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25% => The Boardroom => Topic started by: tans on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:21:17



Title: Club statement
Post by: tans on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:21:17
https://www.swindontownfc.co.uk/news/2018/january/club-statement-county-ground-freehold/


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:23:37
hmmmmm. Many many questions..


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: FreddySTFC! on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:28:56
Very interested to hear the Trusts view on this. I thought the council had given them a period of exclusivity to get the purchase over the line  :hmmm:


Title: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:32:45
Indeed Freddy, not sure on the exclusivity though


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Private Fraser on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:33:12
Yes. It would be good to hear from TrustSTFC about where things stand regarding their proposed offer.  

Interesting times ahead!

So far, the useless Adver have simply rehashed the Club’s statement.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:33:41
statement does say club would own the ground... but devil in detail


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Nemo on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:34:23
Hmmmmmm


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: otanswell on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:37:48
Who is paying for this


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: ferret on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:39:54
I don’t really understand why we need to know that an offer has gone in. There’s got to be a reason behind telling us this.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:41:27
Not good news as far as I’m concerned. We’ve been conned over the training ground and I certainly wouldn’t trust Power owning the ground - no matter how many supposed safeguards are put in place.

I’d rather the council kept hold of it.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: FreddySTFC! on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:46:09
Not good news as far as I’m concerned. We’ve been conned over the training ground and I certainly wouldn’t trust Power owning the ground - no matter how many supposed safeguards are put in place.

I’d rather the council kept hold of it.
Have we though? I'd be very interested to know what the latest is with the training ground. It's a massive, massive part of this clubs potential development yet it has all gone extremely quiet. Either a case of no news is good news or there's something that LP doesn't want in the public domain  :hmmm:


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: otanswell on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:50:59
Not good news as far as I’m concerned. We’ve been conned over the training ground and I certainly wouldn’t trust Power owning the ground - no matter how many supposed safeguards are put in place.

I’d rather the council kept hold of it.

This


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Costanza on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:52:11
I’m a total sceptic when it comes to any redevelopment news.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 18:52:56
 Nothing to add beyond what I posted in the summer....

I said a while back that the Trust are caught between a rock and a hard place, trying to deal with SBC and Power. It was also obvious that if the Trust fail in their bid to buy the CG, then the piranhas would be circling. Looks like Power has suddenly got an interest in the CG having previously said he's none.

Worrying times....


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 19:37:14
Quote from: ferret
I don’t really understand why we need to know that an offer has gone in. There’s got to be a reason behind telling us this.
flushes out other interested parties/sees of they are bluffing


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 19:43:44
flushes out other interested parties/sees of they are bluffing

Hmmm, wonder what the price Lee Power and Clem Morfuni (sorry but that sounds like a Terry Pratchett, Discworld character) have tendered to SBC, in difference to TrustSTFC? As we know in most "deals" it's the price that counts. Were the trust offered it for around £1.5m or I'm I making that up?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: theakston2k on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 19:45:57
Personally would rather the club owned the ground than the trust as realistically the Trust will never have the money for a large scale redevelopment and could see disagreements between the Trust and club causing problems. Whether I trust Power is another matter but will be interesting to see if there are any plans that accompany this.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 19:54:30
Personally would rather the club owned the ground than the trust

But it won't be the club, it'll be Power.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 19:55:16
Hmmmm, it's got me thinking...you don't think Power has been in touch with the Executors of Eady's Will, do you?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: theakston2k on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 19:56:38
But it won't be the club, it'll be Power.
Which is why I added the bit about whether I trust power. If it was Fitton and co we’d have been jumping for joy.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 19:59:09
Hmmmm, it's got me thinking...you don't think Power has been in touch with the Executors of Eady's Will, do you?

I don't think there's a chance Power will get his mitts on that.

We could do with knowing a bit more about Morfuni... after all he may not be from the Jed/Murrall school of Power chums, but as long as he lurks in the shadows, we can only assume the worst.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 20:38:14
I don't think there's a chance Power will get his mitts on that.

We could do with knowing a bit more about Morfuni... after all he may not be from the Jed/Murrall school of Power chums, but as long as he lurks in the shadows, we can only assume the worst.

Not personally get his hands on it but if he's managed to have a natter "in private" and convinced them that it's for use to "benefit the club" he could easily broker a deal in which the Eady Estate could obtain a percentage of any future profits...It's mere speculation on my part but good businessmen are good at getting/sealing/closing deals and contracts (delivering upon them is another thing I admit). Lets not be coy in thinking that the Eady's wouldn't be interested in any future potential returns, even if your Estate was a "gift". I guess we don't necessarily know the full ins and outs of Eady's Estate but obviously we do know that the beneficiary of Wills can change the detail if needed and as long as all beneficiaries agree...


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: RobertT on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 21:21:43
I don't think there's a chance Power will get his mitts on that.

We could do with knowing a bit more about Morfuni... after all he may not be from the Jed/Murrall school of Power chums, but as long as he lurks in the shadows, we can only assume the worst.

His company deals in large scale Utilities work on developments, like a big contractor.  They don't look like they have huge experience of being a lead contractor but they might see it as a way of taking the next step beyond putting the plugs into Wembley.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 21:30:36
Personally would rather the club owned the ground than the trust as realistically the Trust will never have the money for a large scale redevelopment and could see disagreements between the Trust and club causing problems. Whether I trust Power is another matter but will be interesting to see if there are any plans that accompany this.
The one thing that has saved us from serious asset strippers over the years (as opposed to barrow boy amateurs like Jed) has been that we don't own any serious property. This would leave us wide open to every vulture who fancies his chances as a property developer. And no the Goddard Covenant wouldn't offer any protection - it can be bought out at the discretion of the Goddard Estate.
Conversely, it could be the thing that gets the club into a state where Power can reasonably do it up as a saleable asset and attract some serious Championship and upward level owners.
Not sure whether to be more scared or excited. Given Power's previous on property deals, I'm veering toward brown trouser territory


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Oaksey Moonraker on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 21:49:57
A club and Trust STFC partnership to own the ground on a 50/50 basis would be a good compromise. Club saves on current rent to SBC and Trust STFC have a veto on the ownership of the ground. Power would only need to stump up half the cash to buy the ground. Can't see it happening though as Power would be unlikely to want the scrutiny such an arrangement might bring.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 21:51:41
more chance of power charging £1.99 a season ticket next season


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 22:00:59
A club and Trust STFC partnership to own the ground on a 50/50 basis would be a good compromise. Club saves on current rent to SBC and Trust STFC have a veto on the ownership of the ground. Power would only need to stump up half the cash to buy the ground. Can't see it happening though as Power would be unlikely to want the scrutiny such an arrangement might bring.
Think I've got more chance of growing a womb tbh. But it would indeed be almost the best of all worlds, not sure what effect it would have on making the club more saleable though?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 22:16:49
I think it's pretty obvious, that with Brexit and continued Tory austerity in the public sector. SBC will look to sell, and not care about who to, or what their plans are beyond the normal planning regs, which are largely futile these days in the face of Tory donors.

The Trust have a chance to buy under the community asset rule, but would this apply to Power as he could argue his intent to keep it as a football ground, at least in the short term.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 22:39:23
Think I've got more chance of growing a womb tbh. But it would indeed be almost the best of all worlds, not sure what effect it would have on making the club more saleable though?

One has to get into the mind of what P sees as the end game? Buying the Free hold of the CG is IMHO not enough to make a REAL fist of making the mighty reds a force to be reckoned with without the car park, cricket ground and sports field.......Because if you buy the FH all you are getting is the land your concrete stands actually sit on. The real money comes from the area adjacent to it..... not withstanding the covenants from the Goddard estate to amend/overturn.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Wednesday, January 17, 2018, 22:44:43
One has to get into the mind of what P sees as the end game? Buying the Free hold of the CG is IMHO not enough to make a REAL fist of making the mighty reds a force to be reckoned with without the car park, cricket ground and sports field.......Because if you buy the FH all you are getting is the land your concrete stands actually sit on. The real money comes from the area adjacent to it..... not withstanding the covenants from the Goddard estate to amend/overturn.
Oh completely, but it might be enough for him to be able to sell up with an option for a %age of any future development or some such. i.e. an exit strategy with an option for future profits at someone else's risk. That might quite appeal rather than getting stuck here drip feeding in to a non-profit making business in sufficient amounts to make him wince but insufficient to make a difference.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 06:57:01
Power is in it for the money - he’s said it often enough. There is no profit for him in buying the CG and upgrading the infrastructure - if he can’t, or won’t, fork out the much smaller sum making good on his promised training ground, he won’t spend on new stands.

If he gets ownership he’ll get whatever rent he deems appropriate, he can raise money on it and, God forbid, he could run the club into the ground (no pun) until there is no need for a football stadium at all. Think of all those lovely houses.

This is similar to what is happening at Bury. The owners have indebted the club with loans against Gigg Lane which their fans think is a prelude to them folding the club and being left with a nice piece of real estate.

It’s time for the Trust to put up or shut up. Domesday is approaching.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 07:34:39
Oh completely, but it might be enough for him to be able to sell up with an option for a %age of any future development or some such. i.e. an exit strategy with an option for future profits at someone else's risk. That might quite appeal rather than getting stuck here drip feeding in to a non-profit making business in sufficient amounts to make him wince but insufficient to make a difference.
Yep, I get that so in essence we’re both on the same hymn sheet. Just wondering how that would work with the actual day to day running and funding of the club?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: chalkies_shorts on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 07:42:12
I'd imagine Axis are calling the shots. Do they want to rebuild the ground or move the ground. Whichever way they win. I'd imagine Power would be on a nice little earner either way as he's their "in" to get it done.
The football is probably incidental - keep ticking it over and keep income streams going.
I don't think Axis ( Clem M ) are involved because in Australia they had a love of STFC and couldn't wait to get involved and charge us up the leagues.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 08:51:32
So much negativity


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Sippo on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 08:55:57
I wonder if people would think the same if it was ol Jed... Power is made out to be the bad guy all the time, but never gets any credit. Surely it's best 'we' own the ground rather than the council. Will save on rent and give us the chance to possibly redevelop the ground.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Riddick on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 08:57:11
Lots more detail needed but cautiously positive news. Redevelopment to add revenue streams is the only way forward for the club.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:06:14
So much negativity

It's always been this way.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:06:28
I wonder if people would think the same if it was ol Jed... Power is made out to be the bad guy all the time, but never gets any credit. Surely it's best 'we' own the ground rather than the council. Will save on rent and give us the chance to possibly redevelop the ground.
‘We’ won’t own the club, Power et al will. We will still pay rent but to Power instead of the council.

He’s not here to benefit the club.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Sippo on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:08:34
How do you know that? He's put money into the club already, so no reason to doubt it.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:14:45
Cos we’re in L2 due to not giving a flying fuck attitude


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:17:03
When Fitton did the same no one seemed to act like this. Must be because he smiled a bit and spoke more


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:20:23
So much negativity

Its great isn't it...

I think Power is doing this so he can dig beneath the ground, sell all the minerals and then create a huge evil mastermind lair from where he can blackmail the Tory government for billions of pounds, because they are his friends and he knows all their nefarious secrets...

Might happen, has as much firm evidence behind it as most of the speculation on this thread....


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:22:04
When Fitton did the same no one seemed to act like this. Must be because he smiled a bit and spoke more

Pretty much it, remember that he also changed the shareholding structure which made fans shares which they had paid money for essentially worthless and that they had zero say in the future of the club, and didn't he personally get a cut of the Austin transfer fee.

Yet he remains essentially the Princess Diana of Swindon Town.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Panda Paws on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:31:39
Very skeptical but also lots of assumptions being made here. As someone else, lots and lots of questions.

 If only there was money, and hence decent quality journalism, in local media. We might actually get some answers.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Abrahammer on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:44:32
Domesday is approaching.

At this point I decided I’ll give it a couple of days before reading this thread again


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 09:51:52
Domesday is approaching.

What are the club planning to do a massive nationwide survey and write a book? They shouldn't waste money on that, the government will be holding a census in 3 years time....


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Bogus Dave on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:00:46
When Fitton did the same no one seemed to act like this. Must be because he smiled a bit and spoke more

This. The statement says the football club have made an offer, not lee power. I understand caution at the news, this level of negativity outright is a bit silly though


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:01:42
Quote from: Panda Paws
Very skeptical but also lots of assumptions being made here.

exactly.

no information and a vague statement is all there is.

Not surprised people think the worst, but until the details are known nobody knows if this is good or bad.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:10:34
Swindon fans aren't generally negative.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Pax Romana on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:14:40
I don't understand the distinction various people have made between the club and LP (as in "it's not the club buying the ground, it's Lee Power").  Lee Power is the owner and hence effectively he is the club.  He could shut Swindon Town down tomorrow if he chose.  That's the same for any club that isn't owned by a supporters trust.

As said already, he is in it to make money, the question is how he plans to do that.  If it is by getting the club into (say) the Championship and then selling up at a nice profit, as he has always stated, then that would be great.  Clearly if he has changed tack and is now seeking to asset strip the club, sell the CG for building and close down the football club, then not so great.

Buying the CG is consistent with turning the club into a saleable asset as a football club.  I think that we can trust LP about as much as we can trust any owner who isn't a fan.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:20:26
This. The statement says the football club have made an offer, not lee power. I understand caution at the news, this level of negativity outright is a bit silly though

The point has been made often enough, that as a result of historical circumstances the link between club and community has been broken.  In the old sense that club no longer exists. Power is the owner that is all that counts. Should he get to own the ground as Audrey says our future will be called into question.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:29:43
I wonder if people would think the same if it was ol Jed... Power is made out to be the bad guy all the time, but never gets any credit.
I think there's understandable caution because of Jed. If the club had owned the ground when he took over, we wouldn't have a ground now.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:30:26
When Fitton did the same no one seemed to act like this. Must be because he smiled a bit and spoke more
And he didn't have a track record of previous involvement in property deals that didn't go well for the clubs concerned


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Tails on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:35:53
Power is looking towards an end game I think. Abandoning the 'Swindon way' and now talk of owning & possibly renovating the stadium seems to point that way. A club that owns its own, modern(ish) stadium will cost a lot more to a buyer than we will currently. Just my assumption, not really based on anything other than what I've seen... The fact he was so proactive for years and now has completely taken a back seat COULD mean he's lost a bit of interest.

Of course, if it does pan out this way and he does sell us, we could be attractive to the wrong type of person...


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:36:46
Cos we’re in L2 due to not giving a flying fuck attitude

Are we? How would anybody know he has such an attitude? As far as I can tell, we're here because of poor decision making, not because he doesn't give a fuck.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:40:56
Power is looking towards an end game I think. Abandoning the 'Swindon way' and now talk of owning & possibly renovating the stadium seems to point that way. A club that owns its own, modern(ish) stadium will cost a lot more to a buyer than we will currently. Just my assumption, not really based on anything other than what I've seen... The fact he was so proactive for years and now has completely taken a back seat COULD mean he's lost a bit of interest.

Of course, if it does pan out this way and he does sell us, we could be attractive to the wrong type of person...

Spot on. In all regards


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:42:33
Power is looking towards an end game I think. Abandoning the 'Swindon way' and now talk of owning & possibly renovating the stadium seems to point that way. A club that owns its own, modern(ish) stadium will cost a lot more to a buyer than we will currently. Just my assumption, not really based on anything other than what I've seen... The fact he was so proactive for years and now has completely taken a back seat COULD mean he's lost a bit of interest.

Of course, if it does pan out this way and he does sell us, we could be attractive to the wrong type of person...


Power saw the "Swindon Way" as a means of making money, which after all was his stated objective. Similarly he stated that he had no interest in ground redevelopment etc.  It is surely not coincidence that at the time when we've no playing assets to sell, due to Power's poor recruitment decisions, and the Trust reveal what looks like a decent price for the CG... Power suddenly is interested in a property deal.

We need to hear from the Trust on this....


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:46:36
my take on Power slipping into the background was to arrest fanbase decline, and also that continuing in the same way would have us in the conference sooner or later.

but yeah, could be he's had enough here.

interesting times


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:53:41
Power saw the "Swindon Way" as a means of making money, which after all was his stated objective. Similarly he stated that he had no interest in ground redevelopment etc.  It is surely not coincidence that at the time when we've no playing assets to sell, due to Power's poor recruitment decisions, and the Trust reveal what looks like a decent price for the CG... Power suddenly is interested in a property deal.

We need to hear from the Trust on this....
Good luck with that. I just cancelled my membership actually with the guys, been really disappointing over the last 12 months with their lack of communication with the fans,ironically lack of communication is the one thing they were on about trying to address with the club. It's a shame really.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 10:58:09
Good luck with that. I just cancelled my membership actually with the guys, been really disappointing over the last 12 months with their lack of communication with the fans,ironically lack of communication is the one thing they were on about trying to address with the club. It's a shame really.

Having the commitment to voluntarily run something like the Trust is difficult... it's entirely possible that has now gone.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Simon Pieman on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:01:02
Power is looking towards an end game I think. Abandoning the 'Swindon way' and now talk of owning & possibly renovating the stadium seems to point that way. A club that owns its own, modern(ish) stadium will cost a lot more to a buyer than we will currently. Just my assumption, not really based on anything other than what I've seen... The fact he was so proactive for years and now has completely taken a back seat COULD mean he's lost a bit of interest.

Of course, if it does pan out this way and he does sell us, we could be attractive to the wrong type of person...


Could have even agreed a sale subject to planning permission.

Or maybe he has a soft spot for the club and its supporters


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:03:33
my take on Power slipping into the background was to arrest fanbase decline, and also that continuing in the same way would have us in the conference sooner or later.

But it just illustrates that the fucker cannot win,

Heavily involved - Fans - why won't he let the manager manage;
Steps back - Fans - He has lost interest, doesn't care anymore, just looking to get out.

As for the stadium and training ground, we really don't know, what I will say is that having tried to deal with the Council on a planning matter for the last 18 months that are singularly the hardest fucking Council to deal with in the entire country, will not make a decision regarding anything, procrastinate, don't return letters/emails/phone calls and seem to have no ideas of what they actually want.

On the ground if the Council were to sell to Power they would be mental not to include some manner of use restriction on use within the sale and clawback/unlift provision if football ceases to be played on the site and its sold for development, plus they have control over development via the Planning system, and if they depart from the local plan potentially the decision will be taken away from them anyway.

Do I trust Power, I honestly don't know having never seen evidence to come down either side on the argument.



Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:09:08
What are the club planning to do a massive nationwide survey and write a book? They shouldn't waste money on that, the government will be holding a census in 3 years time....
Doomsday is sooooo 1086.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:12:05
Power is looking towards an end game I think. Abandoning the 'Swindon way' and now talk of owning & possibly renovating the stadium seems to point that way. A club that owns its own, modern(ish) stadium will cost a lot more to a buyer than we will currently. Just my assumption, not really based on anything other than what I've seen... The fact he was so proactive for years and now has completely taken a back seat COULD mean he's lost a bit of interest.

Of course, if it does pan out this way and he does sell us, we could be attractive to the wrong type of person...

Totally agree.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Tails on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:13:27

Heavily involved - Fans - why won't he let the manager manage;
Steps back - Fans - He has lost interest, doesn't care anymore, just looking to get out.


As the 'steps back' bit came pretty much directly from me.... I wasn't criticising him for it and it was merely speculation on my part as to why he's abandoned the model and changed his mind re. ground purchase. I'm not a Power fan but also not one of those that will beat him for absolutely anything.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Ardiles on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:16:17
Power saw the "Swindon Way" as a means of making money, which after all was his stated objective. Similarly he stated that he had no interest in ground redevelopment etc.  It is surely not coincidence that at the time when we've no playing assets to sell, due to Power's poor recruitment decisions, and the Trust reveal what looks like a decent price for the CG... Power suddenly is interested in a property deal.

I do think it really is this simple.  Power’s strategy initially was ‘the Swindon way’.  It was all about the playing side - buy & develop young, untested players to sell on for a profit, and then reinvest.  He was so focused on this that he went out of his way to make it clear that developing the club’s infrastructure was of no interest - despite the sorry state of the County Ground.

This strategy worked for a year or two, and then fell apart…since which time the club has been in a state of decline.  So LP changes track, quite rightly in my view.  And purchase of the freehold might well be a part of an exit strategy.  While it does carry risks, we also have to recognise that many have been calling for this for years (even decades).  I remember Rikki Hunt making the same point 20 yrs ago.  The status quo is not sustainable, so I’m inclined to throw caution to the wind here and see where it takes us.

Doing nothing is not an option for us at the moment.  The club is on a downward spiral, and this may just provide a better alternative in the long run.  That said, I remain sceptical that LP will be able to raise the funds to finance the purchase.  The Council will be duty bound to get the best deal for the local taxpayer, so it will not be cheap.  And what will the debt used to finance the deal be secured against?  Lots of questions.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:21:15
I do think it really is this simple.  Power’s strategy initially was ‘the Swindon way’.  It was all about the playing side - buy & develop young, untested players to sell on for a profit, and then reinvest.  He was so focused on this that he went out of his way to make it clear that developing the club’s infrastructure was of no interest - despite the sorry state of the County Ground.

This strategy worked for a year or two, and then fell apart…since which time the club has been in a state of decline.  So LP changes track, quite rightly in my view.  And purchase of the freehold might well be a part of an exit strategy.  While it does carry risks, we also have to recognise that many have been calling for this for years (even decades).  I remember Rikki Hunt making the same point 20 yrs ago.  The status quo is not sustainable, so I’m inclined to throw caution to the wind here and see where it takes us.

Doing nothing is not an option for us at the moment.  The club is on a downward spiral, and this may just provide a better alternative in the long run.  That said, I remain sceptical that LP will be able to raise the funds to finance the purchase.  The Council will be duty bound to get the best deal for the local taxpayer, so it will not be cheap.  And what will the debt used to finance the deal be secured against?  Lots of questions.
Be quite cheap to get the ground i thought?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:36:51
Doomsday is sooooo 1086.

Interestingly, the Goddard estate comprised of lands, mentioned in Domesday, as belonging to Odo, Bishop of Bayeux. He's in the Tapestry, cracking Saxon skulls with a large wooden cross, as peaceful priests weren't allowed a sword.

You might presume that the Normans put the feudal system into place, and so much of the land ownership we have today comes from The Conquest, but not really so, the Normans just imposed themselves on an existing feudal pattern. Swindon had been held by Wadard, pre 1066.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:40:29
I think any excitement I may have is quelled more by the fact we're dealing with SBC than anything else. They don't seem to be big on progress.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Ardiles on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:40:35
If it was going to be cheap, the club would have bought the freehold years ago.  The cost has always been the stumbling block.  The only factor in the club's favour now, I guess, is that central Swindon/the surrounding area is in such a sorry state through lack of investment over a sustained period that the price will be lower, perhaps, that it could have been.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:42:07
If it was going to be cheap, the club would have bought the freehold years ago.  The cost has always been the stumbling block.  The only factor in the club's favour now, I guess, is that central Swindon/the surrounding area is in such a sorry state through lack of investment over a sustained period that the price will be lower, perhaps, that it could have been.
Pretty sure they have given the trust a price already haven't they ?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:43:33
As the 'steps back' bit came pretty much directly from me.... I wasn't criticising him for it and it was merely speculation on my part as to why he's abandoned the model and changed his mind re. ground purchase. I'm not a Power fan but also not one of those that will beat him for absolutely anything.

If you made that point I must have missed it as it wasn't aimed at anyone in particular, more a comment on general social media these last few weeks.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:44:02
I do think it really is this simple.  Power’s strategy initially was ‘the Swindon way’.  It was all about the playing side - buy & develop young, untested players to sell on for a profit, and then reinvest.  He was so focused on this that he went out of his way to make it clear that developing the club’s infrastructure was of no interest - despite the sorry state of the County Ground.

This strategy worked for a year or two, and then fell apart…since which time the club has been in a state of decline.  So LP changes track, quite rightly in my view.  And purchase of the freehold might well be a part of an exit strategy.  While it does carry risks, we also have to recognise that many have been calling for this for years (even decades).  I remember Rikki Hunt making the same point 20 yrs ago.  The status quo is not sustainable, so I’m inclined to throw caution to the wind here and see where it takes us.

Doing nothing is not an option for us at the moment.  The club is on a downward spiral, and this may just provide a better alternative in the long run.  That said, I remain sceptical that LP will be able to raise the funds to finance the purchase.  The Council will be duty bound to get the best deal for the local taxpayer, so it will not be cheap.  And what will the debt used to finance the deal be secured against?  Lots of questions.

I take the point that doing nothing is no longer an option if we wish to sustain league football at the CG into the future.  However such is the break between club and fans, I'm not sure there is much heart left in the fan base if the worst comes to the worst.

It'll be a shame to see the Club go, as the CG must be one of the oldest grounds in the country.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Private Fraser on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:45:33
Pretty sure they have given the trust a price already haven't they ?

From the Trust's November 2017 update:

"Earlier in the year we met with multiple fundraising partners to discuss how we can get the money together to purchase the stadium. Our initial £1.1m bid was not accepted by the Council and we can expect that number to more than double when all of the associated taxes and costs are taken into account and before a final offer is accepted."



Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:46:28
Interestingly, the Goddard estate comprised of lands, mentioned in Domesday, as belonging to Odo, Bishop of Bayeux. He's in the Tapestry, cracking Saxon skulls with a large wooden cross, as peaceful priests weren't allowed a sword.

You might presume that the Normans put the feudal system into place, and so much of the land ownership we have today comes from The Conquest, but not really so, the Normans just imposed themselves on an existing feudal pattern. Swindon had been held by Wadard, pre 1066.

So is the Tapestry coming to the UK a sign?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: JoeMezz on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:49:41
Maybe we're just waiting on a certain Aden Flint to be sold...


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Tails on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:50:33
If you made that point I must have missed it as it wasn't aimed at anyone in particular, more a comment on general social media these last few weeks.

Ah fair enough, it was basically summarising what I said in a way so thought it was aimed at me!


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:51:59
Interestingly, the Goddard estate comprised of lands, mentioned in Domesday, as belonging to Odo, Bishop of Bayeux. He's in the Tapestry, cracking Saxon skulls with a large wooden cross, as peaceful priests weren't allowed a sword.
Yes I remember reading that somewhere, may have been when we stayed in the Goddard Arms, as horlock says the tapestry coming to the UK is a sign!


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:53:13
Interestingly, the Goddard estate comprised of lands, mentioned in Domesday, as belonging to Odo, Bishop of Bayeux. He's in the Tapestry, cracking Saxon skulls with a large wooden cross, as peaceful priests weren't allowed a sword.

You might presume that the Normans put the feudal system into place, and so much of the land ownership we have today comes from The Conquest, but not really so, the Normans just imposed themselves on an existing feudal pattern. Swindon had been held by Wadard, pre 1066.
Nice to get some reminiscences from your childhood, Reg :)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Arriba on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:55:04
As it's the current shambles of a council deciding I expect them to completely fuck this up.
I worry that one man will do very well out of it when, to be frank, they shouldn't. It's not the council's to give away unless it benefits the town, and not just those who go to football, or the man who owns the football club at the time of sale.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Private Fraser on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:55:46
I take the point that doing nothing is no longer an option if we wish to sustain league football at the CG into the future.  However such is the break between club and fans, I'm not sure there is much heart left in the fan base if the worst comes to the worst.

It'll be a shame to see the Club go, as the CG must be one of the oldest grounds in the country.

A classic "Reg-ism".  One for the forum archive.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:55:50
However such is the break between club and fans, I'm not sure there is much heart left in the fan base if the worst comes to the worst.

It'll be a shame to see the Club go, as the CG must be one of the oldest grounds in the country.

As a fan from afar, is this 'break' as severe as many purveyors of doom (or dome) like to make it out to be, crowds are dropping, but have they really dropped any lower than one would expect from a recently relegated D4 club, I cannot imagine we were getting this many in the early 80's when we were down in the depths, we presently have the 5th highest average home attendance in the league (a level that would put us mid table for average attendances if we were in League 1 this year).

Yes the surveys on here for attendance show season ticket levels and attendance among posters dropping, but is that not more to do with demographics of this forum, I don't see loads of young new posters turning up here, but they are possibly getting the bug as happens with natural changes and whats sustaining the crowds etc?

Perhaps the forum needs to have a recruitment drive to get more posters in, get rid of some dead wood (now's no time for sentiment) and get some fresh blood in to take things forward.  :hmmm: ;)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 11:59:36
So is the Tapestry coming to the UK a sign?

This would be a sign....

(http://uh.edu/engines/istimirantstella.jpg)

Next due 2061


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 12:05:18
This would be a sign....

(http://uh.edu/engines/istimirantstella.jpg)

Next due 2061
Thats not a sign....this is a sign....

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/58/Magic_Roundabout_Schild_db.jpg/1200px-Magic_Roundabout_Schild_db.jpg)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Frigby Daser on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 12:10:38
A lot of people are assuming they the worst case scenario here.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 12:13:05
A lot of people are assuming they the worst case scenario here.
Its the Swindon way, what with our track record and fans faith in the owner, then again its like that with any new signing we have too.

Negativity at Swindon far far outweighs any possible positivity.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Abrahammer on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 12:26:00
A lot of people are assuming they the worst case scenario here.

Certain posters, guess who, thrive in it.

Most people are rational and are waiting for more detail before claiming the club is on the brink of extinction.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 12:40:29
A lot of people are assuming they the worst case scenario here.
I don't think there's that many assuming the worst case. But I think there's plenty (and I'd include myself in this) who are wary that there could be a downside to what initially sounds like a good thing, and no more than that. Given our history, it's sensible to be aware surely?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: flammableBen on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 12:59:39
Just popped up on my facebook. Fair play to you optomists, but looks like the begining of the end for me.



Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Ticker45 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 13:07:01
I don't think there's that many assuming the worst case. But I think there's plenty (and I'd include myself in this) who are wary that there could be a downside to what initially sounds like a good thing, and no more than that. Given our history, it's sensible to be aware surely?

This.

I was one who thought many years ago that a new ground was needed and out of the clutches of the council was the way to go. It never happened, so this could be the answer or it could be a total disaster, as usual only time will tell.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 13:12:43
Perhaps the forum needs to have a recruitment drive to get more posters in, get rid of some dead wood (now's no time for sentiment) and get some fresh blood in to take things forward.  :hmmm: ;)

The Tories are having a similar campaign to attract the yoof. Their man is the youthful MP for Mansfield, Ben Bradley, his main selling point is being a Brexiteer who wants vasectomies for the under class. Surprising that Mansfield voted for that... but vasectomy is a long word.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 13:32:09
I used to think fan ownership would be preferably to Power getting his hands on any appreciable asset, but then I spent some time in that facebook group and changed my mind.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 13:32:34
It’s not Power, per se, I’m wary of. It’s any owner in this day and age. The last 10 years or so is littered with clubs fucked over by their owner.

I can only judge on what has happened - we’ve declined on the pitch, year on year, attendances have dropped 1500 or so, we’ve probably been conned re any possible training ground.

I know some on here put Power into the ‘useless’ owner category rather than the ‘evil’ owner, but with his previous business history it’s difficult not to be on the paranoid side of wary.

I do agree, though, that doing nowt isn’t an option going forward.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 14:03:28
I used to think fan ownership would be preferably to Power getting his hands on any appreciable asset, but then I spent some time in that facebook group and changed my mind.
On that basis, I assume you're also opposed to democratic elections as a way of running the country?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: theakston2k on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 14:07:26
I used to think fan ownership would be preferably to Power getting his hands on any appreciable asset, but then I spent some time in that facebook group and changed my mind.
Don’t think any of them would put their hands in there pockets anyway or for a ground purchase for that matter. The apathy that exists, even in the Diamandis days says to me the only way we’d ever progress would be through a private individual.

Nothing has changed at the club in 20 years, the ground is at the end of its shelf life so something needs to change as if nothing changes in the next 20 years I can see us decaying into nothingness anyway. Lots of questions of course but I’m not going all doom and gloom as worst case it would just accelerate an ongoing slow decline of the club in my opinion.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 14:18:56
It’s not Power, per se, I’m wary of. It’s any owner in this day and age. The last 10 years or so is littered with clubs fucked over by their owner.

Absolutely. But we can't stagnate forever (as theakston said).

On the assumption it'll be sold soon whatever, the only way to stop a bellend getting the ground is to own it yourself.

Even then there are no guarantees a well meaning owner won't fuck it up.



Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 14:54:23
Absolutely. But we can't stagnate forever (as theakston said).

the only way to stop a bellend getting the ground is to own it yourself.

Even then there are no guarantees a well meaning owner won't fuck it up.

I'd rather have Audrey than Power.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 15:14:31
It’s not Power, per se, I’m wary of. It’s any owner in this day and age. The last 10 years or so is littered with clubs fucked over by their owner.

So in all seriousness what do you suggest, even if you go down the fan route, if it goes well you end up in the Swansea situation?


we’ve probably been conned re any possible training ground.


Have we?


I know some on here put Power into the ‘useless’ owner category rather than the ‘evil’ owner, but with his previous business history it’s difficult not to be on the paranoid side of wary.


I entirely agree about being wary, however I have never seen anything that suggests that Powers previous endeavors were anything nefarious, they could equally be naeivity and inexperience that he may have learnt from?


I do agree, though, that doing nowt isn’t an option going forward.

Indeed, I have no idea whats going on with the Trust and, understand they all have day jobs but the present scrabble of activity followed by months of silence doesn't really help anyone or build confidence, after the clubs announcement yesterday it would take 5 minutes to draft a statement saying I dunno

'We note the club offer and would like to talk to them about their proposals, we can confirm that we the Trust are still in negotiation with the Council and hope to be able to report progress shortly, in the meantime we would welcome the chance for dialogue with the club to see if we can move forward for the mutual benefit of STFC as a community asset and Football Club representing Swindon'

(You can have that one for nothing!)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 16:12:35
 So the Trust are still in the game according to The Adver.  This could be fun  :popcorn:


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 16:20:31
Be great to see our club become a tug of war. Joy


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 17:10:43
http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/sport/15864694.Trust_STFC_confident_over_County_Ground_freehold_plans/?ref=mr&lp=7



Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 17:18:03
So, if the Trust win out, will Power walk in a fit of pique? Can’t see him coughing rent to the Trust.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Panda Paws on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 17:41:05
Who's funding the trust bid?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 17:42:02
Who's funding the trust bid?
We don't know yet, they will not reveal it which is quite frustrating.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 17:50:03
As I saw you point out elsewhere, DRS, if it were Power not revealing an anonymous funder people would be going berserk.

I understand why the trust probably can't reveal theirs, it's not a dig at them. But still...


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Saxondale on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 18:01:01
Who's funding the trust bid?

Mike Diamandis


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: RedRag on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 18:11:47
My opinion is that only the Trust can ensure any benefit passes to STFC rather than to its owner for the time being. 

Power has never expressed interest in owning the ground previously.

How would it disadvantage him or the club that he owns to have a friendly landlord in the Trust and a friendly partner in any future development plans for the CG (whether for the Ground or for a "never say never" housing development planning gain)?

My view is because he sees a better possibility for a profit for himself - through STFC - in either selling the club with freehold ownership or benefitting from a planning gain with a third party of his own choosing. 

This does not make Power a monster but it would not be in STFC's best interests

My preferred outcomes, in this order

1 Trust acquires freehold
2 SBC retains freehold
3 STFC acquires freehold

I tend to agree with PaulD, Audrey and Reg etc on this issue but as Reg and others note the Trust's limited communication requires powerful and timely correction. 


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 18:28:40
On that basis, I assume you're also opposed to democratic elections as a way of running the country?

Good point, I won't join the general election facebook group just in case.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 18:37:09
As I saw you point out elsewhere, DRS, if it were Power not revealing an anonymous funder people would be going berserk.

I understand why the trust probably can't reveal theirs, it's not a dig at them. But still...

Whoever it is the idea that the Trust buy backed by a couple of very large backers still worries me, people don't give that sort of cash expecting nowt in return, and likewise circumstances change, remember Bill Power and the plane crash, all it needs is for one of the funders to encounter an unforeseen and either they or in the worst case their successors need the cash back sharpish and you are in trouble.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: theakston2k on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 19:00:15
My opinion is that only the Trust can ensure any benefit passes to STFC rather than to its owner for the time being. 

Power has never expressed interest in owning the ground previously.

How would it disadvantage him or the club that he owns to have a friendly landlord in the Trust and a friendly partner in any future development plans for the CG (whether for the Ground or for a "never say never" housing development planning gain)?

My view is because he sees a better possibility for a profit for himself - through STFC - in either selling the club with freehold ownership or benefitting from a planning gain with a third party of his own choosing. 

This does not make Power a monster but it would not be in STFC's best interests

My preferred outcomes, in this order

1 Trust acquires freehold
2 SBC retains freehold
3 STFC acquires freehold

I tend to agree with PaulD, Audrey and Reg etc on this issue but as Reg and others note the Trust's limited communication requires powerful and timely correction. 

Disagree, Trust owning it is only of any use if they have the funds to redevelop it otherwise it's status quo just with the Trust being the landlord rather than the council. A couple of million is one thing, the cost of redevelopment is quite another.
Also as the trust was on about us purchasing shares does that mean the ground would effectively be owned by whoever their backer is rather than the Trust itself or is it a donation? Just as many if not more questions about a Trust purchase especially when it comes to long term relationship with the club and the cost of redevelopment.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: @mwooly63 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 19:28:50
Disagree, Trust owning it is only of any use if they have the funds to redevelop it otherwise it's status quo just with the Trust being the landlord rather than the council. A couple of million is one thing, the cost of redevelopment is quite another.
Also as the trust was on about us purchasing shares does that mean the ground would effectively be owned by whoever their backer is rather than the Trust itself or is it a donation? Just as many if not more questions about a Trust purchase especially when it comes to long term relationship with the club and the cost of redevelopment.

From today's adver article

Quote
The new development came nearly six months after the Trust, having spent £30,000 in fees conducting due diligence on the purchase plan, submitted a proposal to the Borough Council including a financial offer and details of a major third-party fully-funded stadium plan to begin once planning permission had been granted

http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/sport/15864694.Trust_STFC_confident_over_County_Ground_freehold_plans/?ref=mr&lp=7


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 19:35:07
It’s in effect Chelski in reverse if the trust manage to get the freehold.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 19:36:04
Could you imagine if Power said that, though:

"It's alright guys. I've got a major third-party fully-funded stadium plan to begin once planning permission had been granted". What kind of reaction would there be to that?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: theakston2k on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 19:46:52
From today's adver article

http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/sport/15864694.Trust_STFC_confident_over_County_Ground_freehold_plans/?ref=mr&lp=7
A meaningless statement as doesn’t give any details of what they class as the redevelopment and what said third party would want. The Trust are meant to be 100% transparent but they’ve made no communications since November, won’t even tell members who the backer(s) is, just feels like a closed shop to me. Also if Power goes ‘get bent I’ll move the club and build my own ground’ what will they do then? Unless they come to a long term agreement with the club it could be equally as disastrous as any of the Power scenarios.


Title: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 20:16:41
so we have two anonymous  backers, both parties may be bound by non disclosure for all we know.

the trust's comms has been very poor. I know I couldn't do better given work and family commitments.

I'd guess the trust have asked the Eady estate. 100% guess though


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Not that Nice If I'm Honest on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 20:38:10
Latest statement from the Trust
 "We are delighted to announce that one of our backers has given us permission to go public - please welcome Mr Firoz Kassam"


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 20:46:49
Isn't the Trust board member quoted in the article one of a number of wealthy backers the Trust have mentioned having in the past - coincidence??


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 21:08:14
James Phipps is the owner and CEO of Excaliber. A local company. Probably on a par with Power in the richness stakes.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: tans on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 21:47:02
Wonder if LP old mate Colin Hill is involved


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Thursday, January 18, 2018, 22:19:40
In reference to the club/owner recognising a need to change tack I think Is quite the correct approach. Who that will benefit in the long term is quite anyone's guess but as the famous quote goes;

"...doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result."

We have stagnated so much as a club. Regardless of how they are/have doing/done it, look at many of the clubs around us, one thing has stood out. They have changed tack and developed a new stadia. Bristol City, Reading (ugh), Southampton, Bournemouth (more ugh). They've all been in the doldrums like ourselves and yet they've all managed to move on and sustained Tier two or higher. Yes all of those clubs have wealthy backers. We had a wealthy backer in Black, Arbib & co. Infact I think their personal wealth was higher than the likes of Madjeski and the fella at Bristol City. We can bang on about the Madjeski being a soulless field of plastic seats (I bloody hate it and their "fans") but they key thing is, they bring in extra revenue. It's a 24/7 facility. We have buggar all. I love this club as much as any of you here but if ever there was a time for STFC to "move on" now is the time.  Otherwise I feel the club will just run itself into the ground. None of us want that, I'm certain.

We should be a tier two club, there is no doubt. Forget historically we're Tier three. I go through so many clubs that are above us that have "moved on" and I think, we can easily be where they are. Burnley, Cardiff, Swansea, Huddersfield, Brighton, Burton, Hull, Wigan, Shrewsbury. It almost sounds ridiculous how many of these clubs are thriving better than us but they all have a common factor. New ground/redeveloped ground. Pretty much all with extra revenue streams via the club facilities (gyms/5-a-side/spa/hotel/units rented to restaurants and other retail).

I can't wait for all the cunt points btw  :soapy tit wank: :soapy tit wank: :soapy tit wank: :pint:


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Sippo on Friday, January 19, 2018, 07:23:06
James Phipps is the owner and CEO of Excaliber. A local company. Probably on a par with Power in the richness stakes.

He's not. He sold it.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Friday, January 19, 2018, 09:33:19
In reference to the club/owner recognising a need to change tack I think Is quite the correct approach. Who that will benefit in the long term is quite anyone's guess but as the famous quote goes;

"...doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result."

We have stagnated so much as a club. Regardless of how they are/have doing/done it, look at many of the clubs around us, one thing has stood out. They have changed tack and developed a new stadia. Bristol City, Reading (ugh), Southampton, Bournemouth (more ugh). They've all been in the doldrums like ourselves and yet they've all managed to move on and sustained Tier two or higher. Yes all of those clubs have wealthy backers. We had a wealthy backer in Black, Arbib & co. Infact I think their personal wealth was higher than the likes of Madjeski and the fella at Bristol City. We can bang on about the Madjeski being a soulless field of plastic seats (I bloody hate it and their "fans") but they key thing is, they bring in extra revenue. It's a 24/7 facility. We have buggar all. I love this club as much as any of you here but if ever there was a time for STFC to "move on" now is the time.  Otherwise I feel the club will just run itself into the ground. None of us want that, I'm certain.

We should be a tier two club, there is no doubt. Forget historically we're Tier three. I go through so many clubs that are above us that have "moved on" and I think, we can easily be where they are. Burnley, Cardiff, Swansea, Huddersfield, Brighton, Burton, Hull, Wigan, Shrewsbury. It almost sounds ridiculous how many of these clubs are thriving better than us but they all have a common factor. New ground/redeveloped ground. Pretty much all with extra revenue streams via the club facilities (gyms/5-a-side/spa/hotel/units rented to restaurants and other retail).

I can't wait for all the cunt points btw  :soapy tit wank: :soapy tit wank: :soapy tit wank: :pint:

Lansdowne (Bristol City fella) is worth nearly £3 billion - https://www.forbes.com/profile/stephen-lansdown/
Arbib once sold shares for a billion, but is reckoned to be worth around £350 million - http://economia.icaew.com/features/the-accountancy-rich-list-2015/accountancy-rich-list-2015-24-to-11

Nowhere near the same ballpark. Have another couple of cunt points for spouting made up shit as fact again.

We are not a tier 2 club.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Tails on Friday, January 19, 2018, 09:36:16
He didn't say we are, he said we should be in all fairness.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Friday, January 19, 2018, 09:38:01
Why should we be? We're not in the same league financially (or literally!) as any of the clubs in the championship. Last time Bristol City came down to League One they did so on a playing budget of circa £20 million. How can we compete with that?


Title: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Friday, January 19, 2018, 09:41:40
that's the worry now. To me, getting to the championship  and staying there is as difficult as getting to the premier league used to be.

you only need to look at average attendances in the championship to see where we'd sit financially. that's without the parachute payment clubs distorting it further.

how do we bridge that gap without major investment all round?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Tails on Friday, January 19, 2018, 09:48:45
Why should we be? We're not in the same league financially (or literally!) as any of the clubs in the championship. Last time Bristol City came down to League One they did so on a playing budget of circa £20 million. How can we compete with that?

Probably because, like me, his early years were spent with us spending the majority of our time in the second tier. I'm not sure, I'm speculating on his part. I don't see us as a second tier club at all personally. We could be with the potential fanbase, but even the people in Swindon who like the club are majorly apathetic towards it so really, we'll probably stick to third or fourth tiers.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Friday, January 19, 2018, 10:04:40
Wonder if LP old mate Colin Hill is involved
That would be a major "run for the hills" red flag. The reason Power's previous track record of involvement with football and property is dubious is where he's been involved with Hill and pals. Hopefully this is a chance for him to demonstrate that he's put those days (and those people) behind him.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Friday, January 19, 2018, 10:28:43
That would be a major "run for the hills" red flag. The reason Power's previous track record of involvement with football and property is dubious is where he's been involved with Hill and pals. Hopefully this is a chance for him to demonstrate that he's put those days (and those people) behind him.
http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/sport/15865447.Council_pledge_to_make_best_deal_for_all_over_County_Ground/ Thought they spoke very well here. At a time where both parties are not revealing much it was nice to hear something


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Friday, January 19, 2018, 10:32:14
yes good response from Perkins. obviously we'll see.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Friday, January 19, 2018, 10:57:23
Why should we be? We're not in the same league financially (or literally!) as any of the clubs in the championship. Last time Bristol City came down to League One they did so on a playing budget of circa £20 million. How can we compete with that?

Back around to money in football, the biggest spoiler for me personally. Tends to be the haves and have nots with a few mixing it up or down the leagues. All a bit boring and predictable these days.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, January 19, 2018, 11:19:36
http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/sport/15865447.Council_pledge_to_make_best_deal_for_all_over_County_Ground/ Thought they spoke very well here. At a time where both parties are not revealing much it was nice to hear something

Unusually for Perkins, there's a lot of sense written here.  However, we're talking of decision makers, who got into bed with Rikki, so much do they like STFC chairmen.

The lesson learned from that... say the right things about benefit for the people of Swindon, and you won't be held to account for disappearing funds, either by any watchdog or the voters of places like Haydon Wick.

I'm reassured having read the piece that anything will happen any time soon... therefore can return to crocodile mode, half an eye open for danger, but slumber and dream about 3 points at Cov.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: RedRag on Friday, January 19, 2018, 12:37:48
In reference to the club/owner recognising a need to change tack I think Is quite the correct approach. Who that will benefit in the long term is quite anyone's guess but as the famous quote goes;

"...doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result."

We have stagnated so much as a club. Regardless of how they are/have doing/done it, look at many of the clubs around us, one thing has stood out. They have changed tack and developed a new stadia. Bristol City, Reading (ugh), Southampton, Bournemouth (more ugh). They've all been in the doldrums like ourselves and yet they've all managed to move on and sustained Tier two or higher. Yes all of those clubs have wealthy backers. We had a wealthy backer in Black, Arbib & co. Infact I think their personal wealth was higher than the likes of Madjeski and the fella at Bristol City. We can bang on about the Madjeski being a soulless field of plastic seats (I bloody hate it and their "fans") but they key thing is, they bring in extra revenue. It's a 24/7 facility. We have buggar all. I love this club as much as any of you here but if ever there was a time for STFC to "move on" now is the time.  Otherwise I feel the club will just run itself into the ground. None of us want that, I'm certain.

We should be a tier two club, there is no doubt. Forget historically we're Tier three. I go through so many clubs that are above us that have "moved on" and I think, we can easily be where they are. Burnley, Cardiff, Swansea, Huddersfield, Brighton, Burton, Hull, Wigan, Shrewsbury. It almost sounds ridiculous how many of these clubs are thriving better than us but they all have a common factor. New ground/redeveloped ground. Pretty much all with extra revenue streams via the club facilities (gyms/5-a-side/spa/hotel/units rented to restaurants and other retail).

I can't wait for all the cunt points btw  :soapy tit wank: :soapy tit wank: :soapy tit wank: :pint:
Good post so no cunt points from me  ;)

You are reflecting the legitimate desire of our fanbase for progress on the ground as a step towards financial stability.  I share that wish for progress.  In my view that could only be achieved if the Trust purchases the freehold.  

Firstly let's keep clear who could (in the simplest of terms) be involved in the County Ground Freehold purchase:

STFC LTD (ie Power's loss making business))
the Trust (ie vehicle for fans' purchase of County Ground freehold)

Where appropriate I refer to STFC LTD as Power and to the Trust as the Fans

If STFC LTD buys the CG freehold then the club's Landlord becomes Power (or the owner for the time being of the STFC LTD)
If the Trust buys the CG then the club's new Landlord becomes the Fans.  

On paper the Fans' ownership of the CG in place of SBC does not adversely impact one single previously stated ambition of Power for the club.  What it does do is ensure that IF there is any future development of the CG, the Fans would be involved as its owner.  If there were profits to be made from any "development" (whether as income stream or from a planning gain) then the Trust would inevitably share in them.

Otherwise, why the hell would anyone think any financial risk takers in buying the County Ground or in its development would somehow voluntarily just "give" the club a share of any gain or income stream? ie a permanent gift to enure for the club rather than to STFC LTD, solely owned at present by Power?

Why is Power suddenly interested?

IMO that would be because in ADDITION TO ownership and control of the CG, there may ALSO be a present "hope value", ie for a future planning gain.  If so, should any planning windfall accrue to the Fans plus backers (for the permanent benefit of the Club) or to Power plus backers?  

The Fans' financial backers would include those fans purchasing shares plus the Eady Estate (neither of which is likely to require a financial return for itself - unlike an STFC LTD/Power purchase).  

Power is no worse off with the Trust as replacement Landlord.  Any ground purchase, let alone development, will demand unascertained backers and terms.  Trust ownership of the Ground could also ensure the Fans had some leverage on any future purchaser of the club.  I do not see Power with or without backers as financially capable of driving the club forward. 

Excepting the dream billionaire fan-owner, I see permanent progress for the club at least a decade away.  The acquisition now of the CG freehold is the best opportunity to secure this for the Fans' benefit in the club's hundred year history.  What's another decade now?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Posh Red on Friday, January 19, 2018, 12:42:16
Two things that come to mind reading this thread.

Someone questioned why Power/The club are interested in the stadium now when they hadn’t been before.
I’d guess that could be because the council now appear to want to sell it off. It’s one thing having to pay rent to the council, but a whole different ball game to a third party who may well have no interest in football, let alone STFC.

The other is regarding this idea of our potential.
I’m not sure that we would get the crowds that some people think even if we made it to the championship, after all our first ever home Premier league game didn’t make 12000. (I know this was a while ago & against Oldham).


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Friday, January 19, 2018, 12:44:26
You are forgetting Chelsea mustered less at SB when we played them that season  ;)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Arriba on Friday, January 19, 2018, 12:45:34
Perkin's being involved fills me with dread. His track record is shameful.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Friday, January 19, 2018, 13:01:34
Perkin's being involved fills me with dread. His track record is shameful.
Why is this Arriba? not living in Swindon I have never heard of the bloke before today, whats his track record that aggrivates you so much?

Just wondered as I know nothing of the man.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Friday, January 19, 2018, 13:10:18
Two things that come to mind reading this thread.

Someone questioned why Power/The club are interested in the stadium now when they hadn’t been before.
I’d guess that could be because the council now appear to want to sell it off. It’s one thing having to pay rent to the council, but a whole different ball game to a third party who may well have no interest in football, let alone STFC.

It appears the council need the money thats definately one part but I think the other is that Power now has on board the director from Axis who have a lot of experience in redevelopment.

Obviously thats just a guess.

Quote
The other is regarding this idea of our potential.
I’m not sure that we would get the crowds that some people think even if we made it to the championship, after all our first ever home Premier league game didn’t make 12000. (I know this was a while ago & against Oldham).
A town the size of Swindon could support a team that averages 11,000 to 12,000 per week in the Championship I think personally although we haven't regularly had support like that for many many years, I do know a lot of fans that travel to London for games and they could possibly be convinced to follow us as they seem to go to watch Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs, West Ham etc just to watch football not as fans.

This is what happened at Reading after their new build and promotion, yes they may be plastic fans but they are bums on seats.

I think that for now a ground with about 12,000 capacity would be fine, 14,000 maybe at a push, as long as possible stand expansion capability is there just in case.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Arriba on Friday, January 19, 2018, 13:22:35
Why is this Arriba? not living in Swindon I have never heard of the bloke before today, whats his track record that aggrivates you so much?

Just wondered as I know nothing of the man.

He's meant to be the man in charge of the so called regeneration of the town which has failed miserably (kimmerfields farce). The tossing off of the towns leisure facilities. The ski slope pipe dream. The general decline of the town. The Rikki Hunt WiFi missing money. Etc.etc.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Ardiles on Friday, January 19, 2018, 13:33:21
The other is regarding this idea of our potential.
I’m not sure that we would get the crowds that some people think even if we made it to the championship, after all our first ever home Premier league game didn’t make 12000. (I know this was a while ago & against Oldham).

It was:

  • 25 yeas ago;
  • against Oldham;
  • on a Tuesday evening in August (at the height of the holiday season); and
  • just 4 days before Liverpool were due at the County Ground (the following Saturday).

Not a bad crowd, all considered.

 :D


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Posh Red on Friday, January 19, 2018, 13:37:31
You are forgetting Chelsea mustered less at SB when we played them that season  ;)

‘Tis a fair point, maybe if we get a Billionaire Russian owner to spunk away millions of pounds on the club we would get there. I guess that might persuade some of the non Swindon football fans that live in the Town to come to games, I’m just not convinced


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Posh Red on Friday, January 19, 2018, 13:52:50
It was:

  • 25 yeas ago;
  • against Oldham;
  • on a Tuesday evening in August (at the height of the holiday season); and
  • just 4 days before Liverpool were due at the County Ground (the following Saturday).

Not a bad crowd, all considered.

 :D

The first game in the clubs history in the top flight, maybe just me but I’d have thought any Town fan would do almost anything to be there. In fact not only was it not a sell out, but it wasn’t that much bigger than the previous few seasons.

The fact is that our crowd for the first game the previous season was also 11000 odd (although to be fair that was Sunderland on a Saturday).


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Bob's Orange on Friday, January 19, 2018, 13:54:27
The first game in the clubs history in the top flight, maybe just me but I’d have thought any Town fan would do almost anything to be there. In fact not only was it not a sell out, but it wasn’t that much bigger than the previous few seasons.

The fact is that our crowd for the first game the previous season was also 11000 odd (although to be fair that was Sunderland on a Saturday).

Tend to agree, especially after what happened in 1990. I lived in Scotland so had a perfect excuse!


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Friday, January 19, 2018, 14:02:09
Oldham only bought a couple of hundred


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: blah blah on Friday, January 19, 2018, 14:31:53
The first game in the clubs history in the top flight, maybe just me but I’d have thought any Town fan would do almost anything to be there. In fact not only was it not a sell out, but it wasn’t that much bigger than the previous few seasons.

The fact is that our crowd for the first game the previous season was also 11000 odd (although to be fair that was Sunderland on a Saturday).

The second game in the top flight, first at home.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: chalkies_shorts on Friday, January 19, 2018, 14:41:24
Don't forget we were under declaring our crowds to the point that people laughed when they were announced. It wasn't the biggest gate that season but a lot more than that announced - as they all were that season and for the few seasons previous to that. We weren't; the only ones doing it and trips to West Brom and Traders had very interesting gates. 


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Ardiles on Friday, January 19, 2018, 14:48:40
The fact is that our crowd for the first game the previous season was also 11000 odd (although to be fair that was Sunderland on a Saturday).

Bit of a tangent, this, but the tension before that game was immense.  We were in the Town End, and I can still remember the Sunderland fans packing out the Bank opposite and the chants going backwards & forwards across the pitch.  Proper butterflies before that one.

And Hoddle's goal that day was immense.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Friday, January 19, 2018, 14:52:29
Our average attendance was higher than Southampton, QPR, Coventry, Oldham and Wimbledon  :nod:


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Bob's Orange on Friday, January 19, 2018, 14:53:22
Bit of a tangent, this, but the tension before that game was immense.  We were in the Town End, and I can still remember the Sunderland fans packing out the Bank opposite and the chants going backwards & forwards across the pitch.  Proper butterflies before that one.

And Hoddle's goal that day was immense.

To this day probably one of my favourite Swindon goals. Quick shimmy to lose the defender and then put the ball right in the postage stamp.

On another tangent, I had a look at Wiki for crowds that season and noticed the goal scoring prowess of Paul Bodin at home. He only failed to score 1 game in 8 and scored in 5 consecutive matches in the below group of games. Pretty good going for a left back.

30 January 1993   Wolverhampton Wanderers   H   1–0   12,854   Bodin
13 February 1993   Millwall   H   3–0   10,544   White, Bodin, Taylor
23 February 1993   Tranmere Rovers   H   2–0   10,059   Mitchell (2)
27 February 1993   Portsmouth   H   1–0   14,077   Bodin
13 March 1993   Newcastle United   H   2–1   17,574   Bodin (pen), Calderwood
24 March 1993   Bristol City   H   2–1   13,157   Marwood, Bodin (pen)
3 April 1993   Peterborough United   H   1–0   10,314   Bodin
10 April 1993   Luton Town   H   1–0   10,934   Bodin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992%E2%80%9393_Swindon_Town_F.C._season


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Friday, January 19, 2018, 15:02:15
I remember Barry Venison wasn't very happy during the Newcastle game  :)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Posh Red on Friday, January 19, 2018, 15:13:01
To this day probably one of my favourite Swindon goals. Quick shimmy to lose the defender and then put the ball right in the postage stamp.

On another tangent, I had a look at Wiki for crowds that season and noticed the goal scoring prowess of Paul Bodin at home. He only failed to score 1 game in 8 and scored in 5 consecutive matches in the below group of games. Pretty good going for a left back.

30 January 1993   Wolverhampton Wanderers   H   1–0   12,854   Bodin
13 February 1993   Millwall   H   3–0   10,544   White, Bodin, Taylor
23 February 1993   Tranmere Rovers   H   2–0   10,059   Mitchell (2)
27 February 1993   Portsmouth   H   1–0   14,077   Bodin
13 March 1993   Newcastle United   H   2–1   17,574   Bodin (pen), Calderwood
24 March 1993   Bristol City   H   2–1   13,157   Marwood, Bodin (pen)
3 April 1993   Peterborough United   H   1–0   10,314   Bodin
10 April 1993   Luton Town   H   1–0   10,934   Bodin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992%E2%80%9393_Swindon_Town_F.C._season

I remember him scoring the only goal in the game at Sunderland too. The only other thing I remember from that day is the fog on the way up & back. In fact Hartlepool’s game was abandoned at HT because of it


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Nemo on Friday, January 19, 2018, 15:58:20
We could do with knowing a bit more about Morfuni... after all he may not be from the Jed/Murrall school of Power chums, but as long as he lurks in the shadows, we can only assume the worst.

http://mycricket.cricket.com.au/common/pages/public/rv/cricket/ViewPlayer.aspx?playerID=944097&eid=3830

He can't be *so* bad if he plays amateur cricket, right?



Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, January 19, 2018, 16:10:57
http://mycricket.cricket.com.au/common/pages/public/rv/cricket/ViewPlayer.aspx?playerID=944097&eid=3830

He can't be *so* bad if he plays amateur cricket, right?

In Australia though  :hmmm:

If an Englishman had such figures, it would be reassuringly telling about the cut of his jib. But a Convict, not sure it applies.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Friday, January 19, 2018, 16:14:39
He's meant to be the man in charge of the so called regeneration of the town which has failed miserably (kimmerfields farce). The tossing off of the towns leisure facilities. The ski slope pipe dream. The general decline of the town. The Rikki Hunt WiFi missing money. Etc.etc.
Ah thanks, not heard of half of those projects to be fair but I hardly ever read the Adver online and obviously don't get it 100 miles away!

I can understand your doubts about him.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Friday, January 19, 2018, 16:30:35
Ah thanks, not heard of half of those projects to be fair but I hardly ever read the Adver online and obviously don't get it 100 miles away!

I can understand your doubts about him.

When May described the Tories as the Nasty Party, she might have had Perkins in mind.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Friday, January 19, 2018, 17:07:02
Lansdowne (Bristol City fella) is worth nearly £3 billion - https://www.forbes.com/profile/stephen-lansdown/
Arbib once sold shares for a billion, but is reckoned to be worth around £350 million - http://economia.icaew.com/features/the-accountancy-rich-list-2015/accountancy-rich-list-2015-24-to-11

Nowhere near the same ballpark. Have another couple of cunt points for spouting made up shit as fact again.

We are not a tier 2 club.

Sorry, King of the TEF, centre of all knowledge.

That's funny though because in 2010 Andrew Blacks Betfair was worth around £1.4bn(1) and a net worth of £200m. He sold them recently for around £660m(2). Arbib in 2009 was actually around £325m(3).

In 2009 Lansdown was worth £280m(4), in 2010 he paid for BCFC stadia to be built. Today Lansdown is worth about $2.5bn (or £1.8bn)(5), and in 2015 he was worth $1.9bn (or £1.3bn)(6).

I've highlighted the 2009/2010 periods because that is when both Black & Arbib were involved with Swindon Town (they took ownership in 2008, I'm sure you're aware), and Lansdown in ownership of Bristol City. For comparison, as the facts show, the STFC owners net worth of c£525m was nearly double that of Lansdown at that time. Even individually (at £200m, £280m, and £325m) they were all playing in the same ball park. In fact Arbibs net worth was down c£45m from his reported £370m in 2008.

1 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/leisure/8081984/Betfair-shares-get-strong-start-in-boost-to-IPO-market.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/leisure/8081984/Betfair-shares-get-strong-start-in-boost-to-IPO-market.html)

2 http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/betfair-and-paddy-power-merger-set-for-february/2018724/#newsArchiveTabs=last7DaysNews (http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/betfair-and-paddy-power-merger-set-for-february/2018724/#newsArchiveTabs=last7DaysNews)

3 https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/sir-martyn-arbib-and-family-8l26chvpjjn (https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/sir-martyn-arbib-and-family-8l26chvpjjn)

4 http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/specials/rich_list/rich_list_2009/article6068991.ece (http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/specials/rich_list/rich_list_2009/article6068991.ece)

5 http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/leisure/article6115739.ece (http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/leisure/article6115739.ece)

6 https://www.forbes.com/profile/stephen-lansdown/ (https://www.forbes.com/profile/stephen-lansdown/)

So have go every time I post if you like Jayo, were all just coming on here to give an opinion most of the time. Just because you've "been here longer" I couldn't give a damn. We're both cunts. Oh and thanks for extra cunt points. Much obliged.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: THE FLASH on Friday, January 19, 2018, 17:14:12
Sorry, King of the TEF, centre of all knowledge.

That's funny though because in 2010 Andrew Blacks Betfair was worth around £1.4bn(1) and a net worth of £200m. He sold them recently for around £660m(2). Arbib in 2009 was actually around £325m(3).

In 2009 Lansdown was worth £280m(4), in 2010 he paid for BCFC stadia to be built. Today Lansdown is worth about $2.5bn (or £1.8bn)(5), and in 2015 he was worth $1.9bn (or £1.3bn)(6).

I've highlighted the 2009/2010 periods because that is when both Black & Arbib were involved with Swindon Town (they took ownership in 2008, I'm sure you're aware), and Lansdown in ownership of Bristol City. For comparison, as the facts show, the STFC owners net worth of c£525m was nearly double that of Lansdown at that time. Even individually (at £200m, £280m, and £325m) they were all playing in the same ball park. In fact Arbibs net worth was down c£45m from his reported £370m in 2008.

1 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/leisure/8081984/Betfair-shares-get-strong-start-in-boost-to-IPO-market.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/leisure/8081984/Betfair-shares-get-strong-start-in-boost-to-IPO-market.html)

2 http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/betfair-and-paddy-power-merger-set-for-february/2018724/#newsArchiveTabs=last7DaysNews (http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse-racing/betfair-and-paddy-power-merger-set-for-february/2018724/#newsArchiveTabs=last7DaysNews)

3 https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/sir-martyn-arbib-and-family-8l26chvpjjn (https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/sir-martyn-arbib-and-family-8l26chvpjjn)

4 http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/specials/rich_list/rich_list_2009/article6068991.ece (http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/specials/rich_list/rich_list_2009/article6068991.ece)

5 http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/leisure/article6115739.ece (http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/leisure/article6115739.ece)

6 https://www.forbes.com/profile/stephen-lansdown/ (https://www.forbes.com/profile/stephen-lansdown/)

So have go every time I post if you like Jayo, were all just coming on here to give an opinion most of the time. Just because you've "been here longer" I couldn't give a damn. We're both cunts. Oh and thanks for extra cunt points. Much obliged.

Lansdown is a fan...that's the biggest and crucial difference!


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Friday, January 19, 2018, 17:26:15
Lansdown is a fan...that's the biggest and crucial difference!

Yeah it's a massive difference, but an owner doesn't have to be a fan to put his money on the table. Granted, it does help. However Jayo comes on shouting me down, saying i'm spouting bullshit. At that time (10ish years ago), the investors of STFC and BCFC were financially in pretty much the same ballpark. For the record and to add Reading to it too, John Madjeski was worth c£250m 2009.


Title: Re: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Friday, January 19, 2018, 17:55:22
I remember Barry Venison wasn't very happy during the Newcastle game  :)
Oh deer


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Friday, January 19, 2018, 19:29:18
Still not a tier 2 club :D


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Friday, January 19, 2018, 19:42:01
Still not a tier 2 club :D

 :soapy tit wank: :soapy tit wank: haha!


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Friday, January 19, 2018, 22:55:23
Lansdown is a fan...that's the biggest and crucial difference!
And holds the freehold.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Not that Nice If I'm Honest on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 01:30:03
OK, so we may not be quite big enough to be Championship, but I think we could be good enough to flirt between Championship and Div 1 ?

I look at teams like Reading and Bournemouth - they were never as big as us until they had rich backers

Personally, I don't wish for that.

I want Swindon Town to do the best we can within the budget that we can sustain.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Posh Red on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 10:05:18
I think history shows we have been a team at the top end of the third tier.

Can’t remember what it is but our average league position over the years Reflects that


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 10:11:33
I think history shows we have been a team at the top end of the third tier.

Can’t remember what it is but our average league position over the years Reflects that
Thats correct, I think we are about half way down tier 3 in history of league finishing positions, we had to apply a few times for re-election so L1 is our natural level, attendances over the years have fluctuated wildly, but then so have others in similar positions, I remember Shitty averaging only about 3k in the old Div 4 in the early 80s, the same with Reading.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 10:12:04
Big enough to challenge at the top of the 3rd tier, but not enough to compete in the 2nd. Not without significant funding, anyway. That might change if a new stadium puts bums on seats, though.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 10:14:02
That might change if a new stadium puts bums on seats, though.
Absolutely. Swindon as a town does contain a lot of floating football fans that go to London to watch bigger games, and the higher the league the more chance you have of attracting vastly higher visiting support numbers too.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 10:34:04
Last calculated about 6 months ago:

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11096/10881263/ultimate-league-reveals-liverpool-are-englands-top-team-followed-by-man-utd-and-arsenal

We're 48th, puts us 4th in League One?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 10:42:43
Last calculated about 6 months ago:

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11096/10881263/ultimate-league-reveals-liverpool-are-englands-top-team-followed-by-man-utd-and-arsenal

We're 48th, puts us 4th in League One?
4th is higher than the last one I saw a fair few years back, sounds about right though TBH.

We have flirted once with the Premiership and had a few short affairs with Div 4 (the first couple ending badly) otherwise its pretty much been L1 with a handful of Championship seasons thrown in.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: The Artist Formerly Known as Audrey on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 11:02:19
Which is why I don't understand those who say they don't want a moneybags owners taking over. Without one we are forever bouncing around the lower leagues.

Sod that. Bring back Red Bull!


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 11:02:25
Forever in a play off position :suicide:


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: flammableBen on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 11:10:59
When I worked it out a few years ago I think 4th in teir 3 was our mean and median position.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 11:15:19
Which is why I don't understand those who say they don't want a moneybags owners taking over. Without one we are forever bouncing around the lower leagues.

Sod that. Bring back Red Bull!
Without heavy backing it is almost impossible to build a side strong enough to compete at the top of the Championship let alone the Premier League unfortunately.

I cant ever see Swindon as being a viable enough proposition for anyone other than a very rich fan owner, which it appears Swindon has none of.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 11:32:38
Which is why I don't understand those who say they don't want a moneybags owners taking over. Without one we are forever bouncing around the lower leagues.

Sod that. Bring back Red Bull!

I'd love a mega-rich sugar daddy... I just don't want one that will one day get bored and leave us in the shit.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Ardiles on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 12:08:47
Which is why I don't understand those who say they don't want a moneybags owners taking over. Without one we are forever bouncing around the lower leagues.

Because it would defeat the whole object of supporting a team in the first place.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 14:00:42
Last calculated about 6 months ago:

http://www.skysports.com/football/news/11096/10881263/ultimate-league-reveals-liverpool-are-englands-top-team-followed-by-man-utd-and-arsenal

We're 48th, puts us 4th in League One?

That's interesting. I love statistical analysis like this.

So 4th in League One in data form, shouts to me (unbiasedly too) a team with massive potential, within a largish fan catchment area. This may be a wild projection and I'll admit this could sound like bullshit but...If a backer with wealth similar to our previous owners (i'm not counting the charlatan Jeddy baby), even less; say in the £100m-£150m bracket. I think (as well as being shrewd and articulate in spending) if they had a proper extensive portfolio in advertising & marketing exposure and history of attracting true commercial investment, STFC could easily be turned into a "fashionable" club to attract consumers from their surrounding Towns. The right team in advertising, marketing & COMMUNICATION can sell you anything.

I don't foresee it with Power unless he has a revelation (maybe ground purchase is his epiphany). I don't see it with whoever he sells to in the future (not initially) but with the ground coming into ownership (via the TrustSTFC, Power or A.N Other) this is an opportunity to push towards an upward curve. As fans we of course look at this with caution due to our history. A stark reminder; history can repeat itself but it cannot determine our future. Our future enables us to change our past.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 14:15:17
That's interesting. I love statistical analysis like this.

The only real data that matters, is that we are 10th in Div 4. That would seem like a fair reflection of where Power has taken us, meaning there are presently 14 clubs worse off than us and 77 rated better.

To get back to our historic status as a usually semi decent Div 3 club, will require significant improvements all round. At least this season it looks like we've halted the slide, which is a positive.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 14:26:05
The only real data that matters, is that we are 10th in Div 4. That would seem like a fair reflection of where Power has taken us, meaning there are presently 14 clubs worse off than us and 77 rated better.

To get back to our historic status as a usually semi decent Div 3 club, will require significant improvements all round. At least this season it looks like we've halted the slide, which is a positive.

Of course Reg, but on that reckoning surely that also means; a fair reflection of where "another owner" can take us, is indeed above our historic status as a top end tier 3 club?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: RedRag on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 14:57:27
Never mind where we are now, I was shocked to see the Pox only 3 places below us over 50 years


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 17:04:48
Don't forget those stats are over our entire history. Football has changed A LOT in that time. And the change has accelerated in the last 25 years. Money is everything now, and we just do'nt have it.

No denying we have potential, we're the only league club for 30 miles in any direction.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: BambooToTheFuture on Saturday, January 20, 2018, 17:09:30
Don't forget those stats are over our entire history. Football has changed A LOT in that time. And the change has accelerated in the last 25 years. Money is everything now, and we just do'nt have it.

No denying we have potential, we're the only league club for 30 miles in any direction.

For sure, I believe the right team in (as stated above), and obviously funds can expose that massive gap in the market to make us "attractive" to the local consumer.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Monday, January 22, 2018, 00:08:16
Success brings fans. Lots of 50 year old Liverpool fans, 35 year old Man Utd fans, 25 year old Chelsea fans and 15 year old Man City fans across the country / world.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Monday, January 22, 2018, 10:06:02
Some communication from the Trust over the weekend, for those who haven't seen it:

First of all, I would like to wish you a belated Happy New Year on behalf of everyone involved with TrustSTFC. Hopefully 2018 will see good news on and off the pitch, with a positive conclusion to the stadium discussions and promotion for the football team.

It's been really difficult to keep people informed on our progress behind the scenes, much of it is subject to confidentiality clauses and NDAs. We are in dialogue with all the relevant parties, and sometimes it's just necessary for things to play out without a running commentary.

We are however beginning preparations for our March AGM and that will be a chance for the Trust board to speak personally with each of you, should you choose to come along.

We have a board meeting coming up and will finalise a date and a venue, which we will then publish so that you can mark it on your calendar.

As mentioned in the previous newsletter we have spent many thousands of pounds on due diligence and have gone about our preparation in the proper manner, using the professional skills of board members and associated contacts. This was probably the first time in decades (or even the first time ever) that such a study had been conducted, and it revealed some interesting findings that have taken time to work through.

We're happy that we have a great understanding on the current state of the County Ground and how things can be improved going forwards.

In the meantime, I'm sure you will have noticed that the club have put in a bid on the stadium, this is something we have been aware of for a while and so it came as no surprise, and we will continue to work toward the best outcome for the long-term stablity and improvement of Swindon Town FC.

We are well positioned to run a professional campaign and have great support not only from our Red Army Fund members (thanks again to all of you) but also corporate support and other help from local companies.

On the Red Army Fund front, if you're struggling for money after Christmas then don't feel obliged to keep up on the monthly payments, but every bit helps us and will only ever be spent on things to help our campaign. If it doesn't conclude in our favour then all contributors will decide as part of a group vote on what should happen with the Red Army Fund going forwards. If you're happy to keep contributing, thank you again.

In case you missed it...

Click here to read the Swindon Advertiser Swindon Town Bid Article

Click here to read the Swindon Advertiser TrustSTFC Bid Article

Rob Angus, the Trust Vice-Chair, went on-air with BBC Wiltshire to discuss on Thursday

Click here to listen to his interview.

As did Councillor Garry Perkins - Click here to listen

It's really important that we don't let these off-the-field matters affect the promotion push, as we are not a League 2 club and we need to get out of there as soon as possible. There have been a couple of excellent signings during the window and with the table as it is, there is still a very real chance that the team will go up this year.

Please get in touch if you still have questions, and rest assured there will be more to come via the media and other newsletters, in the next few months.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Monday, January 22, 2018, 11:05:41
As a ex Trust leader Paul what do you make of it all ?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Monday, January 22, 2018, 11:30:49
Well firstly, putting a statement out on a Sunday is just plain amateur....


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Panda Paws on Monday, January 22, 2018, 11:46:59
Well firstly, putting a statement out on a Sunday is just plain amateur....

Not a statement, it was a newsletter to members.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Don Rogers Sock on Monday, January 22, 2018, 11:57:40
Not a statement, it was a newsletter to members.
He has a point kind of though


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Monday, January 22, 2018, 12:27:03
As a ex Trust leader Paul what do you make of it all ?
Understand the criticism re radio silence, but also understand it can be difficult to communicate everything when you're dealing with 3rd parties who want NDAs in place. You'd look a twat if you blew a potential deal by going public too early. Difficult balance to strike.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Monday, January 22, 2018, 15:23:53
Not a statement, it was a newsletter to members.

I didn't get it. Not impressed with the Trust at all lately.

DD cancelled.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Simon Pieman on Monday, January 22, 2018, 15:54:42
I didn't get it. Not impressed with the Trust at all lately.

DD cancelled.

Google decided this belonged in promotions. I should really set up gmail tags whenever I get 5 minutes


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Nemo on Monday, January 22, 2018, 16:07:07
I didn't get it. Not impressed with the Trust at all lately.

DD cancelled.

I got it twice, so they must love me


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Panda Paws on Monday, January 22, 2018, 16:16:40
I didn't get it. Not impressed with the Trust at all lately.

DD cancelled.

Agree with both you and DRS, I'm far from impressed at the moment and cancelled my own DD last month. Felt like money down the drain.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Monday, January 22, 2018, 16:24:45
Completely understand where you are coming from.

While I support the Trust's bid, and that considerable time and effort is probably going unseen, it feels like they pushed "the button" too early. For whatever reason the scheme isn't in place, and comms have been poor.

While acknowledging the officers are volunteers with full time jobs it feels like any momentum has been lost, as well as a bit of credibility to those that already had doubts.

And no, I couldn't do a better job of it. I know I wouldn't have the time or frankly the energy to try.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Tails on Monday, January 22, 2018, 16:29:33
So that's Lee Power AND the Trust we now hate because they don't talk to us often enough.

Well we're fucked then aren't we :)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Simon Pieman on Monday, January 22, 2018, 16:37:01
I did get the pen of questionable quality,the pin badge and the shirt in the end

 :banana:


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Monday, January 22, 2018, 16:38:49
Google decided this belonged in promotions. I should really set up gmail tags whenever I get 5 minutes

Yeah realised as soon as I'd posted in was probably in another folder, checked and it was. DD still cancelled, mind.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Monday, January 22, 2018, 16:43:48
Quote from: Tails
So that's Lee Power AND the Trust we now hate because they don't talk to us often enough.

Well we're fucked then aren't we :)
we hate everyone.

I'm still contributing.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Panda Paws on Monday, January 22, 2018, 16:45:36
I don't hate anyone, certainly not the trust. I just can't be bothered to give them £10 a month for another 18 months.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Monday, January 22, 2018, 16:58:00
we hate everyone.

I'm still contributing.

Think it will be a bit easier to get people mobilised when the realisation of what is at stake here kicks in.... may be too late then, mind.

Nobody has yet answered my question as to whether Power qualifies under the Community Asset rule, in the same way the Trust must do.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: RobertT on Monday, January 22, 2018, 18:23:04
Think it will be a bit easier to get people mobilised when the realisation of what is at stake here kicks in.... may be too late then, mind.

Nobody has yet answered my question as to whether Power qualifies under the Community Asset rule, in the same way the Trust must do.

He could get creative, but generally speaking NO:

Voluntary or community bodies

5.—(1) For the purposes of section 89(2)(b)(iii) of the Act, but subject to paragraph (2), “a voluntary or community body” means—

(a)a body designated as a neighbourhood forum pursuant to section 61F of the Town and Country Planning Act 1990(1);

(b)a parish council;

(c)an unincorporated body—

(i)whose members include at least 21 individuals, and

(ii)which does not distribute any surplus it makes to its members;

(d)a charity;

(e)a company limited by guarantee which does not distribute any surplus it makes to its members;

(f)an industrial and provident society which does not distribute any surplus it makes to its members; or

(g)a community interest company(2).

(2) A public or local authority may not be a voluntary or community body, but this does not apply to a parish council.

(3) In this regulation “industrial and provident society” means a body registered or deemed to be registered under the Industrial and Provident Societies Act 1965(3) which meets one of the conditions in section 1 of that Act


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Monday, January 22, 2018, 18:43:52
(e)a company limited by guarantee which does not distribute any surplus it makes to its members;

Surely Power, right there.  In the guise of STFC....


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: wheretherealredsare on Monday, January 22, 2018, 19:43:31
(a)a body designated as a neighbourhood forum pursuant to section 61F of the Town and Country Planning Act 1990(1);

TEF?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Monday, January 22, 2018, 19:46:28
(a)a body designated as a neighbourhood forum pursuant to section 61F of the Town and Country Planning Act 1990(1);

TEF?

Horlock...


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Monday, January 22, 2018, 21:19:52
Here’s a thought or two to ponder.

As it stands I started watching the town in the early 70’s and we were in Div 3. Forty odd years later we’re in Div 4 so not much has changed other than a tower of terrors type ride over the years flirting with the premier league once and Div 4 three times.

So now that there seems to be some real substance to someone other than the council owning the ground would you settle for the next forty years being the same as the last with let’s say the trust or a skint owner running the show and pretty much nothing changing with the ground. Or. An international foreign owner making a real fist of it and developing a mega stadium and supporting infrastructure with us stagnant at the foot of the premier league and yoyoing between there and the championship?

I do not in my wildest dreams think we will ever, ever have the financial clout of the top six in the premier league to make a challenge on even Europe.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Abrahammer on Monday, January 22, 2018, 22:18:33
Don’t think the 2nd option would feel like my club but I suppose I’d be happy to give it a go and see


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 09:54:59
So now that there seems to be some real substance to someone other than the council owning the ground would you settle for the next forty years being the same as the last with let’s say the trust or a skint owner running the show and pretty much nothing changing with the ground. Or. An international foreign owner making a real fist of it and developing a mega stadium and supporting infrastructure with us stagnant at the foot of the premier league and yoyoing between there and the championship?
That's not an either or though is it? We're just as likely to stagnate (or even completely implode) with foreign owners as we are with domestic (Birmingham, Sunderland, Portsmouth, Blackburn, Rovers etc etc). Equally, Swansea show that a Trust-based model can take you to the top (and Stockport shows it can implode too)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Frigby Daser on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 09:59:03
No brainer. The country of origin of the investment isnt the issue. It’s the credibility, experience and objective of the investor. I’d take a credible investor who wants to grow a football club every single time over an investor who can’t progress what we have - whether that is the Trust, Axis, or anybody else. The two Bristol clubs are a great case study - one has investment that has worked, one has a group of well-intentioned, but underfunded “local” investors. I’d rather be City than Rovers. I’m intrigued to see who the Trust’s third party investors are - I completely understand why it’s being kept confidential, but for the fans to have a view on which is the better future for the club, there needs to be two transparent blueprints set out (particularly who is involved, what they bring (experience wise and financially) and their ultimate objective. Until then, it all feels a bit Bill Power/Terry Brady/McCrory/Spaniards and Rufus Brevett/Diamandis and Co....



Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 10:09:19
The trust doesn't inspire me. It never has. It's not just the current or past personnel, the concept in itself does nothing for me. It seems to be shrouded in romanticism but no real umph.

The identity of this mysterious 3rd party might (or might not) change that, though. As noted already, however, I understand why they can't be revealed just yet.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Frigby Daser on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 10:16:22
The trust doesn't inspire me. It never has. It's not just the current or past personnel, the concept in itself does nothing for me. It seems to be shrouded in romanticism but no real umph.

The identity of this mysterious 3rd party might (or might not) change that, though. As noted already, however, I understand why they can't be revealed just yet.

Well put. I almost see a Trust as an “owner of last resort” option - the “nobody else wants us, so we’ll do what we can to keep the club afloat.” If there are funds behind the latest incarnation of the Trust that make them something other than this - great - but otherwise, I’d rather someone with three tools for the job does it - and this comes from someone who wore an orange hat, sat in the Trust meetings at the GW and was one of 15-20 voices at the back of the Arkells in darker days.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 10:33:13
The two Bristol clubs are a great case study - one has investment that has worked, one has a group of well-intentioned, but underfunded “local” investors.
Rovers are now owned by an allegedly wealthy Middle Eastern consortium. No substantial progress over the local investors has been seen as a result, although there's been a lot of talk


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 10:42:15
Rovers are now owned by an allegedly wealthy Middle Eastern consortium. No substantial progress over the local investors has been seen as a result, although there's been a lot of talk
Talking of which, sob story from DC about salary caps.

http://www.bristolpost.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/darrell-clarke-bristol-rovers-transfers-1098855


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Frigby Daser on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 11:35:16
Rovers are now owned by an allegedly wealthy Middle Eastern consortium. No substantial progress over the local investors has been seen as a result, although there's been a lot of talk

Fair shout. But the point stands - it’s not the nationality of the investors that matters, it’s the credibility and the intentions. McCrory was from Evesham wasn’t he?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 11:38:34
Fair shout. But the point stands - it’s not the nationality of the investors that matters, it’s the credibility and the intentions. McCrory was from Evesham wasn’t he?
Oh completely. That was the point I was making (apparently not well) as LL seemed to be implying it was only wealthy foreign investors who would be able to push us up the league structure.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 18:47:51
That's not an either or though is it? We're just as likely to stagnate (or even completely implode) with foreign owners as we are with domestic (Birmingham, Sunderland, Portsmouth, Blackburn, Rovers etc etc). Equally, Swansea show that a Trust-based model can take you to the top (and Stockport shows it can implode too)
FFS. I’d hate to get stuck in a lift with you. Right to help you out. In forty years, as we are in status and ground or a yo yo bottom third premier league team with a decent ground and some reasonable infrastructure?

Who owns it I suppose doesn’t matter, they’re likely to be monied Toriy types who most of you hate with a vengeance or some shady Johnny Foreigner type of dubious character. We’ll all as supporters hate them all one way or another.

Shit ground, shit status or something a little glamorous? Or you slope off to Wealdstone everyother Saturday and rub shoulders with the raider if you don’t fancy either.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 18:49:07
Regarding the anonymous third party who may or may not be in cahoots with the trust, has anybody heard any plausible names?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 21:46:33
FFS. I’d hate to get stuck in a lift with you. Right to help you out. In forty years, as we are in status and ground or a yo yo bottom third premier league team with a decent ground and some reasonable infrastructure?

Who owns it I suppose doesn’t matter, they’re likely to be monied Toriy types who most of you hate with a vengeance or some shady Johnny Foreigner type of dubious character. We’ll all as supporters hate them all one way or another.

Shit ground, shit status or something a little glamorous? Or you slope off to Wealdstone everyother Saturday and rub shoulders with the raider if you don’t fancy either.
My apologies for replying to what you said rather than what you thought you meant.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Tuesday, January 23, 2018, 22:12:25
My apologies for replying to what you said rather than what you thought you meant.
Accepted.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: hobodan on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 07:47:51
Ipswich, Derby, Middlesbrough, Norwich, Preston are towns in the ballpark of ours in terms of population. Burnley, Blackburn have a lower population. Swindon has the ‘potential’ as a ‘football town’ to have reasonable success and decent support.
Redevelopment of the stadium is essential imo. It’s a good location that can be used to generate more money for the club. But we need an owner that is willing to pay for the redevelopment and not siphon the takings it does generate. Just can’t see it happening, we will more than likely end up in a situation like Coventry City with the shenanigans they have had with the Rico. 


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 08:42:29
You missed out Reading, look how their fortunes and support have changed. I know people mention plastic fans etc but would we like to have had the changes that they've experienced?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 09:55:43
Ipswich, Derby, Middlesbrough, Norwich, Preston are towns in the ballpark of ours in terms of population. Burnley, Blackburn have a lower population. Swindon has the ‘potential’ as a ‘football town’ to have reasonable success and decent support.
Redevelopment of the stadium is essential imo. It’s a good location that can be used to generate more money for the club. But we need an owner that is willing to pay for the redevelopment and not siphon the takings it does generate. Just can’t see it happening, we will more than likely end up in a situation like Coventry City with the shenanigans they have had with the Rico. 

All of the places you mention don't have largely incoming populations, I remain convinced that a lot of the problem with Swindon Town engaging with residents is simply the fact that a lot of Swindon residents are not from Swindon and thus there is not the long standing family links to the club passed down through generations.

Also the towns you mention in the main have clubs that have a period of success within their history which always leads to pride in the town and thus historic engagement being enhanced, we have had 1 year (1969) and that is really about it, which is really not enough.

Only way we are really going to get on is with a wealthy backer, we don't have the foundations to attract a non fan, and our wealthy fans (if we actually have any) for whatever reason are not interested.

Ultimately its a vicious circle and we are in and around the level we can reasonably sustain, so really as fans we have to like it or lump it.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 10:06:50
All of the places you mention don't have largely incoming populations, I remain convinced that a lot of the problem with Swindon Town engaging with residents is simply the fact that a lot of Swindon residents are not from Swindon and thus there is not the long standing family links to the club passed down through generations.

Also the towns you mention in the main have clubs that have a period of success within their history which always leads to pride in the town and thus historic engagement being enhanced, we have had 1 year (1969) and that is really about it, which is really not enough.

Only way we are really going to get on is with a wealthy backer, we don't have the foundations to attract a non fan, and our wealthy fans (if we actually have any) for whatever reason are not interested.

Ultimately its a vicious circle and we are in and around the level we can reasonably sustain, so really as fans we have to like it or lump it.

Your conviction doesn't necessarily make it true. I know incomers who are fans and offspring of long standing residents who support other clubs.

However, you're right that we're about the level we can sustain, therefore the challenge is can we over achieve and get back to being a decent Div 3 side.



Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 10:07:18
 Swindon's population in 1911 was over 50,000 which rose to over 70,000 by the early 70's. You'd have to say over half the town population has some rooted history.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 10:13:31
All of the places you mention don't have largely incoming populations, I remain convinced that a lot of the problem with Swindon Town engaging with residents is simply the fact that a lot of Swindon residents are not from Swindon and thus there is not the long standing family links to the club passed down through generations.

Also the towns you mention in the main have clubs that have a period of success within their history which always leads to pride in the town and thus historic engagement being enhanced, we have had 1 year (1969) and that is really about it, which is really not enough.

Only way we are really going to get on is with a wealthy backer, we don't have the foundations to attract a non fan, and our wealthy fans (if we actually have any) for whatever reason are not interested.

Ultimately its a vicious circle and we are in and around the level we can reasonably sustain, so really as fans we have to like it or lump it.

Absolutely spot on.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 10:25:01
Swindon'school population in 1911 was over 50,000 which rose to over 70,000 by the early 70's. You'd have to say over half the town population has some rooted history.

In 1911 we were one of the leading clubs in the country.

Historically we had two links, one with the Works and one with the hinterland, meaning the small Wiltshire, Glos and Berkshire towns and villages. With the closure of the Works in 85, that link was gradually broken. The out of Town link, is still just about there, but changes in demographics and the continued decline of the town centre, will see it become a thing of the past.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 10:32:53
Swindon's population in 1911 was over 50,000 which rose to over 70,000 by the early 70's. You'd have to say over half the town population has some rooted history.

Who knows though, silly example I had various family members included in that 70's figure, i now have no family links to Swindon as everyone moved away after the works closed?

Swindon seems to suffer a lot of population churn due to its employment types and opportunity?

In 1911 we were one of the leading clubs in the country.


In 1911 we still had an empire and a booming homegrown industrial base... Perhaps Brexit and the return to insular greatness will provide the opportunities to bring Swindon Town back to those lofty heights?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 10:55:31
My dad was Irish and my mum's from Surrey and I've had a season ticket for 13 years.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 10:56:24
In 1911 we were one of the leading non league clubs in the country.
Yet we only averaged under 6k for home attendances in the 1910/11 when we won the Southern League.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:01:41
Who knows though, silly example I had various family members included in that 70's figure, i now have no family links to Swindon as everyone moved away after the works closed?

Swindon seems to suffer a lot of population churn due to its employment types and opportunity?

In 1911 we still had an empire and a booming homegrown industrial base... Perhaps Brexit and the return to insular greatness will provide the opportunities to bring Swindon Town back to those lofty heights?

There's quite a lot of out of town support, I come from Calne and know of a few town fans there


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:08:53
Problem solved, perhaps he is one of the out of town supporters?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-5303543/Brazil-icon-Ronaldo-considering-buying-Championship-club.html


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:10:06
Problem solved, perhaps he is one of the out of town supporters?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-5303543/Brazil-icon-Ronaldo-considering-buying-Championship-club.html
I saw that and thought....maybe? yes we are a bit lower than the Championship but we have "potential" ;)

The S*n has the quote
Quote
Pressed on whether he had anyone in mind, he added: "I am thinking about buying a lower league team in Spain or England.

Not specifying Championship level.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Tails on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:20:52
There's quite a lot of out of town support, I come from Calne and know of a few town fans there

I travel in from Wokingham (although I was Swindon born and raised). I know of at least one other (who used to post on this forum!) and I've seen a couple of Town fans at Reading getting the train too. Similarly, my mother is a season ticket holder and she travels in from Oxfordshire with a couple of people.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:25:10
I travel in from Wokingham (although I was Swindon born and raised). I know of at least one other (who used to post on this forum!) and I've seen a couple of Town fans at Reading getting the train too. Similarly, my mother is a season ticket holder and she travels in from Oxfordshire with a couple of people.
Historically Swindon does have a massive catchment area but also as you state fans from further afield too, when we played at Wembley last time I got on the train in Yeovil and was one of about 15 on the same train, another 10 or so at Sherborne and more at Salisbury too.

We have always has a catchment area that includes large followings from Calne, Chippenham, Stroud, Cirencester, Warminster, Hungerford, Newbury, Malmesbury, Andover, Faringdon, Wantage and many other villages too.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:30:31
Yet we only averaged under 6k for home attendances in the 1910/11 when we won the Southern League.

The figures on swindon-town aren't accurate, they all end in 000.  A more accurate indicator of our status was the Cup quarter final v Chelsea,  77,952.

Our status was reflected in the FA asking STFC to travel to Argentina to do missionary work... introduce them to the beautiful game, I like to think of Leo Messi as the heir to Harold Fleming.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:38:35
The figures on swindon-town aren't accurate, they all end in 000.  A more accurate indicator of our status was the Cup quarter final v Chelsea,  77,952.

We will bow down to your eye witness knowledge....  ;D :hmmm:


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:41:13
The figures on swindon-town aren't accurate, they all end in 000.  A more accurate indicator of our status was the Cup quarter final v Chelsea,  77,952.

Our status was reflected in the FA asking STFC to travel to Argentina to do missionary work... introduce them to the beautiful game, I like to think of Leo Messi as the heir to Harold Fleming.
Pretty sure Green and Hillier weren't the first "creative" chairman when it came to attendances!


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:44:01
Historically Swindon does have a massive catchment area but also as you state fans from further afield too, when we played at Wembley last time I got on the train in Yeovil and was one of about 15 on the same train, another 10 or so at Sherborne and more at Salisbury too.

We have always has a catchment area that includes large followings from Calne, Chippenham, Stroud, Cirencester, Warminster, Hungerford, Newbury, Malmesbury, Andover, Faringdon, Wantage and many other villages too.

But the case in point remains that there is limited engagement between the club and the town and that cannot wholly be blamed on recent things or Power.

From up here all the clubs mentioned seem to almost represent the town on a regional level, that doesn't seem to be the case with Swindon, perhaps its because the traditional rivals are either modern or a distance away. For instance to illustrate the division between Burnley and Blackburn or Preston and Blackpool normally it will be illustrated in football terms, but in those cases the settlements are very close and thus this helps foster the pride in our team to get one over on those bastards, perhaps our infamous catchment area is part of the problem, as we don't have the local battles to get the juices flowing?

Its all very hypothetical, but ultimately certain towns population have pride in their teams and Swindon doesn't for whatever reason?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 11:50:16
Its all very hypothetical, but ultimately certain towns population have pride in their teams and Swindon doesn't for whatever reason?
This is a major problem.

Swindon as a town has been portrayed in the media in a very negative light over the years and there seems to be little pride in the town from most of its residents, mostly I find the pride comes from those who have long left its boundaries.

I am fiercely proud of Swindon, the town and the club but I haven't lived there in 20 years.

Town pride first, then club pride may follow, the club has done little to rekindle the spirit or 1969 and probably won't.

I agree with what you are saying about the teams mentioned, there is a massive local pride/club pride with most teams but for some reason I don't see a lot of it now with Swindon, and as you state thats not Powers doing its been like that since the Premier League years if not before then.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:10:28
I honestly could not name any one thing about Swindon that I miss, apart from certain people. Any one thing that I might name can be satisfied in any other town in the country. It's just... meh! It's not as bad as many make it out to be, but the meh-ness is off the scale. If I do, for whatever reason, end up returning to Britain permanently, I can imagine myself staying elsewhere.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: jayohaitchenn on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:12:42
I honestly could not name any one thing about Swindon that I miss, apart from certain people. Any one thing that I might name can be satisfied in any other town in the country. It's just... meh! It's not as bad as many make it out to be, but the meh-ness is off the scale. If I do, for whatever reason, end up returning to Britain permanently, I can imagine myself staying elsewhere.

You could say the same about any town in the UK, pretty much. Which other similarly sized town has more uniqueness then?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:16:58
This is a major problem.

Swindon as a town has been portrayed in the media in a very negative light over the years and there seems to be little pride in the town from most of its residents, mostly I find the pride comes from those who have long left its boundaries.

I am fiercely proud of Swindon, the town and the club but I haven't lived there in 20 years.

Town pride first, then club pride may follow, the club has done little to rekindle the spirit or 1969 and probably won't.

I agree with what you are saying about the teams mentioned, there is a massive local pride/club pride with most teams but for some reason I don't see a lot of it now with Swindon, and as you state thats not Powers doing its been like that since the Premier League years if not before then.

Absolutely spot on, this. Seems to be lots of people who live in Swindon but have very little pride in or connection with the town, it's just a place where they have their house because it's where they ended up or convenient for commuting and affordable. I used to have a house in Bracknell (wouldn't say I lived there because I really just slept there during the week) and felt much the same.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:17:13
You could say the same about any town in the UK, pretty much. Which other similarly sized town has more uniqueness then?

I dunno, ask the people that live there. I'm just passing on my thoughts on the town I did live in which are, very much, meh! There are others with a similar reputation, not not all.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:23:29
The town centre is grim, but one thing Swindon does have is some great parks and decent cycle paths.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:24:33
I can only comment as a bystander as I have not been to Swindon for donkeys years (got to Highworth last year as close as I have been for ages!)

However from what i hear from my old man (Swindon resident from 1937-1973ish) and from most on here is that it has become a shit hole with few redeeming features and no obvious signs of improvement, now if that is representative of residents generally its not surprising it gets such a negative press?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Arriba on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:26:56
I honestly could not name any one thing about Swindon that I miss, apart from certain people. Any one thing that I might name can be satisfied in any other town in the country. It's just... meh! It's not as bad as many make it out to be, but the meh-ness is off the scale. If I do, for whatever reason, end up returning to Britain permanently, I can imagine myself staying elsewhere.

The town has declined rapidly. They've thrown up loads of poorly built copycat houses all on top of each other whilst the infrastructure of the town has been destroyed. The town centre is woeful. You're not missing anything. I want out but the Mrs refuses to move. People keep us here, not the town.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:29:19
Aside from the useless road system/planning and the 1970s town centre I think the town is fine.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:36:34
People keep us here, not the town.

It's the people that matter... I've lived in Swindon for all but 10 years of my life, and have had and continue to have a right good time.  :pint:


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Arriba on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:44:06
It's the people that matter... I've lived in Swindon for all but 10 years of my life, and have had and continue to have a right good time.  :pint:

Absolutely right. Same here. I just could easily move away if it wasn't for the people and it wouldn't bother me.
It's not the town it was.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:50:24
Absolutely right. Same here. I just could easily move away if it wasn't for the people and it wouldn't bother me.
It's not the town it was.

Certainly the 2008 Banker's Crash, took its toll, and with the imposition of Tory austerity, we've yet to see a recovery.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 12:50:33
Living outside of the Town now for nearly 20 years all I really miss are the 3 F's - family, friends and football.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Tails on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 13:20:09
The town has declined rapidly. They've thrown up loads of poorly built copycat houses all on top of each other whilst the infrastructure of the town has been destroyed. The town centre is woeful. You're not missing anything. I want out but the Mrs refuses to move. People keep us here, not the town.

People.... and the fact its a fuck ton cheaper than anywhere else around. The council have allowed the Town to become a dive.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 13:41:29
People.... and the fact its a fuck ton cheaper than anywhere else around. The council have allowed the Town to become a dive.

Yup to all the above! Oh, and its transport links to elsewhere are fairly good once you actually get out of Swindon, M4 and M5 are easily accessible for working elsewhere...


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Legends-Lounge on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 13:51:20
Up until last summer I had plied my trade out on the road in a sales environment for 30 years. I have travelled extensively across the southern half of the UK from mid Wales to the south of Birmingham and across to north & east London and below. My time north of Birmingham is limited but whenever I have ventured up north I have always found the towns and cities a bit grim. So I speak with some authority when I say that when it come to shit holes i’d rather live in Swindon than many, many places. There are of course some places I could happily go to but in the end I take the view that house prices are relatively cheap for the area. Everywhere in the U.K. and indeed the world is within a few hours reach of a decent transport hub (except the flying time) by road or rail. Coming from London as I do i’d rather vote Labour than live there.

Taking an overview of some of the places I have been to abroad Oz, US and Europe the one thing that strikes me is you could put most places anywhere and easily compare them. In other words every western country has a Swindon, Manchester, Dibley etc.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 14:19:50
Dibley

I've heard its got a decent vicar which puts it on the map....


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 14:21:28
I've heard its got a decent vicar which puts it on the map....
All I could think of was this...

(https://i.imgur.com/8DbxFuD.gif)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: pauld on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 14:24:31
Certainly the 2008 Banker's Crash, took its toll, and with the imposition of Tory austerity, we've yet to see a recovery.
It was going downhill well before 2008 or austerity, as much due to successive fuckwits in the council chamber - of both parties. Not everything is the fault of Tory governments (or Labour ones). The major cause of the town's decline is within the borough (council) itself
Up until last summer I had plied my trade out on the road in a sales environment for 30 years. I have travelled extensively across the southern half of the UK from mid Wales to the south of Birmingham and across to north & east London and below. My time north of Birmingham is limited but whenever I have ventured up north I have always found the towns and cities a bit grim. So I speak with some authority when I say that when it come to shit holes i’d rather live in Swindon than many, many places.
You could get a new career as a shithole consultant!


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 14:32:04
I've heard its got a decent vicar which puts it on the map....

No no no no no no no no no no no no.         Yes.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: RobertT on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 14:36:17
Swindon, unfortunately, is now reaping years of bad planning.  It chased a population boon dream in the 80's/90's thanks largely to transportation links combined with the lower cost of living than other areas.  The population boon did not come with an infrastructure investment to match, or improvements in civic facilities, or regeneration of proud historical buildings etc.  It, as Arriba alludes to, became essentially a massive housing estate.  I don't know the stats, but I'd wager it is has a higher commuter % than other towns of a similar size, and even then, it has provided little for those commuters for the times when they are in the Town.

The Outlet Village and the Link Centre are pretty much the only developments I can think of in the past 40 years that brought something new and improved to the Town.  There have been retail parks of course, but even tiny towns have them.  The central area is a joke, how that has been allowed to fester is beyond me.  They missed the retail expansion, then they've not been able to react to it's decline, they just have whatever we thought we needed in a much smaller Town in 1970.

Having now moved away, it becomes much easier to see the issues it faces, and that clearly leaks into the support of the club.



Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 14:44:28
It was going downhill well before 2008 or austerity, as much due to successive fuckwits in the council chamber - of both parties. Not everything is the fault of Tory governments (or Labour ones). The major cause of the town's decline is within the borough (council) itselfYou could get a new career as a shithole consultant!


We'll have to disagree on this. My barometer is something like the Brunel Rooms. The Reids sold up in 2007, it had been a very decent night spot for many years catering to all sorts of young Swindonians, and outsiders. A good time to bail out as the next incumbents were just in time for the crash and bankruptcy. Around the same time the bottom fell out of the thriving pub trade down the end of town. No more late night free bus between The Mission, and Fleet St.

OK it might have resembled Beirut at times, but that's young people for you. It had an energy, much better than the present ghost town...


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: RobertT on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 14:57:48
Reg, the late night trade changed, it was another example of short term planning (excluding the Rooms).  The late night licenses meant pubs pinched a significant club trade, that impacted the Brunel Rooms, Mission and D&D/Kaos/Hardings etc.  Why pay to enter something that sells beer when you are already in one for free.  Then the bottom of town became a concentrated mass of drunks, creating an image problem over a number of years (interestingly this has probably created a bit of an improvement in the general Old Town scene).  For a few years it had worked - to begin with, they sourced the clubs in the area, then the numbers grew once late night licenses were available and the clubs died, but now too many pubs were in the same location all competing for trade at the same time with the same audience - bad design.

The decline of the Town was well set ahead of that, I'd put the date at the closure of the works.  The years following were actually seen to be great for Swindon - low jobless rate, companies moved in, housing in West Swindon and North Swindon etc.  However, nothing was done to fundamentally change the Town, just more houses, more business park, more retail parks.  Take the Northern expansion - how on earth planners thought it was sustainable long term without investment in crossings over the rail lines is beyond me.  Rather than go IN, residents go OUT.  Every opportunity the post Works economic spur provided were wasted in the search for short term gains.  Great community assets such as Coate, Town Gardens, Lawns, Qeens Park and Lydiard offer little more than they did 50 years ago.  The Town expanded but has very few extra rail crossings, so enables traffic problems due to funneling of traffic, it couldn't even be arsed to stick a decent road in to link West and North Swindon.  The bus service is no different than it ever was, not even a hint at alternative public transport options.

All of this was pre-2008 - what that did was seal it's fate for decades.  The "recovery" is now showing we have learned little as a Town - the cart is leading the horse again - mass housing.  Look at the plans for the Eastern development - the traffic improvements appear to amount to sticking a bus lane over a roundabout to manage 8k+ new homes in a decade.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 15:01:12
Swindon, unfortunately, is now reaping years of bad planning.  It chased a population boon dream in the 80's/90's

The plans for Swindon's expansion were developed in the 60's (see the silver book). It was partly a response to the realisation that with the decline of the Works, diversification in employment was needed.

Of course the idea then followed with an expanded population, there would be more money for socialist spending on infrastructure, arts etc.  Remember this was largely driven by local Labour politicians.  Through the 60's into the 70's, it largely worked....you got things like The Wyvern, Oasis improved Parks and Recs, localised Leisure centres like Grange, Croft, a growth in district libraries.  The break came in the 80's, as you point out the Link, more or less the last project of note. The break was precipitated by Thatcherism, removing the local element from government. From then it was multinationals get their profits and the town gets next to fuck all, besides the infrastructure burden.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: RobertT on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 15:05:03
Oh, and what this has to do with STFC - pride and a sense of belonging.  People go OUT, not IN, people visit other places, there is no sense of being a Swindonian other than those that have long term family ties.  Attendances hold up well, because we do have a big population and outlying Wiltshire is small, so for sports the competition is threadbare.  The club stagnates just as the Town does though, missing the same opportunities, suffering the same problems.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: RobertT on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 15:14:18
The plans for Swindon's expansion were developed in the 60's (see the silver book). It was partly a response to the realisation that with the decline of the Works, diversification in employment was needed.

Of course the idea then followed with an expanded population, there would be more money for socialist spending on infrastructure, arts etc.  Remember this was largely driven by local Labour politicians.  Through the 60's into the 70's, it largely worked....you got things like The Wyvern, Oasis improved Parks and Recs, localised Leisure centres like Grange, Croft, a growth in district libraries.  The break came in the 80's, as you point out the Link, more or less the last project of note. The break was precipitated by Thatcherism, removing the local element from government. From then it was multinationals get their profits and the town gets next to fuck all, besides the infrastructure burden.

I would agree that the legacies of the 60's/70's show much more thought, but they were undone quickly by the 80's and 90's.  The David Murray John Tower is glowing example of missed opportunities - how is it still the only building over about 10 floors in the Town?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 15:16:34
I would agree that the legacies of the 60's/70's show much more thought, but they were undone quickly by the 80's and 90's.  The David Murray John Tower is glowing example of missed opportunities - how is it still the only building over about 10 floors in the Town?

There's a 15 storey tower going up on the old market site.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: 4D on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 15:27:15
Signal point is 12 storeys  :bye:


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 15:32:12
Signal point is 12 storeys  :bye:

There was a rash of late 60's 70's office buildings, most of which are now unoccupied or like Aspen House demolished.

Lowndes Lambert were based in Aspen House, they funded Lou Macari....


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 15:35:26
Signal point is 12 storeys  :bye:
You mean the Hambro building ;)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Ardiles on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 16:05:51
All of the places you mention don't have largely incoming populations, I remain convinced that a lot of the problem with Swindon Town engaging with residents is simply the fact that a lot of Swindon residents are not from Swindon and thus there is not the long standing family links to the club passed down through generations.

I think this line would have been stronger in the 1980s & 1990s.  There was a huge influx of families from outside of the area back then as West & then North Swindon went up.  Not sure that the trend is quite so strong these days.  The children of 1980s 'incomers' count as locals today.

Swindon, unfortunately, is now reaping years of bad planning.  It chased a population boon dream in the 80's/90's thanks largely to transportation links combined with the lower cost of living than other areas.  The population boon did not come with an infrastructure investment to match, or improvements in civic facilities, or regeneration of proud historical buildings etc.  It, as Arriba alludes to, became essentially a massive housing estate.  I don't know the stats, but I'd wager it is has a higher commuter % than other towns of a similar size, and even then, it has provided little for those commuters for the times when they are in the Town.

Never a truer word spoken.  Wouldn't it be marvellous if, one day, a stadium redevelopment could encourage further investment in that part of town?  The expansion of Swindon in recent decades has been done on the cheap, and the town is now paying the price.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 16:14:09
I think this line would have been stronger in the 1980s & 1990s.  There was a huge influx of families from outside of the area back then as West & then North Swindon went up.  Not sure that the trend is quite so strong these days.  The children of 1980s 'incomers' count as locals today.

But are they interested in a two bit poorly performing football club, without the burden of family traditions to support the club a lot of us are lumbered with? These are all hypthetical questions, but I imagine there are a lot of premier league shirts in Swindon schools?

Never a truer word spoken.  Wouldn't it be marvellous if, one day, a stadium redevelopment could encourage further investment in that part of town?  The expansion of Swindon in recent decades has been done on the cheap, and the town is now paying the price.

What I will say (and I am not defending the Council as they are clueless to deal with) is that they can only approve developments which come forward via the private sector, the days of large municipal schemes are long gone and I suspect that Swindon being comparatively wealthy has not benefited from the large amounts of government and EU sloshing about which have rejuvenated a lot of similar towns up here! If developers think an economy is weak, they will either try and develop on the cheap or not develop at all?


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 16:18:56
Apparently Speedway got some news today. Not sure if it's good or bad...

http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/15893968.Abbey_Stadium_owners_announce_new_plans_for_arena/?ref=mr&lp=2

It bothers me that GI, who are Swindon based and currently implicated allegedly in Torquay's woes, make their seemingly decent living out of ailing sports venues.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: horlock07 on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 16:25:05
Apparently Speedway got some news today. Not sure if it's good or bad...

http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/15893968.Abbey_Stadium_owners_announce_new_plans_for_arena/?ref=mr&lp=2

It bothers me that GI, who are Swindon based and currently implicated allegedly in Torquay's woes. make their seemingly decent living out of ailing sorts venues.

Fucking hell the Advertiser need to invest in a proof reader......


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Panda Paws on Wednesday, January 24, 2018, 17:51:38
Fucking hell the Advertiser need to invest in everything.....

Fixed for you.

Local media is dead and will not be revived.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Saturday, January 27, 2018, 11:52:47
This thread will do:

Apparently, Power is currently in Australia with Sherwood watching a game. Make of that what you will or, in other words, let the conspiracy theories flow...


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Wobbly Bob on Saturday, January 27, 2018, 11:57:03
They can only be checking out sites for our new stadium.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Flashheart on Saturday, January 27, 2018, 12:00:45
They can only be checking out sites for our new stadium.

Definitely.


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Batch on Saturday, January 27, 2018, 12:09:01
well, there were rumours that Sherwood was a/the source of Powers cash...

Maybe they are there to pull a bank job for next years budget


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Peter Venkman on Saturday, January 27, 2018, 12:10:09
Definitely.
Its an out of town site, 9,500 miles out of town :)


Title: Re: Club statement
Post by: Reg Smeeton on Saturday, January 27, 2018, 12:11:03
This thread will do:

Apparently, Power is currently in Australia with Sherwood watching a game. Make of that what you will or, in other words, let the conspiracy theories flow...

Do they play round ball football at this time of year in Australia?  The cricketers and tennis players have been dropping like flies with heat exhaustion.