Thetownend.com

Couple of interesting stories today.

First of all Julian Assange. Have to say I'm in favour of letting the bloke go to Ecuador, think he's in danger of being royally stitched up by us, the Swedes and the yanks. Also I believe these charges in Sweden have already been rejected in Sverige once, so why are they investigating again - haven't heard there's new evidence.

Second of all - Mr Nicklinson. Let the poor bastard die with some dignity. Yes we have to be careful to give people power to 'kill' someone, but his life must be terrible. On a case by case basis I don't see why the courts couldn't give the go ahead to let him slip away with family and friends close by.

Knowing how our government take it up the arse from the yanks at every possible opportunity, Assange would be on the first plane if we did get him into custody.

I have no opinion on Assange, but think Nicklinson should be allowed his wish to end his misery and suffering with dignity. His reaction to the verdict was heartbreaking.

agree with the above

You having a laugh?

Seriously why would an innocent man want to run to fucking Equador....if he has done nothing wrong then stay and face the music....like we all have to.

For me it just shows the ludicrous system at its best with regards Embasy's.....they should be for nationals of that country in distress.....what next,Al Quida popping into the Pakistan Embasy after one of there bombs was planted by someone else accidently on purpose.

If this guy is innocent then i suggest he stays around to prove it.

Fun fact of the day, Ecuador means equator in Spanish.

In the 1990's, Ecuador meant Sash! in Eurodance.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P86fPsC_cCQ

3 minutes of my life I can't get back.  :(

Wrong....drink less alcohol...eat more healthy....you should get them back.

If you want them that badly that is ;D

I think the sex assault charges have nothing to do with his fears.

Unless you're saying he should 'stay around' to try and fight the US authorities? In which case I'd say your advice isn't the best I've ever heard.

That's because he's being extradited to Sweden under the EU Arrest Warrant - you don't need new charges, in fact you can just make them up as has happened in the past

Keep up at the back.

EH?.....what is with all the anti USA bollocks.....like millions of us if he is wanted for a crime regardless of whether he is guilty or not you do it through the proper channels.

He dont have to fight anything....just answer the questions in a court of law......isn't that what democracy is all about.


I mean Equador's record on human rights is abysmal.....makes the US look almost angelic in fact.

And i wasn't giving him advice Jan....fact is a person who is innocent would not run away.....they would want to shout from the rooftops on how innocent they were....not squirm in a country that wouldn't know justice if it was thrown at them.

http://www.hrw.org/americas/ecuador

Not great reading so slagging the US off is rather rich in my book.

wtf????

Leefer

I think you need to do some googling.

'wikileaks' would be a good place to start.

 I've been waiting for the TEF debate about Assange...my gut instinct is that he's been set up, for daring to take on the US government. Our government will always roll over happily to help, that's realpolitik. I do though have a nagging doubt that Julian may not quite be the freedom fighter he seems.  Therefore I'm sticking firmly in the Pussy Riot camp when it comes to unequivocal support.

Jan....i am responding to your point.....that being we should allow this man to go to Equador?

He seems a bit of a tosser to be honest. By all accounts he's a horrible cunt.

Doesn't make it acceptable for the yanks to bully as they are though.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=wikileaks

In this case I disagree, which is why Assange has been desperate to stay here. Firstly Assange has a strong 'public interest defence' in the UK regarding his activities which would help his case, he has more sympathetic support here, the courts are in his language and Sweden has a worse track record in hindering extraditions to the US. This is why in my opinion they are using the EU Arrest Warrant, as a tool - which we cannot refuse - to remove him from this country in order to make his extradition to the US more likely

All good points...with this in mind political asylum in Ecuador might be a good solution.

I get that Leefer, but you debating whether we should let him go to Ecuador or not is a bit like having a debate on Hitler, and just focusing on his moustache.

It's not a matter whether we should let him go to Ecuador or not, but should we potentially hand him over to the yanks for them to dish out a bit of payback after his wikileaks exploits.

I applaud Ecuador for granting him asylum.

They are doing what we should be doing. A shame they'll be invaded be the yanks shortly.

Your point being what.....instead of being  patronising tell mr why the fuck do i want to wiki leak him for.....surely it just says what i am trying to get through to you.

OUR LAW STATES HE IS TO BE EXTRADITED.....FOR SOME REASON HE RUNS FOR COVER IN AN EMBASSY....SO FOR NORMAL PEOPLE LIKE ME I WONDER WHY OTHER PEOPLE WOULD SUGGEST THAT THE SWEDES,THE US AND THE BRITS WOULD STITCH THIS MAN UP......HE HAS STITCHED HIMSELF UP.

In a nutshell Jan explained he thinks Mr Assange should go to Equador...in a nutshell i dont.

I didn't make any reference to all the other claptrap....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Assange

The top paragraph gives no mention to wiki leaks.....he is to be extradited to Sweden to face sex crimes......am i wrong?

Leefer the argument is the sex charges are basically just an excuse to get him to Sweden. I have read they've already chucked those charges out once anyway.

Once over in Sweden the US will then apply to have him extradited to the US where the US authorities will have their dirty way with him.

As others have said I don't particularly like the bloke, but I object to a stitch up, and this feels like a stitch up, which is why I support his application to get to a safe haven - Ecuador - without fear of being turned over to the yanks.

He IS wikileaks

Yes, it does:

I'm amazed anyone actually thinks he'd get a fair trial in America. straight on the plane to Guantanamo Bay

I'm not sure you are up to speed with this Leefer.

Are you aware of what wikileaks is? This is a genuine question!

The most important fact is that these so-called "charges" were dropped by the Swedish authorities for lack of cause during their investigation to the girl's stories. Normally, for any one of us, that would be that. But SOMEONE pressured Sweden into re-opening the charges...anyone want to guess who? And anyone want to guess why the Swedes will not guarantee his non extradition to the US?

Shame on the Swedes as well.

but more shame on the yanks in the 'land of the free' for being such bullies.

just to clarify....

I don't mean wikipedia. I mean wikileaks.

Two very different things.

I agree Sie but you cannot change international law just because you THINK he wont get a fair crack of the whip.....but the facts are he had all opportunities to appeal to all the top courts...he failed.we the British who Jan reckons will stitch him up gave him bail.....no judge would give a person bail if there was stitching up to be done.

An Australian judge said Assange would have got ten years for hacking years back but because he had a bad childhood was given a slap on the wrist :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Hacking is best done with a sword....if you live by it then chances are you will die by it ;)

To be honest my point was that he has spent a lifetime or so it seems leaking official government records....a good thing in a lot of peoples eyes but then finds sanctuary in the Embassy of Equador....this great country with human rights issues that make us the Swedes and the USA look kind of friendly :D

Touch of irony there surely.

Correct Flasheart i get it.....but in my post to Jan so rudely interupted by you ;D i was talking about the sex case.....and nothing else......that is why Sweden want him extradited.....to face these charges.

You kinda dragged me into all the other stuff....which to be honest has been a real eye opener to me.

Law is law.....if Sweden want him back he goes back end of... whether you me or millions of others disagree or not......you cant just change the law when you feel like it....its just not British!

To anyone believing the Swedish rape tosh:

is there any reason why a Swedish Court could not sit in London (or even the Ecuadorean Embassy) ?

Sweden dropped the sex charges because they thought there was no case.

Do you think it's right the charges were reopened because the yanks want him?

It has fuck all to do with the sec charges Leefer. And the charges of 'rape' against him are because he didn't wear a condom. The women agreed to have sex with him but according to Swedish law, not wearing a condom could be considered rape. He raped nobody, he just didn't bag up. The prosecutor said that themselves.

The charges were dropped but reopened again after pressure from the yanks because he opened a few cans of worms. Now the yanks want him because he did something that they constantly claim to be fighting for the right for........ freedom of speech. Everybody has the right to freedom of speech, except when you say bad things about us. Hurrah for septic democracy.

It has fuck all to do with any sex charges. Do you think it right leefer that the yanks can bully and change the rules as they go along?

I don't know why we let ourselves get caught up in other countries shit.

Get Sweden to give guarantees they will return him to the UK or a country of his choice when they're finished with him and that under no circumstances will he be handed over to the US. If they give it, Assange can fuck off to Sweden. If they don't, Sweden can fuck off.

Worth pointing out he hasn't been charged with anything and at present they just want to question him. They've been offered the opportunity of coming over to the UK to do it, including at the embassy, and they've refused.

Just like none of those "terrorists" in Guantanamo have been charged and are only being held for questioning...

The Guardian says Julian Assange is accused of "serious sexual assaults". Not wearing a condom is not a crime in this country. Sweden it is. The two women were worried about catching the clap. They went to the police to see whether they could compel JA to take an STD test. The Police then said he would be charged with rape. One girl was distraught and refused to sign the statements she'd made. The other allowed JA to stay with her.

No two ways about it, it's a stitch up job.

Leefer - if you were wanted for questioning about a condom incident in Ecuador, after a dream holiday to the Galapagos and the Andes, would you be happy to go out there to answer questions  (just after the Ecuadorean Embassy officials had read your comments about their human rights being a bit shit ;))

I didn't mean it like that, I agree with you. Should have added....

It seems strange to me it's even possible to extradite someone just for questioning without there being any actual charges or an arrest warrant or whatever. Even stranger when they won't come to the UK to do the questioning, as they have in other cases - including a murder suspect.

But it really pisses me off that we have spent a fortune on this when it's not our problem. Isn't there now a couple of Police officers outside the embassy waiting to arrest him? Fucking ridiculous way to spend public money, should be telling the Swedes to pay for it or to fuck off.

I see most people have shied away from the more emotive news story of yesterday (myself included).

There was a professor of medical ethics on Radio 4 who said the judges had some flexibility with the laws as they stand but felt they made their decision on the hope that govt will revise the law so that there is much greater clarity.

Also the arguments that disabled people will be pushed/forced/bullied into following suit is ludicrous.

Agreed DP, the way to stop the pushed/bullied/forced into it would be easily stopped by insisting on a case by case review process. It's clear to see in this case (as others have gone on before) that the individual here wants to end his awful existence. Feel extremely sorry for the bloke but I feel even more sorry for him that the law of the land has stopped him from putting himself out of the misery.

 Pussy Riot got 2 years in some Gulag then....I wont be giving up vodka by way of protest.

I'm pro-choice when it comes to all matters of the body. I believe the state should have no say in what I do to my own body.

That's the point though Nicklinson can't do anything to end his own life except starve to death. Hardly dignified.

 :D

However harsh it may seem, you cannot make the law of the land on a single case or even a case by case basis.  And the issue here, apart from the most dreadful suffering of a particular man and his family, with which no-one could do anything but sympathise, is that there are much broader issues for society as a whole - not least that the whole medical profession's self-understanding is based on the duty to preserve life not to end it.  I confess I have mixed feelings about such a fundamental ethical change , and would certainly expect a very full debate in Parliament and beyond before any such change were made.

The big problem if you legalise assisted suicide is that it will be open to abuse. It's alright when you see high profile cases which probably the majority think should be allowed without fear of prosecution, but what about the borderline cases? What if someone is forced in to it? What if they haven't really thought it through? And so on.

I'd like to see a system put in place where an application could be made, say to the Home Secretary or the House of Lords, and the right people would make the decision. If it was approved those assisting (family members, doctors, nurses) the suicide would be given immunity from prosecution for that case only. Not perfect but it would work and allow the most serious cases through.

I think his wife should just help him; there is no way any judge would hand down a custodial sentence, and it seems clear they will not effect the change in law they require.

I think im right in saying that if Tony decides to starve himself the doctors would be powerless to prevent him doing so and would have to stand by and watch him die a slow and painful death. I would also imagine  he has been granted a DNR ( Do Not Resuscitate ) order which again would prevent them from attempting any CPR once his heart failed so it seems in some ways that he will be allowed to die but to me in a less dignified way.

Winnie Johnson, mother of Keith Bennett, passes away, never found her son.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-19305055

Two brothers re-united after two years apart showing their joy at being re-united;

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-19281347

Except of course they're gorillas. Things like this make me question whether we should be treating primates with so many human like qualities as animals or humans. Really doesn't seem right keeping them in cages.

I can understand why some really endangered animals are kept in captivity for breeding programmes but most wild animals That are kept in cages/captivity are for our pleasure and not theirs which I don't agree with.

They called a Gorilla 'Alf'

I dont understand why the fella with locked in syndrome doesnt just go to dignitas in switzerland. Perhaps he could say his goodbyes with family etc and then be put on a plane to the clinic. From what i have read, he does'nt actually want to die with immediate effect, he just wants to decide when he feels its time to go. its a dificult one i know.
As for pussy riot, imagine the Saturdays jumping around westminster abbey and vandalising crosses and the like. im not religious, but i think that would be punished over here. Singing anti Putin songs shouldnt be punshed though! Note to the saturdays...i'd love it if you went to westminster abbey shaking your arses while calling Cameron a cunt...just dont break owt!!
As for Assange...i just think he is a bit of a twat. Freedom of speech is one thing, but hacking Dept of Defense computer systems and releasing potentaily damaging military info and intelligence into the public domain is a bit of a daft thing to do...   

From an interview I saw with his daughters the bloke doesn't really want to go to Switzerland to die, I think he wants to do it in his own home, own country.  I do get what you mean though, I'd have thought it'd be an option.

He specifically said he didn't want to go to Switzerland to die in "the middle of an industrial estate".

Mother of Keith bennett dead. Where was that cunt Derek acora and co when she needed them?

Think helping someone is still against the law in the UK even if it happens abroad. So if he went to Switzerland, who ever helped him would still be liable for prosecution.

Leave the trip til winter, then his wife could say she was taking him skiing or toboganning?

Could'nt help but laugh at that arriba... :clap:

Not technically accurate... unless its all been a wind-up?

I can see why and thought it night be misinterpreted but I was serious.someone desperate for answers never got them.

Sunday trading hours could possibly be extended, really don't agree with this, let the shop workers have some habitual time off ffs. I really don't think there's the need for a relaxation in the rules.

Assange wise, could be an interesting hour or so, statement from Ecuador's embassy coming up...

I'm not bothered about Sunday hours in truth, but what a fascinating example of 'mission creep': "no it'll be temporary, honest, only for the Olympics trust me, no plans at all to extend it permanently...well actually as it's been a success and there's a recession on...etc"

Was the temporary extension for around London only?

Nope

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17419351

Did anywhere around Swindon take advantage of it?

Isn't the main argument against Sunday opening to do with the Church objecting as they think numbers will dwindle? Turns out it is anyway. Also, if a "believer" decides they'd rather go shopping than to a service then that says it all!

Notice our local Co-Op (Exeter) is now open from 7am - 11pm on Sundays. That's the only shop I've noticed though.

What's people's views on gay marriage? See Cardinal O'Brien is up to his old tricks and has suspended direct communication with Salmond and the SNP over it.

Personally, I'm all for it. After all, why should the Church be permitted to discriminate against a population? No one would stand for it if they said Black people couldn't marry in churches.

Sunday trading hours are nothing to do with the church with me, just I think it's still good to have a period of time that let's most people have sometime to themselves. There's no real need for shops to be open Sunday evening. Although having said that I hear loads of people work in Asda Sunday evening filling shelves, getting ready for the Monday, so I suppose that blows my argument out of the water  - especially as the Mrs has done the weekly shop on Sunday evenings for the last 3 weeks.

I don't see why gays would want to take part in a ceremony borne out of a religion which at the centre of its ethos is intolerant of homosexuality. I'd have thought gay Christians would have abandonned the religion and settled for civil partnerships, given that what they believed in was opposed to their lifestyle choices.

Simplistic and error-strewn, but that's my 30 second opinion on this news story! :)

I just feel that if the trend for Gay marriage continues then in around a million years time there wont be people being born anymore....the world will end :eek:

Do they actually want to?

I thought the issue was that if same sex marriages were made totally legal and on a par with 'normal' marriages then the Church would be powerless to say no to them. With the risk I guess that people would do it just to piss them off.

I'm not sure about it all myself. I'm all for equality but I question whether it is right to be able to force your views upon others. If your opposed to homosexuality, surely you shouldn't be forced to have them in your Church and marry them? Same for if you run a B&B. As long as there isn't any nastiness I don't see the problem in people being able to say no.

Extended trading hours are ace, I prefer shopping in the evenings and the supermarkets are busier than you'd think.

If you are against homosexuality because of a Christian religious view, then I think you should be taking the rest of Leviticus seriously as well.

Some of my personal favourites are the bits about women. IE, if a woman is raped and doesn't scream loud enough for a man to hear and come to her rescue then she should be put to death by stoning.

A mentruating woman is against god, don't look at a menstuating woman, children who curse at thier parents are as bad as homosexuals and adulterers, hadicapped people may not approach the alter, and apparently, God is down with owning slaves.

All this from the same book.

So in summary, if you don't believe in homosexual marriage you must believe in the rest of that stuff to be a 'true Christian.'

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/lev/intro.html

 Fun couple of days on the Assange front...firstly Julian delivers his speech from the balcony of the Ecuadorian Embassy, very much in the style of Mr Hilter from a Minehead B and B all those years ago. Then Occupy London can't decide whether to back Assange and protest outside the Embassy, or just condemn Assange and back Wikileaks...all very People's Front of Judea.

Now Georgeous George has waded in with his tuppence worth, that you can't rape a bird who's asleep in the morning, if you gave her one the night before and that was OK.

I just love the irony of Ecuador looking after a person on the grounds of his human rights :D

That's not even the worst comment about rape of the past 24hrs, some Yank Republican claimed that if a woman is truly being raped her body can shutdown so they can't become pregnant.

It's amazing that shit like this is being spouted in the 21st Century.

Interesting that Gorgeous George's comments have been hidden away down the Guardian's website

http://www.guardian.co.uk/

I think the Cardinal is objecting in principle rather than to any suggestion the church would be forced to conduct gay marriage.  He is wrong whatever...and I'm sure Salmond is writhing in desperation at the threat from O'Brien to cut off direct communication, and only talk through officials.  Who does he think he is? The Queen?

I'm not sure if you're suggesting the Guardian is somehow supporting George's views, but they do have this piece from a feminist perspective.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/aug/21/julian-assange-rape-denial

Tony Nicklinson dies at his home in Wiltshire. RIP.

Tony Nicklinson died this morning... it's sad, but I can't help feel he's better off now, as he wished.

Hopefully he's now got the peace he so desperately wanted. 

Part of me hopes that no one else was involved but another hopes there was so that it goes back to the high court and the judges rule on this. 

As the doctor has now signed the death certificate stating Tony died of natural causes the police have said neither they or the coroner will be involved. RIP Tony.

Venomous spiders found in Swindon family's home

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-19420894 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-19420894)

Our house in Highworth is full of these but I've never been bitten (yet!).

Very interesting thread. Personally, if I find out Reg has started voting Tory, then I'll start throwing stuff at him next time he ignores me in the co-op.

Also first up against the wall and all that.

I said hello to you just the other day....might have been the shock of the apparent presence of a young lady in your company.

Description and opinion needed immediately

Did anyone not think it was a little odd Nicklinson died so soon after the verdict?

Not really, considering he stopped eating as soon as he found out he lost.

An eighteen year old girl out celebrating her birthday with friends in Lancaster on Thursday night drank a Jagermeister cocktail made with liquid nitrogen for effect had to have emergency surgery to remove her stomach to save her life.
Have never had one and don't think I'll be ordering one anytime soon, sounds horrendous ! Anyone else had one?

People were getting them in Manchester on Saturday, despite being absolutely fucked I was not getting one of them.

Wait....

Liquid nitrogen? Really?

Yeah, my wife told me about it so just read about it on the Telegraph site.

Horrendous.

Obviously something went wrong, did the liquid nitrogen normally just evaporator?. I'm not even sure how that could ever be safe, not that you always think of these things when pissed.

It says at the end of the article that there are numerous cocktails around at the moment made with liquid nitrogen but should never been ingested?! The bar that served the drink to the girl say the cocktail was made properly.

I like a drink (no shit sherlock) but why the fuck would you drink liquid nitrogen?!

I assumed it was common sense that, that shit is really fucking cold so drinking it would be a bad idea!

I'll stick to cheap ass beer

Liquid nitrogen should turn to gas at room temperature. I'd imagine drinking pure liquid nitrogen is very small quantities would be 100% fatal!

Not sure what happened here though, I guess it would only take a drop to fuck you up. Not sure that is possible/what happened mind.

I read about this for a couple of days before I realised that it happened in Lancaster in a bar about 5 minutes from home.

Interestingly up here all the local rags have not named the bar (although about 5 secs on google finds it), Oscars has only been open a very short while (used to be The Varsity) and I cannot see it being open much longer.

A very strange thing although Lancaster is absolute carnage at the moment as all the students have just returned so I wonder whether its linked to that?

A two year old was given Whiskey instead of juice today by the staff at a frankie and bennys in Swansea. His mum said he had almost finished probably a double measure before she noticed her son was pulling faces whilst sipping the whiskey. The manager apologised and the toddler was taken straight to hospital (falling asleep on the way) and was kept for observation and released later. What sort of people work in these fast food places.

I'd hardly call Frankie & Benny's fast food, but take your point. I'm somewhat disappointed that I actually only received a diet coke when I went there for lunch today. Not in Swansea for the record. And to be fair, it was what I'd ordered.....

It shouldnt, but that made me laugh

apparently the drinks order was mixed up so someone would of been disappointed they got a lime and water and not a double whiskey.

I think there's more to that whiskey story.

I've seen grown adults retch when drinking spirits. For many it's an involuntary action to throw up yet a 2 year old just 'whinces'. Nah! And if a kid that young doesn't like the taste of something they just won't fucking eat it. they'd throw it on the floor.

Could be a compensation claim job I suppose, pretty hard core drinking whiskey through a straw.

Ca-Ching.

Reminds me of the time the hunch back of Notre Dam went for a drink and asks for a double whiskey....Bells allright enquires the barman?
Mind your own fucking business replies the hunch back.

He sounds a bit of a grouse

The smell of whiskey makes me sick. Whilst it obviously doesn't have that affect on all adults I found it hard to believe a 2 year old would have been able to neck a double - it would have tasted like cats piss to them.

I made the mistake of giving adult toothpaste to my youngest when he was one.  I'll never forget the bewildered look of disgust on his face as he attempted to scrape the stuff off his tongue with his fingernails.  Whisky?!  No chance.  One sniff of that from a toddler and they would hit the roof.

Whiskey is one of the more drinkable spirits.

It was diluted with half a pint of water so should be no problem for someone (albeit a child) from the valleys.

Whisky, it's whisky. Whiskey is the Irish version (or sometimes used for Bourbon but let's not even go there) and apparently this was Scotch.

the winner of this years Nobel Peace Prize has been announced today:

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/nobels_fredspris/1.8355716
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/oct/12/nobel-peace-prize-2012-live

fucked. up.

The Peace Prize doesn't seem all that relevant any more.  Giving it to the EU, an organisation that seems to be tearing itself apart as we speak, is hilarious.  Didn't Barack Obama win it a few years ago, after he'd been in office for no more than a few months?

 :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Winning the prize for "its efforts to promote...democracy in Europe" by an institution that from the very outset, and by its own admission by its founding fathers, is designed to do precisely the opposite.

This news firmly comes under the category of; "you couldn't make it up".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-19976841

Worrying developments in Greece.

At least some Greeks are thinking outside (or maybe inside?) the box to beat the economic hardship

http://msn.foxsports.com/foxsoccer/world/story/greek-club-voukefalas-sign-sponsorship-deal-with-local-brothel-giannis-batziolas-club-president-092712

That's seriously scary.

That's no way to drink whisky - no wonder the toddler became grouchy and abusive

Halliwell admitted guilt in sian murder. Should be sentenced today

Good is not the right word, but at least it spares Sian's relatives and friends a dragged out trial.

He got life.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-20003058

6 months in prison for interrupting the boat race. Seems a tad harsh!

not surprised that prisons are overpopulated

Seems the cunt has got off with the other murder and the bloke who led the investigation has been suspended

its fucking shocking, at least the cunt is inside

That's ridiculous... being jailed for Tweets, offensive t-shirts, and peaceful protest isn't something that should be happening in a supposedly democratic and civilized country.

It was the boat race though, wasn't it? If he had ran on a football pitch he would've got a fine (if that) by the courts. But because it affected some upper class henrys he gets banged up.

One posh bloke gets banged up for disrupting another posh bloke's boat race.

Ironic that you should use that example, bearing in mind tonight's game.

I wonder what sort of sentence the Leeds fan will get for running on the pitch & assaulting Kirkland?

200k fine and 4 game ban

being forced to be an oxford fan for all eternity

The Leeds fan was a knob, but he doesn't deserve that

What the hell happened in Cardiff yesterday? Some dick going on one with a van, killing 1 and injuring 12 others.

There has been increasing coverage in the media recently of companies that are legally avoiding paying UK taxes. Amazon, eBay, Facebook, Google and Starbucks have all been featured though there are obviously lots more doing the same - Apple and Microsoft for starters.

They all use the same trick - pushing sales and profits through other EU countries with lower tax rates (Ireland, Luxembourg and Holland). So Amazon UK doesn't actually sell anything, they're just a "distribution provider". Starbucks pay licensing fees to other related companies and buy all their coffee beans from Switzerland and have them roasted in Holland.

Other than losing the tax man a substantial sum of money every year (at least £500m a year from the companies above) it's taking money out of the UK, taking jobs out of the UK, reducing investment in the UK and putting UK companies out of business.

Reckon time is running out for them as the pressure will force the government to do something. Though you have to question why they haven't acted before now, reckon their links to big business are just as corrupting as their media links.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-20022365

We are all in this together. Except big multinationals, obviously.

I agree Johnny, its legal so why wouldn't they? Time for the Government to have a look at it.

I love the irony of a BBC report on tax avoidance

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/bbc/9588020/How-Jeremy-Paxman-blew-lid-on-BBCs-complicity-in-tax-avoidance-pay-deals.html

I still don't understand how they are allowed to do that (push their salary through a limited company) as there was a new tax law (IR35) introduced in 2000 that was designed to specifically put an end to it. But probably shouldn't be surprised that civil servants and the BBC have found a way round it, all parts of the Government that wrote the legislation.

Boycott them. Simples. I do wherever I can. For example I iwll not buy Argentinian wine. The more that stupid woman critisies us for claiming the Falklands as British and sabre rattles the less likely I am to buy their wine or other goods.

It is about time we tried harder to buy from friendly countries and home produced good where possible.

I do the same with Israeli produce, refuse to buy goods from that country.

I have no issue with Argentina at all, so happily enjoy their wine.

more people need to boycott israel.

I do that too!

You boycott the BBC??

Who are these friendly countries of which you speak?

If I like something I don't care where it's from.

I boycott the X-Factor and Strictly come dancing but that shit is still polluting the airwaves.

I just buy the cheapest version of the product in question.

Though that could be because I am A. A student and B. a massive cheapskate

I don't watch the news as it's far too depressing but I must admit I find this pretty reprehensible. How can the Government who are supposed to be acting in our best interests let them get away with it?

They're in it for themselves. They're cunts. Or both.

Both probably fits the bill

Technically what they are doing is legal, though there is maybe a question over them artificially inflating the prices they pay to other parts of the same company for services and products. So Starbucks pay an inflated price to their subsidiaries for the beans and the rights to use the Starbucks name and branding - moving the actual profit to those subsidiaries. Which may be illegal and some companies are being investigated over this.

I'd argue the real problem is with the Governments that set ridiculously low tax rates and the EU for letting them. Not sure it helps their economies in the long term, they are just giving money away to the big corporations and taking it from other countries. Take Ireland for example, it didn't help them avoid needing a hand out and the countries that bailed them out (the UK and the richer EU countries) are the very ones they are basically stealing from. I'd have told them to go fuck themselves.

Apple are pretty bad for this, even in the USA. If a state wants them they have to give grants and discounted tax rates. Once they've got them and setup the operation, Apple then divert their profits to places they can pay even less tax. If a state questions their behaviour Apple threaten to up sticks and go elsewhere. Of course if the states got together they could stop Apple from doing this, make them pay more in taxes to the benefit of everyone. Except everyone just thinks about themselves.

Presumably you're not suggesting that the unelected EU should tell countries how to set their own tax rates? As for Ireland they were fucked by joining what is essentially a flawed currency

They already do - there is an EU minimum VAT rate of 15%.

On the flip side Starbucks will have paid loads of taxes in the form of VAT and Employers' National Insurance contributions.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20091472

What a great idea, let's raid pension funds and use the money to build houses!

Then when house prices finally correct, not only will a lot of people be in negative equity they won't have a pension either. Genius!

This beggars belief.

The pension funds are not an asset of the council.

Architects in saying people should emply them more shocker.

I agree with the general point that pension funds should not be used for something like this.  But responding to the secondary point about house prices, they have been correcting now for some time.  In real terms (ie adjusted for inflation, which has let rip during the double dip), they are something like 20% below the 2007 peak.  Even when compared to average earnings which, obviously, have not kept pace with inflation, the house price/average earnings ratio has fallen back towards the historical average.  Not sure there is much more of the correction still to come - barring another blow up/Euro collapse etc.  Prices also being supported by a massive undersupply of new homes and very low interest rates - neither of which are likely to change any time soon.

Agree with you entirely about the values vs. inflation, but I do not believe there has been a proper correction. There is a very large negative equity bubble forming. When that bursts property will not be able to sustain it's capital value.

Its nothing new. Governments raided the royal mail profit pot for years to fund other things then said there's no money left and the public swallowed it blaming the postmen's greed-lazyness.

But the trend from the last 3 to 4 years has reversed.  Instead of borrowing more against their homes (as they did during the bubble years), homeowners are now paying down mortgage debt faster than the banks are making new loans...assisted by rock bottom interest rates.  There are always going to be those at the margins who lose out but, across the general homeowning population, I'm pretty sure that the negative equity situation is getting better, not worse.

No, it's increasing year on year according to JPMorgan's latest guide.

Some examples below showing % of mortgages in negative equity, year on year (2010 to Q4 2011):

North West 10.1% 11.5%
North East 7.2% 11.9%
West Midlands 5.0% 8.2%
South West 2.1% 4.9%

Then I stand corrected!

 I was interested in reading today that HM Government has politely turned down US soundings, about their using our bases on Diego Garcia, Ascension Island and Cyprus for a pre-emptive strike at Iran nuclear facilities...apparently it might be illegal.

Nevertheless, the Israelis will have no such scruples....Obama or Romney  :suicide:

They can keep their dirty robbing hands off our pensions, how about filling the 720,000 empty fucking houses first . idiot wankers.

I'm looking forward to a triple dip recession!

Unless we can organise another Olympics, it's coming!  Run to the hills (again).

Sorry if it's been mentioned but was just reading about Peter Ndlovu being in a critical condition after a car crash in Zimbabwe early this morning. His brother, also an ex pro was killed along with a female passenger. I remember Ndlovu playing for Coventry and I think Huddersfield. Hope he pulls through. Sounds like a real nasty accident.
Edit: forgot he also played for Sheff Utd & Birmingham who bought him from Cov for £1.6M
Just saw a picture of his crashed  BMW X5, What a mess but the good news is he is now in a more stable condition.