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Author Topic: What's right with football?  (Read 622409 times)
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« Reply #1125 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 09:38:48 »

he's done a great job. I hate saying that!

But he lost a lot of respect from me for using Shrewsbury as a pawn in the winter break strop
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« Reply #1126 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 10:26:06 »

he's done a great job. I hate saying that!

But he lost a lot of respect from me for using Shrewsbury as a pawn in the winter break strop
Completely agree with both parts of this. Have a lot of time for Klopp, very good coach. On the FA Cup/winter break thing, I get that he was standing up for the concept of a winter break when the FA/PL had fucked it up by implementing it half-arsed and so he was basically just standing up to protect his players. But completely wrong to do that at the expense of Shrewsbury and their players, Liverpool should be heavily fined for it. Or maybe even a 22-point deduction. That would be funny Smiley
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« Reply #1127 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 10:32:47 »

Completely agree with both parts of this. Have a lot of time for Klopp, very good coach. On the FA Cup/winter break thing, I get that he was standing up for the concept of a winter break when the FA/PL had fucked it up by implementing it half-arsed and so he was basically just standing up to protect his players. But completely wrong to do that at the expense of Shrewsbury and their players, Liverpool should be heavily fined for it. Or maybe even a 22-point deduction. That would be funny Smiley

Not sure you can 'heavily fine' a team for putting out a side that wins a cup tie, that would be off the wall even for the FA?
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« Reply #1128 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 10:36:10 »

We got fined once for putting out a weaker team in the JPT (that beat Brentford 4-1)
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« Reply #1129 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 10:38:24 »

Not sure you can 'heavily fine' a team for putting out a side that wins a cup tie, that would be off the wall even for the FA?
The rules of the competition state that teams must play their strongest available side. Which Liverpool clearly didn't do. 22-point deduction and 2-year ban from being considered for one of the FA's Euro places. You'd be able to hear the whining from space Smiley
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« Reply #1130 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 11:15:08 »

The rules of the competition state that teams must play their strongest available side. Which Liverpool clearly didn't do. 22-point deduction and 2-year ban from being considered for one of the FA's Euro places. You'd be able to hear the whining from space Smiley

As the rest of the team were on the enforced 'winter break' which they had been explicitly told not to play games during by the PL, it was potentially their strongest available side?

Its a lawyers dream!

Did you grow up on the blue side of Merseyside perchance?  Cheesy
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« Reply #1131 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 11:40:18 »

As the rest of the team were on the enforced 'winter break' which they had been explicitly told not to play games during by the PL, it was potentially their strongest available side?

Its a lawyers dream!

Did you grow up on the blue side of Merseyside perchance?  Cheesy
No, was raised on the red side, but just think Liverpool are in the wrong on this. Because these kinds of games can be a lifeblood for lower league sides as we all know. Although as I say, I do have some sympathy for Liverpool as the original fuck-up was in allowing replays to be scheduled during the winter break, I still don't think that means these players weren't available within the meaning of the rules which were written before winter breaks, so unavailable clearly means ill, injured or suspended. If "unavailable" was intended to cover 1st team players on a winter break, then neither Spurs nor Southampton would have been able to field 1st team players in their replay. But they did. So clearly these players were deemed available. And there was no winter break when Liverpool did the same (fielded the U12s) in the 3rd round against Everton. Doesn't hold water as an excuse, Liverpool were clearly in breach of the rules in both the 3rd round and the 4th round replay.
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« Reply #1132 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 12:11:01 »

No, was raised on the red side, but just think Liverpool are in the wrong on this. Because these kinds of games can be a lifeblood for lower league sides as we all know.

As the crowd was less than 1k below capacity and the game was still televised, not sure what Shrewsbury lost out on, unless they had a desperate aim to play against James Milner? One could argue that actually they gained a substantial benefit as it gave them mpore chance of a win.

I still don't think that means these players weren't available within the meaning of the rules which were written before winter breaks, so unavailable clearly means ill, injured or suspended. If "unavailable" was intended to cover 1st team players on a winter break, then neither Spurs nor Southampton would have been able to field 1st team players in their replay. But they did. So clearly these players were deemed available. And there was no winter break when Liverpool did the same (fielded the U12s) in the 3rd round against Everton. Doesn't hold water as an excuse, Liverpool were clearly in breach of the rules in both the 3rd round and the 4th round replay.

Yet playing these non first team players Liverpool have won both games so how one could argue 'weakened team' in any court would intrigue me. As I stated at the time the most embarrassing thing was probably for Everton who despite being given a great advantage couldn't beat Liverpool with their first team put together at the cost of Christ knows what.
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theakston2k

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« Reply #1133 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 12:19:41 »

As the crowd was less than 1k below capacity and the game was still televised, not sure what Shrewsbury lost out on, unless they had a desperate aim to play against James Milner? One could argue that actually they gained a substantial benefit as it gave them mpore chance of a win.

Yet playing these non first team players Liverpool have won both games so how one could argue 'weakened team' in any court would intrigue me. As I stated at the time the most embarrassing thing was probably for Everton who despite being given a great advantage couldn't beat Liverpool with their first team put together at the cost of Christ knows what.
It wasn’t televised and tickets were reduced down to something like £10, they missed out on a lot of money.
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« Reply #1134 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 12:27:59 »

It wasn’t televised and tickets were reduced down to something like £10, they missed out onn a lot of money.
I'm sure Shrewsbury weren't complaining,  must have thought it was Christmas,  Came very close to an upset as well.
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« Reply #1135 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 12:34:58 »

I'm sure Shrewsbury weren't complaining,  must have thought it was Christmas,  Came very close to an upset as well.
Which bit of a losing out on a few hundred grand don’t you understand? They weren’t happy and Liverpool paid them something like £35k as a token gesture. Could have been one of the biggest matches of their careers for a lot of their players and instead was reduced to nothing more than a boycott trophy match.
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« Reply #1136 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 12:53:56 »

As the crowd was less than 1k below capacity and the game was still televised, not sure what Shrewsbury lost out on
Gate only held up because ticket prices were slashed (so reduced shared revenue from gate) and it wasn't on TV. Shrewsbury lost out by about £250k according to media reports at the time.

Yet playing these non first team players Liverpool have won both games so how one could argue 'weakened team' in any court would intrigue me.
Whether they won with a weakened side isn't relevant. The rules say "Each team participating in a match shall represent the full available strength of each competing Club". Rule 15 (a). Look it up.
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« Reply #1137 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 13:01:41 »

my point wasn't even a financial one. But yeah, that was well
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horlock07

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« Reply #1138 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 13:17:26 »

Whether they won with a weakened side isn't relevant. The rules say "Each team participating in a match shall represent the full available strength of each competing Club". Rule 15 (a). Look it up.

Thanks Reg.
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« Reply #1139 on: Friday, February 21, 2020, 13:26:21 »

Thanks Reg.
It wasn't me that shifted the basis of the argument from whether the 1st team players should count as "available" to whether it matters they fielded a weakened side. Liverpool broke the rules, disrespected the spirit of the competition and did lower league opponents out of a much needed additional revenue boost they'd ordinarily expect to get from playing the 1st team at Anfield. I agree the cause of the fuck-up was the PL and FA not scheduling the winter break and replays properly but Liverpool have behaved poorly here.
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