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Author Topic: Something going on in Reading  (Read 2331 times)
JBZ

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« Reply #15 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 10:40:28 »

You actually posting something positive would be a start. Hardly knew jerk,  I've thought it for years.

I am not sure that posters on a (loosely) football related forum can offer anything that will result in a paradigm shift on matters such as crime, law and order and penology.
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4D

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« Reply #16 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 11:03:29 »

I've never quite got the tougher sentences being preventative argument for crimes like murder - I think it stands for 'smaller' crimes that people might convince themselves are harmless or worth the risk like drugs or financial crimes, but surely nobody is making a logical decision on committing murder being worth the sentence, whatever that sentence is. I can see the argument from a "we as a society want to punish this person and prevent them re-offending" but not that it would actually stop the first crime.

To reduce the number of events, proper investment into mental health and social services would seem a good place to start. It stands to reason that if you cut these things to the bone, people who are dangerous are more likely to fall through the cracks and people who might become dangerous are less likely to be turned away from that.

In general terms anyway, we don't know anything about this specific event yet.

Something needs to be done, when you read a story about a fella who has dozens of previous and gets to go on a course instead of being jailed for burglary, makes me think that the person hasn't changed with the soft approach. They're just laughing at the judicial system.
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ibelieveinmrreeves
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« Reply #17 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 11:08:38 »

Something needs to be done, when you read a story about a fella who has dozens of previous and gets to go on a course instead of being jailed for burglary, makes me think that the person hasn't changed with the soft approach. They're just laughing at the judicial system.

That's not what he said though.

Quote
tougher sentences being preventative argument for crimes like murder - I think it stands for 'smaller' crimes that people might convince themselves are harmless or worth the risk like drugs or financial crimes,

The career burglar is pre-meditated, and may well 'benefit' from harsher sentencing.

The 'soft approach' as you so loadedly put it, would take some of the pressure off of our over-stretched police.

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JBZ

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« Reply #18 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 11:09:41 »

Something needs to be done, when you read a story about a fella who has dozens of previous and gets to go on a course instead of being jailed for burglary, makes me think that the person hasn't changed with the soft approach. They're just laughing at the judicial system.

I thought the debate concerned knife crime?
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4D

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« Reply #19 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 11:11:31 »

Fines could also do with being stronger for things like fly tipping, vandalism, criminal damage, driving without insurance etc.
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JBZ

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« Reply #20 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 11:14:12 »

Fines could also do with being stronger for things like fly tipping, vandalism, criminal damage, driving without insurance etc.

I suspect that the majority of these offences are undetected. If so, I suspect that this will have limited impact.
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4D

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« Reply #21 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 11:15:47 »

I thought the debate concerned knife crime?

The chances of appearing in court is about the only stat declining
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Peter Venkman

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« Reply #22 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 11:20:32 »

I see it IS being classed as a terroist attack now, a Libyan national arrested.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/jun/21/reading-stabbings-libyan-held-after-three-killed-in-park-attack
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JBZ

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« Reply #23 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 11:22:30 »

The chances of appearing in court is about the only stat declining

Where did the link to the BBC website go?
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Bogus Dave
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« Reply #24 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 12:49:53 »

Yes, where the murder rate in New York is now lower than London. London's increasing and New York's decreasing.

I mean, that’s just plainly not true is it

https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/18/world/london-us-cities-homicide-rates-comparison-intl-gbr/index.html
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Bogus Dave
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« Reply #25 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 12:52:15 »

The chances of appearing in court is about the only stat declining

And this will be entirely down to ten years of the ‘tough on crime’ Tory party systematically underfunding the courts and legal system
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StfcRusty

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« Reply #26 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 13:04:52 »

The chances of appearing in court is about the only stat declining

In England and Wales, there are minimum custodial sentences for anyone aged 16 or over caught with a knife in the following circumstances:

i. Threatening: They are convicted of using the knife to threaten another person where that person is at immediate risk of serious physical harm

ii. Repeat offenders: They are convicted of carrying a knife in a public place or on school premises, and they have at least one previous "relevant conviction" of possession a weapon or threatening people with a weapon

In these cases, offenders aged 18 or over would be sentenced to a minimum six months' custodial sentence and a maximum 4 years. For those aged 16 or 17 the minimum sentence is a detention and training order of at least four months.
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Flashheart

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« Reply #27 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 13:14:18 »

The secret barrister on twitter gives lots of insights.

Apparently the justice system is on its knees. Buidings are falling apart, there are not enough courtrooms, cases keep on having to be postponed to due a lack of staff/facilities, and so on.

Then there's the havey police cuts. I remember one copper pleading with May to not make heavy cuts because it wil mean they can no longer be proactive. It seems that is exactly what happened.

Must be Sadiq Khan's fault, though.
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The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey

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« Reply #28 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 13:42:09 »

Another few thousand coppers along with an iron fist approach to sentencing isn’t going to change a thing.

If young adults, in London especially, want to stab other young adults there’s some tough debates and unpopular decisions to be made about the reasons why.
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StfcRusty

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« Reply #29 on: Sunday, June 21, 2020, 14:22:12 »

Another few thousand coppers along with an iron fist approach to sentencing isn’t going to change a thing.

If young adults, in London especially, want to stab other young adults there’s some tough debates and unpopular decisions to be made about the reasons why.

Equality of education and an actual meritocracy would make a huge difference.

If you banned private education, just see how quickly investment in state schools would improve when the elite are unable to send their kids to Eton, Harrow and the like.

It will never happen of course but removing the tax-free status from private schools (the fact it even exists is mental) and investing the money saved into education programmes, would certainly help.
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