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Thats Scotland qualified for that too :beers:  :mrgreen:

Yipee.

You might not be so shit in 5 years time then :D

You might be though, seeing as you finished bottom of a group including Northern Ireland :mrgreen:

Saying that last time we were in the European u19s we won it and half of that team were never heard of again! :-))(

The foreign invasion has a lot to answer for PM.  I wonder how it'll effect England's national team in years to come.

On a side note it's good to see Gordon Strachan buy scots, the Celtic supporters must be wondering what's going on with all the local lads playing for them instead of a foriegn legion.

They're still robbing bastards though, having said that least they're not robbing cunts like Rangers.

All our decent youngsters go straight into the full team these days

What? like Theo??? :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Well Rooney and Lennon are both 20 and under and they're already world class.

But the problem for you lot SiPie is that only a select few get into the first team and are regularly used at top class clubs.  A few years ago Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal, Spurs, Chelsea, Villa, we're all using British players, and these players were playing in cup finals, european matches etc.   Nowadays most of these clubs predominately use johnny foreigners with a couple of brits chucked into the mix.

The situation in Scotland is a lot worse, although as I say that may happen thanks to Gordon.

I wasn't going down the line of 'we're better than you' arguments. I've been saying for some time that Scotland are improving and I wouldn't be surprised to see them give some of the better teams a run for their money in the not too distant future.

However, I would recommend a jealous jock like yourself to reserve such piss taking to when this does happen. At the moment you look like a cock because you've got a wee bit of glory at a youth tournament.

My comment isn't aimed at you Jan btw

Its getting better in Scotland after the arse fell out of the transfer market. However the EPL will always be able to afford mickey mouse foreigners while the SPL teams are bringing through plenty of youngsters.

Graeme Taylor said it just after the world cup.... England could end up doing a Scotland if there isnt a reduction in the number of foreigners playing in england. Its one thing having top class players like Ballack or Shevchenko, but there is so many shite players that are no better that British players but they can get them on the cheap.

Aaron Lennon is not world class, come on, he's hardly featured for England, to be world class he needs to at least have an international asset or two under his belt.

Guessed that SP.

I do agree with STA about the amount of truely average foreigners playing in the premiership.

I watched Bolton v Pompey last season and was amazed at the lack of quailty on show, average foreign players passing to average foreign players, boring as fuck.  you just don't have any link to those kind of players.

Now I'm not saying if you tune into Killie v Livingston you'll be blown away by the talent on show.

awww come on pieman! its a bit of friendly banter!

 :wall:

Lennon just needs experience to be world class because he already has the talent. Totally agree about all the average foreigners in the premiership, not good for England at all.

I'd agree he's a talented footballer, however someone like Lee sharpe was regarded as highly as Lennon when he broke on to the scene in the 90's (hat trick v Arsenal) but look how he ended up.

I prefer to call players like Zidane, Beckham, Ronaldinho world class, as if you call players who have it to to prove, like Lennon, world class how do you describe these players?

To be honest I dont buy the "foreigners are ruining English football" arguement. Most of the current England squad have been involved with the national team set up though the ranks and have been earmarked by their clubs as potentail stars for years before we've even heard of them.

Avergage foreign players stop average young english players getting a game, and even so they just get loaned out anyway.

The cream always rises to the top.

Look at Carrick, Defoe etc

True about Lee Sharpe but Lennon's already played at the highest level in the world cup and he looked to have no problems playing at that level and outperformed players like Beckham and Gerrard even at 19 so unless he's hit by injury problems he should have a great future.

And Theo is a world class mascot in the making I tell thee  :old:

My mates son was actually one of the msacots at the world cup final! His escort didnt actually finish the game that night though :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Give it a rest ffs.

Oh and will you be coming to any Town games this season?, or do you need directions?.

Depends if I can afford it. Flights to the Ukraine, Georgia, and the Faroes are gonna wreak havoc on my finances this year! wont be going to the Reading game if Scotland get through to the final of the u19s but I will be coming  to a fair few this season though.

if you take our current squad as an example it seems to be helping. best set of players (admittedly not showing it in performance terms, but i'd partly blame sven for that) we've had for years and it coincides with the massive boom in foreign players over here.

You could argue that as the proof that it is hindering the team. Probably the best, most talented group of players that england have had for decades, yet they still cant compete.

From a Poland perspective (where the U19 tourney is being held), i reckon the Czechs will have too much in the tank for the Scots - but i guess stranger things have happened in football.   I'll be routing for the Scots tho  :beers:

Could have said that about Portugal and Turkey, and France in the Qualifiers.

Our current squad has a lot of overhyped players...most of whom aren't a patch on some of the talent we had even back in the 70's when we didn't qualify.....it was of course harder then as less teams.went to the finals.

 Too many foreigners etc will eventually as G Taylor has said will drain our resources, unless you somehow get lucky, or more of our young players look to make it abroad as say the French do.

  This side still, has Beckham and Neville, who were of the generation that Ferguson was forced to play in the Champions League by the 3 foreigners rule....so were given a kick start along with Butt and Scholes.

  Would they make it now?

how do you figure that one then?

i thought the original point was that foreign players hinder the development of english talent, when this is the best crop of players we've had for 30 years and they had to break through in spite of this alleged negative foreign influence.

it all reminds me of the old "all these foreigners taking our jobs" argument used by ignorant idiots.

so, how exactly did foreign players stop our national side from under-performing at the world cup? because they all had good seasons until it came to sven organising them all....

Completely agree Reg.  However, in your first paragraph you said less teams qualified.  That should really say fewer teams qualified.  Woo, I corrected Reg!

   A fool's brain digests philosophy into folly, science into superstition, and art into pedantry......GB Shaw.

I dont believe that Beckham and Neville for example became the players they are because of early champions league experience.

They became the players they are through hard work, profesionalism and good coaching.

By that logic you could pop Pook and Holgate into a champions legue side and in 5 years they'd be ace. :?

Once again I admit defeat to the great Reg Smeeton.  He knows more than any mere mortal could ever know.

 This is a good argument....no doubt players like Beckham get to where they are because of talent, yet because football is a relatively short career, getting opportunity in a strong side at a good level of competition is crucial....

 Frank Lampard was voted no 2 player in the world.....yet at WHU he looked no better than OK, it wasn't until going to Chelsea to play CL that he thrived.

 Nevertheless he'll probably go through an England career having played 1 WC and flopped in that.

 Sorry Doore, I didn't realise I was in a competition with you......what's the prize?

Natural talent will nearly always break through. ie Rooney. However you could argue that there are a number of very good english players over the years that never really got a chance because of teams rather going for a quick fix foreign import. So many players over the years have been hailed as the new great white hop, but never really get a chance.

Wasnt Nigel Quashie being hailed as the next big thing when he played for the england u21s?

Interestingly some of the best English players of our time have emerged out of West Ham, where the investment and realisation in youth talent is evident. So I do think the whole foreign argument is valid.

If you look at Spain they don't realise their full potential either. Italy aren't as bad because they seem to 'top up' italian playing talent with foreign stars. All but the exception of the biggest teams (one of which is buggered now). I think playing in the same league forges a bond as well (for the older players). That was a big contributing factor in Italy's win in the world cup I feel, perhaps England could emulate this?

At the end of the day we're a nation of bottlers.

OF said "it all reminds me of the old "all these foreigners taking our jobs" argument used by ignorant idiots"

No I'm not arguing about talented foreign players coming to our shores and playing for our top clubs I just think there are too way average foreigners plying their trade in the top flight (and Championship for that matter) which means the British players have less of an opportunity to play at the highest level.

Look at players like Paul Lambert and John Collins, both went abroad played at Champions League level and Scotland reaped the rewards.  Hopefully with Celtic playing more Scots and Gary O'Connor playing in Moscow the youngsters will get used to competing with the best and take that to the international level.

Well im hoping the Czechs win now as ive stuck a few notes on them to win the game today at evens money.   :D

thats true, but the foreigners wouldn't be in the side if they weren't better than the equivalent english talent.

i'd agree with some sort of capping whereby you're not allowed more than 5 foreign players in your matchday squad.

They are not better, just the same but cheaper.

i missed out the word "value" after "better"

Unfotunately we are in the realms of idealism versus realism.  Ideally clubs would buy the British option, but the foreign option is cheaper.  Therefore managers and Chairmen go for the cheaper option to protcect their clubs. Its the way the market works.  Its interesting that when a major tournament has recently been played that we talk about football in terms of whats good for the national game, but once the club season starts we will all be looking out for our own clubs once again.  For example, if Darren Bent is rated at ten million, it is likely you can pick up a similar player for half that, spend the other half on another decent player.  Any fan of their club would want to take the second option.

Fair play to Scotland.  They had too much grit and determination for the poor Czechs nd proved me wrong  :D

Shame Fletcher's out for the final though.

whats the point in having a good youth team then not winning fuck all at the major comps :?  :?

its all well celtic bringing scottish players through but its the level of opposition you play thats the downfall.playing kilmarnock etc will not help when it comes to playing champs league and national football and thats where scotland get caught out,as someone else said its no suprise that when lambert,collins etc moved and played a better level of football that scotland benefited

Too true, Was really happy when Gary O'Connor decided to go and try his luck at Lokomotiv Moscow. He is scoring goals, and the fans love him, especially after scoring against CSKA! :beers:

Isn't that a Double negative?  What's the point in not winning fuck all?  

Anyway, if everyone shared that thought what's the point in 90% of international teams playing football at all.  The next world cup may as well be a 5 team affair with Brasil, Germany, Italy, Uruguay, Argentina the only teams involved.

I didn't include the likes of France who could only win it in their own backyard.

As a Hibs fan I was gutted about Gary leaving but I suppose if it's good for Scotland it's good for me.  A worthy sacrifice.