Thetownend.com

Haven't heard anymore about this...has it happened? If not when is it going to court?

Think it goes to Court mid november???

 That'll be about November the 16th then.

thought the court date was earlier than that, although can't find the link anymore...

coincidence?

 I did wonder why such a specific date was given for the "takeover"

I thought I'd read November 9 as the date for the court case somewhere. I remember seeing the November 16 date from the club and thinking that at least Bill Power would get his day in court...

Is the judgement actually made on the day, or does the judge take both sides evidence and come to a conclusion some time thereafter?

From diamandis interview


I assumed this ment the BP case rather than anything to do with the cost of the BEST deal?

Is Shaw Park Developments the company that Wills & Diamndis set up to do the Shaw Tip Stad (ie Is this money owed to them selves ?
How could the Shaw tip fiasco cost them 2.5 million?

Every statement by this lot raises 10 x more questions than answers given

Shaw Dev is a company set-up for the development, the money owed to them is largely the St Modwen money (they loaned Shaw who loaned the club).

who is bill power

Not only the stadium site development though, I understand they are either doing, or have done, a rather tasty development in Hungerford!  That must have made them a few bob.!!!

Was this the one where it was being built on land owned by the Wills family ?

Not sure about that PtoP, could well have been.  Saw the sign which said it was developed by Shaw Park Developments.

Yeppers

Hungerford Marina

So am I factually correct in saying that Shaw park Developments was set up by the Owners & Advisors to the club. They were set up to redevelope the Tipstad, which couldn't have cost very much at all that happened were a few drawings were done.
The same company DID actually make money in redeveloping Hungerford Marina.
Somehow, STFC owes them £2.5 million.
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong !

I think you're making the assumption that the debt owing to St Modwen actually relates to the work undertaken on the Shaw tip proposal. As you say that amounted to a bit a feasibility and inital design work, a couple of hundred grand at the very outside I would have said.

Actually the club got St Modwens to front up the couple of million or so to keep them ticking over until the stadium development came together. Effectively it's a loan, repayable next spring I think.

According to St Modwen:

£2.2m owed by Shaw Park Dev, Interest charged at 1.5% above Base Rate
£2,2m owed by Healnorth, same interest.  This company is controleld by SPD.

St Modwen have a 50% stake in SPD.

The loan is secured.

secured on what?

So, Shaw park development lent the club, 2.2 or 2.5 million did they ?
Or is the club liable for the debt for the work done on the tipstad /
Or is the club liable for money that was actually used to fund the Hungerford marina ?
PS.
I am not stating the above as fact. Just asking questions as a consumate busybody.

Healnorth being SSW's Real Estate company, is that right?

I believe the money was simply funnelled through SPD, probably because that was going to be the vehicle for the development of the ground, which in turn is a great way of keeping the money seperate to a loss making football club ltd.

It cleared off the Debenture owed to Swindon Town Properties Ltd and then a bit more was called for to cover the VAT issue.  There are 3 charges I think held against assets of the club, effectively secured against the lease on the CG and any property owned by the club (Shrivy Rd Stand from memory is a modular building owned by the club).  Not sure if any of the money is secured directly on land owned by SSW and family.

Healnorth was SSW's development company, and I think the ones who actually took on the Marina development.  No idea on the money loaned to that company and as far as I know it's not money connected to the club.

It's just that I have difficulties getting my head around why & how STFC can owe so much.
I mean I can't get the  figures to add  up.
How can we owe the Inland Revenue 1.8 million in tax?
According to the CVA supervisors report these payments between 2002 - 2006 were approx 1.8 milliom, but are shown as paid.
 http://www.truststfc.co.uk/pdf/cva_update_may_2006.pdf
Am I making a fundamental mistake here ?
PS does any one know the approx club turnover ?

between £3.3m and £3.8m ish

I would assume that as SPD and St Modwens have the same registered office we can assume they are fairly closely linked!

So lets say that turnover is £3.8 million. Vat on that is £670,000 assuming no Vat is reclaimed. The players wages last season were "capped" to 60% of turnover so would have been £2.3 million.  If you assume that the average PAYE & NI is say 45% then the PAYE should be approx another £1,035,000.  That means that the tax bills hasn't been paid for over a year !
Could it be that as part of the CVA process, the tax bills are paid through the CVA supervisor ? Is this maybe why the tax bills haven't been paid. ?

BTW that turnover. Would that include transfer fees ? Would the Parkin/ fallon/ Elton John/ Wise Poyet & Lucas money be included ?

So lets say that turnover is £3.8 million. Vat on that is £670,000 assuming no Vat is reclaimed. The players wages last season were "capped" to 60% of turnover so would have been £2.3 million.  If you assume that the average PAYE & NI is say 45% then the PAYE should be approx another £1,035,000.  That means that the tax bills hasn't been paid for over a year !
Could it be that as part of the CVA process, the tax bills are paid through the CVA supervisor ? Is this maybe why the tax bills haven't been paid. ?

BTW that turnover. Would that include transfer fees ? Would the Parkin/ fallon/ Elton John/ Wise Poyet & Lucas money be included ?

I think the salaries are net of PAYE so your figure is going to be out if that's the case (although I can't remember, it was so long ago since I researched this).

Also, where did you get the 45% figure from? Bearing in mind a lot of the team are going to be higher rate tax payers and add on employee and employer NICs, you're probably looking at a higher figure!

Turnover is a term for sales usually. Sales of players would probably be classed as a profit/(loss) on sale, although I can't remember off hand what the exact presentation is in the STFC accounts.

It would be a seperate item such as profit on disbursement of player registrations or something like that, or a loss I suppose!

£3.8m is about the top level I think, £3.3m is around the level for 2005/06

Wages are listed as a seperate item in the accounts so it's possible to get that figure.

Oh the 45 % takes into account the lower rate bands & personal allowances etc. It was an arbitary figure, but I was merely trying to get the 1.8 mill into context. I would suspect some of the youth team for exmaple wouldn't even pay tax