Thetownend.com

So Chelsea are accusing Clattenburg of racially abusing one player (John Obi Mikel) and using unsuitable language at another (calling someone a "Spanish t**t", maybe Torres?). Guess we'll find out what was said as the 3 other officials would have heard every word through the mics and the Sky camera's have probably picked it up.

But either way I'm not sure Chelsea are doing themselves any favours. They claim to have a zero tolerance to racism, yet Terry is found guilty and they don't even take the captaincy off him. Today their fans were throwing missiles on to the pitch, possibly injuring a steward in the process. After the game Di Matteo pretty much called Clattenburg a cheat. Then they make the complaint, issue a press release and then brief the press on the side as to the racism claim.

Seems to me like things are veering towards getting out of control. Continual attacks on the referees. Players baiting the crowd and managers (reckon Moyles would have been justified giving Suarez a good slap). Missiles being thrown. The fight against racism is becoming a farce. Can see it kicking off big style if they don't get it under control.

Those nice Chelsea players never abuse refs and call them every name under the sun.

I just am not entirely sure where it all ends really.  Do I think Clattenberg said something?  Probably, its a pretty serious accusation to make.

They should get their own house in order but that doesn't mean they shouldn't report any abuse given out by referees.

Saying that, the amount of abuse given to referees by players is ridiculous at times and wouldn't be tolerated in most sports.

Stuff like this is why I lose more interest in the Premiership every year.

Every time there is a big game the main story in the aftermath is always a controversy of some sort as opposed to headlines about a great goal, team or player performance.

This thread reminded me of this :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4ruNosLNOE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4ruNosLNOE)

Bad language or not, the man has long showed himself to be an incompetent match referee. Why they keep giving him these big games is beyond me.

Its not tolerated at lower levels though is it?

Lower you go the better you have to behave.

Bang on....have some class and however you lose accept it and move on.
It is becoming so fucking boring hearing managers moan at every decision that goes a wry.
Yep Chelsea were unlucky no doubt but move on.

Interesting article from the Daily Mail;

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2224744/Mark-Clattenburg-just-latest-referee-involved-controversy-Chelsea.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

Commenting on what has happened to some of the referees following them officiating Chelsea games. Frisk quitting the game due to death threats from Chelsea fans. For Poll it contributed to him retiring. Tom Henning Ovrebo had to be taken to a safe house and then smuggled out of the country, also received death threats from Chelsea fans and quit a year later.

Something bad is going to happen one day if the authorities don't get a grip on things. Sure refs make mistakes and some come across as incompetent but I also know they're trying their best and wouldn't knowingly make a bad decision. They do an excellent job when you take all the abuse and criticism they get in to account and they need more protection.

Even worse are commentators and the like who have multiple slow-motion replays to base opinions on, refs have no such luck.

If found guilty Clattenburg could be sacked by FA, yet a footballer just get a few match bad. double standards.

I get that the refs make mistakes, and some believe video evidence can erradicate this, but other than the use of several well placed snipers in the stands, how do clubs like Chelsea propose to erradicate Ashley Cole and his ilk (excessively over paid shit average at best defenders) so that they don't have to deal with game changing conceeded goals like the first two yesterday?  It is shocking in the modern age that clubs have to have their seasons, and Managers their careers, decided by moments of incompetence like these.

On the abuse, assuming it wasn't racial for now (you'd think given he is miked-up it's a bit suicidal otherwise), I'm all for dishing out free kicks and then yellows for any abuse to a ref.  Yes games will end up being abandoned due to too few players for a week or two, but it'll soon sort it out.

I think you'll find Clattenberg was just repeating, incredulously, the words he thought he heard Jon Obi Mikel utter to him - it's easily done you know

Agree that refs do get a hard time, nearly every decision they make is contested by Players. Even when it's a blatantly obvious and correct decision someone still has something to say. My only gripe is you don't very often hear a ref come out afterwards and say they messed up during a game and got decisions ( some very ) wrong.  it's like they all close rank and deny any knowledge of making mistakes. I know they move refs around the leagues depending on their preformances but I'd like to see the refs every now and then put their hand up when they mess up big time. Think they would gain more respect in the long run which can only be good for the game.

Details from the Mirror of what happened after the game.

Well that sounds like everyone involved comes out smelling of roses.

Haha trust John Terry to get involved

Is it usual for players/managers/Chairmen to be allowed into the match officials room straight after a match?

I just assumed, naively it seems, that it would be out of bounds for an hour or so while officials did paperwork and managers talked to their teams and the media.

I think you are right. IIRC there is a period of either an hour or half an hour where officials can't be contacted by either team. Although I obviously don't agree with an racial abuse (alledgedly), I would love for a ref to give some abuse back, especially with all the shit they take. I'd even applaud if one chinned JT or some of the other whinging cunts that are famed for it.

A cynical person may think that Chelsea's allegations are fabricated, to deflect attention away from what they did.

It crossed my mind that this may be a premeditated tactic by Chelsea to throw the racism spotlight on football in general rather than their club. By accusing Clattenburg, even if there is no shred of truth in it, they make the various governing bodies explicitly deny it.....just like Chelsea  did with Terry. But of course, Terry went to court...and instantly, football history has a victim...Chelsea FC. Long shot perhaps, but with the amounts of money at stake for a club’s reputation and credibility around the globe, this is business and I wouldn't put anything past them.

If di Matteo did that he should be suspended for a long while. If Mikel did that he should be suspended too. Both breached football conduct standards and should be dealt with by the FA. If Terry did that, he should be charged with assault, because he was already suspended and was banned from taking part in football matters. His conduct is therefore not covered by the FA's jurisdiction, but instead by the law of the land.

Surely if Clattenburg was miked up and racially abused someone, the recordings would have been made public, as whoever has them would have been offered a lot of dosh by the media for them.

Clattenburg, to me, is only guilty of officiating a football match in the way that he was empowered to do so. He made decisions that he thought were right.

What will really happen? Clattenburg will be marginalised and won't have his contract extended or be allowed to referee in the Premiership again, while little will happen to Chelsea and its thuggish organisation.

There are no recordings. Fifa directive. Don't ask me why, would have solved this solution in about a minute. The other officials could hear but it's then their word against whoever they disagree with.

It's a big, big statement from everyone to presume that Chelsea have even considered making something like this up. Would be cynical beyond belief and morally repugnant, but there is no evidence for that (or the alternative, I accept, beyond a few players word) other than existing prejudgements of the morality of Chelsea Football Club (which I also understand, as the club retained Terry as captain despite all that has gone on).

It would be pretty dumbass to fabricate them.  But I have no doubt they have a chip on their shoulder about the whole Terry affair and are looking to lash out at every opportunity.

If Clattenburg said what they claim then he's probably officiated his last game.  Even if its quotes taken out of context.

Bleurgh. This whole situation reeks of Chelsea trying to portray themselves as victims. Given Clattenburgs respectable and extremely impressive resume, it really would shock me if he did what they said he has. This needs to be sorted out quickly, publicly, and effectively.

Then again, if Clattenburg DID say what they've accused him of, he should be punished. To give him a greater punishment than John Terry would, however, be extremely stupid of the FA as it's another 'one rule for them, another rule for everyone else' situation.

Imagine if Di Canio had been found guilty of his supposed slurs against Tehoue? The club, him, his agent, and his agent's mum would probably all be slaped with a hefty fine and banned for half the season. Club would also have to sack him, further crippling their monetary resources. What if Ritchie or McCormack, or any player in the lower league was found guilty of exactly the same thing? Apparently John Terry is too precious to be properly dealt with, but everyone else is fair game.

All these problems with racism in football are a disgusting series of events that need to come to a head and be sorted out as soon as possible. The Premiership is supposed to be the leading light of English (and Welsh) football, with the people who play in it the idols kids try and live up to. To give players 'joke' fines (i.e. less than two week's worth of their overpaid wages), make them sit out for 4/8 games before allowing them straight back into football with no other repercussions is just disgusting.

It shocks me that the FA, and clubs, seem to have no protocols for this sort of thing. Simple solution for players and referees- 6 month ban. Fine equal to a month's wages for top-tier players (more if it was a serious incident), and perhaps two week's worth for lower-tier or referees (who earn a fuck ton less). Positions of responsibility cannot be held during this time, or for a short period after (say 3 months), to let the media hype die down a bit. To sort this whole situation out, people need to act harshly, quickly, and consistently, to stamp it out as soon as possible so we can get back to the job of speculating about scorelines as opposed to who said what to each other during a match.

I also think referee microphones should be omnidirectional, so you can hear what's being said to them, and their conversations during the match should be recorded so we can be 100% certain what was said. If a referee is mobbed, yellow cards all round. Fine, you'll be playing joke games with 4 people a side for a couple of weeks, but after that players and clubs will learn you need to leave the ref alone and let him do his fucking job. Whether he's getting it right or wrong.

And now, because this is a rage post, some puppies to lighten the mood.
[url width=800 height=531]http://wagsandwhiskershouston.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/puppy-dog.jpg[/url]

Nice puppies.

Ironically, even as a professional match official, Mr Clattenburg's annual salary is less than the weekly wage (and fine handed out for his recent Twitter rant against the FA) of a certain Ashley Cole (not vilifying Cole specifically, just stating a fact). Make of that what you will.

I wish MOTD would occasionally feature a referee or ex-referee as one of its pundits - it could educate fans in the Laws of the Game, and they could explain the pressure refs get from players and how little leeway they're allowed by the assessors.

skysports do this with dermot gallagher

As long as it wasn't Poll. Or Winter.

This, this, 100 times this. And Alan fucking Green should be horsewhipped every time he fills yet another tedious 606 with his tedious whinging about match officials. Or buried up to his neck in a tar pit. Either's good

Along with the above it would be good to have rugby style refs explaining decisions as they are made with ref links available to the crowd.

As others have pointed out there are simple solutions to the abuse referee's receive;
- Raised voices, abusive / aggressive / foul language, aggressive body language to be a yellow card.
- All audio to be recorded from the officials mics. Initially for internal use but eventually to be used at games / on TV.
- Stricter controls on interviews and press conferences to stop pressure being applied to officials and unfair criticism.

I reckon the madness would last no more than 45 minutes the first week it was applied. Then the only aggression we'll see is the managers shouting at their players to shut the fuck up and get away from the officials.

The stupid thing is that I don't think anyone is actually opposed to this kind of change and the yellow cards wouldn't even need a rule change - just a reinterpretation of the current rules (which they do all the time). Though strangely it only seems to be fans that call for it to be done.

Rugby is a perfect example which football should follow. Always amuses me to see a 6 foot 6 brick shit house talking in a quiet and apologetic voice to a stick insect referee. If we get the same attitudes in football it will be a far better game.

Didn't they do this once last season? Or perhaps it was football focus?

MOTD2 have had referee's on occasionally, might only be retired ones though.

Refs get more abuse from fans than players. Its part of the game nothing will change just like diving.

I think Chelsea are going to be in the shit big time over this.

Man Utd have stated their players heard nothing.

If it boils down to Chelsea players just backing up others who said they did hear something, they have previous about lying through their teeth in the John Terry case.

Cant imagine future refs in their games are ever going to be over sympathetic towards them.

If this was supposed to of happened during  the game Sky haven't shown a reaction from either Mikel or Mata. surely at least one of these players would of gone mad if they were racially abused by Clattenburg. Just don't stack up to me.

Seems to be a lot of confusion over which Chelsea players heard what, as well as whether they actually heard what they thought due to English not being their first language and Clattenburg's accent. Even Chelsea seem to be questioning whether anything happened and if there is a case to answer.

As you say, there could be a whole world of hurt heading Chelsea's way over this.

Think Chelsea are bitter about not getting decisons and with all the recent racist shit they have been guilty of and are trying the gain some sort of higher ground now. It will be a few of their words(which have been proven to not be trusted-cashley)against the accused and his officials. Without knowing what the alleged comments were meant to be cannot currently see Chelsea gaining anything from this and are just dragging a referee through all sorts of shit in the process.

the only way this can be stopped is for refs to use a rule of the game and send off players for foul and abusive language. Even if Clattenburg did say anything it would have been in retaliation at dogs abuse from the players.

To accuse a ref of such a serious allegation would mean you would need concrete evidence and then some. It looks like Chelsea don't...if the allegations are proved untrue Chelsea need the book thrown at them

Relegation by 2 divisions would be fair enough...

However I see the FA book to be thrown as looking something like this..

[url width=300 height=274]http://cdn.static.ovimg.com/episode/424599.jpg[/url]

 :D Sadly, you've got it about right...

Chelsea have seen a teeny, tiny gap left open by the FA and have decided to rip it open with huge force and vigour to try and make something out of nothing in order to get back at them at what they deem to have been unfair and aggressive behavour towards them from the FA.

Clattenburg is the innocent victim in this.*


*maybe

My take;
- a few Chelsea players thought they may have possibly heard something.
- they didn't, due to; the noise, emotions, not speaking English fluently, Clattenburg's accent.
- Chelsea players and staff are annoyed after the game, viewing their loss as being caused by the referee.
- it kicks off in their dressing room, a few off the cuff comments get turned in to allegations and they turn in to a lynch mob.
- they confront the referee and it kicks off.
- emotions continue to run high, feel they're being picked on by the FA and officials, so they make an official complaint.
- once they'd calmed down they'd realised they'd made something out of nothing and fucked up big time.
- they're now working on an exit strategy.

Which is more likely? That Clattenburg called him a monkey, or that he said Mikel and they misheard him? I also find it hard to believe that anyone in the UK would use the term monkey racially as it just doesn't get used in that sense. Unless he said cheeky monkey in which case he should get sacked for stupidity.

I've just read his thread, and thought I'd throw a couple of points in.

1. Refs being interviewed after the game and explaining decisions/apologising.
The PGMOL (FA body who supplies refs to professional games) do not allow this.  Personally I think hey should, perhaps 24 hours after the match, but a wall of silence does nobody any good.

2. Bad language not being tolerated at lower levels, but accepted higher up.
Difficult one this.  In a nutshell, refs at park level and have no problem sending players off because at the end of the day they only have to control the environment of 22 players and a handful of subs etc.  At premier league level, sending someone off and having 40,000 people potentially kick-off because they did not hear it could make things difficult.  Coupled with the argument that it is players livelihoods and therefore are more highly strung...  I would like to see all premier league refs mic'd up like David Ellary and then hear them on MOTD.

3. Being allowed into the dressing room after the final whistle.
The higher up you go, the more this comes into play.  I don't know the exact details, but I believe in the premier league players and management cannot go in for 30 mins after the match unless invited in.   The rationale is that this gives everyone time to calm down after the match.  I can't see why Clattenburg would invite them in "Minutes after the match" after all that went on, so this strikes me as a little strange.

4. Referee microphones
These can only be heared between the 4 officials, and are "always open" with no recording allowed.  Personally I would like these to be recorded and subsequently available to explain contentious decisions.

5. Refs on MOTD etc...
Sky tried this when they first won the premier league rights, but it only lasted for about 4 weeks.  At the end of the day it doesn't make "good television" to calmly explain why the ref made a decision.  Presenters and pundits from BBC, Sky and ITV are regulary invited by the FA to attend session where the laws of the game are discussed and taught, but they have never attended.  Much better to show slow motion replays from 10 different angles and then still argue about it!  The premier league do have an ex-ref go through major decisions on Yahoo on a Monday morning though to explain why decisions went the way they did. 

6. The whole Clattenberg/Chelsea thing
IF Clattenberg did use racially abusive language, and it is a big IF, then the FA should throw the book at him.  Forget Suarez and Terry, referees are expected to uphold not just the letter of the (footballing) law, but also the spirit.  However, if it transpires that Chelsea are just causing problems out of bitterness, then I would hope they do the same to them.

Chelsea's fans aren't helping their cause much: Police are asking fans to identify a Chelsea fan who appeared to be making monkey gestures at Danny Welbeck at last nights game. The picture is in a link on the bbcfootball site. I didn't know until now that Chelsea are accusing Clattenburg of saying " shut it monkey " to Mikel.

I would be very suprised if he was found guilty of saying those words

[url width=380 height=237]http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02385/chelsea-banner-3_2385555d.jpg[/url]

The Serbs will probably want us to get our own house in order before pointing fingers !

Well the serbs can fuck right off.

At least the English FA does try to stop it instead of denying it happens.

Yeah, bloody Serbs. Someone should round them all up and gas them or something.

Apparently it's all the Daily Mail's fault

http://www.theshedend.com/topic/21909-what-is-it-with-the-daily-mail/

One wonders if Chelsea have ever heard of a device called a mirror?

I would love to get a scaffold pole and smack it square on straight into that twats features(Chelsea fan)

What a fucking knob.

Bet he kept his head down today, walking the streets of London wouldn't be his best move right now. ( if that's where he's from )

Ralph McTell?

I see they arrested the Chelsea fan in connection with the Monkey gestures. Gavin Kirkham 28 was released on bail until later in November. The report also states Clattenburg Will not officiate in any games this weekend and that he denies any wrong doing and The two assistants and the forth official will not be backing Chelsea's claims. The Met police are also Investigating allegations After a complaint from a source from outside of the game.

If the reports that Clattenburg said "i don't give a monkey's" were enough for chelsea to make a complaint,i think that say's more about them than anything. He'll be found to have done nowt wrong and they will come out smelling more shitty than they already do

How much more desperate can Chelsea get, truly pathetic clutching at straws.

yup, pretty much.
Like arriba said, Clattenbury said something along the lines of "I dont give a monkeys what you think" and then one of Chelsea brazilians players basicly told Mikel that he just called him a monkey.

...Alegedly.

I almost want this to be true now - and then watch Chelsea's credibility slide into the swamp.

Don't forget that Chelsea's complaint is I understand being led (is that the right word) by the club secretary, that being the club secretary that was shown to have lied with regards to the JT case and led on the changing of the statesments etc.

Chelsea really do personify everything which is wrong with modern football, from the shady foreign chairman down to the obnoxious and cheating players, I understand that the sending off of Torres for diving may have been harsh in that case, but sorry what goes around comes around and he has done it enough times in the past.

Even Di Matteo who seemed to be an Ok bloke before he went back there has turned into a idiot, as has Rodgers at Liverpool - why does managing a 'big' club seem to turn all into objectionable twats!

i can't quite find the words to describe how deep rooted my hatred for chelsea is

I know, I actually found myself hoping that Man Utd beat them the other night which felt dirty!

Man Utd and especially Ferguson seem to have improved a lot recently, seems almost a conscious effort on their part to improve their image. Who'd have thought Ferguson would come out and so vocally support referees? Same with Wenger, who pretty much said he knows he acts a twat from time to time and he's grateful the refs have a quiet word with him about it rather than grassing him up to the FA every time.

I don't think anyone has a problem with Chelsea reporting the matter, they had to as it is a serious accusation. But the way they have gone about it, especially making the claims public and leaking all the details to the media, is despicable. They've permanently tarnished Clattenburg's name and pretty much put an end to him refereeing at the very highest level again.

Once this is sorted (and provided he's found innocent) I really hope the referee's refuse to officiate Chelsea matches until something is done about them, as they have been suggesting they might.

THIS

Chelsea have banned the Fan making monkey gestures pending further investigation.Also Millwall have banned a 13 year old for the foreseeable future after he verbally abused Bolton striker Marvin Sordell. Two horrible sets of supporters so not overly surprised.

It is nice to see millwall doing something about the problem.

http://www.itv.com/news/story/2012-10-28/chelsea-referee-complaint/

That can't be left that low key!

I don't like Clattenberg as a referee, but it is unfair to leave his name being dragged through the mud.

What we should remember here is that the Met Police complaint is dropped, the complainants were not Chelsea or the player but the Society of Black Lawyers!!  Nobody came forward to offer evidence on this one. The FA are still investigating the Chelsea complaint.

Chelsea seem to have been on the spin offensive over the last couple of days. Making the point they had every right and had to make the complaint to the FA about Clattenburg, though no one has disputed that. It's the way they handled it which people have a problem with and they're sidestepping that subject.

Chelsea are saying the decision to make the complaint was made solely by the chairman and chief executive. Which seems kind of stupid given that Buck (the chairman) is American and has admitted he's not aware of the phrase "I don't give a monkeys" (and no doubt other English uses of the word monkey) or it's meaning.

I still struggle to see what Clattenburg could have said that was offensive and used the word monkey, far more likely if he did say it the usage was non-offensive. Which again is the problem, Ramires made the accusation and from comments he's made if he hears the word monkey he views it as always offensive - highly unlikely he's aware of other suitable uses.

Wonder when or if he'll be reinstated?

Unless it was "go back to the jungle, Monkey" I can't either. And I can't believe anyone with half a brain cell would say that, let alone a referee with cameras pointed at him from every which way.

I'd guess at him saying "don't give a monkeys" or "cheeky monkey" being miss-understood. And IF that's the case the FA will clear him, though damage has been done already. Lets see what they uncover, if anything.

It's just not a word you really hear or use in a racist sense in the UK, compared to Eastern / Southern Europe where it seems to be a popular choice. As far as I'm aware they haven't said what the alleged phrase was, have they?

I heard he ran around the chelsea changing room with his hands under his armpits like a chimp

Clattenburg cleared, i expect to see a statement out soon from the SBL spouting some shit about how badly the investigation was done etc.

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11661/8271320/Referee-Mark-Clattenburg-cleared-of-alleged-inappropriate-language-by-Football-Association

Fuck the SBL

I await the statement from CFC with baited breath

once a bunch of cunts, always a bunch of cunts

http://www.chelseafc.com/news-article/article/2988432/title/statement-on-clattenburg-decision

Not even an apology

like I said

once a bunch of cunts .................

The Referees union are demanding Chelsea make a full and unreserved apology to Clattenburg and also compensate him for loss of earnings, damage to reputation and stress. They are also expecting Chelsea to make a sizeable donation to anti discrimination bodies show racism the red card and kick it out. Over to you Chelsea !

http://www.chelseafc.com/news-article/article/2993363/title/joint-statement-from-chelsea-fc%2C-the-premier-league-and-pgmo

Just apologies, seriously.

Chelsea regret nothing, they're a bunch of complete wankers who did this to deflect attention away from the Terry incident.

Big of them to allow Clattenburg to ref them again.

That statement makes me want to eat my own teeth.  Chelsea are in the gutter.  An apology would be the first step towards climbing out of it.  But they choose to stay there.  Horrible little club.

I'm going to stamford bridge next Wednesday night  ::)

And there was me thinking it was Man United's decision when to play him