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Title: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Peter Venkman on Friday, December 14, 2018, 13:26:11 Here are the stats showing the number of on pitch minutes that players under the age of 23 have played per team in the EFL so far this season.
We are right up there (or down there on this upside down list, why its upside down I don't know) in 4th place. Not really of much relevance TBH but interesting none the less to see that some teams like Notts County have an ageing team yet still struggling, experience definately does not guarantee success. 72. Bolton (#bwfc) 1417 mins 71. Stoke (#scfc) 1468 mins 70. Notts County (#notts) 1517 mins 69. Bury (#buryfc) 1529 mins 68. Sheffield Utd (#sufc) 2135 mins 67. Middlesbrough (#boro) 2303 mins 66. Bristol Rovers (#utg) 2601 mins 65. West Brom (#wba) 3019 mins 64. Birmingham (#kro) 3211 mins 63. QPR (#qpr) 3288 mins 62. Millwall (#millwall) 3358 mins 61. Southend (#blues) 3843 mins 60. Gillingham (#gills) 4018 mins 59. Sunderland (#safc) 4070 mins 58. Crawley (#ctfc) 4120 mins 57. Nottingham F (#nffc) 4123 mins 56. Northampton (#ntfc) 4137 mins 55. Plymouth (#pafc) 4312 mins 54. Blackpool (#UTP) 4439 mins 53. Tranmere (#trfc) 4459 mins 52. Rotherham (#rufc) 4540 mins 51. Ipswich (#itfc) 4681 mins 50. Lincoln (#imps) 5184 mins 49. Leeds (#lufc) 5227 mins 48. Luton (#ltfc) 5245 mins 47. Exeter (#ecfc) 5349 mins 46. Reading (#royals) 5364 mins 45. Newport (#ncafc) 5482 mins 44. Norwich (#ncfc) 5564 mins 43. Bradford (#bcafc) 5675 mins 42.Sheffield Wed (#swfc) 5758 mins 41. Accrington (#asfc) 5826 mins 40. Hull (#hcafc) 6016 mins 39. Wycombe (#wwfc) 6099 mins 38. Grimsby (#gtfc) 6165 mins 37. Fleetwood (#ftfc) 6320 mins 36. Cambridge (#cufc) 6350 mins 35. Aston Villa (#avfc) 6479 mins 34. Port Vale (#pvfc) 6501 mins 33. Morecambe (#shrimps) 6512 mins 32. Cheltenham (#ctfc) 6530 mins 31. Wimbledon (#afcw) 6636 mins 30. Blackburn (#brfc) 6913 mins 29. Derby (#dcfc) 6940 mins 28. Burton (#bafc) 6947 mins 27. Stevenage (#boro) 7021 mins 26. Portsmouth (#pompey) 7308 25. Franchise (#mkdfc) 7334 mins 24. Macclesfield (#mtfc) 7393 mins 23. Wigan (#wafc) 7483 mins 22. Peterborough (#pufc) 7677 mins 21. Carlisle (#cufc) 7812 mins 20. Shrewsbury (#salop) 7882 mins 19. Doncaster (#drfc) 8033 mins 18. Bristol City (#bcfc) 8310 mins 17. Oxford (#oufc) 8710 mins 16. Rochdale (#rafc) 8886 mins 15. Brentford (#bees) 8949 mins 14. Coventry (#pusb) 8950 mins 13. Mansfield (#stags) 8968 mins 12. Preston (#pnefc) 9031 mins 11. Charlton (#cafc) 9246 mins 10. Oldham (#oafc) 9463 mins 9. Barnsley (#COYR) 9709 mins 8. Walsall (#saddlers) 9831 mins 7. Colchester (#ColU) 10,099 mins 6. Forest Green (#fgr) 10,346 mins 5. Scunthorpe (#sufc) 10,382 mins 4. Swindon (#stfc) 11,031 mins 3. Crewe (#cafc) 11,477 mins 2. Swansea (#swans) 11,480 mins 1. Yeovil (#ytfc) 13,245 mins Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: reeves4england on Friday, December 14, 2018, 13:34:45 Interesting to see. As you say, experience doesn't guarantee anything, especially if the players you have are poor or the management isn't up to scratch.
What the stats don't show are whether the teams at the bottom (more minutes) would do better with a couple of experienced heads of suitable quality. Also, teams in this table could be classed as senior even with a squad entirely made up of players aged 24-26, or aged 33-35, so it would be interesting to somehow factor in an average age of the starting XI too. Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, December 14, 2018, 13:36:32 It is quite interesting.... Notts aren't doing well but Bury are.
Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Peter Venkman on Friday, December 14, 2018, 13:37:21 Indeed, its interesting but hard to correlate anything much from it really.
I am sure somebody can do a chart with starting line up ages, but, blimey that would be a lot of work for someone! Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, December 14, 2018, 13:45:19 Indeed, its interesting but hard to correlate anything much from it really. True, but for example I've a mate who's a Jack, and he tells me that he's enjoying it so much more this season, as they're playing youngsters who although hit and miss have that enthusiasm. This pic captures that from a Town perspective... (https://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/resources/images/9104278.jpg?display=1&htype=0&type=responsive-gallery) Great when they're your own, less great when they're someone else's Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: pauld on Friday, December 14, 2018, 13:48:17 Indeed, its interesting but hard to correlate anything much from it really. tbh I suspect the conclusion is that there is little correlation between age and success, with quality of players and management being far more relevant. If you're good enough, you're old (or young) enough, as the saying goes. What does make a difference though is for the fans, always nice to see some of our own homegrown players being given a chance and having some successTitle: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, February 6, 2019, 13:10:58 An update to this as of Feb 4th.
Up to 2nd in the table! (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dylt6KsWoAEX4oe.jpg:large) Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: horlock07 on Wednesday, February 6, 2019, 14:01:43 An update to this as of Feb 4th. Up to 2nd in the table! (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dylt6KsWoAEX4oe.jpg:large) Yeah *foaming at the mouth* but that.s because Power will not spend any money and just ways us to go down to the National League with kids. Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: RobertT on Wednesday, February 6, 2019, 16:55:17 Check out where experience gets you, Notts County.
Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Wednesday, February 6, 2019, 18:55:36 Yeah but then Bury are doing ok so the model really provides nothing, other than showing us the teams that are providing minutes to younger players. League position really bares no relevance and the Alan Hansen comment still haunts him "you can't win anything with kids."
Also, who is the new team in there? R Wigan Athletic? :hmmm: Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Wednesday, February 6, 2019, 20:38:31 Oh and the glaringly obvious one, Yeovilton Youths aren't doing too greatly either. They, may I add have former Premier League experience at CB in there too.
Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: DiV on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 07:36:09 Would be interesting to know the break down of minutes between club contracted U23 players and U23s on loan.
Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Peter Venkman on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 10:09:12 Oh and the glaringly obvious one, Yeovilton Youths aren't doing too greatly either. They, may I add have former Premier League experience at CB in there too. TBF Dickinson only played there 5 times and that was 10 years ago now.Would be interesting to know the break down of minutes between club contracted U23 players and U23s on loan. Of the teams on the left of the list, the highest number of U23 players, only Swansea, Crewe, Barnsley, Colchester and Brentford have 2 or less loanees.FGR, Scunthorpe. Mansfield, Coventry, Oldham, Charlton, Swindon, Rochdale, Oxford, Walsall, Wimbledon and Macclesfield have between 4 and 8 loanees. Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: DiV on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 10:26:10 Of course not all loan players are under 23.
Just curious because for us personally it’s a bit of a waste if all those minutes are going to other teams U23s (I know they aren’t) It’s like renting a house vs buying a house. Not ROI is you’re renting Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Batch on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 10:44:40 It is a roof over your short term though DV.
Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Peter Venkman on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 11:05:22 Of course not all loan players are under 23. Absolutely true, here is a list of the teams above with their relevent league position in their own table and the number of U23 players that are loans over the period up to 1st January.Just curious because for us personally it’s a bit of a waste if all those minutes are going to other teams U23s (I know they aren’t) It’s like renting a house vs buying a house. Not ROI is you’re renting 17th Brentford, 0 13th Swansea, 1 11th Crewe, 1 2nd Barnsley, 1 8th Colchester, 2 21st Oxford, 3 17th Walsall, 3 5th Charlton, 4 24th Wimbledon, 4 4th FGR, 4 13th Swindon, 4 14th Scunthorpe, 4 2nd Mansfield, 5 11th Coventry, 5 15th Oldham, 5 18th Rochdale, 5 23rd Macclesfield, 6 I think it proves there is little correlation at all between loan players and league position either for the better or the worse, but still an interesting stat. I would guess that stats would be more relevent if done on the Premier League where the more experienced sides seem to prosper much more than in the lower leagues. Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 11:58:29 Absolutely true, here is a list of the teams above with their relevent league position in their own table and the number of U23 players that are loans over the period up to 1st January. 17th Brentford, 0 13th Swansea, 1 11th Crewe, 1 2nd Barnsley, 1 8th Colchester, 2 21st Oxford, 3 17th Walsall, 3 5th Charlton, 4 24th Wimbledon, 4 4th FGR, 4 13th Swindon, 4 14th Scunthorpe, 4 2nd Mansfield, 5 11th Coventry, 5 15th Oldham, 5 18th Rochdale, 5 23rd Macclesfield, 6 I think it proves there is little correlation at all between loan players and league position either for the better or the worse, but still an interesting stat. I would guess that stats would be more relevent if done on the Premier League where the more experienced sides seem to prosper much more than in the lower leagues. Doesn't that show the majority of teams with say 3-5 loans aren't doing so well? Exceptions being Charlton and our 2 ex gaffers.. it would be useful to know the positions played. Back in the summer I pointed out the error of having loan kids in key spine positions in the side, and got the usual negatives from those who felt nothing wrong with the strategy. Interestingly Wellens then said it wasn't a good policy, so at least a couple of his loans have experience, even if 3 haven't. Going to be interesting to see what his side looks like on Saturday.... Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Peter Venkman on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 12:12:37 Going to be interesting to see what his side looks like on Saturday.... Rather ironically it looks like one of our loans, Woolfenden, won't be playing anyway due to injury.Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 12:28:51 Rather ironically it looks like one of our loans, Woolfenden, won't be playing anyway due to injury. Means Wellens can pick the other 5 if he wants... Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: Peter Venkman on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 12:30:11 Means Wellens can pick the other 5 if he wants... It does, could mean Conroy starting Saturday hence freeing up the other 5 loanees for possible selection.Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: RobertT on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 14:28:27 Doesn't that show the majority of teams with say 3-5 loans aren't doing so well? Exceptions being Charlton and our 2 ex gaffers.. it would be useful to know the positions played. Back in the summer I pointed out the error of having loan kids in key spine positions in the side, and got the usual negatives from those who felt nothing wrong with the strategy. Interestingly Wellens then said it wasn't a good policy, so at least a couple of his loans have experience, even if 3 haven't. Going to be interesting to see what his side looks like on Saturday.... The sample data provided has an R squared value of 0.0286 - which is essentially saying, as Venks did, no correlation whatsoever. The sample may be a poor sample for all I know, but the only conclusion that can be drawn is one does not relate to, let alone cause, the other. Title: Re: U23 players in the EFL Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Thursday, February 7, 2019, 15:49:43 TBF Dickinson only played there 5 times and that was 10 years ago now. Yes mate, he would've likely been a mainstay but got injured and I think Higginbottom replaced him. He was loved at Stoke. My sister's fella is mates with him (and no it's not a Sid Nelson's Dad, scenario), he has quite a story. From high Prem wages (£20k pw) to L2 wages (£2.5k pw) in 10 years, is quite the relative fall. People will say "it's still a good wage for doing something you love" and they are right but all our lifestyles are relative. If we were earning £1k pw and that dropped to £100 pw, I'd ask anyone how they would manage that severe a drop. The other angle is, that a footballer should be prepared for their own "exit strategy" per se, as they know it's only a 20year career at best. |