Thetownend.com

I think a separate thread for this maybe required.

All I have to say now is, if England lose those who like to criticse will say England never beat a 'big' nation, and if England win those same people will say Germany are a shadow of their former selves.  Book it.

10-9 to England on penalties after a riveting 3-3 draw😀

With the Dutch out, winning this gives us our best chance of reaching the final, possibly ever. Think it'll be a very close one, probably 1 - 0 either way.

I’m going  :pint:

Its England. Our best chance of a good route to the final. 60k English fans at Wembley.

We’ll lose.

Who you supporting  :eek:

This.

IF we can get past Germany, then it's Sweden/Ukraine in the quarters, then Czech Republic/Denmark in the semis.

I'm not saying any of these games are easy, but fuckin' hell, we'd have a great chance of making the final.

Come on you cunts and beat Germany!

I think my biggest concern is Southgate. If he allows us to go at their distinctly average defence we will get a couple at least. Their midfield is also technically good but slow. Perfect for a number 10 to exploit.

I worry he'll go Henderson, Phillips and Rice which will encourage the Germans forward though.

Going out here would be horrible when you look at our side of the draw. I think we really should be winning this with it at Wembley.

England 2-1 Germany.

Said this in another thread.
We will attack at the start of then game, score within the first 15 minutes.
Sit deeper & deeper & deeper
Take off all our attacking players.
Sit deeper & deeper.
Concede in the 94 minute
Boring extra time
Lose on Penalties.

I'm here for this final sentence. Tip top value!

It won’t be the Germans

 :pint: :clap: :pint:

Just got a ticket for tomorrow night - absolutely buzzing.

nice! hope it's enjoyable come 6:45 or so

It’s a 7pm KO here. Plenty of time for a few pre match nerve settlers.

I've got a ticket for tomorrow. Has anyone else been to Wembley games? Having to get into the ground between 1400 and 1430 feels like a bit of a buzzkill for the build up.

It’s more of a recommendation mate, doesn’t matter if you are there after.

Splendid. Thanks.

How is everyone getting tickets or have you all paid over the odds

But you will miss the legendary Rockin' Robin haka.

I paid £200 in the end.

Quite a few spares on Twitter - it's just terrifying not knowing if you're being conned.

The fella I bought from wanted a charity donation so paid his justgiving page rather than himself, and he transferred the ticket while I was on the phone to him.

You're probably in the away end  :)

Mine was €50 using the usual channels. Think my pal had a priority email as he had tickets for the Dublin game that this would have been.

England vs. Germany in Ireland? Probably for the best that Dublin has avoided that.

God yeah imagine

It's a tricky one... most seem to want Southgate to put out a side which plays with freedom and focuses on attack, and I get that. But Germany looked strongest against Portugal who went at them and left gaps, whilst struggling against France and Hungary who took a more cautious approach.

As long as he doesn't go with the three defensive CMs...

What would be your line ups tomorrow

Pickford
Walker Stones Maguire Trippier
Hendo Rice
Foden Grealish Sterling
Kane

…………………Pickford
Trippier Maguire Stones Shaw
……………………Rice
…………….. Foden Grealish
………….Saka Kane Sterling

I think fast wingers to try to pin back their wing backs is the way to go tomorrow. Maybe more attacking full backs too, that feels like somewhere we can get at them. It might be more damage limitation in the middle of the park

Pickford
Trippier Maguire Stones Shaw
Rice Phillips Bellingham
Saka Kane Sterling

But wouldn't mind Rashford or Sancho. Or Foden in the midfield three. We'll see.

Pickford

Walker
Stones
Maguire
Shaw

Rice
Phillips

Saka
Grealish
Sterling

Kane

                  Pickford
Walker   Stones    Maguire    Shaw
        Henderson        Phillips
Saka                Foden           Sterling
                    Kane

This one but with Foden over Saka

Was listening to the Quickly Kevin Podcast and they reminded me of the England team when we last played Germany in 2017:

Pickford

Trippier
Phil Jones
Stones
Maguire
Danny Rose

Loftus-Cheek
Dier
Livermore

Abraham
Vardy

Bench included Jack Cork, Joe Hart and Ryan Bertrand

Christ alive we've come a long way.

No way you should be dropping Saka after the way he played last game.

Saka or Grealish, I’m easy.

Foden is amazeballs, 2nd name on the team sheet for me

This is bang on pretty much mine, although not averse to having Mings in the CB pairing. He's done better than many thought. Much like Phillips who I think is undroppable at present. Not fussed about Rice. He's good but when Henderson is available he gets the nod. Phillips can play further forward and be a nuisance this way too. Henderson protects the back line. It's nice  to have these kinds of problems though too :)

Not so sure Southgate is that brave and reckon Saka will miss out and Rice will start

I think he only drops Saka if he's starting Mount. Which with preparation/isolation aside, if he's been training (I'd imagine he is), there's no reason why Mount can't be a starting option too.

I don't think the Germans need to worry about Sancho until the second half

Been told Mings is starting tomorrow, and we are going 3-5-2.

I’ve been told security at the England camp is tighter than a crabs arse.

At least this game is at 5 so the evening won't be ruined.

I go into this game expecting the worst. I shouldn't because Germany are not playing particularly well, but I just get the feeling that their experienced players know how to get things done.

Sane and Havertz have been woeful so far so expect them to both have blinders to show the English public what they can do.

Back 3 of Maguire Walker and Stones.

England to win 2-1.
Goals from Maguire & Sterling.

No in depth thinking involved just that they are the only two England players in the trusty Panini album at this time, with only a hopeful looking Bernd Leno on the Germany page.
Hardback edition of course.

Oh shit, I've only just realised we're playing at 5pm. I was convinced it was 8pm  :doh:

My mate is head of security for the England team and you have been told correctly.

I used to be employed as England football security back in the 90s and it was fairly tight back then but I have been told that this is more like protecting the US president than a football squad.

Mings is starting - from the horses mouth.

Hope he misses the teeth!

Oh dear!

Why so down on Mings? Haven't we just kept 3 clean sheets with him in defence?

At international level its much more about horses for courses, playing players for a certain role to compliment the tactics rather than going with the same formation game in game out.

If Southgate thinks we will be better served by going 3 at the back with Mings in to do a man marking job Havertz say then that would facilitate that change it would also match us up more closely to the 3421 favoured by Germany.

Yep think you are right and we will likely see walker rwb then

I see the "If we fail Southgate has got selection wrong" Twitter brigade is already starting to rumble.

This is the curse of having a deep, talented squad. There's no way you can get every brilliant attacking player into the side, so there will always be someone people can point at and go "If only we'd picked Grealish/Sancho/Foden we'd have won 5-1". I would like people who say "Grealish must play" to be forced to explain who they'd drop though, so many of them seem to think Southgate is maliciously passing up the opportunity to play with 15.

I think most of the big calls so far he's got right - Phillips seemed an odd call in the first game but did well, Sterling many of us would have dropped but has been our best player so far, Saka was left field but brilliant. Where we've struggled is with the first name on the team sheet - Kane - not finding form.

The deficiency in attack is caused by the central midfield I think, not the rotation of those up top (although Kane has been next to useless in this tournament thus far and seems like his ankle is fucked to me).

It's the fact we don't have anyone who can dictate the pace, drive the team, create the openings.  You can't just pass the ball around for two minutes, give it to Grealish and expect something to happen.  Meanwhile their defence has had an armchair ride preparing for the final ball.

On the plus side, we seem to bore the other team into not scoring very often.

A couple of teams have already shown that you do not need the best players all the time, a good work ethic and cohesion at this type of tournament can be enough.  Players are generally not that far off each other ability wise plus you get the impact of mental pressure on the players.

It’s a tough choice for Southgate, based on form & performance Kane shouldn’t be getting in the team, but it’s virtually impossible to drop him.

Time to go.

Come on England!

Give Kane the ball in the right areas and he will score goals....simple

Go easy on the pop it could be a long night😀

Therein lies the problem, hes been playing much deeper coming back to win the ball rather than getting any service in the box which is what he thrives on.

It has to be a Southgate problem which hopefully he will rectify tonight.
Love the flag you clever fu***r😀

I'd check your sauces. Mings is on the bench.

Well, we're not short of options from the bench.

He's no JJ😀

Mr Ed is a lying cunt

Southgate is Mr Cautious (7 defensive players at home) but given what Germany did to Portugal in the groups is probably a sensible option. I can see us picking off Germany on the break but either way suspect a very very tight game.

If we are shit but win 1-0 - Happy Days (aaaaaayh)

Tend to agree this is the right way to start. Trick will be changing it at the right time and in the right way if it's not working.

Werner starts in place of Gnabry, bit of a surprise

I have to remind myself we're the home team

Is Calvert-Lewin injured. Two keepers on the bench is odd.

Unless they're the penalty takers😀

A back 3 v Werner. He's going to get a hatrick isn't he?

(it OK, England will get 4).

Double what we've scored so far 😀

Awful team.....

No creativity, no inspiration.

Is Southgate playing for penalties..

How is Rice still getting a start?

I'm led to believe not. Can't understand that one myself really.

Clever. A striker who plays in England and will know how the defenders play.

If only we had the same option😀

Both spare keepers need to be in the 23, really odd rules but it's been the same every game

Work laptop off, cider open, World in Motion on. Let's fucking go!

Ah ok - I should probably have checked that first then before poo pooing Southgate!

Damn I've just sent you an urgent email😀

wrong thread - there is one specifically for discussions about cider already!

All my deadlines met for the day.

Stopping work now means I'll have a particularly busy day tomorrow, but fuck it. It's coming home. Maybe.

It would have been nice if Klopp was a pundit for this game

Klopp and Souness on together to blind us all with their teeth, perhaps?

Three Lions on now. If you can't lose your head now you don't like football. Belting it out in the living room, my wife has gone for a walk. Probably a good call.

Not that I'm filling time before kick off, but just found out the Euros trophy is named after Henri Delaunay, unless you were wondering exactly who was still gleaming.

 :clap: :clap:

Love it. That was me in my kitchen at about the same time putting some more beers in the freezer!

Come on you cunts!

There's some tasty German birds in the crowd😀

Out of Office on, logging off work now.

Might pop on at half time to see what the general mood is. Suspect it will be goalless.

yeah, I didn't realise that.. makes sense now

Home in time  :)

There looks a lot more than 40,000 odd.

Put it this way, I don’t see them getting double this when it’s full

We're sitting back at home

Nervy

Just turned it on. 8 defensive players. 8. Coward

They're dictating the play

Spot on

Not good so far. Their midfield has a free ticket.

We need to up our fucking game it's all Germany

We are so shit thanks to Southgates team selection

Absolutely no creative outlet...

We are just trying to get long balls to Kane....

Awful...

Stop passing it back

Saka doing well.

very well, making up for a our lack of midfield!

Better in the last 10-15 minutes.

Much better but would prefer Grealish down the left rather than Shaw

We’re getting some possession but other than from crosses we don’t look like creating. I just don’t get it, what kind of manager plays a team that has no one capable of playing an incisive pass or some actual creativity. We’ve basically got 8 defensive players, 2 runners and a goal scorer. Surely any half competent manager would sacrifice one of the defensive players and play someone to try and create for the attacking players.

I wouldn't mind our defensiveness so much if we countered quickly.

But we don't even do that.

I'm not particularly bothered about international football (even less so after my interest in club football has waned this year) but looking at the collective shit losing going on on social media I hope England win just for the back tracking its going to lead to.

Sent from my SM-A125F

Could you then bring on a keeper out on pitch?
I’ve said my piece on having to have three keepers in the 26 but all three in the 23 too.
What is the point. Thus far I think it’s only Italy who have used two keepers.

bloody hell Kane.

thank fuck Werner is playing and not Gnarby. Baffling.

England ok after first 10.

Hopefully that Phillips yellow at the end of the half will force a change and allow us to bring on a creative player. Not sure you can trust him for another 45 minutes not to make a risky challenge and the yellow will take away his ‘edge’.

Phillips, Saka, Waker good. Kane, Rice not so good. Henderson or Bellingham on I think, preferably for Rice - both DMs on yellows is asking for trouble.

First ten minutes were awful but better team now.

Pace is troubling their backline no doubt.

Agree with all of this. Gold medal for Nemo

Kane has been a complete passenger all tournament. Has he even had a SoT?
DCL should have been in the team from the Scotland game.

Kane seems to purposely play deeper as he's usually heavily marked. When he drops deep, he pulls a couple of defenders with him creating space for Saka/Sterling. We just haven't exploited that yet.
It's been such a cagey game, lets hope for a more adventurous 2nd half.

It's a really difficult one. There's no doubt he's one of the best strikers in the world AND he's badly out of form. Having him back on form would be a huge bonus to our chances of winning the tournament. DCL is a good player but has a lower ceiling.

That's the kind of decision that makes a makes a manager's reputation. I wouldn't want to make it.

Anyway, second half. See you on the other side.

Town flag behind Neuer. Quagmire or Costanza?

Brilliant save

England Pickford is so much better than Everton Pickford.

I'm fed up of this defensive negative stuff

Yes much better if England

It’s like the 2010 Paynter play off final dilemma.

If you play Paynter/Kane and they are useless then people will question why you didn’t play player x instead.
If you play Player X instead and they are useless then people will question why you didn’t play Paynter/Kane

Slightly different in tournament football as you have a minimum of three games.

I've been saying that for the past 4 games plus we need more options going forward

You need creative forward thinking players to give him the opportunities

Started to remind me of the Scotland game

Shaw and Trippier aren't the answer

You have had Mount, Foden, Sterling, Saka, Grealish all on the pitch at some point.
Whilst we haven’t exactly created a million chances, Kane has still done nothing. I mean he did have the ball about three yards from goal before half time...

Get Sancho on ffs.

So he suddenly becomes a poor player then

Yes, he’s off form and arguably wasn’t fully fit coming into the tournament.
He is off form currently therefore a poor player currently.
We’ve enabled that at the expense of our other striker.

Kane hasn't recovered from that knock. Rashford on please, three fast forwards against this defence.

Disagree play to his strengths give him support and he will deliver but maybe the knock is hindering him

What does that look like in the context of this England team? We've played like this for a long time and he's done well, I think this is form or fitness rather than tactics.

You disagree that Kane is off form?

This is painful second half, almost like we are playing for penalties. Grealish coming on, must be for either Rice or Philips surely?!

Ffs

Not disagreeing just giving the reasons I think he's off form

Nope! Gotta maintain the defensive 8 obviously!

But we haven't changed our style. Almost all of Kane's England goals have been scored in teams that play like this.

Grealish for Saka... I can see why, Saka had faded. Come on Jack, prove the internet right.

Saka has been our most forward thinking player this tournament.
So let’s take him off

England haven't played much over the last year but Spurs have

Agreed unless Southgate thought he was getting tired

Was Low in the Ramones?  :)

We are hanging on until the 88th minute until we try & score so that Germany don’t have time to respond

Goal

Get in :pint:

Off form Harry Kane was involved.....he had players around him😀

Thank god for Sterling in this tournament!

Fucking yes yes yes yes

Honesty time: I wouldn't have picked Sterling. He's scored every England goal. Fair play Southagte.

Keep it going lads o/

Did you see the pass from Kane 😀

Only player that’s looked remotely capable of scoring.

Fate on the side of Sterling!

Such. A. Let off.

What a cock-up. Lucky to get away with that.

Good job he passed it rather than trying to shoot.

Tap
In

Kane get in there :pint:

Kane get in there :pint:

Jesus motherfuckign Christ

Waited 31 years for this  :pint:

I thought he was finished

Get a million fucks in

BBC saying ‘that is that’. We are going to lose 😁

Don’t think anyone said anything remotely close to that.

He also said nobody had scored a direct free kick when Germany had one on the edge of our box on the first half. Good commentator Guy Mowbray, but clearly not one who believes in the commentator's curse.

Plenty of negative comments and soon as he got support he delivered!

Enjoy the fucking monumental game, I told you so is a poor substitute.

Care to elaborate

you fucking beauties.

Jurgen Klinsmann, the bloke who paid the wages on the building site in  Weidersehen Pet, Boris Becker, Angela Merkel, Matchwarn Shirts, can you hear me? CAN YOUR HEAR ME? Your boys took one hell of a beating. one hell of a beating.

(once in proper battle in 47 years, got to)

It was a wonderful, wonderful moment and your first thought was to say you were right all along on the internet? It just doesn't seem like you're enjoying it if that's your step. I'm absolutely fucking delighted that Kane did what he did - I have no idea if anyone else brought on for him would have done the same but I also don't care. It's brilliant, four games, no goals conceded, we've beaten Germany 2-0. I could not be happier. I hope that's the same for everyone.

Wow! Very nervy, but what a game.

Yep just like you were quick to keep knocking a player who wasn't getting any support but is a proven goal scorer if played to his strengths

What a bunch of heroes. Sterling, Shaw in the second half, the lot of them. Phillips and Rice deserve credit for still impacting the game on yellows.

We might lose the next two games, but we will never have a better chance of making a final. Henri Delaunay's still gleaming.

Gareth Southgate: Master tactician  ;)

Well, it's one more night in Rome next.

Come on England. Bloody wonderful, hope you all enjoyed that as much as I did. Firmly giddy.

Super enjoyable and don't come around very often  :pint:

Herr Grunwold, Mr Bronson in grange Hill, born in Aberdeen 🤣🤣



Sent from my SM-A125F

Stop comparing facts to 1966 Lineker you Toby.

Was fully expecting us to lose, and despite insisting to work colleagues that I couldn’t give a toss how England fared tonight, I’m completely chuffed to bits. Fair weather r me, but who gives a shit, it’s coming come

Am I right in thinking England fans won't be allowed to travel to Rome

pretty much. isolation 5 days there and 10 when you back

It could be a flat atmosphere then

Good performance by England and deserved the win.

In a strange way the next 2 games may actually be tougher for England as the opposition are more likely to sit back and let England dominate possession and play the come and break us down game.

It’s England’s to lose now though and home advantage in the semis and final is key.

Even England couldn't transpire to lose in both the quarter-finals and the semi-finals. I mean, we'd give it a bloody good go but still.

 :pint: :pint:

Brilliant result,  one or two posters on here gone rather quiet.......

The Kane doubters have😀

You’re not suggesting anti English sympathies are afoot?

Very happy with that. Good performance. Didn't give them many chances. Got lucky with the Muller miss but they would have been lucky to be level.
Despite Southgate and our brand of football not being universally liked, in 2 tournaments he got us to the semis and at least the quarters. Unlike the golden generation, this is a team and not a collection of supposedly talented individuals.
I'm more than happy with where the national team is.
Now, more cider.

Absolutely buzzing.
I felt so nervous before the game and up until early 2nd half as we never do well against Germany.
So many demons being laid to rest by Southgate.
I thought we were flat first half, very cagey, however, 2nd half we played so well, won pretty much every header and 2nd ball and battled hard for everything. Deserved winners and will give anyone in this tournament a good game.

Just need Clem to take over for a ruddy good week :D

The one thing that teams that win tournaments do is win games when they don’t play that well.

To be fair England haven’t yet played really well, but have been able to keep clean sheets & score goals when they really need to.

Hopefully this continues until the final, and the they play a blinder & batter somebody.

Struggling to watch Sweden v Ukraine might have to watch the last 10 minutes of the second half to see how its going

Fucking still riding this, wave til Saturday at least.

If people don't think sport has an impact on the morale of a nation (or even a boost at least) then I'm not sure what Rock they live under.

Nipped out at FT to grab some more beers (skipped the pub as wasn't too sure of where was screening it and decent etc) and saw, fucking humans smiling at each other. Total strangers. Something that has been vacant for a good while. Like people actually having unconditional respect for one another.

I'm not talking people happily beered up with faux happiness. Genuine niceties. Sometimes we just need this kind of shit to lift a few grey clouds.

Fucking buzzing. No doubt it comes crashing down on Sat Eve but boy oh boy there are billions of endorphins bouncing around rigtt now. It's a nice vibe. I hope this can time well with the emergence of coming out of covid restrictions and we can continue being a bit nicer to each other!


It might just be coming home!

Cowley's predictions just as good as usual

Let's hope that England don't drop their game when playing away against lesser (than Germany) opposition

You don't half get through some beer Kevin :pint:

My slender frame is very deceptive in regards to a few scoops.

Although in truth. I don't drink that much at all any more. Just a case or two a day...   :pint:

From what I've seen so far I don't think we have much to fear from Sweden or Ukraine in the next round (famous last words!).   :suicide: :suicide:

I don't think drinking upto 48 cans or bottles a day is anything to worry about😀

One goal doesn’t not change the fact up until that point - he has not had a good tournament.

Ukraine play a lot like Swindon last season. Lots of side to side and backwards passing. So poor to watch. No ambition what so ever. I understand that kind of play if you are playing a Belgium or France but Sweden are no great team either.

Just like Shearer in 96

Very true but here's hoping its the confidence booster and catalyst he needed. Did seem a little more perkier than in the group matches today. Dropping deep did wonders really as it gave more licence to the flanks to get further up.

England are a real headache for any team because whilst they're doubling up on Kane. You have one of Sterling/Saka/Mount/Grealish/+ that you are giving space, to. Which no team wants to give any of the above any space.

Special mention to Shaw btw. He was playing like an overweight past it pro in the first half but he came to life second half. Assist for the first and laid off the ball to Grealish for the second I think. I was begging he took him off instead of Saka but Southgate made all the right calculated calls today.

The manager gets all the credit. This meant so much to him mentally too. Despite him being very reserved about it. His post match said it all. He know he let a nation down 25 years ago and even though most will have forgiven him. It's a mental monkey that he probably personally has struggled to shift.

Put that one well and truly to bed. Well done Mr Southgate!

Oh my. What a day.

Marathon and not a sprint. Lest we forget that the front wheel skid has a very suspect set of ankles and has been out injured a lot this season and all though deemed fit, is not 100% considering his age. Never the less, that was a good strikers instinctive Finnish. Who knows what lies ahead in the next game in this tournament.

I’m so drunk. What a day.

Shearer scored 23 minutes into the first game?

If anything Kane is the opposite of Shearer 96.
Kane was on good form in the lead up to the tournament but has been poor.
Shearer has been poor in the lead up to Euro 96 but was the best striker there.

Just rewatched the highlights:

a) I cannot believe Muller missed that
b) The Kane header was an incredibly difficult one. He had to lean back, head it down and cushion it all at once. Very few strikers could have done that. Fantastic

Best football day of my life.

Never known an atmosphere like it. Never known an England performance like it. We were perfect.

In 95/96 season Shearer scored 37 goals in 48 games
In 2020/21 season Kane scored 33 goals in 49 games
Very similar don't you think irrespective of performance leading upto the tournament

So what’s your point then?
You said Kane was like Shearer at Euro 96 when I claimed Kane was having a poor tournament until he scored. Shearer scored 23 minutes into the first group game. It took Kane near enough 4 games to get a goal.
So Shearer has a poor 23 minutes?! comparable with Kane who has had a poor 350ish minutes?

Anyway, not that club form was even my point.
Do England games now instead.

Shearer was on international goal drought before Euro 96 if memory serves me correctly. About 2 years.
He definitely needed a goal to get his tournament started as did Kane tonight.

What's your point? You said Shearer was in poor form leading up to the 96 tournament and was the best we had. Out of curiosity who would you have started in place of him against Germany?

Shearer was on a 2 year goal drought for England before Euro 96. So was off form for England.

I’d have certainly started Kane against Croatia & Scotland. I’d have taken him off not long into the second half against Scotland for DCL.

Any future team selections would have been based on how different the Scotland game may have turned out.

I’m out.

Since when have you been one of the Dragons? This is a new revelation to me  :pint:

#MyOfferIsEightyPercentOfTheBusinessForOneGrand

Don't lie. The first time you realised you was an unconditionally supporting Town fan was the best ;)

Think I spotted you on the telly Tel.

Is DV Geoff the Ref?

I know you're on a high because you were there but performance wise I don't think we were great. Solid enough and did the job. Atmosphere sounded and looked fantastic though, better half full than it is full (although it didn't seem half full at all!)

Uuuuh. My head!

I enjoyed the game despite the seemingly passive line up. I’m not sure the performance was that great, but a win is still a win and it seems many teams play this new brand of international football where they play not to lose. It’s dull, but it works.

I might think Southgate is incredibly limited, but he’s proven to know more than me and we might yet win it. My overriding fear is that this talented group of players will be wasted by him.

When the 2nd half was drifting listlessly towards the doldrums, I raised the question as to the value of Kane's contribution and whether he could be a candidate to be subbed, notwithstanding being a banker to take a pen if necessary.

Although disappointed with his contribution, I reluctantly accepted that his finishing quality was such that he should stay on.  He played exactly the right pass in the build up to Sterling's goal and then finally turned our nerves into euphoria with a striker's run and finish on 85'.

It was indeed about quality in the end yesterday.  

Really, Shearer scored after about 20 mins of the first game, Kane has taken about 300 mins to get of the mark.

It will be great if he goes on from here & ends up the tournament top scorer as Shearer did.

Nobody around me thought it was a masterclass*, that's for sure. People started getting a little anxious on 60 minutes with shouting at attacking players and calls for subs (nothing different to any game).

Think think the combination of many people's first game with a decent crowed in 15 months and the whole history with Germany was a loving and lethal mix.

* Swashbuckling/the stereotypical positive stuff. It was a solid plan by Southgate but a nervy one.

I understand the comparison. Southgate sticking with Kane despite his baron spell

In hindsight it could be the best decision of the comp if he hits form now as he was clearly suffering some dip in confidence. Like shearer we need to remember Kane isn't some flash in the pan he is the real deal and will come good again

It’s funny how the result changes everyone’s perspective, at half time many people were slagging off the team selection and Southgate, Win 2-0 & it’s the best game ever.

Personally, the 4-1 win over the Dutch in 96 was better, in fact possibly the best an England team performance I can remember.

I believe that was as good as that team could play, with this team I think they could play better than they did last night, and I really hope they do

I thought England did well. Muller had to score. That may have changed the game.

Ukraine will be difficult, but England are the strongest team in the last '4' of their route to the final.

If they don't get to the final, especially with most games at Wembley (apart from Sat) then would that be classed as disappointment?

I love the idea of people watching with their arms folded saying 'well its not as good as [insert game here]'.

If no thrills, slow and steady wins the race gets England through the rounds then I'm all for it.

There will come a time when the game plan is compromised and that's when we'll need to see how Southgate deals with it because he failed versus Croatia but until then just enjoy the progress.

What worries me is how the team would perform if we went a goal down, surely it would change the style that we are currently playing?

Well, that was an interesting read back - it seems Southgate might have a semblence of a clue after all.  Great defensive display first half, not so much going forward.  Maguire, Stones, Walker, Rice and Philips gave the strong defensive performance needed.

Grealish for Saka at the right time, Saka was dead on his feet, and that was the introduction that picked the German lock.  For tournament football against the Germans, the selection and game management from Southgate was spot on.

After the doldrums of the past 18 months, some on here need to relearn to enjoy football again and avoid petty arguements on a football forum whilst football history is playing out in front of your eyes..

Life is too short people..

On reading back this thread is definitely a thread of two halves  :D :D

For me the game was slow and we were ponderous on the counter until Greaish came on.

I am not suggesting he is "the great white hope" but things started happening and the pace picked up in attack. Saka showed loads of potential but his final ball is not yet consistant enough, but it will be. Grealish has a far better final ball.

For the first 2 England games I saw him I thought Phillis was slow, too heavy in the tackle and only sidewats passing but in this tournament hes been the 2nd best player for me, he has really grown on me and was one of our best performers last night IMO.

The other player who has really impressed me was Pickford, hes turned into a great international keeper, his shot stopping and distribution have been a highlight.

I think we were all thinking it wasn't going to be our night right up until the 1st goal went in, it was end to end but the germans seemed to have the upper hand for long periods.

The other turning point was Muller missing the easy chance to equalize, I was cheering that like it was a goal.

Its not great to watch, its slow and dull but we have the players to beat any team when they are on form, I just wish we played a little more gung ho when attacking, taking a few risks rather than trying to walk the ball in the net.

Ukraine will be by no means a walk over but what a route to the final we have got.

Knife edge for Southgate the results are doing the trick for him.

Lost last night and he would of been slated for sticking with a very very poor Harry Kane who has often left us looking like a ten man side.

But we won...so who cares?

I hope we dish up slow ponderous wins all the way through and lift the cup!!!

Someone is getting carried away, it wasn't even close to a great performance, it was solid at best.

Like this, you mean! You’re not dinging any more. 1.22 sec in

https://www.ruptly.tv/en/videos/20210629-079-Germany--Fans-watch-in-despair-as-national-team-loses-Euro-2020-match-to-England

I am still very happy about life.

Still can't believe Muller missed though, that was Austin-v-Millwall levels of sliding doors moment I think.

Absolutely, only  matched with the 5-1 away win in Germany in 2001 but of course that wasn't at the final stages. Both far better all round performances than last night.


:D

I think what we need to take into consideration is that if we play the gung ho attacking football everyone wants we will be in trouble. Our 2 midfielders are not good enough in a team that plays like that and at times are really exposed.

I would go against the grain and suggest if anything last night we were a defensive midfielder short at times

I still think Henderson offers more to the team than Rice defensively and going forwards, not fully gung ho but attacking with a bit more impetus and pace and actually shooting would be nice (barring 1 shot from Sterling) we rarely offered a shot outside the 6 yard box.

As it is it did the job, it didn't excel in the win but the result must come first I guess.

Agreed, strangely I remember both of those games vividly but not really for footballing reasons;

Netherlands 1996 I didn't actually watch the game on the telly as it was the day I got my finals results at Uni and we ended up spending the day playing football and getting pissed on the beach at Tynemouth.

Germany 2001 My brothers wedding day so ended up watching the game in a side room at the reception where they had set up a telly. I had been made redundant the day before so watched the game drowning my sorrows with my mum (who didn't drink) and then we got locked out of our hotel! Flew to Sweden a couple of days later to stay with my other brother (not like I had to get back to work) and then 9/11 happened!

I suspect that Henderson might replace Rice if he is fit enough, I think fans need to get a better handle that swash buckling football while nice on the eye rarely wins, spoken as someone who lived in Newcastle through the Keegan years!

I am not advocating shwashbuckling, just a bit more attacking flair, when you start the game with a goalkeeper, 5 defenders and 2 defensive midfielders than just maybe your forward players should be looking at taking just a few more risks with shots rather than walking the ball into the net?

^^^^  yep

T'wasn't aimed at you, more fans generally.....

I think any of the slighty educated fans will know that balls out attacking very very rarely works in any football let alone international football, all I ask is a little more creation of chances.

When you have Grealish, Sterling, Sancho, Saka, Foden, Mount, Rashford and Calvert-Lewin then I think its an embarressment of riches in attack yet we seem to have created so little so far in the 4 games, I fully understand why some fans are asking that question though.

For me I have no problem with the attacking 3 players in Kane, Sterling and Saka but none seem to take even the remotest risk looking to play a safe pass, unlike Grealish who loves to run at players and take them on and go past them inviting the foul and Foden who loves to have a pop at goal from outside the box, I think Sterlings shot from 20 yards must have been pretty much our first long range effort this tournament, or close to it.

All that matters is the result. Yeah it wasn't perfect, but it was a convincing win in the end. If we don't win it this year then we never will. Big chance it comes home

It definitely wasn't a mind blowing attacking performance, but it was an excellent one defensively and in controlling the game - particularly the tweak after ten minutes to drop Sterling a little deeper and help the midfield who were being overrun and then replacing Saka with Grealish changing up our attack. In-game tactical tweaks aren't really what I'd consider Southgate's strength, so the fact that he made a couple that clearly affected the game is a real bonus. We're definitely not especially strong going forward, but we haven't conceded a single goal - against teams that have scored 3 past Spain, 4 past Portugal and 2 past the Netherlands. And Scotland.

This is a very strong defensive team with enough quality up front to nick the winner. I'd back that side to go much further than a Sven team that's trying to shoehorn the 11 most famous players into just about any formation. We're a bit like Nuno's Wolves of two years back really, and that's not the worst thing to be in an international tournament - Kane, Sterling and Saka as Jiminez, Jota and Traore.

Which reminds me of a story that is mildly amusing.

My late nan was German. Which obviously means we have German relatives.
Thorsten (RIP) was such a relative. He used to visit England a lot.

One day he and his father (also RIP) were driving from the airport to my nans in Gloucester and needed to stop for a pee in the services.

They must have spoken to each other in German while pee'ing. Next thing a guy in there was all "we won, we won, we won"

(Thorsten thinks "oh no not the war...again")

"we won, we won"

(Thorsten think "isn't it time to let it go?" )

"we won, we won. 5-1 even Heskey scored, 5-1, eeeeeven Heskey scored..."

Don't mention der Sieg, herr Batch.

Von Batch  :)

Reminds me of the time we watched a world Cup game in Trier, Germany.

Whilst hunting for a cab back to Luxembourg myself and 2 mates spent a good 5 minutes singing the "5-1 even Heskey scored" song to the chagrin of the locals. Thankfully we found and jumped into a taxi before some of the more angry locals got pissed off and started running towards us. We'd have been battered had that taxi not been there at that time!!

I had a 5-1 Tee shirt back in the day.

Agree with this for all of our other games so far, bar last night.  I think the overly defensive approach to the first half of the game was spot on, and the timing of the tweaks with Grealish, Sterling, Saka and Henderson made it the perfect tactical display against a German side that in the first 15 mins looked like they were going to dominate us.

I would definately like to see a less conservative selection against Ukraine, there is an opportunity there to blow them out of the water early and capitalise on what looked like a team that is tired and carrying a few knocks based on what I saw last night.  Our lack of travelling has certainly improved our chances of going long into this tournament - you don't often get that opportunity so we should take full advantage of it.

When was the last time that we beat one of the bigger boys, inside 90 minutes, in a knock-out game?

Must be a World Cup, because it’s never happened in the Euros

I guess it depends who you you class as bigger boys, but I guess Belgium in 1990

I still have mine.

Germany 1 (A German)

England   5 (M Owen 3, S Gerrard, E Heskey)

Maybe I should wear it under my England shirt in a Biergarten here on Saturday...

1966?