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« Reply #7500 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 12:49:58 »

I think 'at the earliest' has slipped by a lot of people which was my original point a couple of pages ago!
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horlock07

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« Reply #7501 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 12:54:34 »

I think 'at the earliest' has slipped by a lot of people which was my original point a couple of pages ago!

Who reads the detail, and who reads the headlines on the front of the Mail, Sun etc.
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Panda Paws
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« Reply #7502 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 12:57:10 »

and who reads the headlines on the front of the Mail, Sun etc.

Bingo.
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donkey
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« Reply #7503 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 13:03:51 »

I think 'at the earliest' has slipped by a lot of people which was my original point a couple of pages ago!

It's the same with MINIMUM added time at end of a football match.
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pauld
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« Reply #7504 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 13:08:08 »

And this is my main problem with the dates. If they waited an extra month, two months to send the kids back so that the teachers could be vaccinated then I'd think the dates were more realistic and I'd feel a lot more positive about it.
Scotland had younger kids back in yesterday and are waiting to see the impact of that before fully reopening schools rather than going all out big bang. That might have been a better way for the rest of the UK.
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pauld
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« Reply #7505 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 13:09:44 »

I think 'at the earliest' has slipped by a lot of people which was my original point a couple of pages ago!
Agree, although as PP and horlock pointed out, a lot of it also has to do with how it is briefed (because that is how a lot of people will get the details) which may not always align with the actual plan.  I think the 5-week gap between each stage is a really positive aspect of the easing this time round, it allows enough time for the impact of each phase to be assessed before moving on to the next. In stark contrast to last summer's "Shit or Bust/Boris saved summer" approach. I very much hope they stick to it.
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« Reply #7506 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 14:39:50 »

Given the shit show most Western countries have made of it, the vaccine effort by the UK and lesser extent USA, plus the more robust plan for moving towards 'normality' is actually quite refreshing.

I think they could have thrown a bit more weight around the tentative nature of the dates and focused in much more on the WHY those dates are tentative, but broadly speaking it actually looks coherent.

The vaccine data is giving the path out - the fact it seems to stop infection as well as serious illness even after just one dose.  That combined with getting the current level of infection under control have dove tailed well.  The logic seems sounds now - infection under control, ensure you can properly suppress outbreaks through mass testing (UK is doing a good job here now, still nothing like it over here) and then the vaccine distribution speed means you are getting the most at risk population covered quickly, followed by the rest.  The delays in opening are geared to stop rampant spread and provide enough time for the vaccine to continue reducing the transmission vectors.

Maybe in the future people in Western Govt's will watch Monsters Inc, "2319!"  Most of what they need for pandemic planning is covered there.  Treat it like it will go this way again, early.
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Aaron Aardvark

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« Reply #7507 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 14:48:51 »

Treat it like it will go this way again, early.
Absolutely this. If nothing else comes of this shitshow, govts must now have proper plans in place to prepare for the next pandemic. And the next. And the next. Until we stop fucking up the natural world, this is going to be an ongoing and ever-worsening cycle. Still, at least if we wipe ourselves out with a supervirus, it will stop us wiping out the rest of the natural world with climate change.
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horlock07

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« Reply #7508 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 15:08:41 »

Absolutely this. If nothing else comes of this shitshow, govts must now take note of and adhere to the have proper plans they already have in place to prepare for the next pandemic. And the next. And the next. Until we stop fucking up the natural world, this is going to be an ongoing and ever-worsening cycle. Still, at least if we wipe ourselves out with a supervirus, it will stop us wiping out the rest of the natural world with climate change.

Corrected for you....

We already had a robust plan in place, other countries followed our blueprint and proved it worked very well, our shambles ignored it and killed a load of the population.
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horlock07

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« Reply #7509 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 15:54:49 »

Just one general thing which has popped up today via The New Statesman. After all the pictures of last year, no outbreaks were ever identified associated with people going to beaches last year.
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« Reply #7510 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 16:32:16 »

Just one general thing which has popped up today via The New Statesman. After all the pictures of last year, no outbreaks were ever identified associated with people going to beaches last year.

Have often wondered the same about the other outdoor events which were attributed to CV outbreaks e.g Atalanta v Valencia, Liverpool v Atletico or even Cheltenham races. Suspect any transmission would have been in the crowded pubs, bars, transport, etc rather than in the open-air stadium watching the event itself.
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pauld
Aaron Aardvark

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« Reply #7511 on: Tuesday, February 23, 2021, 18:35:03 »

Corrected for you....

We already had a robust plan in place, other countries followed our blueprint and proved it worked very well, our shambles ignored it and killed a load of the population.
Yes, although I was talking more generally really. As in globally, we should expect more pandemics, not necessarily coronavirus-based, unless and until we start to look at how and why there's been a rash of such outbreaks in the past few decades and change the way we interact with the natural world.
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