Thetownend.com

Non-Footy Forum => Sports => Topic started by: RedRag on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 14:31:57



Title: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: RedRag on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 14:31:57
England squad for first test

Alastair Cook, Mark Stoneman, Dawid Malan, Joe Root (capt), Jonny Bairstow (wk), Ben Stokes, Jos Buttler, Chris Woakes, Mark Wood, Stuart Broad, James Anderson, Dominic Bess.

A little uninspired, imo.

Some good youngsters coming through at Surrey CCC, my county of choice but what about Dominic Bess, Somerset fans?  Would be great if he actually got a game.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 14:44:07
 There really isn't a whole lot to pick from.   Jos Buttler wil be delighted to get called up and so have to return from India where he's ripping up the IPL, hasn't played any red ball cricket for ages.

 Dom Bess is just the next cab off the rank, and wouldn't have been called up if Jack Leach hadn't busted his thumb.

 The one fella who should be getting picked is Joffra Archer, but he's really cracked it big time, the hottest bowler in IPL, and can't be picked by England for about another 6 years or so.  Means he doesn't need to go down the Hales/Rashid route of appearing disloyal by retiring from red ball cricket.

Stokes and Woakes have been terrible in the IPL... can't see a whole lot of point in playing them both, unless Stokes is justa  bat.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: fittons_coaching_badge on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 14:58:46
Bess probably is the next cab off the rank but id have loved to have seen Amar Virdi picked.

Pakistan and India both competent players of spin so I expect the seamers will have to do most of the work.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: michael on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 15:17:05
Bess can, at the very least, hold up an end, and is a pretty good batsman so maybe that gave him the edge. He hasn't played all of Somerset's games this season due to Leach being first choice, and not all pitches at this time of year being spin friendly.

There are a few glimmers of hope in the CC in both batting (Clarke, Gubbins, Foakes, Pope) and bowling (Bess, Virdi, Stone, Tongue, Porter, Coad), I don't think there are many first class fixtures for a while now though.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Nemo on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 15:46:12
Dom Bess has 63 first class wickets at an average of 22.49 and is 20 years old. He's not exactly a dull selection, even if Virdi is the flavour of the month. Also has a first class ton and and 80 both scored this year.

Buttler back in is... surprising. I can see the "why" behind putting an attacking batsman at 7, just not really why it's him. Vince himself would have been much better lower in the order than at 3, and if it's Surrey teenagers we want in the side, Ollie Pope is on the hottest of hot streaks.

Ultimately though, it's not a terrible selection. The problem is we have a lot of depth in some positions (RFM bowlers, wicket keepers) and not much in others (fast bowlers, opening bats) so you have to make the decision to either put some square pegs in round holes or pick players who aren't even close to being the best eleven cricketers in England. Tough gig.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 15:57:56
Bess probably is the next cab off the rank but id have loved to have seen Amar Virdi picked.

Pakistan and India both competent players of spin so I expect the seamers will have to do most of the work.

Up to the start of this season Virdi had 6 wickets at 45. He may be the answer, but you have to give these lads a chance to learn their craft first.... this is why the ECB's messing with the CC is such a problem. How the hell is Virdi supposed to learn if he's not playing 1st class cricket? I don't think they've done Mason Crane any favours by sticking him in too soon.

Dom Bess and Jack Leach have had a bit of a leg up at Ciderabad, prepare a spin friendly pitch, at least it gives them some sort of chance to learn.

Northants County Ground, always used to be reasonably friendly for spinners which is why our last 2 decent spinners Monty and Swann learned their trade there.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 16:17:07
Dom Bess has 63 first class wickets at an average of 22.49 and is 20 years old. He's not exactly a dull selection, even if Virdi is the flavour of the month. Also has a first class ton and and 80 both scored this year.

Buttler back in is... surprising. I can see the "why" behind putting an attacking batsman at 7, just not really why it's him. Vince himself would have been much better lower in the order than at 3, and if it's Surrey teenagers we want in the side, Ollie Pope is on the hottest of hot streaks.

Ultimately though, it's not a terrible selection. The problem is we have a lot of depth in some positions (RFM bowlers, wicket keepers) and not much in others (fast bowlers, opening bats) so you have to make the decision to either put some square pegs in round holes or pick players who aren't even close to being the best eleven cricketers in England. Tough gig.

Thing with Buttler is that he is hugely talented... therefore they think he should be able to do Test cricket, just that so far he can't.   A proper left field punt would be stick him in to open with Stoneman, drop Cook to 3, Root 4


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: RedRag on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 17:10:34
That punt has had me spilling my Pimms all over my Daily Telegraph :)

Interesting to read more about Bess in particular.  Virdi does give it a rip.  Bess obviously an edge over Virdi in terms of first class experience, a decent average and in his batting.  

Would love to see Bess play.  England early in the summer for a green spinner on a green top against Pakistan is a risk but the right player can only gain from experience.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: hefty toe on Tuesday, May 15, 2018, 17:21:09
As a Somerset fan, I've watched Bess and Leach bowl a lot over the last 2 seasons.  Leach is the more accurate at present, but Bess gets more spin and has better flight.  Bess is potentially the best young player Somerset have produced since Trescothick (plenty of Somerset fans agree).  His fielding and batting are excellent too.  He's a better long-term prospect than Leach. Haven't seen Virdi bowl yet.  Quite annoyed that England have picked Bess as was hoping he'd get a couple of unencumbered seasons at Somerset.  


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Private Fraser on Thursday, May 24, 2018, 15:42:07
Glad I didn't waste £150-ish on going to Lords today.  Oh well, let's see what we can do with the ball.  Not optimistic, though.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Posh Red on Thursday, May 24, 2018, 16:11:10
Glad I didn't waste £150-ish on going to Lords today.  Oh well, let's see what we can do with the ball.  Not optimistic, though.

Remember it's the overseas conditions which cause us problems, we'll be OK once we get back on English pitches with the ball we prefer............oh wait :(


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: RobertT on Friday, May 25, 2018, 16:55:37
Is there any department of the game we are any good at now?


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: RobertT on Friday, May 25, 2018, 16:56:06
It's all turning to mid nineties dross for England it seems.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, May 25, 2018, 17:41:02
Is there any department of the game we are any good at now?

Ranked world number 1 in 50 over cricket.  This was the priority that Strauss put in place, when getting to be head honcho. It's te reason why Bayliss is still in a job. To that end, English domestic cricket has been tailored to suit, and unsurprisingly the Test side has suffered a bit.

It's somewhat bizarre that the Pakistani lads have had more 4 day cricket going into this game than the England squad.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Posh Red on Saturday, May 26, 2018, 14:32:38
Itís one thing getting humiliated by the Aussies over there, but suffering the same fate in a home series is a step too far.

Surely the batting coach has to be under pressure after another abject batting performance.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Saturday, May 26, 2018, 15:02:00
Itís one thing getting humiliated by the Aussies over there, but suffering the same fate in a home series is a step too far.

Surely the batting coach has to be under pressure after another abject batting performance.

It's difficult to know where to go from here... it's partly a case of too many chiefs not enough Indians.  There's a case to be made for a complete cull of players and staff, including getting a new captain. At the moment, we seem to have Strauss who's taken time off to look after his sick wife, then Bayliss who's stated he's going next year.  The selectors have the clueless Ed Smith, backed up by someone, not sure if Fraser and Newell stayed on or not, at one time they were not.

As for coaches what do they really do?  The bowling coach Silverwood played a handful of Tests, is Jimmy or Broad going to listen to him.  Ramps, was a great county batsman but failed in Tests.

No, I think we have to accept that the ECB, no longer take Test cricket seriously in this country. 

This Test will last less than 3 days, the next one starts at Headingley on Friday.... Headingley should suit this Pakistan side nicely, then we see no more Tests til August, just one day stuff.  A couple of Tests shunted off into September.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: hefty toe on Saturday, May 26, 2018, 18:46:03
It's difficult to know where to go from here... it's partly a case of too many chiefs not enough Indians.  There's a case to be made for a complete cull of players and staff, including getting a new captain. At the moment, we seem to have Strauss who's taken time off to look after his sick wife, then Bayliss who's stated he's going next year.  The selectors have the clueless Ed Smith, backed up by someone, not sure if Fraser and Newell stayed on or not, at one time they were not.

As for coaches what do they really do?  The bowling coach Silverwood played a handful of Tests, is Jimmy or Broad going to listen to him.  Ramps, was a great county batsman but failed in Tests.

No, I think we have to accept that the ECB, no longer take Test cricket seriously in this country. 

This Test will last less than 3 days, the next one starts at Headingley on Friday.... Headingley should suit this Pakistan side nicely, then we see no more Tests til August, just one day stuff.  A couple of Tests shunted off into September.

What makes you think that Ed Smith is clueless?   


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Posh Red on Saturday, May 26, 2018, 19:00:35
Nice to see the young lad (Bess) showing some fight, and a decent technique.

Presumably Ramps hasnít managed to break him yet :)


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: REDBUCK on Saturday, May 26, 2018, 19:20:22
What makes you think that Ed Smith is clueless?   

Or that the test will last 3 days


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Saturday, May 26, 2018, 19:40:13
What makes you think that Ed Smith is clueless?   

Watched him bat, read a book (not all) and listened on TMS. 


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: suttonred on Saturday, May 26, 2018, 22:03:48
Watched him bat, read a book (not all) and listened on TMS. 

Reg is right he wasn't a good batsmen. Defo pink tie/pig bothering scenario got him him in my limited opinion.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: hefty toe on Sunday, May 27, 2018, 11:11:45
Reg is right he wasn't a good batsmen. Defo pink tie/pig bothering scenario got him him in my limited opinion.

He was a good batsman at county level.  His batting ability won't have any bearing on his ability as a selector. 


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Sunday, May 27, 2018, 11:38:45
Or that the test will last 3 days

Hour and a half over 3 days.  Good that a couple of Somerset lads, at least kept the Lord's crowd entertained on Saturday evening.  But just delaying the inevitable.  

Heads should roll, after this latest debacle, but we know they won't as the ECB no longer see Test cricket as important.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Monday, May 28, 2018, 10:03:42
 So, the only head in the tumbril, is poor old Mark Stoneman, who at least looks like he tries to graft.  Keaton Jennings, gets another go, although Buster Keaton may have been a better bet.  My impressioin was that last summer he had a spot of bother against Vernon Philander.... watching Abbas bowl he reminded me of Vern  :hmmm:


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Kinky Tom on Friday, June 1, 2018, 10:10:58
Good over from Broad, batsman gets a reprieve from a review of an lbw only to slash it to the slips a couple later. 

Pakistan 0-1


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, June 1, 2018, 10:46:16
Good over from Broad, batsman gets a reprieve from a review of an lbw only to slash it to the slips a couple later. 

Pakistan 0-1

Bit of luck that we're bowling....  :)


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Friday, June 1, 2018, 14:26:02
170-9

Christ, weíre going to get 45 on that basis


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Private Fraser on Friday, June 1, 2018, 14:32:57
Another addition to the long list of occasions when we fail to polish off the oponentsí tail end.  Itíll be ok though because weíll be sure to bat sensibly, understanding that there are still four days and one session to play.  Oh, hang on ...


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, June 1, 2018, 14:39:53
Another addition to the long list of occasions when we fail to polish off the oponentsí tail end.  Itíll be ok though because weíll be sure to bat sensibly, understanding that there are still four days and one session to play.  Oh, hang on ...

Think that's a bit over critical, if a couple lower down have a swing they can easily pick up 20 or 30. 

It's going to be interesting to see if England can bat properly and put a decent score on the board.  Far from guaranteed, Amir was sat in the pavilion with a big grin on his face, probably thinks there's a fifer coming up.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Wobbly Bob on Friday, June 1, 2018, 14:52:14
Who actually plays cricket at the CG?

Was hoping to support the local team over the summer, i.e. crash out comatose in a deckchair for the day.

Nearest venue for Wilts minor counties looks to be Marlborough or Calne.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, June 1, 2018, 14:59:39
Who actually plays cricket at the CG?

Was hoping to support the local team over the summer, i.e. crash out comatose in a deckchair for the day.

Nearest venue for Wilts minor counties looks to be Marlborough or Calne.


http://www.swindoncricketclub.co.uk/


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Wobbly Bob on Friday, June 1, 2018, 15:22:04
http://www.swindoncricketclub.co.uk/

Cheers Reg.
Proper grass roots.
Doesn't look as if the local talent pool is being utilized properly going by the table.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, June 1, 2018, 18:00:08
Cheers Reg.
Proper grass roots.
Doesn't look as if the local talent pool is being utilized properly going by the table.

SCC has always to some extent reflected the prevailing social conditions.  When I was a kid it was very much a case of it was a club for the small numbers of solicitors, bank managers, estate agents etc in Swindon, very much wanted to keep the oiks out.

Swindon BR was more open to talent.  TBF that was a long time ago, and in recent years they've tried to get more kids involved.  Cricket in Swindon schools though is pretty much dead.

Look at the sort of facilities you've got at somewhere nearby like St Joe's.... disgraceful, and they're probably not the worst.  At St Joe's there'll be numbers of cricket mad Goan kids, how do they get a chance?

Then go somewhere like Marlborough, walk up to the Common past the school playing field and you'll see 2 if not 3 pristine cricket pitches, scoreboxes, pavilions etc with full time groundsmen beavering away.

There's so much potential talent just going to waste.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Private Fraser on Sunday, June 3, 2018, 15:24:14
Credit where itís due.  England get their tactics and concentration levels right and win by an innings within 3 days. Tougher tests to come against the Indians, though.  Should be interesting.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Sunday, June 3, 2018, 17:23:37
Credit where itís due.  England get their tactics and concentration levels right and win by an innings within 3 days. Tougher tests to come against the Indians, though.  Should be interesting.

Really looking forward to the Indian series, but the bummer is we've now a 2 month wait, stocked by one dayers. The Test series shunted off to the back end of the season. OK a good one dayer is OK, but who remembers much about them?  It should stay as it always used to be, perhaps a couple of one dayers to warm up the summer, five Tests in June/July early August, then some one dayers tacked on at the end of the season. Especially now they can played under lights.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Sunday, June 3, 2018, 17:25:41
Really looking forward to the Indian series, but the bummer is we've now a 2 month wait, stocked by one dayers. The Test series shunted off to the back end of the season. OK a good one dayer is OK, but who remembers much about them?  It should stay as it always used to be, perhaps a couple of one dayers to warm up the summer, five Tests in June/July early August, then some one dayers tacked on at the end of the season. Especially now they can played under lights.
Ah the hidden user surfaces...


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Red Frog on Sunday, June 3, 2018, 17:33:00
I'm at a conference which is taking place at The Oval this week. I gather some cricket is due to happen on at least one of the days, and since some of the sessions are taking place in boxes, I'm assuming a pitch view. Is there anything worth distracting myself from the sales sessions for?


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Sunday, June 3, 2018, 17:35:36
I'm at a conference which is taking place at The Oval this week. I gather some cricket is due to happen on at least one of the days, and since some of the sessions are taking place in boxes, I'm assuming a pitch view. Is there anything worth distracting myself from the sales sessions for?

Surrey v Glamorgan in a one dayer 50 overs on Wednesday.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Sunday, June 3, 2018, 17:39:38
I'm at a conference which is taking place at The Oval this week. I gather some cricket is due to happen on at least one of the days, and since some of the sessions are taking place in boxes, I'm assuming a pitch view. Is there anything worth distracting myself from the sales sessions for?
Death by power point by a load of managers full of their own self importance riding on your efforts. Unless youíre one of those managers...


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Red Frog on Sunday, June 3, 2018, 22:32:39
Death by power point by a load of managers full of their own self importance riding on your efforts. Unless youíre one of those managers...

My innings will, as ever, be mercifully short and unremarkable.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Saxondale on Tuesday, June 19, 2018, 16:34:44
Rather enjoying ourselves against the aussies in the one dayer today.  Though we have just had a collapse to 459-5 with a couple of overs left!


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Tuesday, June 19, 2018, 17:02:46
Rather enjoying ourselves against the aussies in the one dayer today.  Though we have just had a collapse to 459-5 with a couple of overs left!

Trent Bridge is the place for 50 over stuff. Flat pitch and boundaries which seem to get smaller by the year.  Couple of years back Notts got 445 and Northants managed 425 chasing


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Private Fraser on Sunday, June 24, 2018, 16:35:43
5-0 to England! Buttler digs us out of a hole.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: suttonred on Sunday, June 24, 2018, 19:48:35
Death by power point by a load of managers full of their own self importance riding on your efforts. Unless youíre one of those managers...
I'm at a conference which is taking place at The Oval this week. I gather some cricket is due to happen on at least one of the days, and since some of the sessions are taking place in boxes, I'm assuming a pitch view. Is there anything worth distracting myself from the sales sessions for?

I sat out side for 10 minutes twice last week on the way to a school. Wondered if there was a game on, but that explains the suits wandering in past me


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Nemo on Monday, June 25, 2018, 16:53:20
World Cup ticket emails just went out... Applied for over 2k worth of tickets (in fairness, I'd be fucked if we got even half of them) and got only Bangladesh v New Zealand in a midweek day nighter at the Oval. Glamorous.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, July 26, 2018, 12:04:34
 Squad picked for the Test series v India...

 Moeen back and Adil Rashid back.  Jamie Porter in for the first time.

 Kind of sums up the state of domestic 1 st class cricket.....   Adil gave up red ball cricket at the start of the summer, yet gets picked for the Tests.

 Both Jack Leach and Dom Bess left out, essentially as they have hardly played any Championship cricket, to get any form and fitness.  There isn't too many other options.

Porter is fair enough... leading wicket taker last year and has been steady this year, so merits a chance.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Wobbly Bob on Thursday, July 26, 2018, 12:56:48
Given the conditions, was thinking back to the cricket in the summer of '76.

The West Indies spent just over three months in the country for a 5 match test series, three ODI's plus tour matches.

Vic Richards scored over 800 runs in the test matches, as the ball shot across parched outfields.

It's very unlikely that the current England captain will say anything to upset the visitors beforehand, unlike the abrasive Tony Greig back then.

Back to this summer, and chief selector Ed Smith has an impressively large forehead. What could possibly go wrong.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, July 26, 2018, 13:05:03
Given the conditions, was thinking back to the cricket in the summer of '76.

The West Indies spent just over three months in the country for a 5 match test series, three ODI's plus tour matches.

Vic Richards scored over 800 runs in the test matches, as the ball shot across parched outfields.

It's very unlikely that the current England captain will say anything to upset the visitors beforehand, unlike the abrasive Tony Greig back then.

Back to this summer, and chief selector Ed Smith has an impressively large forehead. What could possibly go wrong.

One of my favourite series.... Mickey Holding at The Ova,l 14 wickets, 9 bowled, 3 LBW, only 2 caught.  Fast yorkers on a dry pitch.

The match at Edgbaston next week is the 1000th Test played by England.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Wobbly Bob on Thursday, July 26, 2018, 13:20:31
One of my favourite series.... Mickey Holding at The Ova,l 14 wickets, 9 bowled, 3 LBW, only 2 caught.  Fast yorkers on a dry pitch.

The match at Edgbaston next week is the 1000th Test played by England.

Leading run scorer for England was David Steele, looked like an accountant going out to bat.
Stood up to the fast bowling in the pre helmet days wearing glasses if memory serves.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Pax Romana on Thursday, July 26, 2018, 14:12:21

 Kind of sums up the state of domestic 1 st class cricket.....   Adil gave up red ball cricket at the start of the summer, yet gets picked for the Tests.

 

Yup really dumb misguided opportunuism.  Offers no encouragement whatsoever for ambitious cricketers to stick with championship cricket.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: aroundthefur on Thursday, July 26, 2018, 20:45:08
Yup really dumb misguided opportunuism.  Offers no encouragement whatsoever for ambitious cricketers to stick with championship cricket.
Except that Jennings, Porter and Curran have all earnt their places off the back of Championship performances.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Pax Romana on Friday, July 27, 2018, 08:23:28
Except that Jennings, Porter and Curran have all earnt their places off the back of Championship performances.

If there's one thing I can't stand it's people using pertinent facts to undermine my point of view.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: michael on Friday, July 27, 2018, 09:35:40
I like Rashid, he'll probably go for a similar number of runs per over in Tests as he does in ODIs but if he gets Kohli out a few times then it might be worth it.

It is usually a good policy to do anything that Michael Vaughan disagrees with. His media career really does make me wonder how he managed to be such a good captain.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: RedRag on Friday, July 27, 2018, 17:03:07
he inherited a squad battle-hardened and competitive under the leadership of Nasser Hussain and a few great players many of whom stayed uninjured for the big series


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: grubby on Saturday, July 28, 2018, 06:22:12
https://www.facebook.com/172866549539947/posts/1062275143932412/

An evening with Merv Hughes at Swindon Cricket Club on 12th August after his touring team match with Swindon.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Pax Romana on Saturday, July 28, 2018, 08:08:33
he inherited a squad battle-hardened and competitive under the leadership of Nasser Hussain and a few great players many of whom stayed uninjured for the big series

Doubtless AroundTheFur will have some irritating facts to contradict this, but I think you are being too dismissive of Vaughan's contribution as captain. 

The key to the whole series, for me, was the first day (and particularly the first morning) of the Edgbaston test when Vaughan encouraged Trescothick & Strauss to go out and bat aggressively after we had been inserted by that arrogant prick Ponting.  We stole the initiative from Australia by scoring 400+ on the first day, which hadn't happened to them for 50+ years (I think), and never looked back.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: RedRag on Saturday, July 28, 2018, 17:47:53
You're right - that was a critical morning I had forgotten about.  In one of the greatest series ever.

I just felt that while Nas managed to get his team to compete touring the subcontinent and climb the rankings, Vaughan  was a bit of a home boy, up for the big occasion and benefited from performances by players at their peak.

Anyway, down with bringing pertinent facts into it generally.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Nemo on Saturday, August 4, 2018, 11:33:23
That was rather good.

1-0 up going to Lord's, where I think we'll have a tough time on a flatter deck and without Stokes. But a lead is good.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Saturday, August 4, 2018, 12:36:45
That was rather good.

1-0 up going to Lord's, where I think we'll have a tough time on a flatter deck and without Stokes. But a lead is good.

Very enjoyable Test... wouldn't describe it as great, as too many basic mistakes.  Whereas England's record at Edgbaston is very good, at Lord's it is indifferent.

Presumably Woakes will come in for Stokes. That might save Malan.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 08:44:58
 Well England somehow won the series, despite some horrendous sessions.

 I guess by the array of all rounders finding something at the right time and Buttler morphing into a proper bat on occasions.  Jimmy and Broad, had their moments in helpful conditions.

 It's fitting the all rounders in, that causes a problem... so a strength becomes a weakness.

 So on to Cooky.... it's been a shame to see him wane this summer, but the time is right. I shall miss him, but at least he's going to carry on for Essex.

 Did alright with only 3 shots. Some people if finding it difficult to sleep count sheep, I suggest running the pull to midwicket, cut wide of the gully and prod down through the V between mid on and midoff, as a foolproof method. 

Add in extra Siddle, Hilfenhaus and sundry Convicts getting hot under the collar, in 10/11.  Cooky and J Trott is probably what drove them to sandpaper to get them out.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: bamboonoshoe on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 12:56:31
My opinion (not that it's worth much), is that Cook should never have been captain. While it is contradictory to say, he was actually captain material. I feel this took away from his game. His batting went down hill and I always felt he couldn't quite deal with the responsibility and the politics of the ECB. Now shoot me down but had he been a slightly lesser player or a wicket keeper (Alex Stewart comes to mind) then we might have had a perfect formula. Unfortunately Cook never truly recovered from his responsibilities, and his game suffered. Still a great player on his day and history will remember him for "that" Ashes series.

It's a nod to the adage that the best players (in many sports) don't always make the best captains, and vice versa. Let the best players concentrate on being best. Let the organisers/morale boosters/captains concentrate on cohesion. It is a rarity that these two things are prevalent, in one person all the way to an elite level. The exception maybe, in a solo sport but you generally have a team around you dong the managing/captaining, while everything is left to the individual to just go and do what they do best. Federer, Hamilton, Rossi, Ainslie etc are examples of elite individuals of this in a modern era.

Back to the series v India. Although we didn't play as consistently well, I think it's encouraging to have beaten India, who also were out of sorts and indifferent at times too. There were glimpses of new shoots coming through the set up because we really need to focus on building replacements for Broad and Anderson...when they finally go. We can't be scrambling around for a bowler or two when it's too late. The ECB really need to get their finger out in this respect. We must build on the positives though. The 4th test really was the Moeen Ali show, notched a few runs to boot with his bounty of wickets. The trouble is, I like Ali, but can he do it on a more consistent basis? Say 3 wickets per innings? Butter chips in and if Curran can keep that kind of all rounder form than that bodes well not only in wickets but also for ou middle order.

Lots of work to be done but promising signs. Be interesting how the approach to the 5th test will be. A chance for fringe players to tie down a place and surely Cook would like to go out on at least a 50 or 100. Will the Indian contingents have grace and allow him the time? or will they be ruthless and make Cook work for that final century? The latter would be much more satisfying and I'm sure Cook would agree.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 14:07:43
  Captaining a Test side, of any country is a uniquely difficult thing to do in sport.

  However captaining England, is probably harder than say New Zealand.  The captain of Australia, is the iconic job in that country, which is why Smith's fall from grace was so great.

 The way cricket is now structured, players don't get the captaincy experience of say a Ray Illingworth in the County Championship... so it really is the old Aussie model of pick the best XI then see who looks like the best egg.

 Cook was the obvious choice after Strauss... and he did OK. The likes of Botham, Flintoff, Pieterson were always doomed to fail.

 Root, similarly was the obvious choice.   I reckon it should be a bit lke US presidents... serve a fixed term say a max of 3 years and then someone else gets the gig.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: RedRag on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 14:15:22
just trolling really. :)

Did anyone think that after his failures with the bat, it was a bit premature of Cook to announce that the next test would be his last?


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: RobertT on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 14:36:27
  Captaining a Test side, of any country is a uniquely difficult thing to do in sport.

  However captaining England, is probably harder than say New Zealand.  The captain of Australia, is the iconic job in that country, which is why Smith's fall from grace was so great.

 The way cricket is now structured, players don't get the captaincy experience of say a Ray Illingworth in the County Championship... so it really is the old Aussie model of pick the best XI then see who looks like the best egg.

 Cook was the obvious choice after Strauss... and he did OK. The likes of Botham, Flintoff, Pieterson were always doomed to fail.

 Root, similarly was the obvious choice.   I reckon it should be a bit lke US presidents... serve a fixed term say a max of 3 years and then someone else gets the gig.

One of Anderson or Broad should really have been the right choice, but neither seem capable of thinking beyond their own over I think.  Anderson is a real oddity, great bowler and seems exceptionally selfish on the pitch, sounds like a great bloke when interviewed off it.

There isn't a captain in the side.  Right now, outside the two main bowlers, there isn't even a player who has a confirmed spot on form!  Root is a different player with the captaincy weighing on him.

Ali need to hold down  spot in the top four or five, otherwise his bowling is too erratic on it's own - he has games like the last one that give you hope then offers nothing.  Too many all rounders, not enough focus I think.  Even the batsmen are not focused on Test cricket as their main outlet, they are players of multiple forms.  Seems to be a problem for a few countries now as well, probably a result of the money in the shorter form.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 15:15:56
 It's exceptionally rare to make fast bowlers skipper as bowling is so physically demanding. Ideally you want a skip who stands at first slip all day and manages to catch stuff.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: bamboonoshoe on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 16:08:21
Agree, any out and out "specialist" be it bowler or batsman is always going to add extra pressure as a captain. As Reg says, you want a slips players who can keep his eyes on everything. I'm bias, I think Wicket Keepers generally make decent captains. I'm sure there are plenty who have failed miserably though.

On the notion of Wicket Keepers, who was your best England WK. For me it's Jack Russell to date. Always thought he was underrated by the selectors, even if a little on the quirky side.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 16:23:06
Agree, any out and out "specialist" be it bowler or batsman is always going to add extra pressure as a captain. As Reg says, you want a slips players who can keep his eyes on everything. I'm bias, I think Wicket Keepers generally make decent captains. I'm sure there are plenty who have failed miserably though.

On the notion of Wicket Keepers, who was your best England WK. For me it's Jack Russell to date. Always thought he was underrated by the selectors, even if a little on the quirky side.

Alan Knott by a long way. Jack ws good but he'll be the first to defer to Knotty.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: bamboonoshoe on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 16:33:21
Alan Knott by a long way. Jack ws good but he'll be the first to defer to Knotty.

Of course, Russell learnt a lot of his trade under Knott but for me it's the fact Russell was overseen for Stewart (who was handy) way too much. Russell was probably one of the last of a kind of cricketer (and WK). Indeed he would be modest and tell us that Knott was better. I loved the way Russell, when batting, could hold of an ambush for hours. Perfect if you've got a decent opener or no.2 with you and great for holding out a score when the other team need wickets. Almost Boycott-esque, except Russell didn't even bother going for singles  ;)


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: RedRag on Tuesday, September 4, 2018, 17:19:55
It's exceptionally rare to make fast bowlers skipper as bowling is so physically demanding. Ideally you want a skip who stands at first slip all day and manages to catch stuff.
Not really relevant but at my level, fast bowlers especially, were too engrossed with their own bowling to see the bigger picture. Keepers may have the best seat in the house but that is one taxing job physically also.  I happened to notice that Cook was having a little trouble with Jimmy and Broad about who exactly was setting the field in the last test.


Title: Re: Summer Cricket 2018
Post by: ChChNZRED on Thursday, September 6, 2018, 01:09:26
Not really relevant but at my level, fast bowlers especially, were too engrossed with their own bowling to see the bigger picture. Keepers may have the best seat in the house but that is one taxing job physically also.  I happened to notice that Cook was having a little trouble with Jimmy and Broad about who exactly was setting the field in the last test.

Broad Experimented with the t20 captaincy and struggled with it on many fronts, i have a feeling because of that we didn't really see him again in any short form team for England. Im glad Eng have gone with Buttler as the Vice in test's he has the brain and shown that in the ODI stuff. Stokes should never have been the VC and having meet Stokes while he was playing for Canterbury last summer and talking to him he has idea's but ones that maybe to far fetched for test cricket, decent bloke though and played a few times against his brother. I play for a club here in Christchurch and keep for them, i got made captain of the side last season and i found it the best to see the whole game and the fields you can set, it is taxing but the best seat in the house, and your always in the game.