Trivial things you don't understand/mildly annoy you

[Amir]

What is it with this recent trend of people trying to challenge established, verified science based on nothing.

The Earth is warming. That much is a simple fact. It is widely accepted throughout the scientific community (people that know what they are talking about) that this is down to changes in the atmosphere. On what basis are unqualified people challenging those that spend their lives studying and learning this stuff?

One thing that makes people very sceptical is they can see there's an industry built up around climate change, and as such it's in a lot of people's interest to perpetuate the 'myth'. You also have people who may well be on the right side of the argument, yet piss people off by being self-righteous and loud without knowing any facts, thereby getting others' backs up.

On a very base level I've seen the change over 15 years in your neck of the woods, and spoken to countless locals who've said how much things have changed(not necessarily temperature but weather patterns for sure). I also think 7 billion people must be having a huge effect. I have no science

When you've seen enough of the third or developing world, it can also make you realise how futile a lot of the efforts in the developed world are. I'm a fatalist though, I think it's too late to do much and mother nature will naturally correct things.

[pauld]

One thing that makes people very sceptical is they can see there's an industry built up around climate change, and as such it's in a lot of people's interest to perpetuate the 'myth'.

I'll not pick holes in the abuse of the term "industry" but when it comes to vested interests, let's not forget the comparatively few people directly employed in monitoring, researching, combating or lobbying about climate change pale into insignificance compared to the trillions of dollars invested in the fossil fuel industries. Which are actual indiustries. And, not entirely coincidentally, pump hundreds of millions of dollars into climate change denial lobby groups, front organisations and political candidates. Like the Republican Party. And Donald J Trump. When it comes to vested interests, unlike the science, the weight is very heavily on the side of climate change deniers

[Amir]

I'll not pick holes in the abuse of the term "industry" but when it comes to vested interests, let's not forget the comparatively few people directly employed in monitoring, researching, combating or lobbying about climate change pale into insignificance compared to the trillions of dollars invested in the fossil fuel industries. Which are actual indiustries. And, not entirely coincidentally, pump hundreds of millions of dollars into climate change denial lobby groups, front organisations and political candidates. Like the Republican Party. And Donald J Trump. When it comes to vested interests, unlike the science, the weight is very heavily on the side of climate change deniers

I agree, I'm explaining my experience with people who are in denial. Most of these people are involved in trying to get houses built(apparently we need more?)

Doesn't the term industry relate to the production of goods or services? You also compared the amount of people employed about climate change to the amount of money involved in fossil fuels. Even if you consider the amount of people employed by the fossil fuel industry, most of those will have no dealings with the general public.

If you don't try to see where other people are coming from, then you get nowhere.

[pauld]

Doesn't the term industry relate to the production of goods or services?

No, it's more specific than that:

Economic activity concerned with the processing of raw materials and manufacture of goods in factories

Which is a very apt term for the refinement of fossil fuels, rather than, say, the production of scientific papers. It's not a big point one way or t'other tbh, but it's an abuse of the term as a perjorative which irritates me (see also "the race relations industry" - like there's a chain of smog bound factories churning out Trevor Phillips replicas somewhere) and which is particular ironic in this instance when the thing that the climate change lobby are campaigning against is very definitely an industry.

If you don't try to see where other people are coming from, then you get nowhere.

Completely agree. Which is why it's important people understand there's 100s of millions of dollars being pumped into front campaigns, dodgy politicans and astroturfing to bend the debate.

[Amir]

Tourist industry, service industry, climate change industry It's not a pejorative either, other than the suggestion that certain people's jobs depend on it being accepted(and they do!) That doesn't make it any less true.

People see things from their own perpective. Those hundreds of millions are much more invested in influencing those in power, rather than the general public. Some people are just plain thick too.

What we need is a revolution. I'd been away so long I'd forgotten how much I hate the tories

[pauld]

Tourist industry, service industry, climate change industry It's not a pejorative either, other than the suggestion that certain people's jobs depend on it being accepted(and they do!) That doesn't make it any less true.

Fair dos. That beeping sound you can hear is me reversing rapidly

People see things from their own perpective. Those hundreds of millions are much more invested in influencing those in power, rather than the general public.

It's both. They pour huge amounts into astro turf campaigns (i.e. fake grassroots), albeit that is also usually aimed at influencing those in power indirectly. But as a direct example of where money was used directly to influence public opinion, look no further than the millions they poured into Trump's campaign. That way they no longer need to influence those in power, they just replaced them with their own placeman.

Some people are just plain thick too.

Yes, but he's president now and you'll just have to learn to live with it

[Flashheart]

It's good to see that some states are committing to the accord independently, which will help limit the damage.

It must be very embarrassing for Trump as well, which is a Brucey Bonus.

[horlock07]

It's good to see that some states are committing to the accord independently, which will help limit the damage.

It must be very embarrassing for Trump as well, which is a Brucey Bonus.

Must be likewise that the only countries that haven't signed it are Syria (which has a lot of other things to worry about) and Nicaragua (we hope refused to sign if not due to any denial of climate change but because it doesn't go far enough in this opinion).

[sonicyouth]

Not entirely the correct thread but the latest terror attack took place very close to my work and not long since the attack at Westminster, a place I pass daily. It's becoming genuinely scary and although day to day life must continue, it'll be a surreal experience walking down Borough High Street tomorrow morning.

[Nomoreheroes]

Not entirely the correct thread but the latest terror attack took place very close to my work and not long since the attack at Westminster, a place I pass daily. It's becoming genuinely scary and although day to day life must continue, it'll be a surreal experience walking down Borough High Street tomorrow morning.

Keep calm & carry on

[Saxondale]

Different area entirely but I was working in Camden last night and as I left it did feel quite eerie and a little scary.  More so than just the normal parade of pissed up dickheads on a Saturday night. 

[Legends-Lounge]

Glad I took my missus and son to the smoke last week end....

[Sippo]

I'm off there on friday/saturday. Apprehensive, but you have to carry on as normal. Wife is off to the O2.

[Ells]

I'm staying in Ealing for a bit.

Stay safe, everyone. Hold deg trygg 

[sonicyouth]

I'm staying in Ealing for a bit.

Stay safe, everyone. Hold deg trygg 

*dere

I think