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Author Topic: Wellens interview in the Grauniad  (Read 3969 times)
Reg Smeeton
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« Reply #30 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 15:04:39 »

That may be a reasonable explanation. Although I’d imagine any compo would be less than his worth if he wasn’t OOC.

We signed James Collins and TAH in similar circumstances Tribunal rated Collins at £140K a bargain.... TAH at 200K a waste of money.
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Reg Smeeton
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« Reply #31 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 15:08:00 »

Sorry, but I'm struggling to see the difference - if we'd shifted DT he'd have had a larger budget but we couldn't so he didn't? So he stretched the budget a bit further with loans. Also probably an element of "Try before you buy" I suspect

A classic case of a poster actually agreeing, but preferring to argue with themselves in an empty room.....  it's very lucky manager who has a fully fuinctioning squad of fit and firing players without at least a bit of deadwood wastage
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« Reply #32 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 15:23:35 »

Sorry, but I'm struggling to see the difference - if we'd shifted DT he'd have had a larger budget but we couldn't so he didn't? So he stretched the budget a bit further with loans. Also probably an element of "Try before you buy" I suspect
Yeah, maybe that was badly thought out...... Wink

With the budget he had he could obviously have bought some permanent strikers. He chose, instead, to get the 2 on loan that were cheaper and higher quality than what he could have got if he had opted for permanent signings. He could have bought either one and not got in Isgrove, for example. Personally, I think he did well to get all the players in that he did, whether on permanent deals or on loan. And if he manages to offload Toums, which I would presume is the intention, the money that is freed up could well pay for one of them on a perm.

It's nonsense to suggest we can't afford any strikers, which is how Reg interpreted Wellens' remark.
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« Reply #33 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 15:24:40 »

A classic case of a poster actually agreeing, but preferring to argue with themselves in an empty room.....  it's very lucky manager who has a fully fuinctioning squad of fit and firing players without at least a bit of deadwood wastage
Except I didn't agree with you.
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pauld


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« Reply #34 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 15:37:44 »

Yeah, maybe that was badly thought out...... Wink

With the budget he had he could obviously have bought some permanent strikers. He chose, instead, to get the 2 on loan that were cheaper and higher quality than what he could have got if he had opted for permanent signings. He could have bought either one and not got in Isgrove, for example. Personally, I think he did well to get all the players in that he did, whether on permanent deals or on loan. And if he manages to offload Toums, which I would presume is the intention, the money that is freed up could well pay for one of them on a perm.

It's nonsense to suggest we can't afford any strikers, which is how Reg interpreted Wellens' remark.
Fair enough, although I don't think Reg was saying we couldn't afford *any* strikers. I still don't see that his interpretation was unreasonable tbh, fact is we were able to afford the squad we have (and even then I seem to remember Power, Wellens or both saying we'd stretched it to get Doyle in) by getting Yates and Doyle in on loan, we might not have been able to if we'd had to make perm moves for both of them. Hopefully one or both can be made perm in Jan. I think we're all on the same page here!
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« Reply #35 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 15:56:44 »

Also probably an element of "Try before you buy" I suspect

I agree that this seems to be the policy.  And there is obviously logic to it when you are a club with limited finances.

Problem is that by the time we can see for sure that they are worth buying so can everyone else and the price goes up, usually beyond our means.  We therefore get stuck in a cycle of short terms loans. 

I'd love to see a squad that stays reasonably intact for a few years that we could identify with and really get behind.  I guess that is unrealistic, however, in the current financial reality for small clubs.
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RobertT


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« Reply #36 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 16:02:22 »

Surely this is just basic math?

Buy a player who is in contract - need to at least match existing contract, if not higher to tempt them fro current security.  Plus you may need to pay off the existing club - either transfer fees or cover any contractual bonuses the player may be leaving behind.

Loan a player - pay at most what they earn today, maybe less if the other club is keen to free-up some wages but not as fussed about selling the player.

Therefore, better quality available on loan for same funds.  We end up with a Yates and Doyle frontline and not a Norris and Mullin that we owned two years ago (not saying they are terrible, well maybe I am with Norris, but so far the quality looks better in the 2019 vintage).

Simple, isn't it?
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The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey


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« Reply #37 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 16:09:53 »

Yet both Mullin and Doris cost c £100k apparently. I suppose if you’re paying that sort of fee, wages would be commensurate.

Truth is, us fans never really know what financial shenanigans go on around signing players.
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« Reply #38 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 16:41:51 »

The other thing to bear in mind is both Doyle and Yates have been based up North - it’s one thing moving down to Swindon for a few months on loan, a longer term move may be more difficult to secure, especially if they have a young family. Once out of contract they may be able to get a more “attractive” offer in their preferred locality - they would probably want higher wages to come down here than they would take up there.

On the original subject, I think Wellens has done well so far - he knows how he wants to play and has signed payers who will fit into that plan. He has taken a slight punt on one or two who have had injury problems previously, but this as increased the quality in the squad. Inevitably if he is offered championship money he will take it (it would bring him and his family a level of financial security a league 2 manager won’t get) and the location of his family may also be a factor (as it was with Flitcroft- but thank goodness he jumped, as that season’s hoof ball was the most sterile football I can recall at the CG since the Ken Beamish era.)

I am optimistic we will have a good season, but we will have a better idea how good (eg challenging for championship, automatic promotion or play offs) after 15 - 20 games rather than 7. Injuries to the “wrong players” could impact on that too. I’d also remind us all that the modern way is to over react to a single defeat or victory rather than looking at the bigger picture. Keep calm and try to take a season long perspective - it will be less stressful that way!
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« Reply #39 on: Wednesday, September 11, 2019, 22:28:06 »

See, I don’t think Rovrum rate him at all. Loaned out to Carlisle last season and us this. And he’s OOC at the end of this season and would go for nowt. It’s a strange scenario why they would loan a player for a season when they’ll get nothing for him. I suspect there may be a ‘buy’ clause in January.

See Sid Nelson. My thoughts were similar re:OoC, go for nowt/nominal. I thought we were nailed on to get him but football moves fast and I made an error of judgement there.
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Reg Smeeton
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« Reply #40 on: Thursday, September 19, 2019, 11:59:19 »

It's nonsense to suggest we can't afford any strikers, which is how Reg interpreted Wellens' remark.

 a bit more from Wellens....

 
Quote
Wellens also confirmed that Town’s playing budget isn’t at a sufficient level to attract strikers of Doyle and Yates’ calibre on a permanent basis.

He added: “With the money we’ve got, we can’t afford to sign Eoin Doyle on a permanent basis – hence the reason why we’ve got him in on loan.”

I suppose you'll still carry on arguing that we could have afforded Doyle.....

Further Wellens says that Bantams can recall Doyle in Jan.
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Exiled Bob


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« Reply #41 on: Thursday, September 19, 2019, 15:25:35 »

a bit more from Wellens....

 
I suppose you'll still carry on arguing that we could have afforded Doyle.....

Further Wellens says that Bantams can recall Doyle in Jan.

Let it go Reg. You're beginning to sound like a bitter and twisted old cunt.
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Red Frog
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« Reply #42 on: Thursday, September 19, 2019, 15:48:00 »

Let it go Reg. You're beginning to sound like a bitter and twisted old cunt.

Bit rich non?  Wink
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« Reply #43 on: Thursday, September 19, 2019, 15:50:41 »

Then why was Wellens praising Power for financing and getting the deal done a few weeks ago?

Also he said only a week or so ago he wasn’t concerned about the 2 strikers being loans.

Either he’s bending with the wind or he’s using the old ‘we’re skint, do us a deal’ scenario.

He does contradict himself at regular intervals I must say.
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Reg Smeeton
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« Reply #44 on: Thursday, September 19, 2019, 15:53:08 »

Let it go Reg. You're beginning to sound like a bitter and twisted old cunt.

So  you think it's OK to accuse me of negativity and having some sort of way of twisting facts to support a narrative, whatever that is. and then not expect some sort of comback when evidence is there, for supporting what I do which is observe and then interpret.

Not how I understand debate.
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