Thetownend.com

Why the uproar? Its a political party and I for one was shocked they are only standing in pinehurst/gorse hill.

Your views.......

They make some valid points...

They are cunts.

I think they have a good chance in pinehurst though.

why are they cunts yeovil?

See the news today reckons 25% of the public would now seriously consider voting for them.

because they're a racist and fascist 'political' party.

or maybe ive been listening to too much billy bragg

That's as a stupid a sweeping statement as saying Blair's Labour...

and you're a cunt

:roll:

Never mind

Bloody good debate this, no valid reasons!

I wouldn't ever vote for them but i can understand why people in places like Oldham have done.

i don't understand why people can't accept the fact they're racist and fascist.

if you want to vote bnp (not that you can vote, hoho) then that's fine by me, after all we do live in a democracy... for the time being at least.

billy brag talks shit whoever he is. the other parties are trying so hard to make them think that there solely a rascist party, not the case, national front yes, BNP no. the other parties are just scared of them and the english public getting a say against immagration, i for one would vote for them if there was someone standing in my area

sure i'll be deemed rascist for that as thats the way this country is  going, say anything and your racist, but just don't want the cunts coming here and living of my taxes

The BNP is racist from top (Griffin is one of many of the scummers to have convictions for racist crimes, in his case inciting racial hatred) to bottom. Even their constitution explicitly forbids non-whites from even being members. Not racist?  :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:  :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

May be contraversial, but terrorists acts like 7/7 are more likely to swing more voters in their favour. Or am I just being naive?

you say that then condemn anyone who accuses you of being racist. how exactly does that make any sense whatsoever?

i don't care if you're a racist or not, you're entitled to think what you want but at least be honest about it.

How many suicide bombers are from other religions?

I rest my case.

the japanese used kamikaze pilots, they weren't muslims.

same difference

True, i mean modern day though.

Why SY is going about racism...I found out yesterday that kids in schools aren't allowed to sing baa baa black sheep in schools anymore as its deemed racist. They now need to sing Baa Baa Rainbow sheep.

WTF!!  :x

No. Say black people "should go back where they came from", even if their 3rd or 4th generation British, and people will call you a racist.

That's because those are racist opinions. The people that hold them are racists. Political parties advocating repatriation are racist political parties, and the people that vote for them are racists or fucking idiots.

You get to choose which one of those to be.

Twat.

 :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

Thats ridiculous!

What next? rainbow pudding with your fry up?

Erm, the Japanese kamikzae pilots (surely the first suicide bombers) were largely Shinto, at least one of the Lebanese terrorist groups which first deployed suicide bombings were Syrian-backed socialists, and the Tamil Tigers are secular (ie non-religious) but have often clashed with the Muslim population in areas they control. That's off the top of my head, like.

Political correctness is a load of wank. I'm sure j1mmy will agree with me.

You are like a walking encyclopedia Paul  :mrgreen:

Or for example, launching a manifesto that proposes segregating schoolchildren. Like the BNP just did. Because they're racists.

Actually, more like a walking cure for insomnia  :D

political correctness - which is absurd in it's own right - has precisely fuck all to do with racism and fascism.

Well not fascism obviously.

I think anyone who votes for the bnp should be deported. I don't want my taxes helping to pay for those cunts to live in my country.

Is that actually true or is it just a load of crap. I remember people saying how you couldn't use the word christmas in shops in case other religions got offended.

Total bollocks though, every shop was using the word christmas as much as ever.

it's true but it was only in one school i believe.

It's interesting the way the phrase "politically correct" has evolved in it's meaning over the years.

Back when I was younger, and a hard-core lefty, to be politically correct was about supporting the right political positions (basically being a revolutionary).

As all the Labour party careerist wankers have moved to the right, they've turned it into just being about the kind of language you use. Until you get to the ridiculous bollocks about baa baa blacksheep etc.

I'd go off into some boring ramble about post-modernism, and the development of a european left that focused almost exclusively on language and the media, largely arising from the failed Paris uprising in '69, but I can't be arsed.

If you want that it's all to be found in the rather marvellous "Against Post-Modernism - A Marxist Critique" by Alex Callinicos who's quiet switched on for an ultra-left, semi-Trotskyite State-Cap.

Tis right. But I think its spreading...most schools now need to cover their backs as they don't want to get sued...

Only if the voters are fucking retarded though. Isn't that a bit like blaming all whites for all the people killed because of Hitler because Hitler was white.

No Hitler was German and everyone hates them.

yes and hitler was a racist fascist, as are the BNP, who are the political wing of the national front. anybody who supports the views of this party are either ignorant or have been given misinformation.

anyone here watched band of brothers? or Saving Private ryan? my grandfather and millions like died for the world we live in today. they were fighting fascism, german fascism, there is no difference between the rhethoric of british nationalism and the goals preached by adolf hitler.

if you support the BNP you may as well as stand and seig heil, and actually think what that austrian cunt did 60- odd years ago before any fucker gives me a glib response.

Oh yeah another thing.

I'm fucking sick of this liberal bollocks about everyone being allowed to have an opinion, including the fascists, otherwise it's not fair or democratic.

Fuck off you Fucking morons!

How fucking democratic do you think facism is? Read a bit. Try to cram just a few simple facts about the matter into your thick fucking heads before you come on hear and start bleating about democracy.

How many elections do you think there were from the time Hitler took power in Germany to the time he topped himself in a bunker?

I'll give you a clue, it's the same number there were in Italy from the Bennie took over to the time he found himself hanging from a lampost.

My attitude to the BNP can be summed up by the 2 stories; the funniest things I've ever seen:

It's about 10 years ago, just after the Stephen Lawrence murder, and the BNP have been making a bit of a name for themselves.

They  therefore decide to start a "paper-sale" on Brick Lane. Effectively an excuse to stand in a largely Asian area and spit at and verbally abuse bengali women as they do their shopping.

After the first week there's a counter demonstration every time they come. This quickly turns into a stand off between the 2 groups with the coppers in the middle.

Now the lefty group I was involved with at the time happened to have a fair group of young white lads, including a fair few skins. It didn't take much for a group to separate out and arrive a bit after the rest. No papers, no badges, a quick chorus of Land of Hope and glory and the police are guiding you into the Nazi side of the line.

Never knew what fucking hit them. Didn't come back either. And no-one got more than a caution for affray. Lovely. :D

The same year the bastards turned up on memorial day in London as they do each year without a trace of fucking irony, (at least they don't wear the jackboots). The counter-demonstration was, as always, surrounded by police, and a few of them clearly got cocky.

"Safe" behind the police lines, a small group of skinhead patriots decide the best way to honour those that died in the last war is to form into two ranks and deliver a series of Nazi salutes to the now fucking seething anti-nazi crowd.

What they didn't notice was they'd formed up outside a branch of McD's which at the time contained the entire Glasgow Pollock branch of Militant (the Wege's love their burgers). One minute they were there giving it the straight arm, the next they disappeared beneath a sea of kicking, rucking West of Scotland Trots.

Laughed 'til I fucking cried.

this is where voting for the BNP will lead you to, lets not fuck about this is there ultimate agenda

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c116/mexicored/crocamp1.jpg

spot on mex.

Surely though, at a time when out nation is divided on so many issues, a bit of race hate would be exactly what we need unite the nation. There's nothing like a common enemy to bring people together. personally however I'd skip over asians and blacks - far to many of them, bit too much like hard work. Jews lack originality having been done enough times. It's blatently all about  creating a new minority. I like the idea of people who were born in March. Those fucking marchies taking places in our over-crowded schools, stealing our taxes. should round them up into labour camps. or sommin.

Marchies are superior.

We will wipe out the rest of the year scum.

If you don't like the people that live in this country, whatever the reasons, you should fuck off out of it yourself instead of chucking others out.

Yet more words of wisdom from mex. Mex is the new Reg (erm, with apologies to the current incumbent)

what a thick fuck you are.bet you believe everything you read in the sun!
without the immigrant doctors and nurses, our nhs system would be even more fucked than it is now.

after having a gander at the BNP website - it's their idea to redeploy all the overpaid civil servants as customs and immigrations officials which sums it up for me - fucking lunatics

oh, by the way Paddy, piss off back to Ireland!!!

Personally I will always vote condervative, however politics is about opinion.  I hate the fact a lot of people come over to this country with no intention of working?!?! Thats what annoys me, also I believe in looking after your own first.  If that makes me racist then I will live with it.

What is your own though?  National boundaries are made-up, by the use of sticking flags in a bit of land (very simplistic I know).  I support my local area and by that, my country on the basis of the fact that it's a community I am part of.  However, who is to say who should and shouldn't be in that community.

Race is a misnomer anyway, it doesn't really exist as their is only one race in the world of human beings - Homosapiens, as far as I am aware.  We see difference due to skin pigmintation and beliefs and people use these to produce fear, the BNP do just that.

Lets not forget Christian Fundamentalists are just as bad (only they manage to run countries of democracy so get away with bombing other people) - said a little tongue in cheek but sections of the Bible belt in the US still refuse to teach Evolution.

Anyhow, I won't be voting (mainly because I forgot to complete the registration form), but if I was, BNP would be right down the bottom of the list below the Monster Raving Loony Party.

By own I mean speak the countrys language make an effort, contribute to the economy etc.  Im not a religious person, my own belief is that no matter how many time you pray etc life plays you a hand.  How many priests/vicors die etc? if religion meant anything these people wouldnt get ill.

I dont care what colour people are or what race but when there in england I would like them to work etc or attempt to work.

Actually that's not a bad idea   :D

Immigration are always desperate for officers and resources.

i'd hazard a guess at all of them?

anyway it's too easy to be racist, it's so ironic its unreal. like mex said, people preach about patriotism and nationalism but then they zieg heil?! errrrrrrrr hang on a sec...

Come on dex your the most racist person on here and you know it

i'm not racist. i just hate the white cunts that ran me out of my farm. bastards  :(


errr zeig heil  :? that'll show them

and this is what relying on the three main political parties will lead us to/has lead us to.

http://www.aldunya.net/Images/London%20bombing.jpg

If you think that wouldn't happen under BNP you are deluded.

this whole polictical correctness stuff is what is driving people to vote for the BNP! if the 3 main parties actually offered some policies to the public and stopped spouting on about how bad other partys are then we wouldnt have this situation! i dont see what the problem is tbh. its a democracy and if people want to vote BNP they are quite welcome to! may i just add that i will not be one of them people

rich is right, it is political correcteness that is causing this. i had no bad feeling a couple of years. and i have no problem with the people who come here and make an honest living whether it be lawyer, NHS, or cornershop

Right so what you're saying is that the terrorists have got you so scared, you'd willingly give up your freedoms and put up with concentration camps etc to any monkey in jackboots who talks vaguely tough about "sorting em out". The men who fought and died to keep us free would be so proud.

anyone seen central news tonight? they showed some images of racist grafiti on mosques, some spastic had spraypainted 'hail hitler' (sic).

if you're going to do it, do it properly

Is he fuck!

I'll say it again, try fucking reading something that isn't posted on a web forum.

Look through one of the broadsheet newspapers from the last few days, and the comments of the people from Essex that were considering voting BNP are all pretty much the same.

"My kids can't get a council house" over and over again. And the answer is, the blacks and asians have got them all.

Ignores the fact that ALL the housing statistics show that ethnic minorities have the WORST access to housing.

(Of course if they really wanted to get back at the people who've deprived them of social housing, they should be sticking dogshit through the letterboxes of their neighbours who bought their council houses for a pittance back in the 80's, rather than the local asian family, but you can't reason with some people as this thread makes fucking obvious.)

i will this and this only: i think the bnp are idiots. thankyou.

Wise words indeed.

Political correctness is more of a society issue rather than a central government issue. If people want to make a meal of things then they will. I do personally hate political correctness gone mad, but there's a borderline between racism and political correctness and I would like to think that I fall close to that boundary.

Anyone who thinks the BNP can change Britain back to anything like the way it used to be, is completely and utterly deluded.

That fight was fought and lost by the NF over twenty years ago.

Exactly Amir. There are plenty more issue that should be of concern than your origins or whatever.

Personally I think that people should immigrate to this country on merit (skills; availabilty of work etc.) but that's not to say let's kick everyone out who doesn't conform to a certain way/rule.

People already in this country shouldn't be kicked out. That's a rediculous notion. People are quick to forget that Indian and Asian doctors saved the NHS not so long ago - you can't go kicking them out. Why does race or religion matter in the sociological hierarchy? I'd soon rather kick some chavy waster on benefits who has no aspirations out than a succesful person who aspires to make something of themselves, regardless of age, colour or creed.

Basically the BNP's whole support base, then. In fact, given they're supposed to be so tough on criminals but are largely all criminals themselves and tough on "scroungers" when most of their voters are just jealous because they think someone else got a hand-out they were expecting, surely the best thing the BNP could do for Britain would be to deport themselves en masse?

As long as dmr goes with them I'm happy  :wink:

I'm not so sure, Paul.  I think alot of people have real grievances they just don't focus on the real cause, and they misguidedly believe the BNP can help them.

So no BNP supporters are successful, earn good money etc? Thats a bit like saying all football fans are thugs which we all no isnt true.  Shouldnt label a whole group just cos some of them have dodgy pasts

Oh, no, please don't be unfair on the BNP and use broad-blanket stereotypes - after all, they'd never dream of doing that to, say, immigrants or Muslims. And it's not just some of them - most of their leadership "cardre" have got form

haven't read the entire posts but from what i have read isn't the whole racist thing swung around 180º so that the whites are a minority and the others are a majority. in some town,s / city's in about 5 years the whites will be a minority so we are know going through what the coloureds went through during apartied etc. The B.N.P party have some good (not great) ideas and some of there policies works both ways, I rather have the B.N.P party in the local elections than the N.F one of there motto's was THERE AINT NO BLACK IN THE UNION JACK SO SEND THE F*****S BACK. i am not raciest by anybody's means but i am just predijuice. I get flustered also when immigrants move in to our street (which they have) get a everything that we have been waiting for,for years straight away and all drive brand new b.m.w's aud's etc and i struggle to keep my battered cav on the road......... :evil:  :roll:

the rallying call for all that are partially racist.

And who do you think the BNP are, exactly? They're just the old NF rebadged - after the NF's disastrous showing in the 79 election, they were riven with splits and a feud erupted between NF chairman (and ex-paramilitary) John Tyndall and some of the rest of the Fuhrergruppen. He split to form the New National Front which a couple of years later became the BNP and during the 80s eclipsed the NF as the major far-right racist party in the UK. Nick Griffin the current fuhrer stayed with the NF until the early 90s (blathering about a Jewish conspiracy to control the media) when even he could see it was a dead duck and jumped ship to the BNP, eventually ousting John Tyndall as party leader. They can dress themselves in suits, call themselves BNP, NF, whatever they like but they're still the same old Nazi scum they always were. Don't be fooled - they're violent racist thugs and a vote for the BNP is a vote for Nazis.

point taken and a valid one.

i read somewhere also about nick griffen saying that the jewish controlled the media also think he said that it was the jewish that actually controlled the bank of england. i also appriciate the history lesson as i totally forgot about the new n.f party i was about 8 when the nf was in the 79 election i can just remember the uproar as we was living in germany at the time.....

cheers pauld for that :thumbs:

No probs, it's a bit obscure tbh and wouldn't really expect people to be familiar with it. Sorry if it came out a bit "history lesson"-ish, but like I say most people aren't aware of quite how deep into Nazi ideology this lot really are and it's important they know what they're voting for.

Errrr.........are you being ironic or are you just deluded. Do you really think that the DSS are handing out brand new beemers to asylum seekers? Or is it possibly that someone with a brown skin has moved in locally and happens to have a decent car because they go out and fucking work for it.

And incidentally try visiting:
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/

and look at the population statistic for race. Hmm! I've got no stats qualifications but I'm sure that to qualify as a minority you really have to be below 50% of the population. 91% to 92% really can't be considered a minority (and that's just in England and Wales, the figures even higher if you include Scotland and Northern Ireland which are even more predominantly white.

Your comparison with South Africa is just fucking laughable. Let me think...... have a racial minority who are immigrants to this country taken over all the land, the entire economy, political and state structure and excluded the natives from the political process? Oh perhaps not seeing as my polling card for the local elections is lying on the table in front of me, the House of Commons and the Lords are overwhelmingly white, and a black face at a CBI meeting is usually the fucking security guard!

Oh and this "the BNP aren't like the NF" thing that a fucking load of you keep spouting!

DO THE FUCKING RESEARCH before you post! Where do you all think the BNP came from! Just sprung up in the last couple of years? No. split from the NF back in the 80's when they felt the NF was going a bit "soft" and moving away from it's neo-nazi skinhead streetfighting roots. (The NF was toying with the idea of a 3rd way, a nationalism with an economy between socialism and facism. Conceptually bollocks but it appealed to the bunch of middle class university types that formed part of the NF's leadership. During this time they formed some fucking weird links with other nationalist groups, including Gadaffi, and even reportedly the IRA.)

The BNP took itself back to the nazi bully boy roots of the NF. Tyndale gets to wear his Nazi uniform and jackboots and have a bit of a civil war with the Front. Fast forward ten years and the NF had disappeared up its own arse, and the BNP were THE neo-nazi presence in Britain. Racist attacks, parcel bombs, fire bombings, they've got convictions for it all. They even form a armed wing Combat 18 to carry out the nastier bits of what is, lets face it, terrorism (oh the irony of their fucking bleating on about 7/7 when they had a convicted bomber on their national exec for about 15 years)

Just because Griffins got a degree and wears a tie doesn't suddenly make them an English Plaid Cymru.

You can get a gorilla to wear a suit for a short time if you try hard enough.

Does everybody get the fucking message now!

Good.

Racism is to be prejudice against someone because of their race you fool  :o

That makes you a racist. I'm by no means judging you, just stating the fact.

Is it ok to dislike the French with a passion though?

look im not a racist...and i can understand that certain areas of the bnp maybe racist and they may attract a racist following, BUT there never actually get enough votes to be in complete controll of the country. Even if they did do you really think your black next door neighbour who was born and raised here is going to be called for and sent to a concentration camp like the jews in nazi germany?

times change people.

if they can get a few seats it will be enough to put pressure on the government in charge to sort out this countries immigration policy. the only other alternitive are the torries and while i might agree with there immigration policies...its probably the only one i do agree with.

Totally summed it up steve.

Bollocks Mex summed it up best. That's what you're voting for, pure and simple. Hands up anyone with any sympathy for all those muppets in 30s Germany who said "Well, the Nazis will never get in, I'm just registering a protest vote. Someone's got to do something about these Jews". If you're not a Nazi, don't vote Nazi. If you vote for them, don't be surprised if the rest of us draw our own conclusions.

Pauld

I already said I have always voted conservative, so please re read the thread.  In fact I stand corrected when I was 18 I voted Labour in a local election when I was mis informed about certain things.

I just wanted to know why everyone gets in a mood about them, they are a political party and therefore at current have the right to try and attract a vote.

At least it made this forum interesting for a few minutes anyway.

No I knew that, my comments were aimed generally at anyone thinking of voting BNP as a protest vote, not directed at you. Egomaniac.


As were the Nazis in 30s Germany, do you really need me to explain why people would "get in a mood" as you put it about violent racists? FFS!


And on that we can agree

I love the word egonamic! Definately describes me in one word (thats a joke by teh way and very untrue description) but thanks for lightning up my day....

At least we agreed on some things.

what's wrong with the country's immigration policy may i ask?

Immigrant populations (%):
FN =Foreign Nationals
FB = Foreign Born

Korea - 0.5 FN
Italy 2.4 FN
Netherlands - 4.3 FN, 10.3 FB
UK - 4.4 FN
Sweden - 5.3 FN, 11.5 FB
Belgium - 8.2 FN
Germany - 8.9 FN
US - 11.1 FB
Switzerland - 19.7 FB
Australia - 23.1 FB

you are either very misinformed or a racist. i'll leave you to take your pick

i spent a good hour or so today putting up posters from the unite against fascism website around my college. obviously, i got permission from the powers that be and they were quite happy for me to do it.

surprisingly enough, a few people actually asked what i was doing and took an interest, all of whom - bar one who is a twat anyway - agreed with what i was doing.

i'll probably get some stick for being a self-praising nobjockey, but never mind.

you can see the leaflet here
http://www.uaf.org.uk/resources/0503CAcolDLleaflet.pdf

You self-praising nob-jockey. But well done anyway

at the end of the day the bnp dont even need to do political broadcasts when theyve got the bbc doing it for them.

crime watch is a good enough example as it is....half the crimes on there are by immagrants who shouldnt be in this country, and they dont deport them either.

you can point out if you want that british people commit crimes aswell (ofcourse they do there are good and bad in all races) but the thing is they shouldnt be here in the first place...and then they go and really take the piss out of us by not abiding by our laws.

maybe if your daughter/sister/mother gets raped by one of these people in the near future your attitude to them might change alittle?

I despise all violent criminals no matter what race they are. It is true that a lot of immigrants are criminals, but so are a lot of natives.

A prime example of a white man commiting a disgusting offence:

http://www.thisisswindon.co.uk/display.var.736318.0.man_tries_to_drag_girl_12_into_car.php

That's total bollocks Stevo and you know it. Typical lazy bigoted thinking that typifies the BNP

what utter crock. haven't you learnt to think for yourself yet?

its not aloud of bollocks even simon who has similar views as you has said alot of crime is brought into this country by immagrants. the thing is they dont fuck about in those countries if your a forgiener comitting crime.

at the end of the day if you rape someone in this country and are not a native you should be deported as soon as your sentence is finnished...end of. no playing the race card, nothing. i dont care if youve moved here from america or australia or uganda or kazachstan...same rules, its not racist. we have got enough crime comitted by the natives here without dealting with other countries aswell.

the thing is take out all the illegal immagrants in the first place and were already such a small island and densly populated....and then we go and take on more asylum seekers and immagrants to top it all off.

We should take a reasonable ammount of asylum seekers from war torn countries on a tempoary basis dictated by our population and size of our country but the fact remains that other countries dont take enough and we take too many...if its not the immagrants that are taking the piss out of us its the rest of europe especially.

im not saying that the bnp getting in power would be the answer as they would be too extreme but the fact remains they never will get in power but i will vote for them to put pressure on the other parties to pull there fucking finger out, its already started with labour trying to pull afew brain cells together and figure out why they are losing votes to the bnp.

if caring about the state of this country and the way its going is racist then yeah im a racist. my definition of a racist is someone who discriminates against someone due to a prejedice from within (ie colour of skin) and i dont do that. my only prejedice is of people who move to this country, claim every benifit going and commit every crime they can think of without a respect to the country....once again if you think thats racist then thats fair enough, in your eyes in a racist.

You're prejudiced against all immigrants on the basis of a lie (that all immigrants "claim every benifit going and commit every crime they can think of") - so yeah you're racist. And pretty thick to boot. Are you a native English speaker, by the way?

you're quite blatantly racist, swindonstevo.

your deportation idea doesn't really work as is proven by the current system - deport people all you like they will still try to get back in, and eventually succeed.

and the small island/dense population agrument is pure bollocks, have you ever seen the UK? we've got fuckloads of land.



lame. its not hard to "care about the country" and not be racist you ignoramus.

it doesnt work because 1. its not in place and 2. what is in place isnt run as it should be.

so we should just give up then? not bother with even trying and just let even more in? wow that will solve the problem. governments like australia, the us and new zealand manage it pretty effectively....why cant we?

i have friends of asian decent (there familys came over here legally and worked hard for there money) who feel the same way about the current system and how were getting taken the piss out of....by your thinking there racist too?

you're boring.

put down the daily mail and we'll talk.

care to prove the statistics upon which you're basing this fascist view?

i dont read the daily mail. i dont have statistics...i use my eyes.

i asked you a pretty valid question but got no valid answers.

express? mirror? sun? got to be one of those lot (if any).

i agree that statistics don't prove anything, such is the nature of them.

pretty valid isn't good enough i'm afraid, ask a valid question and i'll give you answer but until then.....

How do the Australian and American governments supposedly handle immigration more effectively then.

They both have a much higher proportion of immigrants than the uk.

i chop and change, the suns hardly an ideal newspaper so i started reading the mirror for abit but it started to be filled with dogooders like u lot so i stopped.

the question was valid, so if you might stop avoiding the question that you dont like the answer to....that would be nice.

whilst statistics can be unreliable, they're not neccesarily biased like your clearly racist eyes are.

you say im racist, but my question remainds unasnwered.

  Just not true....England is one of the more densely populated areas of Europe...where building land is at a premium....the political elite and scummy liberal opinion formers....are quite happy to to bleat like about this as long as they can retain their pockets of privilege by sending house building to other areas of the UK and retaining their 2nd homes either abroad or maybe Scotland or Wales.

 Then its not their problem..

  Stevo's point is that  immigrants put pressure on the rest of us especially by illegal entry, purely from a population perspective.  This does and  has led to the ghettoisation of many urban communities in the UK.

 With inevitable social problems to follow......at the 2001 census it was estimated that upward of 1 million people had disappeared from official view....these mainly in the communities mentioned.

which question?

and another point to make.....australia is a huge undensly polulated country with achers of space, but they let no fucker in (with an extremely sucessfull low crime rate)......but oh wait there racist!

if they share the same ill-informed views as you, then yes. although it would be worse, as first/second/third generation immigrants they'd be kicked out of the country as well.

much of the empty space in australia is fairly inhabitable isn't it? not sure about that mind.

They let people in on their merits to society from what I gather, so doctors etc.

Most of Australia is desert, which is why it's not densly populated.

Japan is one of the worst for letting immigrants in if I rightly remember...

no your misinterpreting my views, why would i want my best friends farther (born in pakistan) to be immigrated when hes arrived to this country legally and worked all this life over here? this is not the sort of people im talking about....your misinterpretation of my views would obviously lead you to belive im some sort of nazi.

the fact that one of my friends is a muslim of pakistani decent would lead any rattional thinking person to belive i wasnt a racist in the first place.

No of course not. But now you're talking about abuse of the benefits system I presume, which is not a problem exclusive to the immigrant community. If you "used your eyes" to look at the white community in the same way as you do the immigrant community, you'd find that benefit fraud is (surprise, surprise) widespread across the spectrum.

As an example, Radio 5 did a piece on people signed off sick a few months back in which they said that at one point some 25% of the male working population of a chunk of South Wales was in receipt of invalidity benefit. They're not all immigrants, in fact South Wales is largely white. In the same programme, the boss of a S Wales bus company complained he was having to get Polish drivers in because the locals were too comfortable on the sick and weren't prepared to work for the (standard) wages offered. Those same locals then bitterly resented the immigrant drivers for "taking their jobs". That's more a problem to do with the benefits system/the minimum wage/the poverty trap than it is to do with immigration, but it's very easy for the lazy and the bigoted to just blame all their woes on immigrants, a prejudice the likes of the BNP are delighted to capitalise on.

I'm very much of the view that the way people act is based on the way they are treated than where thay are from.

If crimes commited by asylum seekers when they get here are high when compared to the rest of the population, then yes we should change the stytem. Not to let less in, but to remove some of the beurocracy they face, help them intergrate into the country with education about our culture (whilst still letting them keep their own cultural identity) and educating the native population to remove some of the negative stereotypical views that a lot seem to carry.

hello me.

"my best friend is black/indian/muslim/jewish" is the oldest line in the book, but i'm sure you're being honest.

perhaps i am misinterpreting your views, but why would you want to vote bnp if you don't want your friend's father deported? because that is essentially what they want to do.

Why because he is of a different colour to me hes not a racist even though he shares the same views? surely treating people differently just because of colour is classed as.....hold on whats it called? 'racism' i think!

and your point about white people (which isnt the argument in the first place because this has never been about colour, british would have been more apropriate) claiming every benifit they can and fleesing the country is a very valid one....but ive never said i agree with that either.

yeah they probably would, but the thing is in all seriousness there never actually get into complete power in this country...but given afew seats they may put pressure on the other three parties to do something about the problem.

the bnp seem the only alternative (apart from ukip who seem quite on the ball when that twat kilroy isnt representing them)

So why are you turning a benefits fraud issue into an anti-immigrant argument (and you don't say illegal immigrants so you seem to be anti all immigrants, legal or not - where's that leave your mate?) that then translates into a vote for a Nazi party? Where the hell's the logic in that? There is none, you just don't like immigrants and you're looking for a reason to back your prejudice

in reference to your views on ethnicity/immigrants and crime, have a gander at this

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=467

im sorry i didnt specify illegal immagrants im against, with a reasonable ammount of legal immagrants allowed into the country(controlled and they have to obey our laws)...let me give you an example which pretty much proves in not a racist.

afew years back when i was in school (churchfields, a bit multi-cultural school) there was an influx of immagrants who attended the school in my year 10.


there was a lad in my year called mohammed, he was from afghanistan and his whole family were killed years back. the kid was fucking sound, wouldnt hurt a fly unless provoked. he was hear leggaly and because his country was in a state with bin laden and all those wankers. he went to school, studied hard and i think hes actually got a job now and is considering moving back to afghanistan.

people like that i dont mind, i think all countries should take a certain ammount of people from countries in the state afghanistan was in at the time (not just us taking the majority like a bunch of mugs)

like i said im not even sure the bnp are the answer, but they may put pressure on labour to get their fucking fingers out of there fucking arses.

this is your killer question is it?

i couldn't give a shit. obviously objecting to our current system, or saying that it is not restictive enough, does not make you a racist. your prejudices as highlighted in many previous posts, however, do.

Australia and New Zealand might be able to manage their immigration but then they're not a thin strip of water (with a tunnel under it), away from mainland Europe.

As for the US, do you read watch the fucking news? Read the papers? Are you in fact aware of anything going on the real workd around you rather than the fucking fantasy world the Daily Mail and the Sun inhabit.

If you did you'd know the HUGE issue that illegal immigrants are the US. Some southern states have enormous % of the population that have no legal residential status.

to be honest i cant even be bothered to carry on this argument so unless someone says something completely outrageous and i just cant help myself this will be my last post.

the basis of it all is that im not a racist....but im pissed off with the state of this country. i realise that the only parties that will be charge of this country are labour or conservative, with a small chance of the lib dems getting in. the reason i vote bnp is so hopefully they can have a say and change afew things for the better.

i can totally understand why people wouldnt want to vote for the bnp as if what people say is true (about them being the nf under a different name) then even i have my reservations about voting for them....but id never even consider it if labour looked after this country in the first place.

so my political stance doesnt make me a racist but how you have interpreted my personality and my prejedices do.....so what evidence do you have to suggest that?

my asian friends maybe?

Stevo,

Join the club mate, we're all fucked off with the state of the country. We just don't want you to lay the blame on some easy scapegoat, based on the fucking baseless propaganda of a bunch of nazi's and the people who have a vested interest in us finding someone easy to blame for the mess we're in, so that we don't look to hard at them.

Look back up this thread.

Notice anything about the nature of the posts? Your lot post nothing but opinion, which you claim is based on "experience", and every time you do, someone answers you with FACTS and statistics that prove you're talking out of your arse.

You're wrong. Why can't you just admit it?

this is an argument based on opinion mate, very rarely has anyone brought many facts into it during the argument.

one fact that does remain is that this is a democracy and you cant tell me or anyone else whos deciding to vote bnp now that i cant.

the most you can do is call me a racist...which ive clearly proved im not.

thats my final word

agree with lumps; you'd be mad if you were happy with the way the country being run but attempting to write off your clearly racist views by saying "oh its for the good of the country so not racist" is pure bo-locks.

the evidence is in this thread. whether or not you've got asian mates is irrelevant, it doesn't remove all possibility of you having prejudices does it? in fact, some racists are such hypocritical gimps that they regularly engage with, befriend, and seek the help of those who they are meant to despise (don't know if anyone saw the documentary about TerreBlanche in South Africa, leader of the AWB, but his right hand man lived next to a black man and they talked often, yet he openly admitted to previous racial crimes). pussies.

your right to vote was never in question so i don't know why you've brought that up.

  We live in a rather fine country which is why large numbers seek to come here illegally....this is a problem....its not racist to point this out neither is it racist to deport those who flout the laws of our land..

  Stevo is expressing an opinion, you and OF are doing the same.

agree that UKIP would be better to vote for to make a point, they are who i voted for before last time but they just seem to have dissapeared, anyone else heard of them recently???

only problem is reg, is that stevo's argument is based around the fact that he thinks some people deserve a better life than others depending on what country they happen to be born in. he wants to maintain his ideal of british life (which has never actually existed) whilst others suffer. which, to me, is fundamentally wrong and fascist.

kilroy left them in the shit i think.

he probably went bankrupt, he was a bit of a wanker anyway

Fair play Stevo, you've stood up for yourself despite taking flak from all sides. Partly I think because you misrepresented your own position to some extent


Aren't we all?


And that's where the problem is - voting BNP can only make things significantly worse. "Tactical voting" just doesn't apply to scum that far off the scale - would you "tactically vote" for al-Qaeda? No chance, because you'd never want to give them the slightest encouragement. So how are the Nazis any better? OK, you say you don't think they'll get into power, but every vote for them, tactical or not, encourages them in their vile views, spreads fear in ethnic communities, and massively increases racial tension. Bottom line, Stevo, like I said earlier is if you don't want a Nazi government don't fucking vote for one.

 Can I humbly suggest OF that you don't give this too much thought....in terms of global resources, we can only maintain our standard of living on the backs of other poorer people...its been like this for the hundreds of years European cultural hegemony.

 Seems to me you can have three responses to this situation.

 1.  Accept it....get your nose in the trough and see how many other people you can exploit in looking after number 1.

 2.  Think its fundamentally wrong, and devote yourself to seeking a political or maybe humanitarian solution to this fact.

 3.  Think its wrong, but because you enjoy the advantages of our exploitation of globalisation, do fuck all apart from get angsty at dinner parties....and go to Bob Geldof shows.

You missed out number four Reg - the BNP response:

4) Actively go out of your way to make life even more miserable for everyone by scapegoating those at the bottom of the pile and encouraging hatred and division in society

 Think 1 covers 4.

Nah, 1's more the Tories position

 I can see my three pointed summary of the human condition is going to need a bit more work. :scribe:

quite a black and white (bu-dum) picture you paint there, reg.

i'm not sure about the view that anyone has to live off the back of others either.

 I take it you've never read any Marx or Engels.

no, i've not.

commie shite isn't it?

I've never been brave enough to try and read Das Kapital.  I tried Mein Kampf and about 100 pages was as far as I got.

 I'd prefer to see them as historians and philosophers.

what's your (their) point then?

all i know is they were commies (which i know very little about) and thought that capitalism would result in the bourgois vs workers class divide growing

Marx ended his days drunkenly brawling around London pubs.  You've got to respect him for that at least.

I thought real Marx views were everyone deserves to do as well as they work for, hence if the poor work and the rich do fuck all redistribution should occur.

It's a good start tho - one day we could be talking about Marx, Engels and Smeeton as chroniclers of the human condition.

i read that as mex instead of marx. still fits mind.

 My point is that they saw a change in the world, the increasing pace of western global capitalism, and how the this system could only operate on the back of exploitation...whether women, children or other workers and how it needed a global element for the gaining of resources at cost to the workers extracting them at source.

  Many of the worst excesses of this system, have been eradicated in a long established economy like Britain...through the political intervention of such as trade unions....but whilst paying lip service to internationalism,  trade unionists in Britain have been complicit in the increasingly and rapacious exploitation of global scarce resources.

 Which brings me back to the three points....you have to decide where you stand.

 :Ride On Fatbury's Lovestick:

I'm a mix of all three.

What exactly is the "situation" you talk of though? we seem to have moved onto globalisation?

I'm hereby starting the International Peoples Smeetonist Party - Forward with the world!

  Fair enough...

  The situation isn't a Glen Hoddle situation more the global exploitation situation.

 Take for example the gathering of a resource like coltan, needed in mobile phone technology.

 A classic of how global capitalism exploits workers,  and environmental degradation follows on.....Marx and Engels would have recognised this.

 I'd like to propose that henceforth it be known as the Smeetonist International Party of the People.

 Point of order......Partie Internationale du Peuple de Smeetonisme has a more authoritarian ring.

Much prefer the work of Howard Marks myself.

Must admit the BNP do make me chuckle.  Take away the media hype and they are the equivalent ideals of a minibus full of Morris Dancers on a day-trip to Blackpool.

Their manifestos are pretty inoffensive .  Most people would be hard pushed reading through it to find anything in principal that they disagree with.  Alright the solutions raise a smirk with the simplicity and their ‘I’m not racist but I’m alright Jack *wink*’ approach but in an ironic twist of fate what was once the most extreme political party has become so middle of the road it makes New Labour’s Mondeo Man look like a naked Dutch lesbian sucking a cat off on her trike.

The BNP been around for years in one guise or another and will continue to do so many more.  They’re nowhere near as extreme or as offensive as they once were, take away the hoo-haa and they’re the equivalent to earth in the Hitchhikers.  If you wanted the non-offensive British equivalent to your racier European models the BNP are the Austin Maestro of political parties.

Yes they attract an ‘element’ but as my old Nan used to say ‘at least it keeps the kids off the streets’.   I’d rather read/listen/watch some monkey in a suit try and play at politics than have him on the Streets taking things into his own hands.

Yes they talk claptrap and add two and two together to make six but what political party doesn’t?   Take away the media publicity and the only people to ever bother listening will be a half empty town hall in Bury on a Wednesday night.  

If people really buy into and believe in it all look no further than your Morris dancer on his day-trip to Blackpool.  Unfathomable but it exists and while they’re not hurting anyone let them get on with it and the rest of us can point and laugh at the beardy men with their sticks.

Beats the skin heads with their baseball bats any day of the week.

Now where’s my McArtney gone?

Ebony and Ivory……..

a conservative on question time has just made the valid point that out of 22,000 councillors in the country, there are 21 from the BNP and that the press they've got over the last week is wholly disproportionate and plays into their hands.

xbennettx- V for Vendetta says:
london blacks are just scum mate

they are, i wish they didn't have a right to be here.

i think london turns people nasty

which number are you on your list reg?

It's worth pointing out that the skins with the baseball bats haven't gone anywhere, they've just been shoved off camera most of the time. But next time Griffins in court, you shouldn't have to wait long, have a close look at the crowd hanging around on the steps outside.

 Spent a lot of years as a 1....a lot less as a 2 and am now probably a 3, without the dinner parties and Geldof shows..

2 "london blacks" hacked a bloke to pieces and set their dogs on a bloke today.

oh fuck i know my borderline sense of humour is bad when dmr is trying to back me up.

i'm going to repent and never mock a racially aflicted person again, except gingers

I'm sure some white people commited a bit of murder today as well, or are you taking the piss, it can get hard to tell on this forum

thing with marx was he had some nice ideas but all the end results he predicted ended up being complete bollocks

It's precisely that view that could see them take more seats in the future. I'm not saying you would vote for the (or maybe you would) but if people don't see them as much of a threat the vote to put pressure on other parties could get them more seats.

Yeah I thought he meant a bit more than what he did.

Yeah? And two "London Whites" have just been arrested for being part of a gang of 15 that dragged an Asian bloke from his car and kicked him to death.

What exactly does any of that prove? I tell you now for every crime you come up with with a black protaganist I can list 50 committed by white people.

It means FUCK ALL.

Are you to blame for the actions of the Yorkshire Ripper because he happens to also be white?

No, i didn't think so.

im not saying this to prove im not racist or anything as i dont really have to prove anything to anyone - i know myself.

that quote about london blacks is outrageous. i dont think colour is the issue....if were going to be in the slightest bit racist here lets make it to londoners (and im not even doing that) cause i think the problem is the place not the colour.

Give me some credit Si  :D

What they’re preaching may be in some respects thinly veiled stuff but on the surface it’s very much Morris Dancers on Blackpool beach.

It’s the hoo-haa in the media that gives them the voice and the exposure that leads to voters using them as a lever on the Government and other parties.

Had they been left to get on with spouting their drivel and not been the centre of the media circus they wouldn’t have a fraction of the backing they have now and more than likely gone the same way as UKIP.

Dazza, you're being naive. I'm pretty sure Hitler's manifesto in the 1933 elections didn't mention gas chambers - everyone should know what the BNP stands for, they're racist thugs from top to bottom, and the fact they've tried to dress it up by squeezing a few of them into suits and putting out a bland manifesto is neither here nor there.

i made a close to the bone joke on msn, i've since clarified.

you'll never convict me

My point is though Paul they may be racist thugs and have an agenda and I’m not saying they should be left to get on with it, far from it.  But all of the time, hype and attention given to ridiculous policies like the 'one school meal for all' are absurd.

Yes it’s aimed right at religious groups who can’t eat your bangers and mash and what not, but unless they say as much directly why give them the airtime?  All it does is lead to more publicity and more support from the aggravated.

Calling them the root of all evil plays right into their hands,  If they want to play at flag waving politics treat it as the drivel it is and pull them up when it counts and then make them look like the bunch of inarticulate monkeys they are.

OK, I see your point, but it's like not cleaning up that dirty corner of your kitchen - leave it to quietly fester and pretty soon you'll be overrun with rats. Wherever the BNP go, violence and intimidation follows and more often than not race riots (Oldham a couple of years back, Bradford late 80s etc etc). They might be inarticulate monkeys, but they also have a fair amount of dangerous psychos attached to them who if allowed to breed will attract other inarticulate dangerous psycho monkeys to their banner and that is how they grow. They're currently trying to break out of the bovver boy ghetto by appearing to be (to paraphrase) no more offensive than Morris Dancers, and it seems to be working to some extent - it's fooled those who started this thread and have argued the "I'm not racist but...." line in this thread hasn't it? The BNP are shitheads and should be exposed as such at every opportunity.

Fully agree chief, but I've seen more grief caused over the past couple of years by the unnecessary exposure the BNP have been given than they would have ever got by preaching in village halls

I’m not saying they should be left to fester at all.  But those being swayed possibly like the posters at the start of this thread would in all likelihood not given a rats arse had the BNP not been given the opportunity to play the ‘I’m not racist I’m British and standing up for Britain’ card to such an extent in the mainstream media.

On the flip side I’ve seen friends and colleagues who had always learnt to deal with the handful of idiots with a loose tongue become increasingly edgy over the rubbish printed in the press.  There are those not far off taking things into their own hands and some that already have done and will do again.

All of the dread being dirged up is simply opening a divide that plays into both extreme’s hands.

Everyone stop talking shit about the fucking BNP.

They are no marks end of.