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Author Topic: Let's Get Political!  (Read 1996213 times)
Ironside
Wir müssen die Liberalen ausrotten

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« Reply #405 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 18:45:47 »

Yes, not unexpected after we had to bail out the bankers and hedge fund operators after the 2008 global crash.
True. It's not even as if the British Government had some kind of contingency fund or something, you know, just in case their imaginary banishment of boom and bust might not have happened to be the case...
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Genius, Gentleman Explorer, French Cabaret Chantoose  and Small Bets Placed and someone who knows who they are changed my signature but its only know that I can be arsed to change it....and I mean all the spelling mistakes.

Was it me? It can't have been an interesting enough event for me to remember - fB.
Arriba

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« Reply #406 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 19:21:08 »

I know, anyone with of age knows it, anyone brought up through the 'Labour years' should be able to see it.  Yet some on here keep voting for them!
I was a kid during Thatcher's years. A kid on the breadline. Wearing clothes from jumble sales, my cousins passed on items and my mum going without meals so my siblings and I could eat. We were so poor as my mother fled the marital home due to an abusive husband. This was a house that she saved the deposit to buy and until leaving lived in a desirable part of town. From that point it was a harsh reality of living under a cruel and heartless Tory government. They are doing exactly the same thing now to people in a similar position and this is 30 odd years later. I will never vote for those bastards. Ever!
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Ironside
Wir müssen die Liberalen ausrotten

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« Reply #407 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 19:42:26 »

I was a kid during Thatcher's years. A kid on the breadline. Wearing clothes from jumble sales, my cousins passed on items and my mum going without meals so my siblings and I could eat. We were so poor as my mother fled the marital home due to an abusive husband. This was a house that she saved the deposit to buy and until leaving lived in a desirable part of town. From that point it was a harsh reality of living under a cruel and heartless Tory government. They are doing exactly the same thing now to people in a similar position and this is 30 odd years later. I will never vote for those bastards. Ever!
Yep. She's still dead and hasn't been in charge for 20 years. Any solutions you fancy putting forward or is it all a dead woman's fault?
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Genius, Gentleman Explorer, French Cabaret Chantoose  and Small Bets Placed and someone who knows who they are changed my signature but its only know that I can be arsed to change it....and I mean all the spelling mistakes.

Was it me? It can't have been an interesting enough event for me to remember - fB.
RobertT

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« Reply #408 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 19:46:53 »

Do immigrants take our jobs or fleece our benefits system?  Not sure which is the one I'm supposed to be angered by?

Banks - should they have been left to fold?  I think they probably should have been.  Would have wiped out a load of "savings" (investments really, and if your bank gambles it, that's the risk you take even if it is normally less risky than shares).

Social Housing - should we be building social housing stock rather than funding housing benefit?  It's a yes for me, investment in infrastructure equals jobs, reduced benefit reliance = reduced govt admin burden = equals reduced jobs, so it will al come our in the wash but it helps people.

Private housing - should it receive any kind of stimulus from governments?  Why should prices always go up?  Always ways onto the ladder, nobody makes people move into a house of their own or make them live in the South East.

Tax - should we remove taxation for anyone claiming benefits today, but also remove the benefits - why administer taking money and then giving it back?  I'd say so.  If I receive benefits while earning, why am I being taxed at the same time, equal them out.

Tax - should those earning more pay more, than they do today?  Yes.

There's a few "debates" to be had.  Unfortunately a party system makes these tough to combine, that's my problem with our democracy.  Let me vote for policies I want and maybe intelligent people to administer them?
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Ironside
Wir müssen die Liberalen ausrotten

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« Reply #409 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 19:47:40 »

I was a kid during Thatcher's years. A kid on the breadline. Wearing clothes from jumble sales, my cousins passed on items and my mum going without meals so my siblings and I could eat. We were so poor as my mother fled the marital home due to an abusive husband. This was a house that she saved the deposit to buy and until leaving lived in a desirable part of town. From that point it was a harsh reality of living under a cruel and heartless Tory government. They are doing exactly the same thing now to people in a similar position and this is 30 odd years later. I will never vote for those bastards. Ever!
Having read your post again, it's fair to say that your upbringing has less to do with Mrs T and more to do with an abusive and ultimately absent father.

Stop blaming someone else and take some responsibility for yourself.

Fucking loser.
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Genius, Gentleman Explorer, French Cabaret Chantoose  and Small Bets Placed and someone who knows who they are changed my signature but its only know that I can be arsed to change it....and I mean all the spelling mistakes.

Was it me? It can't have been an interesting enough event for me to remember - fB.
RobertT

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« Reply #410 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 19:48:35 »

Yep. She's still dead and hasn't been in charge for 20 years. Any solutions you fancy putting forward or is it all a dead woman's fault?
Well you were the one raking up history, seems fair to bring other controversial figures into the debate.

While we are on history, why do people who voted into Europe get so agitated by it?  The Rome Treaty clearly outlined the path it should take as an ideal - if you don't bother to read up on it, you take your chances.
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Ironside
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« Reply #411 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 19:58:49 »

Do immigrants take our jobs or fleece our benefits system?  Not sure which is the one I'm supposed to be angered by?

Banks - should they have been left to fold?  I think they probably should have been.  Would have wiped out a load of "savings" (investments really, and if your bank gambles it, that's the risk you take even if it is normally less risky than shares).

Social Housing - should we be building social housing stock rather than funding housing benefit?  It's a yes for me, investment in infrastructure equals jobs, reduced benefit reliance = reduced govt admin burden = equals reduced jobs, so it will al come our in the wash but it helps people.

Private housing - should it receive any kind of stimulus from governments?  Why should prices always go up?  Always ways onto the ladder, nobody makes people move into a house of their own or make them live in the South East.

Tax - should we remove taxation for anyone claiming benefits today, but also remove the benefits - why administer taking money and then giving it back?  I'd say so.  If I receive benefits while earning, why am I being taxed at the same time, equal them out.

Tax - should those earning more pay more, than they do today?  Yes.

There's a few "debates" to be had.  Unfortunately a party system makes these tough to combine, that's my problem with our democracy.  Let me vote for policies I want and maybe intelligent people to administer them?

Unskilled immigrants take entry level employment opportunities from the native, partially skilled population and, when they come from an economy that has invested in education for their population, they leave that economy with a skills deficiency. When they arrive in a higher-wage economy, and consider themselves, and are considered by the government of that economy to be transient, they will have a negative effect on the wages of the existing population. The simple fact is that a transient workforce doesn't have the same commitments financially that the local population have.

Other than that, I broadly agree. There's a fucking suprise!
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Genius, Gentleman Explorer, French Cabaret Chantoose  and Small Bets Placed and someone who knows who they are changed my signature but its only know that I can be arsed to change it....and I mean all the spelling mistakes.

Was it me? It can't have been an interesting enough event for me to remember - fB.
Arriba

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« Reply #412 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 20:06:51 »

Yep. She's still dead and hasn't been in charge for 20 years. Any solutions you fancy putting forward or is it all a dead woman's fault?
the same thing is happening now. Different leader, same party.
Having read your post again, it's fair to say that your upbringing has less to do with Mrs T and more to do with an abusive and ultimately absent father.

Stop blaming someone else and take some responsibility for yourself.

Fucking loser.

My upbringing was great and full of love despite an absent father and my mum being skint. I'm not sure how a 4 year old could take responsibility?

Dunno how I'm a loser? Is it because I have a different view to you or because my mum got sick of being a punchbag and took herself and kids away from that situation?
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Ironside
Wir müssen die Liberalen ausrotten

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« Reply #413 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 20:08:33 »

Well you were the one raking up history, seems fair to bring other controversial figures into the debate.

While we are on history, why do people who voted into Europe get so agitated by it?  The Rome Treaty clearly outlined the path it should take as an ideal - if you don't bother to read up on it, you take your chances.

Well the last referendum on Europe happened before most people who post on this forum were born. In fact, I'm almost 40 and my father wasn't even old enough to participate in that referendum.

That referendum incidentally was mis-sold. Everyone who was there at the time says so an they all agree they were blagged into an economic treaty which has since morphed into a political treaty.

It's about time the current generation asserted their rights, which as far as I'm concerned (and my father), means a vote.
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Genius, Gentleman Explorer, French Cabaret Chantoose  and Small Bets Placed and someone who knows who they are changed my signature but its only know that I can be arsed to change it....and I mean all the spelling mistakes.

Was it me? It can't have been an interesting enough event for me to remember - fB.
Ironside
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« Reply #414 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 20:10:37 »

the same thing is happening now. Different leader, same party.
My upbringing was great and full of love despite an absent father and my mum being skint. I'm not sure how a 4 year old could take responsibility?

Dunno how I'm a loser? Is it because I have a different view to you or because my mum got sick of being a punchbag and took herself and kids away from that situation?
A four year old can't 'take responsibility'. A grown man, which you apparantly are can.
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Genius, Gentleman Explorer, French Cabaret Chantoose  and Small Bets Placed and someone who knows who they are changed my signature but its only know that I can be arsed to change it....and I mean all the spelling mistakes.

Was it me? It can't have been an interesting enough event for me to remember - fB.
Nemo
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« Reply #415 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 20:11:43 »

Can we have a political thread that doesn't involve Ironside and Paul (Okay, not Paul at the moment, but I'm sure he's firing himself up...) posting text walls at eachother about how their side makes everyone free cakes and the other side punches babies please? It's tiresome and you're about as likely to change eachothers' minds as you are to turn into pumpkins.
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Arriba

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« Reply #416 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 20:16:38 »

A four year old can't 'take responsibility'. A grown man, which you apparantly are can.
How am I not taking responsibility for myself currently then? I'd argue I am taking my responsibilities seriously enough and who are you to conclude I'm not, and how?
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Reg Smeeton
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« Reply #417 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 20:23:23 »

Well the last referendum on Europe happened before most people who post on this forum were born. In fact, I'm almost 40 and my father wasn't even old enough to participate in that referendum.

That referendum incidentally was mis-sold. Everyone who was there at the time says so an they all agree they were blagged into an economic treaty which has since morphed into a political treaty.

It's about time the current generation asserted their rights, which as far as I'm concerned (and my father), means a vote.

I remember the last EU referendum, being in 1975...so your old man must have been very young.  At the time Labour was opposed to membership, after all it was the Tories who'd taken us in, under the much maligned by the Thatcherites, Edward Heath.

I thought of Heath just recently when in Salisbury, as he used to live on the Green, and there were always armed coppers, outside his house....of course no longer.  I digress, for me the thing with Heath, was that he'd fought in WW2 in Europe, and so had witnessed first hand, what happens when European powers do not co-operate. Churchill himself, had been an advocate of a European Union.

Labour opposed, as it was believed the EU would be a construct to the benefit of bankers and bosses, with working conditions suffering.  When this proved not to be the case that opposition dropped.
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RobertT

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« Reply #418 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 20:25:26 »

Unskilled immigrants take entry level employment opportunities from the native, partially skilled population and, when they come from an economy that has invested in education for their population, they leave that economy with a skills deficiency. When they arrive in a higher-wage economy, and consider themselves, and are considered by the government of that economy to be transient, they will have a negative effect on the wages of the existing population. The simple fact is that a transient workforce doesn't have the same commitments financially that the local population have.

Other than that, I broadly agree. There's a fucking suprise!

I don't buy the immigrant thing - the jobs exist and we have unemployed people, they shouldn't have any jobs to come over to in that case.  I am all for forced employment - anyone worth their skilled salt can absorb a few months in a job they don't want while still seeking employment more befitting their skill level if that's their problem.  By forced I mean take a job that is on offer or lose the minimum level of benefit I talked about before.  Seek your own money in that event by self employment or live outside of the supportive society.

I'd reinvest much of the save money into proper job seeking skills - this is most likely the fundamental problem that immigrants are beating them on - they show willing, the right attitude, suggest they will be great employees.  I've recruited a lot of people and this is the real challenge.  I was shit at interviews despite thinking otherwise until I got made redundant and was given 3 months of coaching on CV & letter writing, interview training etc.

Oh and I'd either renationalise the rail network or at least make one company responsible for both the track and carriages for cut up sections.
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herthab
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« Reply #419 on: Friday, April 3, 2015, 20:28:35 »

How am I not taking responsibility for myself currently then? I'd argue I am taking my responsibilities seriously enough and who are you to conclude I'm not, and how?
Having read Ironside's posts previously, can I politely suggest that you ignore him? He's proved himself in the past to be a racist, tiresome, angry little troll. It's probably something to do with not enough affection when he was a child, or something.
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It's All Good..............
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