Let's Get Political!

[Reg Smeeton]

As per Reg's suggestion above, if they had any honour or integrity they'd wait to see what the choices were for them to vote on, assess that against how their constituents voted and either vote in line with that or, if they felt unable to, stand down and offer themselves up for re-election at the earliest. Of course the killer clause there is "if they had any honour or integrity". Which they don't.

One pro Brexit Tory has jumped ship today....another 4 or 5 will make a GE inevitable.

[Ardiles]

Didnt hear that from Cameron, myself. I did Osborne though. Difference is, they didn't have those points as the basis of their campaign and also plastered on posters, in the background of speeches on tv and the sides of buses.

I think it's also fair to say that most commentators predicting a financial cost of Brexit are predicting that it will arrive after we have left, or at least after Article 50 has been triggered.  Stating the obvious, I know, but as of today, we're still in the EU - so the financial fall out has, so far, been restricted to what looks like a permanent fall in the value of the ££.

[horlock07]

Lovely to see even the BBC are trolling politicians now...

[suttonred]

Lot of waffling on this thread. A vote is a vote, and a decision is a decision right or wrong, and it doesn't matter how many airy fairy obstacles are planted, and histrionics, and foot stamps by financial types, and self interested politicos. If we don't go through with it wave bye bye to democracy as we know it.

[Posh Red]

If we don't go through with it wave bye bye to democracy as we know it.

So to play devils advocate, if the decision is deferred to our democratically elected parliament that signals the end of democracy.

[pauld]

If we don't go through with it wave bye bye to democracy as we know it.

Get what you're saying and I agree the referendum decision has to be implemented. But actually "democracy as we know it" is precisely the government and MPs ignoring the wishes of the people who elected them and doing what suits their interests best. Taking a decision by referendum and sticking to it, despite it being against the wishes of most of the elite in this country, would be a radical departure from democracy as we know it

[chalkies_shorts]

The decision is interesting. I don't have a problem with article 50 going through parliament. It will be interesting to see what mps do and if they vote against there may well be a backlash. We can't put our cards on the table though. Cameron really was a total fucking bellend.

[suttonred]

So to play devils advocate, if the decision is deferred to our democratically elected parliament that signals the end of democracy.

If they vote against, then yes. All in my opinion of course.

[chalkies_shorts]

If they vote against, then yes. All in my opinion of course.

And in my opinion also. They should rubber stamp the referendum not start dictating terms of leaving.

[suttonred]

And in my opinion also. They should rubber stamp the referendum not start dictating terms of leaving.

It's all a bit like losing a bet to your mates on a friday night, when you didn't do the fat bird. You know you agreed to it. but you couldn't pull the trigger. As much as you may bluff, everyone knows it will happen soon to save face. (does that make sense in pub and real  terms)?

[chalkies_shorts]

It's all a bit like losing a bet to your mates on a friday night, when you didn't do the fat bird. You know you agreed to it. but you couldn't pull the trigger. As much as you may bluff, everyone knows it will happen soon to save face. (does that make sense in pub and real  terms)?

Hopefully this is just a precudural correction rather than anything more. Vote done, let's get on with it. Surely if we trust our mps to enact article 50 then we should trust them to enact the terms of leaving. After all we trusted them to get us in and what what the EU became.

[suttonred]

Hopefully this is just a precudural correction rather than anything more. Vote done, let's get on with it. Surely if we trust our mps to enact article 50 then we should trust them to enact the terms of leaving. After all we trusted them to get us in and what what the EU became.

Yeah I agree, but you can never rule out self interest, and their little clubs, thinking otherwise..

[Ardiles]

MPs won't vote against, but they will at least now get a chance to scrutinise and to influence the shape of the exit.  As they should...because none of that was on the referendum ballot paper.

I'm sick of seeing pro-Leave politicians taking a 'winner takes all' approach...as if the 52/48 margin gives them carte blanche to target the extreme/'hard' form of Brexit.  There is no mandate for this.  When I hear 'the people voted clearly' - which happens a lot - I disagree.  A 52/48 margin is slim.  And at the very least, it signals that a 'soft' Brexit would sit much closer to the centre of gravity of thinking across the country.

Give parliament it's chance to test what's on offer.  Theresa May is going to come seriously unstuck if she ploughs on ahead as if there is complete support for getting the hell out, how ever & whatever the cost.  We're leaving, but now she needs to start listening to the country - all of it - about how that happens.

[THE FLASH]

MPs won't vote against, but they will at least now get a chance to scrutinise and to influence the shape of the exit.  As they should...because none of that was on the referendum ballot paper.

I'm sick of seeing pro-Leave politicians taking a 'winner takes all' approach...as if the 52/48 margin gives them carte blanche to target the extreme/'hard' form of Brexit.  There is no mandate for this.  When I hear 'the people voted clearly' - which happens a lot - I disagree.  A 52/48 margin is slim.  And at the very least, it signals that a 'soft' Brexit would sit much closer to the centre of gravity of thinking across the country.

Give parliament it's chance to test what's on offer.  Theresa May is going to come seriously unstuck if she ploughs on ahead as if there is complete support for getting the hell out, how ever & whatever the cost.  We're leaving, but now she needs to start listening to the country - all of it - about how that happens.

I do get your point but a margin is a margin however slim....fuck me, we've lost some games this season by one goal.

We were asked to vote in or out and the majority would decide.

The vote happened, which shocked me a bit.

52 is more than 48.... So that's the result isn't it?

I'm just as pissed off with the pro stay brigade bitching about what happened and questioning every decision thereafter.

It'll take another two years I reckon before we are fully out and the mess is sorted out.

I work in the food game and the Brexit impact (or rather...lets blame Brexit for prices going up) is starting to have a influence.

[chalkies_shorts]

We're leaving, but now she needs to start listening to the country - all of it - about how that happens.

Yep. All of the country. Inners and outers. Im very much hard brexit as id just rather be done with the fucking thing but if the best deal for the uk is soft brexit then so be it. The problem is twofold. We don't know what those sneaky fuckers in the eu are planning. Also you do not play poker with your cards on the table for all to see so actually wide consultation may actually not deliver the best deal for the uk but if it brings peace amongst us then again so be it.