutory right to a guarantee payment in accordance with legislation in force from time to time. Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Sippo on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:00:22 Are you with a Union?
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:01:15 no mate.
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: stfcinbmth on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:09:23 CAB
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:15:42 they're my next step tomorrow. phone acas today who offer impartial advise but it looks like proper employment law stuff so not sure how much they can help
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: stfcinbmth on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:19:29 they're my next step tomorrow. phone acas today who offer impartial advise but it looks like proper employment law stuff so not sure how much they can help They will probably point you in the direction of ACAS Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: ron dodgers on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:32:46 all I can say is it could be such a change in your working conditions that you could walk out and claim constructive dismissal - but I doubt you want to go down that route
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:36:38 it's what i shall do if this clause is put into place. one board director told myself that if we don't sign it then we're out of a job
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: stfcinbmth on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:38:13 it's what i shall do if this clause is put into place. one board director told myself that if we don't sign it then we're out of a job Then that deffo would be constructive dismissal Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: horlock07 on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:39:39 They will probably point you in the direction of ACAS Missus works for CAB (sadly not in Swindon) but she confirms that they should help with it if you contact them - they will only normally refer to ACAS if concilliation (poorly spelt!) is the process to follow. She suggests that you also look on www.adviceguide.org.uk Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:42:10 ok i'll phone them tomorrow.
doing my nut here as got a house + 3 kids to feed and dress. my employer is a cunt Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: blah blah on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:42:51 they cannot force you to sign anything, or sack you if you dont, but it really depends on how much of a change this is from your current T&Cs. If it is such a change that it could be viewed as a different job, you may have a claim to redundancy pay if you dont sign it, but this will depend how long you have been there etc.
Employment law is a real nightmare, I dont know who you work for but if they are a decent sized company they will probably already have taken legal advice before asking employees to sign it, so that probably tells you that they think they are within their rights to do it. Citizens Advice or ACAS are the right places to start, but I wouldn't recomend the constructive dismissal thing, that has a very small success rate Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:45:40 i work for a company called JMP Consultancy.
they employ roughly 300 staff and have got lawyers envolved over this. it is a massive change to our contracts as ours clearly state we work 37.5 hours per week etc where as there slauses state we are required to work when they want us. basically a zero hours contract Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Sippo on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:47:19 If it was me, seek advice. Sign the contract anyway. End of the day its better to have a job than no job. Then look for another job whilst you tick over.
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:48:58 sorry sippo i'd rather not sign to those terms. a zero hours contract basically means if you're not needed next week or he 3 weeks after then you have no pay and can't claim anything to supliment this.
resulting in no bills being paid, no food being brought and the kids go without. this i can't and will not do Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: stfcinbmth on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:49:59 From my poor understanding of employment law. An employer has to give two weeks notice of changes to your terms and conditions. You have to actually agree to them before the changes can take place. blah blah has certainly raised a couple of worthwhile points
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: blah blah on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:51:54 I would hold out for as long as you can without signing it. If you sign then go back and say "actually I dont agree with it and dont want to sign up to this", you wont have a leg to stand on.
If the workforce is 300, you may well also be able to set up an employee forum where 4 or 5 of you enter discussions with the Management on behalf of the rest and also take advice from employment law specialists. It is a bit like an ad-hoc union - they are often used when redundancies are announced, dont see why you cant use one here too. Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:53:41 yeah his points are noted. i've raised concerns over the contract and will just go through the consultation period with everyone else to iron things out etc but if they impliment it i wont sign and shall work under protest until something is agreed. if it is not i shall resign and seek constructive dismisal
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:55:05 I would hold out for as long as you can without signing it. If you sign then go back and say "actually I dont agree with it and dont want to sign up to this", you wont have a leg to stand on. If the workforce is 300, you may well also be able to set up an employee forum where 4 or 5 of you enter discussions with the Management on behalf of the rest and also take advice from employment law specialists. It is a bit like an ad-hoc union - they are often used when redundancies are announced, dont see why you cant use one here too. got representatives setup mate ready to start meetings on Monday Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: stfcinbmth on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:55:26 You certainly do need specialist advice on this matter. Good luck, it must be very worrying for you
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Sippo on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:56:49 But if for whatever reason you leave, are you confident enough of getting another job? Is it worth the risk?
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:57:09 what i shall propose in our pre meeting monday morning is if people want to throw £30 each into a pot to hire an employment lawyer to aid us.
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 18:58:26 But if for whatever reason you leave, are you confident enough of getting another job? Is it worth the risk? nothing is certain in life sippo. but being unemployed makes me feel less nervous than being employed by my current employer on those terms Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: RobertT on Friday, September 24, 2010, 19:06:19 http://blogs.findlaw.com/solicitor/2010/02/unite-union-workers-win-battle-over-zero-hours-contracts.html
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 19:09:47 excellent Rob. cheers.
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: stfcinbmth on Friday, September 24, 2010, 19:16:52 That looks promising
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 19:26:33 is it worth me joining them before the consultation period starts or am i not allowed. i don't know much about unions
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: stfcinbmth on Friday, September 24, 2010, 19:30:06 is it worth me joining them before the consultation period starts or am i not allowed. i don't know much about unions Can't help with that one, but no harm in contacting them and discussing the situation, I'm sure they'll be happy to help Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Simon Pieman on Friday, September 24, 2010, 19:37:02 What's your notice period?
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 19:37:33 i have a months notice period why?
email to unite sent Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Sippo on Friday, September 24, 2010, 20:00:30 i have a months notice period why? email to unite sent They probably won't help unless you subscribe. Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 20:07:24 i've questioned that in my email to them. hopefully hear something soon
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Sippo on Friday, September 24, 2010, 20:15:24 It might be worth joining. There are plenty of unions out there. You can leave at anytime.
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Friday, September 24, 2010, 20:26:16 i think i might. Do i have to inform my employer?
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Sippo on Friday, September 24, 2010, 20:28:49 No not at all. My union take it out my wages each month, but I'm sure you can pay by direct debit. You can talk to your union rep at any time, without anyone even knowing.
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: jonny72 on Friday, September 24, 2010, 20:29:49 Might be worth checking all of your insurance policies (house, car etc) or anything similar you have in case there is some form of legal aid / advice included with it. Often you don't even realise it's included till you check the policy.
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Simon Pieman on Friday, September 24, 2010, 21:44:51 i have a months notice period why? email to unite sent Because a) you'd be giving that up. b) there may be a chance you could be made redundant, so at least you have a month's notice. I know it's easier said than done but you should really get out of there sooner rather than later. Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: bassett boy on Saturday, September 25, 2010, 07:54:08 How long have you worked for the company?
You mentioned 1 months notice however if there is a potential change to your terms and conditions then they have to give you indivual notice for example if you have worked there 6 years then 6 weeks up to a maximum of 12 weeks Are the company carrying out indivdual consultation? If so you could ask to form a employee forum that would represent all of your concerns and put this in writing and they have to confirm their response in writing Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Batch on Saturday, September 25, 2010, 08:25:35 Definitely get proper advice, which you seem to be.
I remember a similar question popping up on another forum and seem to recall simply non-signing of a contract may after a certain amount of constitute implied acceptance. Might be total guff, but worth covering just in case. The law is often an ass. Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Samdy Gray on Saturday, September 25, 2010, 08:37:05 Yeah, I always thought best advice was to sign it but let them know you are only continuing to work under protest.
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: magicroundabout on Saturday, September 25, 2010, 08:43:01 i've worked for them for 3y 8m.
We've got representatives which are going to meetings which cover a large group of us. we have raised questions to hopefully change what they want to impose yet i doubt they'll change anything. looking at the link RobT posted it would seem to sign yet tell them i will challenge it. So Si if i'm part of a unuon does that render my notice period null and void? is that what you mean? Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: warksred on Saturday, September 25, 2010, 09:26:32 is it worth me joining them before the consultation period starts or am i not allowed. i don't know much about unions 3 months ago 7 colleagues were in a situation whereby they needed to re-apply for 5 jobs, none of these colleagues were members of a union and a member of management informed them that they could not join a union and have union representation because the consultation process had commenced.They ignored this information from management, joined (subscribed) UNITE and accessed union advice and representation at their meetings with management. There are some union benefits that you are not entitled to until you have subscribed for 6 months but for what you need NOW join a union. Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Arriba on Saturday, September 25, 2010, 16:00:50 unions are lefty scum only in it for themselves,cause trouble,are the reason the country had a recession,lazy,do nothing,socialist bastards,etc,etc,etc,etc.....
Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: Simon Pieman on Saturday, September 25, 2010, 16:41:33 i've worked for them for 3y 8m. We've got representatives which are going to meetings which cover a large group of us. we have raised questions to hopefully change what they want to impose yet i doubt they'll change anything. looking at the link RobT posted it would seem to sign yet tell them i will challenge it. So Si if i'm part of a unuon does that render my notice period null and void? is that what you mean? No but you must make sure you are not accepting the new conditions because your notice period could effectively be nothing if they tell you you're working no hours that month. Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: tans on Saturday, September 25, 2010, 16:43:07 unions are lefty scum only in it for themselves,cause trouble,are the reason the country had a recession,lazy,do nothing,socialist bastards,etc,etc,etc,etc..... No that's bob crow. The cunt Title: Re: Does anyone here have any experience with Employment Law Post by: bassett boy on Saturday, September 25, 2010, 18:19:33 unions are lefty scum only in it for themselves,cause trouble,are the reason the country had a recession,lazy,do nothing,socialist bastards,etc,etc,etc,etc..... Now lets not sit on the fence :D |