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Its not going to happen with the current personnel is it?   ESSAY TIME

I'm trying not to have a knee jerk reaction because we lost last night - I didn’t go, but by all accounts we were poor.  I know we were bad against Morecambe & Bury, and from what I've read on here and been told by a neutral who went to Torquay we wernt very good there either.

The defence should be ok in my view. They had a shakey game last night, but to be honest it was bound to happen eventually. Sturrocks desire for the full backs to get forward is pretty much covered by Nicho and Jack Smith. Both are capable of putting a good ball into the box, and Nichos long throw can be a useful weapon at times. Lack of depth has to be a worry though.

Its midfield and attack where we look lost.

If the wingers and full backs are going to play wide and pushed forward then it makes sense to me that you need a solid base in central midfield. Now with Evans in the team I dont see it as being as much of a problem. He has the experience, and ticks the basic boxes of being able to run, pass & tackle. His long range shooting and set piece delivery is a bonus. Frankly we miss him like hell at the moment, as he is easily our best centre mid.

Weston looks better along side him than anyone else in my opinion, and again he can run and tackle, his passing could be better at times, but he has the bonus of being able to run with the ball.  I don’t rate Timlin. Pooky is alright but limited. Whalley is useless and needs releasing ASAP. I like the look of Zaboob, but think he will eventually end up as left back.

On to the wingers. I'd have monkhouse on the left, as I hate brown. Its not even because of the whole transfer thing anymore, its just his constant lame, half arsed, performances. He seems to have lost at least a couple of yards of pace over the summer, rarely beats his man, and despite having a decent cross on him at times, seems reluctant on putting the ball into the box.  

Shakes limitations are well documented, but he does work very hard for the team. We still need someone better though. I do wonder if Sturrock will eventually try Roberts there, but its swings and roundabouts. What is better? a hard working winger who can’t cross or shoot or a lazy converted striker on the wing with a good  cross and potential goal threat? I'm not sure. How was Wells on the wing? Looked good against Salisbury, but then it wasn’t even Salisbury’s 1st team.

Up Front. Everyone including Luggy seems to think Lukas did ok at Mansfield and definitely deserves to be in the 1st team squad. He needs a goal though for his confidence, and its unrealistic to pin our hopes on a 17 year old without a 1st team goal to his name.  Roberts just doesn’t fit in to what Sturrock has stated he would like his strikers to do. He's crap at holding the ball up, is scared of heading the ball, and naturally drifts out wide to find space. Despite is recent goals, hes either going to be on the bench, right wing or out the door. Having said all that, his pace and skill (when he can be arsed) are a cut above the rest of our strikeforce. We just all wish he wasn’t so fucking inconsistent, as he could be one of our best players.

Personally, I think Peacock is alright. we all know he works hard, but even I will admit he needs to score more. Worryingly he doesn’t even seem to be getting into goalscoring positions at the moment. And he's was utter shite in the last 2 games he has played. However he does fit the bill for what Sturrock wants from his strikers. Fola is long gone. Blair Sturrock? fuck knows. Caton? meeeh.  Brownlie? I just dont think hes any good really, and suspect Luggy agrees. i think he'll be of in Jan.  

I'm going to change my tune here and say we do now need a striker. Prefrebly one with pace, skill, power and lethal finishing. Should be a piece of piss with no money in league 2.

It wouldnt surprise me to see a high turnover of players in January, as many of the players we have are clearly unsuited to the style of play Sturrock wants and expects. He seems adamant that the team will play to his tactics, not fit his tactics around the abilities of the personel we have.

In strurrock we trust.

Bollocks.








 :wink:

Amen Brother!  :D

No being serious some very valid points there Piemonte.  Now I know we did play awful against Morecambe, but when Zaboub came  on and Roberts wandered out wide we did at least put a couple of crosses in the box.  

I too wonder if PS will go for Roberts and Zaboub on the wing at some stage in the near future.  Play Dukeysbitch and Peacock up top and see what happens.

Drum into Lee Peacock that he's not there to chase back quite as much as he does now, make the midfield take responsibility for that, and who knows what'll happen.

For me Shakes and Brown are as bad as each other, Pook shouldn't be in the first team either.  Still early stages for Timin, I'm hoping he'll get better once his fitness is up.

Also I do also think that we should be running at these centre halves more at this level, Robbo, Weston, Zaboub, Monkhouse (if he comes back) they could easily beat their men with the ball at there feet, these centre halves are cart horses in L2.

It always comes back to beer.

Hmmmm, chang.  :beers:

 :ontopic:

I didnt spend that much time and effort writing that to have the thread ruined by cheap jokes about beer brewed by ching chong chinamen :wink:

agree with pretty much all of the post.

I'd start the job now of converting Shakes into a back-up right back.

Certainly need someone on the right and Monkhouse with Zaaboub as a left back would be a great combination I think.

Central midfield is ok when Evans and Weston are both in, but the cover is poor.

Upfront, I just can't see us finding someone to fit the bill in January so we'll have to muddle along.

:sorry:

Though it is Thai beer  :wink:

You made some good points, I just couldn't get past making the cheap joke I'm afraid.

I had to cheer myself up after wondering where this super striker will materialise from.

I feel partly responsible for the way it's gone, but was expecting some decent replies PM.  Thought it's a topic worth chatting about.

To be fair to Sturrock, most of us have been going on about the lack of quality crossess and competent front men since the pygmy was here.

I don't think Luggys ideas are causing the problems, I just think we've got players who think they're better than they are and they go out and prove themselves wrong everytime they step on a football pitch!

Roberts is the real enigma: Undoubted skill, but no application. I wouldn't be suprised if Sturrock begins to get very frustrated with him.

The most annoying thing is the apparent lack of interest or desire displayed by the team. It used to be two or three of them, now it's looking like most of them.

If Sturrock can't get the best out of them, I predict many moves in January.

Jan / Bo I was only joking :D

And Chang is thai? :shock:

Shakes as back up right back is a good call, I thought he looked half decent there earlier in the season.

Another natural centre back to compete with Ifil and williams would be good also. I was far from covinced by Nicho there, hes a better left back and I'm unsure if CCP is ever really going to make it.

Most of our players know they'll be moved on either in Jan or the summer, which is why they don't give a shit......they're not Luggy players and mostly haven't impressed.

 There are one or two exceptions.....think we need to accept that auto promo this season is unlikely and a PO the best to hope for...once you start a slide though it can be difficult to reverse.

I'm not so certian Reg. Even the top 6/7 in the league (bar Walsall, currently) drop a lot of points so its not going to be as hard as it might be to keep in with a shout. That and the 3 auto slots of course.

about 35 points from the rest of the season should confirm the play off spot so even moderate form should see us around the 3rd place battle for much of the season from here on in.

I think people need to remember Dennis Wise had a whole pre-season to check out the team, apply tactics and get everything the way he wanted it. Paul Sturrock has had a month so far, and is looking to make huge tactical changes to the side.

We have played poorly, but a lot of it is down to a massive change, not to mention off the field events. I dont think we'll see a huge change of personnel in january - maybe 3 out and 3 in.

also, massive changes in personnel would have an adverse effect on the team as a whole.

Centre back cover is important, Nicho is OK, and at least we have Zaboub to cover LB as Vincent looks very defensive and poor at distribution.

I agree with the main points that all have said.  I thought CCP looked good last season and I hope he makes it here but I can't see it.  I think he'll need to majorly impress to earn a contract though.

Up front and CM are undoubtedly the key areas, we're lacking two key components of the spine of the team, and ultimately to be doing so well without any strikers illustrates our luck thus far.  I just hope Luggy has someone lined up for the new year.

First team players who are "safe" imo.

P Smith ( & Brez), J Smith, Nicho, Williams, Ifil, Weston, Lucas, Evans, Zaboub, Roberts (can't see him letting him go mid season at least), and maybe Shakes!

Others could find themselves out the door.

 In a fairly even league like ours with poorly resourced clubs,  getting a winning side is difficult....which tends to explain the fluctuation, between the 20 game point and teh seasons end......basing this on last season,   Northampton and Cheltenham were outside the top 7 after 20 games...the likes of Rochdale and Chester were in the top 7 and went to the last game under threat of relegation. the scum were just outside the PO places with Cheltenham.......and we know what happened to them.

  My point is that it can be very difficult to arrest a slide once it kicks in....to my eyes we look like a side on the slide.

Its all about the spine of the team

Brezovan, Williams, Evans, Peacock

and we started off well and we were winning games, 3 of those players didnt play last night.

Phil Smith is decent cover for Brezovan, and Lukas is ok but certainly doesnt have the expirence Peacock has. A team with the spin of

Smith, Williams, Timlin, Roberts

Is never going to work.

Paul Evans is the key man, he holds the team together in the middle. That last few games our central midfielders have been totally annoymous....that what we desperately need a 2nd Paul Evans.

The striker issues is well document, last night we put in lots of decent crosses and no one attacked them.

Peacock needs to be told to look after number 1 and be more greedy. Stop helping the other usless cunts by doing their work and concentrate on getting into that 6 yard box. Dont do all the running upfront yourself because Roberts cant be arsed to break into anything more than a strut.

I think Sturrock has shot himself in the foot, getting rid of CCP, Monky & Fola was a poor decision. They maybe shit players with no future (they arent imo) but they are squad players. Fola despite all his faults maybe capable of changing the game a bit, and he has done.

We were 2-0 down and playing shit, with a bench of Stewart (0 games), Wells (1 game?) Pook, Brown (shit) & Brownlie....now really which one of those are capable of coming on and turning a 2-0 to a 2-2 or better yet a 3-2 win....none of them.

Would Monky and Fola have made more of an impact on the game then Brown and Brownlie....probably.

Also, I dont like the fact Sturrock has tried to change everything, yes we dipped under Ady, but we've got worse since Sturrock has been in charge. I know he likes his own style and all that, but November in what HAS to be a promotion season isnt the time to completely change things.

This time on Saturday we could be 6th and 13 (THIRTEEN) points off top spot, which is not good enough and near impossible to claw back

i disagree that we have got worse under Sturrock DV. the first game in charge was much better than the crap we saw under Wise. to an extent i think we have looked to play more attacking. but the players are so used to the way Wise wanted to play they know no different

Agreed Rich.

Unfortunately Luggys hope that they're 'not as thick as mince' seems to be wishful thinking.

The thick cunts...............

Not rocket science is it?

i agree with you to an extent but i think this is a transitional period hence the abysmal performances, footballers have difficulty following one standard set of instructions at the best of times let alone having to adapt to an entirely new way of playing.

i couldn't be arsed trying to draw a diagram in paint, sorry.

simple formation, simple instructions. full-backs pushing on - both nicho and smith are capable of it - and wingers playing high up the pitch. direct and attacking.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/jameswalsh/442formation.jpg

evans provides cover all over, he's got the engine to keep it up for 90 minutes.

by overloading the wings, it keeps our strikers in the box. all play goes down the flanks but weston is essentially given a playmaker type role giving him carte blanche to go wherever when we're attacking, providing he doesn't neglect his defensive duties.

this all sounds horribly champ man, doesn't it?

the wingers play wide and they stay wide. we've got a fairly large pitch at the county ground, why don't we utilise it?

it's all well and good being a "solid" team who are "difficult to break down" but we're not battling relegation here, we're trying to get promoted. i think every man in the starting eleven is capable of doing what they're asked, it's just a case of building a squad to provide cover and competition for those players.

Careful Sonic, you'll have Luggy stealing your tactics  :wink:

That's a bit of a strange thing to come out with when we are actually still in an automatic promotion spot isn't it Reg?  I certainly don't accept automatic promotion is unlikely, not by any means.

We are 3rd,still in with a shout of 2nd place imo thats what the rest of the league is aiming for as i think walsall will piss it.

we have things to look forward to its a totally different season to last year so i dont really understand all the fuss

Yep, agree with all of that.

Yep, exactly - Good post

Yes, Dennis Wise had a whole pre-season to check out the team and apply tactis....and he did, he bought in some good players and applied winning tactics....

Sturrock is his own man, but why come in and totally try to change something mid-season which has actually worked damn well so far...

Because if we go up playing Sturrocks way we'll be better off next season

theres your answer

No. No no no no no no no.

That is all.

Exactly

one defeat since he came here and now he is doing things wrong.

football really is a weird sport

Red this is STFC .... when does anyone EVER do anything right for long??

 :-))(

Some more good points on here. In particular I agree with VD regarding the spine of the team.

Kudos to Sonic Youth for his fag packet tactics too :D