ADVER: Fitton Back In Uk to Finish Takeover

[deltaincline]

So what do you think of the situation paul? do you think it is likely to be resolved? or is this issue going to scupper the takeover? i know it's a fairly big legal issue but how much of a problem is it?

Until we establish exactly what the nature of the problem is, it's very difficult to tell. The claim that SPD/Holding Co hold some form of rights to do ANY ground redev has always seemed extremely tenuous, but Fitton clearly wants to buy the club unencumbered by any residual problems or anyone stomping up and saying "Aha, I see you're planning on doing a ground redevelopment, we'll have £25m for that, ta". They might not have such rights, but it may be a question of wishing to avoid any prospect of a legal tussle in the future. Most likely, the current incumbents are waving the SPD claim around in an attempt to secure a pay-off, rather than there being any hard and fast black and white certainty over it. The problem is as others have pointed out that any such issue may be complex and hence timeconsuming to unravel and determine the full legal position. And time is not something we have here. Hence the current lot are holding this over Fitton's head - either give us the payoff and you're guaranteed not to have any trouble down the line on this or we'll sell you the club without it and you run the risk of a complex legal battle in the future if you try to redevelop when we turn up again and try to stick our snouts in the trough again.

How the fuck can anyone or a company own the rights to develop something like a new stadium complex that has not had a nod from the council, does not exist on paper, has no outline planning permission let alone full planning consent and has not even left the inside of someones head yet, let alone been funded or had a location found for it?

I appreciate that Diamandis and Holt may have a string of holding / shell companies that are attached to to the football club in some tenuous ways, but why the fuck can Fitton not just tell them to fuck off? I'm serious. Surely no company can legally own the rights to something that may or may not ever be built! How long would they reasonably expect to keep those rights if they even existed? Could they pass the rights on as some sort of fucking family heirloom, ad infiniteum?

The whole notion that they could possibly own the rights, let alone enforce them at some future point is fucking insane.

If the law is really that loose I'm going to create a new company that has the right to build every new house in Swindon, as of next monday morning. I will enforce my rights every time some hairy arsed groundworker starts pulling out the footings of a new dwelling. As of then, no one shall build a new house in the town of Swindon without paying Delta a healthy premium for doing so.

Preposterous I know. Like I said, Fitton should just tell them to fuck off.

[Bushey Boy]

Fitton comes across as a man who knows how to get a deal done.  I am confident he is aware of his 4 aces he is holding in this game of poker.

I just hope he hasnt underestimated how much of a crook these newbury people are

[Ardiles]

So what do you think of the situation paul? do you think it is likely to be resolved? or is this issue going to scupper the takeover? i know it's a fairly big legal issue but how much of a problem is it?

Until we establish exactly what the nature of the problem is, it's very difficult to tell. The claim that SPD/Holding Co hold some form of rights to do ANY ground redev has always seemed extremely tenuous, but Fitton clearly wants to buy the club unencumbered by any residual problems or anyone stomping up and saying "Aha, I see you're planning on doing a ground redevelopment, we'll have £25m for that, ta". They might not have such rights, but it may be a question of wishing to avoid any prospect of a legal tussle in the future. Most likely, the current incumbents are waving the SPD claim around in an attempt to secure a pay-off, rather than there being any hard and fast black and white certainty over it. The problem is as others have pointed out that any such issue may be complex and hence timeconsuming to unravel and determine the full legal position. And time is not something we have here. Hence the current lot are holding this over Fitton's head - either give us the payoff and you're guaranteed not to have any trouble down the line on this or we'll sell you the club without it and you run the risk of a complex legal battle in the future if you try to redevelop when we turn up again and try to stick our snouts in the trough again.

How the fuck can anyone or a company own the rights to develop something like a new stadium complex that has not had a nod from the council, does not exist on paper, has no outline planning permission let alone full planning consent and has not even left the inside of someones head yet, let alone been funded or had a location found for it?

I appreciate that Diamandis and Holt may have a string of holding / shell companies that are attached to to the football club in some tenuous ways, but why the fuck can Fitton not just tell them to fuck off? I'm serious. Surely no company can legally own the rights to something that may or may not ever be built! How long would they reasonably expect to keep those rights if they even existed? Could they pass the rights on as some sort of fucking family heirloom, ad infiniteum?

The whole notion that they could possibly own the rights, let alone enforce them at some future point is fucking insane.

If the law is really that loose I'm going to create a new company that has the right to build every new house in Swindon, as of next monday morning. I will enforce my rights every time some hairy arsed groundworker starts pulling out the footings of a new dwelling. As of then, no one shall build a new house in the town of Swindon without paying Delta a healthy premium for doing so.

Preposterous I know. Like I said, Fitton should just tell them to fuck off.

Brilliant post!  You've managed to articulate something that I'm sure many of us have been thinking.  Anyone have an answer?

[STFC_Gazzza]

i can only see what is there in black and white.
if you are joking then haha.
as i can see only your previuos posts as evidence then do you blame me?

yes, yes I do  

[Spencer_White]

Mike D will haul Fitton through the courts if he doesnt get this sorted now.

[pauld]

So what do you think of the situation paul? do you think it is likely to be resolved? or is this issue going to scupper the takeover? i know it's a fairly big legal issue but how much of a problem is it?

Until we establish exactly what the nature of the problem is, it's very difficult to tell. The claim that SPD/Holding Co hold some form of rights to do ANY ground redev has always seemed extremely tenuous, but Fitton clearly wants to buy the club unencumbered by any residual problems or anyone stomping up and saying "Aha, I see you're planning on doing a ground redevelopment, we'll have £25m for that, ta". They might not have such rights, but it may be a question of wishing to avoid any prospect of a legal tussle in the future. Most likely, the current incumbents are waving the SPD claim around in an attempt to secure a pay-off, rather than there being any hard and fast black and white certainty over it. The problem is as others have pointed out that any such issue may be complex and hence timeconsuming to unravel and determine the full legal position. And time is not something we have here. Hence the current lot are holding this over Fitton's head - either give us the payoff and you're guaranteed not to have any trouble down the line on this or we'll sell you the club without it and you run the risk of a complex legal battle in the future if you try to redevelop when we turn up again and try to stick our snouts in the trough again.

How the fuck can anyone or a company own the rights to develop something like a new stadium complex that has not had a nod from the council, does not exist on paper, has no outline planning permission let alone full planning consent and has not even left the inside of someones head yet, let alone been funded or had a location found for it?

I appreciate that Diamandis and Holt may have a string of holding / shell companies that are attached to to the football club in some tenuous ways, but why the fuck can Fitton not just tell them to fuck off? I'm serious. Surely no company can legally own the rights to something that may or may not ever be built! How long would they reasonably expect to keep those rights if they even existed? Could they pass the rights on as some sort of fucking family heirloom, ad infiniteum?

The whole notion that they could possibly own the rights, let alone enforce them at some future point is fucking insane.

If the law is really that loose I'm going to create a new company that has the right to build every new house in Swindon, as of next monday morning. I will enforce my rights every time some hairy arsed groundworker starts pulling out the footings of a new dwelling. As of then, no one shall build a new house in the town of Swindon without paying Delta a healthy premium for doing so.

Preposterous I know. Like I said, Fitton should just tell them to fuck off.

Brilliant post!  You've managed to articulate something that I'm sure many of us have been thinking.  Anyone have an answer?

The point is (and I've probably not been expressing it very well) is that you can sell someone the rights to anything pretty much if they're gullible enough to buy it, normally the key issue is whether those rights are enforcible. Like those guys who sell plots of land on the moon - good luck to anyone who bought those trying to get a payment from the US/Russians when they start exploiting the moon for minerals etc. Won't happen.

But in this instance, it's not so much a case of whether the rights are enforcible, more whether either party feels they might be. There isn't the time to resolve the issue legally before a takeover either happens or doesn't happen, and Fitton clearly wants to buy the club cleanly without risking someone popping up x years into the future waving a piece of paper that then entangles the club in a complex legal dispute before a ground redevelopment can proceed. The other side know that and as I said elsewhere probably themselves don't believe they've actually got any actually enforcible rights, just using it as a lever to try and get him to increase the offer.

[Ardiles]

Thanks Paul.  That's a little clearer now (in a murky kind of way.)

[STFC Bart]

And in any case- no prospective investors/takeover group are gong to come in without getting this sorted out. SSW has run out of money therefore he has no choice but to make concenssions

[Simon Pieman]

Fitton comes across as a man who knows how to get a deal done.  I am confident he is aware of his 4 aces he is holding in this game of poker.

I just hope he hasnt underestimated how much of a crook these newbury people are

Does Diamandis hold the straight flush?

[OneAndrewFitton]

Let's hope this takeover goes through by the end of the week, it's getting very frustrating for us fans, surely it has to happen this week, if it doesn't get completed this week i will be less confident than ever, it needs to get done now.

The board cannot appoint a manager until fitton takes over because fitton and the board may disagree on who they want as manager and we don't want williams/byrne in charge for long so fitton needs to get in and bring his own man in and quick.

[SwindonTartanArmy]

Fitton comes across as a man who knows how to get a deal done.  I am confident he is aware of his 4 aces he is holding in this game of poker.

I just hope he hasnt underestimated how much of a crook these newbury people are

Does Diamandis hold the straight flush?[/quoteyeah, although it was cellotaped under the table

[reeves4england]

Let's hope this takeover goes through by the end of the week, it's getting very frustrating for us fans, surely it has to happen this week, if it doesn't get completed this week i will be less confident than ever, it needs to get done now.

The board cannot appoint a manager until fitton takes over because fitton and the board may disagree on who they want as manager and we don't want williams/byrne in charge for long so fitton needs to get in and bring his own man in and quick.

Just incase anybody missed the subtle 'mind-game' repetition propaganda hidden in that post  

[ahounsell]

How the fuck can anyone or a company own the rights to develop something like a new stadium complex that has not had a nod from the council, does not exist on paper, has no outline planning permission let alone full planning consent and has not even left the inside of someones head yet, let alone been funded or had a location found for it?

This is pure guesswork but its possible that these rights are an "asset" on which the money SPD has leant to the club is secured. In which case it may be possible to resolve the problem by the club repaying the money.

I am not a lawyer, but it does seem like an agreement that is messy and difficult to enforce, but equally difficult to be 100% sure you were not going to be snared by it, which seems to be standard practice for certain individuals.  :roll:

If SPD do hold such a right, it may be possible to find out from St Modwen. As they are 50% owners and the sole funders of SPD. As a PLC they may be required to disclose the arrangement. Probably not in any detail but at least to clarify if it exists or not.