Let's Get Political!

[Private Fraser]

I don't have any great hopes for today's discussions. Will probably just be a re-run of...

https://twitter.com/i/status/1070679248900362240

[Reg Smeeton]

You would like to think the potential wellbeing of the country but this is politics so Corbyn/Labour will want something for themselves out of it

Jeremy has shown throughout his political career that talking with people, however unpleasant, is always the best way forward... obviously Umunna excepted.

This is a national crisis and several figures like John Major have suggested that a National Government may be needed, particularly to get through the negotiations, after the WA is settled.

If it ended up in the lap of a Johnson for example.... it is very easy to see the tensions now manifest in society breaking out into something very, very unpleasant.

[chalkies_shorts]

In other news one of the main financial backers of Brexit bets on the pound crashing, must confess never saw that coming...... https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/09/09/hedge-funds-wager-3bn-pound-plunging-year-amid-no-deal-brexit/

As will remaining, money giving, foreign interfering Soros. To be honest, if you're in that game you'd be negligent not to make money out of it - its what they do, Brexit, Remainer, Agnostic.

[dogs]

I wouldn’t worry too much, we won’t be using the pound in the next decade anyhow and I’m sure when come the day we switch to the euro we’ll be shafted anyway.

This whole debacle should result in a final referendum, and it should be clear that:-

Leave = Leave means the UK leaves all EU institutions and everything associated to the EU to become a totally independent and sovereign state. Default onto WTO rules.

Remain = Stay in the EU, however we have a legally binding commitment to join the Euro, Schengen,  the rebate is phased out and a commitment to an EU army.

Get this thing sorted once and for all, because leaving on the terms presented, May’s deal or a soft Brexit will solve nothing.

Nobody could then argue how people decided to vote was an unknown quantity, nor that future risks were not considered.

[RobertT]

As I understand it, the EU "army" is not part of the EU membership, but instead a European style NATO effort that we were driving and are still looking to be a part of regardless of any type of Brexit.  Other than that, I agree.  Sadly I think the UK would still vote to leave if that was presented to them, but so be it.  It's not like I can complain having already jumped ship for a bit.

[Bogus Dave]

I wouldn’t worry too much, we won’t be using the pound in the next decade anyhow and I’m sure when come the day we switch to the euro we’ll be shafted anyway.

This whole debacle should result in a final referendum, and it should be clear that:-

Leave = Leave means the UK leaves all EU institutions and everything associated to the EU to become a totally independent and sovereign state. Default onto WTO rules.

Remain = Stay in the EU, however we have a legally binding commitment to join the Euro, Schengen,  the rebate is phased out and a commitment to an EU army.

Get this thing sorted once and for all, because leaving on the terms presented, May’s deal or a soft Brexit will solve nothing.

Nobody could then argue how people decided to vote was an unknown quantity, nor that future risks were not considered.

Why would that be the remain position, rather than ‘maintain our current standing and position in the Eu??’

Remain already has a simple, straightforward easy to implement and understand picture of the UK’s place. It’s the other side which haven’t got a fucking clue

[Combe Up]

Why would that be the remain position, rather than ‘maintain our current standing and position in the Eu??’

Remain already has a simple, straightforward easy to implement and understand picture of the UK’s place. It’s the other side which haven’t got a fucking clue

So those who voted remain (in the referendum on the EU) were actually voting for different version of remain?

[Bogus Dave]

No, they were voting to remain in the EU

I see your argument though, and get it to a point

But remaining in the status quo doesn’t fuck everything up

[pauld]

As will remaining, money giving, foreign interfering Soros. To be honest, if you're in that game you'd be negligent not to make money out of it - its what they do, Brexit, Remainer, Agnostic.

You've got a bit of a Soros obsession of late. Been reading too many far right FB posts?

[horlock07]

I wouldn’t worry too much, we won’t be using the pound in the next decade anyhow and I’m sure when come the day we switch to the euro we’ll be shafted anyway.

This whole debacle should result in a final referendum, and it should be clear that:-

Leave = Leave means the UK leaves all EU institutions and everything associated to the EU to become a totally independent and sovereign state. Default onto WTO rules.

Remain = Stay in the EU, however we have a legally binding commitment to join the Euro, Schengen,  the rebate is phased out and a commitment to an EU army.

Get this thing sorted once and for all, because leaving on the terms presented, May’s deal or a soft Brexit will solve nothing.

Nobody could then argue how people decided to vote was an unknown quantity, nor that future risks were not considered.

No idea what the point you are making is, there is no suggestion that to remain we have to join the Euron or Schengen (despite the bollocks being spouted by various discredited prominent brexiteers the opt outs last in perpetuity and there is no real evidence of any sort of EU Army?

[RobertT]

In fairness to Dogs (OP) - the path we should be on is for ever closer integration and that should include the currency aspect.  We, as a Nation, just keep putting it off.  I'd like a Vote for completely In or completely Out.  Stop pretending to people around the goals of the EU, and equally, show the people what being Out really means.  It's the constant half hearted pro-Europe efforts for a generation that have created the path for people want to get out, layered on top of that is the negative stuff, so the case for being IN has never been made.

[chalkies_shorts]

You've got a bit of a Soros obsession of late. Been reading too many far right FB posts?

I'm just trying to add a bit of balance to the argument where there has been talk of Russian interference and alleged but yet unproven provision of funds. Soros is doing the same for the Remain side. Similarly when there is talk of Brexiteers profiting from the pound, they will not be alone and I can't see Soros missing that opportunity having made a cool billion previously. I'm sure there are other foreign nationals providing assistance on both sides, its inevitable.
I just get a bit pissy that Brexiteers are the bad guys and Remainers are saints. Pieces of shit on both sides. Just trying to bring balance.
Also, not on facebook so haven't got a clue whats on there. If I was I'd as likely read Remainer stuff as equally. I like Ian Dunt's stuff Horlock has posted. I don't agree with his punchline but he's a very clever and engaging writer.

[horlock07]

You've got a bit of a Soros obsession of late. Been reading too many far right FB posts?

Thing is that most of the Soros stuff if you delve back into the detail comes from Hungary and his spat with Orban... The laziness of the reporting is shown by the fact that certain media outlets are still spinning this as a Soros donation to Gina Miller, despite her leaving the organisation involved way before Soros gave them a penny. But i suppose if one can link 2 of the bogeymen on the remain side, chances must be grasped.  

[chalkies_shorts]

Gina miller left the organisation just before or after the donation so there is clear water between them but it's undeniable he's donated approx £800k to remaining organisations.

[horlock07]

Gina miller left the organisation just before or after the donation so there is clear water between them but it's undeniable he's donated approx £800k to remaining organisations.

So less than 10% of the Banks donations from offshore (dubious legally to start with), ultimate sources unknown although there is a vodka smelling trail of diamonds?